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Apple Technology

Apple Working on Updated Vision Pro With M4 Chip as Early as 2025 63

Posted by msmash from the shape-of-things-to-come dept.
Apple plans to release its first Vision Pro upgrade as early as this year, according to Bloomberg. The updated $3,499 headset will feature an M4 processor, replacing the current M2 chip, and components designed to better handle AI tasks.

The company is also developing new straps to reduce neck strain and head pain from the 1.4-pound device. The Vision Pro launched in February 2024 but has sold only hundreds of thousands of units. Apple is working on a significantly lighter redesigned model for 2027, the report added.

Apple Working on Updated Vision Pro With M4 Chip as Early as 2025 More | Reply

Apple Working on Updated Vision Pro With M4 Chip as Early as 2025

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  • I never heard anyone complain the original vision pro was "slow", so why are they adding a faster chip?

    • I never heard anyone say they actually wanted this thing, either.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by drnb ( 2434720 )

        I never heard anyone say they actually wanted this thing, either.

        Other than a developer. Who can write it off as a business expense? :-)

      • Itâ(TM)s totally awesome. I love mine. Just go to r/VisionPro . Itâ(TM)s gotten substantially better as Apple improves VisionOS, especially for use as an external display.

    • I never heard anyone complain the original vision pro was "slow", so why are they adding a faster chip?

      Oh, come now. A product with no well-defined use-case that can't seem to find a userbase just needs a faster processor to become a super hot commodity. Right? RIGHT?!

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by GoTeam ( 5042081 )

        Oh, come now. A product with no well-defined use-case that can't seem to find a userbase just needs a faster processor to become a super hot commodity. Right? RIGHT?!

        Turns out not [newsweek.com] to be such a great driving aid. We'll find a nail for that hammer eventually!

      • The user base are people who want to watch movies on a big screen and use their mac on a big screen⦠especially while traveling. The project probably is close to break even for Apple, which means that it was a good idea even in this early stage.

        • Apple's Wearables division has made less money than the previous year [apple.com], every quarter since the Vision Pro was released. I would have assumed that's because when the Vision Pro moved from R+D to actual product, the Wearables division started taking its losses. So the question is.. if the AVP is breaking even, what wearables product do you think is cratering? AirPods or Watches?
    • Agreed. The problem with this device is its price. The CPU was already literal multiple times faster than any other self-contained headset's.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by drnb ( 2434720 )

        Agreed. The problem with this device is its price. The CPU was already literal multiple times faster than any other self-contained headset's.

        And with M2 losing economies of scale, and the M4 currently receiving that benefit, we have an unsurprising move from M2 to M4.

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by Entrope ( 68843 )

          Maybe unsurprising but still informative: they apparently expect enough sales between now and the next bigger update to justify this change rather than just stock up on the M2 version.

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by drnb ( 2434720 )

            Maybe unsurprising but still informative: they apparently expect enough sales between now and the next bigger update to justify this change rather than just stock up on the M2 version.

            Just In Time manufacturing. Inventory is death. :-)

          • They have a mountain of parts for the original model that were never assembled because demand wasn't there. Swapping in the M4 is a way to build a "new" model with mostly the same parts, so they can generate some demand to clear those out.
            • The mountain of parts includes the M2 mainboards.
              Being actual sales were about half of what their projected sales were, we can anticipate they've got literal fucking mountains of back inventory.

              The M4 refresh is an attempt at Appling the problem without understanding the problem.

              As you noted, they're trying to create some demand, but I doubt anyone with a Vision Pro is going to upgrade to an M4, and I don't see anyone deciding now they want one because of an M4.

              The M2 in them was already far more tha
        • Aye- I understand that part. "Using the CPU we're currently mass producing".
          However, I *sincerely* doubt they're anywhere close to struggling to keep up supply on these things.
          I'm quite sure their M2 repair inventory would last them (practically) indefinitely.
          i.e., mostly- I'm surprised they're continuing to make new hardware.

          Estimates for the first-year sales were between 250-500k. I don't think they're going to see people upgrading to the new hardware because of the new CPU, either.

          I feel like this

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by drnb ( 2434720 )

            However, I *sincerely* doubt they're anywhere close to struggling to keep up supply on these things.

            I agree with respect to Mac computers. Hell, 10 year old PCs are pretty capable machines outside of gaming. CPU performance moved beyond what ordinary users needed long ago. But I have not tried using a Vision Pro, and given its 1.0 nature I would no be surprised if it is sluggish at times.

            Plus, it's really a development system, a beta test system. So by having developers tune their software for an M2, but consumers actually have an M4, consumers get a better experience. Assuming the M4 is consumer ready

            • I've been using an M4 Max since November 2024. Moved to that from an M1 Max.
              Also have an M1 MacBook Air.

