WordPress Founder Claims Apple Cut Off Updates To His Free App Because It Wants 30 Percent (theverge.com) 91
WordPress founding developer Matt Mullenweg is accusing Apple of cutting off the ability to update its iOS app -- until or unless he adds in-app purchases so Apple can extract its 30 percent cut of the money. The Verge reports: Here's the thing: the WordPress app on iOS doesn't sell anything. I just checked, and so did Stratechery's Ben Thompson. The app simply lets you make a website for free. There isn't even an option to buy a unique dot-com or even dot-blog domain name from the iPhone and iPad app -- it simply assigns you a free WordPress domain name and 3GB of space. Is Apple seriously asking for WordPress owner Automattic to share a cut of all its domain name revenue? How would it even know which customers used the app? Or was this all a mistake? Apple, Automattic, and Mullenweg didn't immediately reply to requests for comment. As the article points out, all of this is happening in the shadow of Epic Games' gigantic fight against Apple, one that Apple responded to this very afternoon.
Interesting (Score:3)
Re:Interesting (Score:5, Informative)
Far more effective is for the important app makers to abandon Apple platforms. Apple might get the hint when it starts to lose customers. Apple believes that it is so central to things that people cannot do without it.
While some of its kit is good, it is not really better than the competition; but it does have the cachet of a status symbol and so some will pay more to buy it as they have friends who are impressed by that sort of thing.
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Far more effective is for the important app makers to abandon Apple platforms.
Not going to happen. You can't just lose 50% of your customers.
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Why not? Microsoft does that with every release!
Re: Interesting (Score:2)
That's also a way to lose money fast.
Re: Interesting (Score:2)
Tell that to Steve Balmer. Satya got it right.
Re:Interesting (Score:5, Insightful)
Far more effective is for the important app makers to abandon Apple platforms.
Not going to happen. You can't just lose 50% of your customers.
Tell that to Mozilla.
Re: Interesting (Score:2)
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Mozilla is a trademark.
There's the Mozilla Foundation and then there's the Mozilla Corporation.
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Re: Interesting (Score:2)
And given that the Apple appstore and the development environment is more demanding it's not worth it to try to develop for Apple.
Especially when making small simple apps for free just because you want to contribute and share.
Google play and Android has some quirks and some apps aren't worth it, but overall it's not a world of impossible you'd encounter there.
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Well, the gamble is that your customers will care enough about your app to dump the Apple gear and use something else.
For a Wordpress app, it may not be the worst idea. I'm sure iOS is well less than 50% assuming that a good portion of their user base probably uses a computer instead of a phone to create their Wordpress site. Besides, if they aren't actually selling anything on iOS it's not like they are going to lose any direct revenue over it.
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but it does have the cachet of a status symbol and so some will pay more to buy it as they have friends who are impressed by that sort of thing.
This is absolutely untrue when it comes to iOS devices. The iPad is less expensive than the Surface Go 2, and the iPad frequently goes on sale for around $250. The iPhone SE 2 is extremely cheap when purchased with cell service (for example, Metro [metrobyt-mobile.com] has it for $50).
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The big tech corporations are pissing off the other corporations with their monopolistic tactics and costing them money. So class action and legal force applied to Apple to open up Apple phones to whom ever the customer wishes to buy applications from direct or indirect. It was pretty clear what that new monopoly law was all about and who it was targeted at.
No matter how much money you have, you can only spend so much in a court of law and when your opposition can spend just as much in that court of law, t
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While some of its kit is good, it is not really better than the competition; but it does have the cachet of a status symbol and so some will pay more to buy it as they have friends who are impressed by that sort of thing.
I agree Apple products are often over-hyped and over-priced, but, having tried various tablets over the past 8 years, I found the IPad to be the best of the lot.
It's a huge improvement over the Nexus 7 tablet I started with. Despite the positive reviews, mine was a dog - painfully slow display, barely adequate and the app store was always an adventure - far too many bad apps.
The HP Slate 7 that replaced the Nexus was much faster, far more stable and more usable. But, I found a 7 inch screen becam
Re: Interesting (Score:1)
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Because their previous flagship product - a giant $2000 phone/tablet hybrid - almost literally broke in half after a moderate amount of gentle use, perhaps?