              I have no doubt in my mind that the M2 Vision Pro worked excellently, and that the M4 Vision Pro will also work excellently.
              There is no other iGPU in their power envelope that comes anywhere close to their performance. Really, they're spectacular.
              They're competing against really quite shitty (relatively speaking) Snapdragons. A base M4's GPU has ~3.4x more performance.
              And it's not like an M4 costs t

            • However, I *sincerely* doubt they're anywhere close to struggling to keep up supply on these things.

              I agree with respect to Mac computers. Hell, 10 year old PCs are pretty capable machines outside of gaming. CPU performance moved beyond what ordinary users needed long ago. But I have not tried using a Vision Pro, and given its 1.0 nature I would no be surprised if it is sluggish at times.

              Plus, it's really a development system, a beta test system. So by having developers tune their software for an M2, but consumers actually have an M4, consumers get a better experience. Assuming the M4 is consumer ready. It may well be a second beta for early adopters and a second developer platform.

              $3500 feels kind of insulting.

              Makes me think developers. Sure some early adopters too, but they tend to be pretty affluent so I don't care. Me, I'm being cheap here, I'd get one tomorrow if I had a billable project that used one. Until then ... I don't feel like being an early adopter, a beta tester, and paying for the privilege. I'm an old spoiled Apple developer who preferred the days when Apple gave registered developers a discount on hardware.

              And when it cost $500/yr and a D&B Rating and Bank References to be a Registered Developer,

              • Re: (Score:2)

                by drnb ( 2434720 )

                And when it cost $500/yr and a D&B Rating and Bank References to be a Registered Developer,

                It cost us nothing. Our home based business, with no D&B rating, had shipped Apple II software so were automatically added to the Mac Developer Program with no fee and no D&B. That was 1983.

                In the mid 1990s we had a garage based business, with no D&B. We had pre-existing Mac development experience, did contracting work for others, but had not shipped any products ourselves. We were admitted to the Mac Developer Program with no D&B. Although this 1990s company was unrelated to the 1980s co

        • Agreed. The problem with this device is its price. The CPU was already literal multiple times faster than any other self-contained headset's.

          And with M2 losing economies of scale, and the M4 currently receiving that benefit, we have an unsurprising move from M2 to M4.

          Agreed.

      • No, the problem is not price, because the value is there now. The problem is weight. Speaking as a user who has no regrets and uses it for work.

        • You're a very limited customer base.
          Over here in Real VR World, the weight isn't bad at all. It's the price.
          My headset is 888 grams. The Vision Pro is light in comparison.
          But I'm not replacing my Index with something that isn't as good for 3.5x the price.

          I've used the Vision Pro. It's neat. I'd pick one up for $1500.
          This is the mindset of the regular consumer. [forbes.com]

          I have no doubt that people who are using them in business situations, who would bought weird shit like the HoloLens are concerned only with

    • Because you clearly need a lot more performance to efficiently collect dust on a shelf from having no worthwhile use.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by dgatwood ( 11270 )

      I never heard anyone complain the original vision pro was "slow", so why are they adding a faster chip?

      I can't imagine. Spending more money on Vision Pro hardware right now seems like throwing good money after bad. For most users, Vision Pro is a fun toy, and an expensive one at that. Toys don't get upgraded very often even if they work well and are frequently used. Unfortunately for Apple, surveys show that users aren't using them very much at all, and there's no reason to believe that CPU speed has anything to do with the lack of use, which means you should expect nearly zero upgrades unless Apple take

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Sebby ( 238625 )

        Cutting a zero off the price, yeah, but faster, no.

        So, something like $3,490.99 to $3491.00?

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by dgatwood ( 11270 )

          Cutting a zero off the price, yeah, but faster, no.

          So, something like $3,490.99 to $3491.00?

          No, that's adding a zero. :-)

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by Entrope ( 68843 )

            Oh! Instead of charging $3499.00, they should charge $3499.0? I don't get the appeal of that change.

            • Re: (Score:2)

              by dgatwood ( 11270 )

              $3,490.99 to $4,391.99

              • Re: (Score:2)

                by Entrope ( 68843 )

                It should be obvious that changing a 0 to a 1 (whether or not one swaps other digits) is not cutting a zero off the price. The normal price is not $3490.99, either.

                • Re: (Score:2)

                  by dgatwood ( 11270 )

                  It should be obvious that changing a 0 to a 1 (whether or not one swaps other digits) is not cutting a zero off the price. The normal price is not $3490.99, either.

                  Yeah, the snark is high in this thread.

                  But in all seriousness, $3,499 really is an order of magnitude too expensive to compete against Quest at $499. If they had game availability that could compete with Quest, they might be able to get away with more like $750, but not $3.5k, or even $2k, realistically. It's just way too overpriced for something that in practice is only usable for gaming.

      • So much armchair quarterback here. You are making the old âoethe world only needs 100 computersâ argument. Vision Pro absolutely needs more horsepower for features and capabilities that havenâ(TM)t been revealed. For one, real time interpretation of hands and real time masking are very computationally intensive. Situational awareness and AI. Denoising video pass through. 16k immersive video playback. Real time ray tracing. Apple Vision Pro is absolutely awesome. What they need to do is lighte

    • I never heard anyone complain the original vision pro was "slow", so why are they adding a faster chip?

      They are presumably switching to the less expensive chip, the M4. One that is currently benefitting from economies of scale due to its use in Macs and iPads. M2 has lost that advantage.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Chaset ( 552418 )

      As others have pointed out, so that they don't have to keep producing the old chip that is now "outdated". Everything else they will be producing will be M4 or later, so it makes sense to take advantage of the economies of scale.
      Also, presumably, each iteration of their M series gets more power efficient for the same unit of computation, so they can get more battery life out of it, or even possibly get rid of the separate battery pack. Lower power will make the thermal design easier, which could also lead

    • Same thing with any other computer.

      The Vision Pro shouldn't be marketed as a virtual reality headset. Because that's not what it is.

      It should be marketed as an all-in-one computer with a virtual monitor. And as such, it should be updated every 1-2 years with faster hardware and more memory, just like every other desktop and laptop computer.

    • I never heard anyone complain the original vision pro was "slow", so why are they adding a faster chip?

      Methinks that TSMC wants to retire the Line that does the M2 Fab. The M4 is being used in several current Products.

  • Can't wait to not buy this one either! Apple really missed the mark on this one. Even the first Apple Watch wasn't this much of a miss and it was a fraction of the price...
  • It's interesting that Apple buys a lot of displays, but they did little of anything to make their last headset smaller or lighter. Also with the needless addition of the outside LCDs, their last headset was too expensive. Basically, Apple is using the same non-logic on the headsets as they used on the last three generations of Mac Pro's: try to make a media splash with an unsellably expensive device. I could design and spec a better VR headset than make. Many of you could.

    • Anyone who'd actually used VR or AR could predict the Vision's lackluster performance.

      It was marketed as an AR device to compete with Hololens, but it doesn't allow you to move freely with confidence like a Hololens does because you can only see inside the tiny FOV.

      It seemed to compete more with a Quest in terms of features and applicability, but they seemed to actively avoid marketing this, maybe to avoid comparison with a $300 device.

      The first release was a toy for techies with disposable income -- I real

      • Ridiculous argument. Absolutely nobody uses HoloLens. And the fov of HoloLens was useless.Vision Pro has a wide fov by comparison and FoV is certainly not a weak spot. Vision Pro has an active user base and itâ(TM)s selling fast enough to be profitable this year⦠paying for 8 years of development in just a year or two.

  • I do! I can already hear the yawns of excitement!

    • I do! I can already hear the yawns of excitement!

      Personally I like the notion that I can now assume ARM v9 with the move to the M4. :-)

  • I feel like there's a huge blindspot in the comments here. The prototype launch was instantly more capable than any other headset. even if not every feature is going to make the ultimate cut. Of course the thing to do is to double-down and keep iterating on it. We're looking at what will heavily influence the way humans interact with technology in the future. We should be cheering this on. Whether it turns out to be a descendant of this product or something that is inspired by / influenced by it, this is j

    • It's almost as if the original were a beta test / development system. Something only for early adopter feedback. :-)

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Holi ( 250190 )

      Well that gaming computer and GPU actually have software to use.
      A quick look shows there are few compelling apps to justify the price of a Vision Pro.

      • MoonPlayer justifies the entire price of the Apple Vision Pro. There you go, a single app makes the whole thing worthwhile. Another one would be the YouTube safari extension enabling you to watch YouTube on a 20 foot screen. Itâ(TM)s knock your socks off amazing. Spatial photos in the Apple Photos app are incredible. The environments are pretty phenomenal too.

    • That's because it wasn't a "prototype launch"... until Apple retconned it into one because of disappointing sales and tepid interest.

      • ... Apple retconned it into one because of disappointing sales and tepid interest.

        Did they? I know the Apple commentariat did, but has Apple itself made that argument? Apple doesn't have much of a history of saying anything the least bit negative about any of their products.

  • It's not going to do well unless there is a killer app. Live sports could easily be that app, but Apple still hasn't found out how to do it well. Also it's still too heavy. Way too heavy.

    • I have an AVP and I agree with this comment. Sports and weight are areas of focus. But the device is already doing just fine. There are plenty of reasons to iterate it.

  • The problem with the Vision Pro isn't the lack of AI. It's the eye-watering price compared to the complete lack of anything you can do with it. If Apple wants to impress people they need to stop talking about the damn headset and start talking about the apps, the games, and the benefit from wearing it. Right now it's a $3500 showroom piece that has no purpose or provides any meaningful functionality.

  • I don't care about VR, I'm not going to use it every day or in any meaningful way.

    You know what I would use? AR glasses.

    Nothing fancy, mind you, mostly just the details on my iwatch that appear right in my lens. Throw in some facial recog to give me the name of the person I'm talking to, and bam - you have a product I'd order today.

    But you can keep your big, gawky, awkward VR goggles...

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