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Using price point as justification for a badly functioning product is only valid if I expected Ferrari performance at Hyundai Accent prices. While the Nexus 7 did not pretend to be anything but an entry level product, based on many positive reviews, I thought I was buying a working tablet suited to my very limited tablet wants - adequate functionality as an agnostic e-reader, and maybe plays a few simple card games. My Nexus was not a great tablet from the start, but, it was functional (barely) for the fir
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How much money you have in the bank shouldn't have any effect on what is right and wrong.
This society is so poisoned by the love of money. Which we all know is the root of all evil.
The next time you see a billionaire drive past a homeless person shoot that fucker in the head and give his cash to that homeless person. After a while we will run out of homeless people. Imagine that. A society trying to take care of itself without greed and racism.
O wait..... Nevermind. Just shoot me in the face for trying to m
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Ahhh, I DO see your logic. . .see billionaire, shoot, give money to homeless, homeless person now billionaire, see them, shoot them, give money to next homeless person R&R. I guess that IS one way of taking care of the homeless problem - not sure it's exactly what society has in mind though.
Damn those unintended consequences!
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Except you forgot the fact that the new billionaire will probably share the money with his other homeless friends since they know how fucked up it is to be poor while the rich ignores there own brother.
It wouldn't take long to shift the powers that be with some input and actions by our own society.
But its cool....troll away.
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Ahhh, you're one of those serious types. Apologies, please ignore my previous post.
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It's all good. 52 years on this Earth kinda takes the humor out of everything. Unless, of course, one is a sociopath.
I'm just here to light fires under the asses of the masses.
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Meh! You've only got a year on me. Lighten up : b
Don't think there's enough oil man. . .sadly.
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You silly people hope for oil to light asses on fire when you need to get into the modern age and get a handheld multi-watt laser. That'll light fires under asses quite easily. Also works as a great protest self-defense device.
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Hey, you two youngsters pipe down in there and also get off my lawn.
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*takes a moment to appreciate your lawn and morn my own*
*TPs your house*
Take that grandpa!
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Lol, fair enough.
Also, I think the link in your sig is broken.
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You might think so... I'm not so sure. Everyone has larceny in their hearts. Give someone a billion dollars, and they might share some of the largess, but I doubt they would give away significant fractions of it.
Hmmm. We need a few billion dollars so that we can conduct a study? Know any donors?
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I would.
I'd reserve $50M for myself, and I'd have some serious fun giving away the rest.
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Re: Interesting (Score:2)
Abuse of digital monopoly. I can see a $12 billion settlement with Europe and a few other countries soon. Itâ(TM)s sad Cook got this greedy and lost.
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This will be interesting to watch. Companies thinking they can win with 2 trillion dollar behemoth. Class action next?
It's already over. The actual issue was that the app was referring to paid plans available on the website without offering those in the app. Those references were removed and the updated app is in the store.
Does apple take 30% of cars sold on an app? (Score:3)
Does apple take 30% of cars sold on an app?
Re:Does apple take 30% of cars sold on an app? (Score:5, Insightful)
what about the e-doctor does apple get 30% charge (Score:2)
what about the e-doctor does apple get 30% of the charge master rate?
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Apple draws a (less and less meaningful) distinction between physical and digital goods. Physical goods—like those sold on eBay and Amazon—have never been subject to the 30% cut.
Re:Does apple take 30% of cars sold on an app? (Score:5, Informative)
Really makes me wonder why Apple doesn't require ApplePay as a payment method in the ebay app.
Quite simple, read the ToS. The 30% cut applies to:
When you buy something physical from ebay or Amazon it doesn't affect the app. It doesn't affect the content available in the app. As such Apple makes no claim on it what so ever. If you buy a movie from Amazon to play in the app, or a book from Amazon to read with the app, then you affect the content and Apple wants a cut. If you buy the Bluray or a physical book, the content of your app is unchanged and Apple doesn't take a cut. Quite simple really.
That's it. There was never a "we take 30% of everything you do". It was a "we take 30% of any money you make changing the app," roughly anyway, the reality is the terms list the situations where they do take a cut to the exclusion of everything else.
Re:Does apple take 30% of cars sold on an app? (Score:4, Interesting)
Is there something like a red cross donation app? Do they want 30 percent from them too?
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Seems only fair that it should work both ways.
I'm sure it does work both ways. Apple will happily take a 30% cut off the gift given to users. ;-)
Solution (Score:3)
The solution is simple, just sell $5000 upgrades to WordPress Specialist Edition. Which is the same as the normal edition except for the title.
Re: Solution (Score:2)
Just call it the Apple edition instead.
Android version - free, Apple version $5000.
But why can't Wordpress make a web page for that service? No need for an app at all. In some cases apps seems to be a waste of time.
This will get ugly (Score:5, Interesting)
Apple is the 2000 pound gorilla in the room here, but if they don't apply their standards equally across the board, they might eventually lose in court.
I'm sure there are angles to this that I'm not aware of.
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It's not even a work-around. The WordPress app actually does stuff without having to pay WordPress anything.
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It seems like Apple is trying to stomp on ANY attempted work-around that sends customers to a different website to make a transaction.
Only for a few specific cases to enhancements of the contents of an app. Given how their ToS wouldn't make them go after Wordpress for this I'm going to assume one of the following:
- It was a mistake by Apple.
- It was a lie by Wordpress.
- It was a lie by the media looking for an opportunity to run a time relevant story.
well (Score:1)
From what I can see... (Score:5, Insightful)
At this point we only have Matt Mullenweg saying that Apple stopped WordPress from doing updates. I will withhold my condemnation of Apple until it has been confirmed by at least one other source.
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Wouldn't a founding developer be one who would know if updates are being blocked?
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RTFA, for God's sake.
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At this point we only have Matt Mullenweg saying that Apple stopped WordPress from doing updates. I will withhold my condemnation of Apple until it has been confirmed by at least one other source.
Mullenweg's company makes money hand over fist, both with hosting managed Wordpress sites and selling addons to WooCommerce. Oh, and Akismet subscriptions.
Not seeing any upside to him lying about this. Step 1: take on Apple for some false reason, Step 2 ??? Step 3 Profit?
Stop it. (Score:4, Insightful)
Maybe stop making so many apps and go back to making websites? Those things which (mostly) work on all platforms?
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If they make websites people here dogpile on them about websites are supposed to be static and all this javascript stuff is the worst thing in the world to happen to the web and that 'apps' don't belong on the web.
So they make an app to be installed and run on your device, and you condescendingly tell them they're doing it wrong, and they should be making websites instead.
The only winning move is not to play.
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Angular is the worst thing in the world to happen to the web.
Now that most browsers are very standards compliant on Javascript, it really isn't as bad (nor anywhere near as hard) as it used to be.
So long as people stick with the basics and keep things simple, that is. If you pile your website high with off-the-internet fancy prefab javascript components, you will have a mess to deal with (mostly inherited vulnerabilities, inherited bugs, a weekly chore of chasing down new versions to stay current, higher-t
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Nobody minds a website with a little JavaScript that makes it better. It's when it gets huge and consumes resources for no good reason that it's objectionable. But honestly unless you're building a website that needs to do a lot, it should degrade to HTML+CSS. There's no good excuse for requiring JS when your content can be displayed and functionality like search can be accomplished with Forms. It takes little more work to implement such functionality even if you're doing it yourself,
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Maybe stop making so many apps and go back to making websites? Those things which (mostly) work on all platforms?
With Wordpress, avoiding the app would be a smart idea in any case. Last time I checked, the app requires XML-RPC. Wordpress' implementation of XML-RPC has been the source of various security problems.
Not to mention that the app doesn't really seem to add any functionality over just using Wordpress' web admin panel.
Wordpress no longer gives you the option to disable XML-RPC - probably because of this app. But there are plugins which will turn it off; plus you can always block it in your web server config. A
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We finally gave up and built a small app wrapping the browser (which on iOS of course is always Safari, not the world's best browser).
I think Apple's rejection of PWAs was to keep people in the "app mentality."
And sucking money off
Search and discovery (Score:3)
If you go look on a website like freelancer.com at the App jobs listed there you'll regularly see job postings for Apps that are just shell Apps that load a web page or two. :)
It's pretty dumb and they usually get kicked out at review time before ever making it onto an App Store. You'll also see "get my app through review" jobs postings.
App Store keyword ranking is a valuable marketing asset which hasn't been missed by the majority.
You'll see plenty of apps, that have passed review, on the app stores that don't really make a lot of sense and their main business is a website.
There's 2 types of App in my eyes. One is a real app that is of use and value and the other is a marketing app that really shouldn't be on the app store but is there for discovery via the app store's search results.
Apple and Google are aware of this and, just like any shop keeper, they aren't going to clutter their shelves with goods that they aren't getting sales commission on.
If someone was using you to market their goods you'd want a cut wouldn't you?
So by this logic... (Score:1)
Simple solution (Score:3)
STOP making apps for Apple iOS!
If developers just stop making apps for Apple pretty soon no one will want their stinking phones because there are no new apps or less apps than android. Eventually Apple will get the hint. The ONLY thing these big companies understand is $$$$$! If you remove as much of it as you can from them sooner or later they will stand up and take notice.
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Apple customers are eager to throw much more money at 'apps' than people with other phones. It's a lucrative market, even though you have to share 30% with the enabler.
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Or reflect on the fact that Apple going after an app which doesn't violate it's ToS at a time when they are under heavy media attention it's likely: a) a lie, or b) a mistake.
Your comment is like saying that people should quit their jobs so they don't have to pay income tax. The reality is people make money developing for iOS.
eveonline app (Score:1)
What's the problem? (Score:1)
Is it just me? (Score:5, Interesting)
Am I really the only one who reads this as:
WordPress Founder uses cover of the Apple / Epic Games controversy to sneak monetization features into his iOS App while blaming Apple for it
Really? I mean sorry but it sounds really kind of farfetched to complain about Apple forcing you to do something you don't want/need to do while having already decided to do it anyway. Whole thing just reads like a way to sneak monetization into the app and tell your customers "its Apple's faule" to me...
Now you know why they have so much money (Score:2)
With stories like this it's like they are asking for regulatory action against them, they don't need more money and 30% is exhorbant.
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Hey. People who want to posture that they are higher class can buy their "Buick" phone if they want to. They can even pretend to any friends who will go along with it that it's a BMW phone.
There will always be fools, Apple has every right to harvest their money for as long as the hustle continues to work. They've been doing it for decades with the Mac and their brand cache' has at least a little longer before people figure out.
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apple always find a new way (Score:1)
Back when Apple released the iPhone.. (Score:1)
Comment removed (Score:3)
These Are The Straws (Score:2)
They telegraphed to us they would grasp at when iPhone sales started dropping.
It’s “services” now. Subscriptions and In-App purchases. Things, frankly, most people are not excited about. Last year they held events to try and convince app developers to move to subscription models. They wanted everything to have subscriptions, even calculator apps. Some obliged, some didn’t.
Wordpress has probably a bazillion downloads, but Amazon makes no direct revenue, I may be wrong, but I think
We need a good FOSS touchscrenn OS + hardware. (Score:2)
Apples walled garden makes sense expecially in terms of quality control and *if* Apple does a good job at it. However, it *is* a walled garden
However, 30% is a hefty tax and I see a growing PR problem for Apple here. The iPad is, by my definition, not a turing-complete device and has so much consumer-device lockin that in terms of usage it seriously stretches the definition of a computer IMHO. This AppStore enforcement and Apple tax battle doesn't look good either and I wonder how they can get out of this
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From my point of view, we're already surprisingly close.
An open-source kernel, or a close descendant thereof, powers nearly every smartphone in existence (BSD for Apple and Linux for Android). In noplace anywhere does open source dominate so much as it does in smartphone operating systems.
If you meant a viable open-source touchscreen UI, well, Android itself, which is open-source, would certainly seem to qualify. People put up with closed-source derivatives primarily because otherwise they don't get the a
"Founding Developer"? (Score:2)
That's a fancy title for someone who forked b2