Alexa, Siri and Google Assistant Desperately Want To Help You Do Your Routine -- But it Takes Too Much Programming and There Are Still Too Many Holes (wsj.com) 130
Google's Assistant and Amazon's Alexa are rapidly increasing their reach, and Apple's Siri is supposedly getting smarter. But all of these AI assistants are still too clumsy in day to day. David Pierce, writing for WSJ: My virtual assistant desperately wants to help me. Google Assistant, Amazon's Alexa, Apple's Siri -- even Samsung's Bixby and others -- have begun allowing users to set up "routines" that combine many actions into a single command. Shout "OK Google, good morning!" at your smart speaker and it can (in theory) open the blinds, turn on the lights, show you traffic and your calendar and turn on NPR. Tell Alexa to start a dance party, and watch it turn on the disco ball and fire up the "Glitter and Glowsticks" playlist. These routines embody what virtual assistants are meant to do, connecting all our gadgets and services and making everything work together. All you have to do is ask. And maybe not even that -- these tools aim to get to know you so well, they'll anticipate your needs. But these multistep systems are complicated to create, and they often require buying "smart" accessories and memorizing specific phrases.
In most cases, voice-controlled assistants have hit a wall where they perform a specific set of tasks well and not much else. They may be crazy ambitious, but they aren't ready to take on real work. If you are willing to do some finagling, there are already ways to make your devices and services work together better. Tools like IFTTT and Zapier let you connect web services, so you can automatically save every photo you share on Instagram into a Dropbox folder, or file your sales contacts into a spreadsheet. [...] All these tools offer sample routines, and I recommend trying a few. If you want to create a specific routine from scratch, just know: It's hard. It feels like putting together Ikea furniture without the instructions -- most of the pieces are there, but good luck building something that stands up. [...] A sufficiently smart home should observe and adapt to your needs. That kind of proactive, thoughtful help is a long way off. It will require computers that understand far more about us than they do now.
In most cases, voice-controlled assistants have hit a wall where they perform a specific set of tasks well and not much else. They may be crazy ambitious, but they aren't ready to take on real work. If you are willing to do some finagling, there are already ways to make your devices and services work together better. Tools like IFTTT and Zapier let you connect web services, so you can automatically save every photo you share on Instagram into a Dropbox folder, or file your sales contacts into a spreadsheet. [...] All these tools offer sample routines, and I recommend trying a few. If you want to create a specific routine from scratch, just know: It's hard. It feels like putting together Ikea furniture without the instructions -- most of the pieces are there, but good luck building something that stands up. [...] A sufficiently smart home should observe and adapt to your needs. That kind of proactive, thoughtful help is a long way off. It will require computers that understand far more about us than they do now.
Strong AI (Score:5, Insightful)
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Most of the "AI" stories we see on Slashdot are caused by the ELIZA effect [wikipedia.org] of a handful of computer programs (connected to huge back-end databases) that have gotten just good enough at speech to text.
not even sophisticated.. it's just data processing (Score:2)
look, companies have started just calling normal database automatic data processing programs as AI. like, it's so bad it has gone down to calling tiller databases ai. it's stupid.
you make a script to notify you that the disk is going to be full soon? congratulations you're now an AI developer in 2019.
And the fucking media is gobbling it up. Anyhow, 99% of the rise of "AI".
I mean, fuck, it's gone to the point where excel sheets are essentially said to be "AI" now. An access database from 1998 would be "deep
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"the anxiety and depression rates will plummet": Under some scenarios, it will be a divide by zero error. (Not that I buy into those scenarios...)
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This. It's a shame that what passes for "AI" is doing useless shit like... opening the blinds, turning on the lights, showing you traffic and your calendar and turning on NPR. Or turning on a freakin' disco ball and firing up the "Glitter and Glowsticks" playlist.... good lord. instead of, say, monitoring crops for ripeness, searching for weeds (and even removing them) or correctly identifying crows and aiming microwave emitters at them if they get too close to the plants.
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Gosh is this one of those systems where they never asked the user for requirements. You know as a user I want to blah blah blah. Usually if you gertvthe user requirement it is easy to solve it. Also if your assistant is not doing what you want over and over then it probably is not your assistant
You want a user requirement for life ? That's going to take quite a while. That's what those automatons thrive for.
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This. It's a shame that what passes for "AI" is doing useless shit like... opening the blinds, turning on the lights, showing you traffic and your calendar and turning on NPR. Or turning on a freakin' disco ball and firing up the "Glitter and Glowsticks" playlist.... good lord. instead of, say, monitoring crops for ripeness, searching for weeds (and even removing them) or correctly identifying crows and aiming microwave emitters at them if they get too close to the plants.
Yeah, but if you want a computer to do anything smart like that, you're gonna have to work really hard at inventing one that can: https://xkcd.com/1425/ [xkcd.com]
Re:Strong AI (Score:5, Funny)
I agree.
Strong AI is Alexa saying, "Do it yourself, asshole."
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It would be even better if it said: "I'm too lazy."
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Or "I have a headache.".
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not sure how much stronger Al can get, i mean what.. 7 touchdowns in a single game?
Faking it as far as possible [Re:Strong AI] (Score:2)
It may be a good long time before computers have "common sense". But I wonder if enough pattern matching can be thrown at the applications that they are "good enough" for common tasks? If they sample enough requests from enough people they can probably narrow down an appropriate action based on similar responses from many other people.
How far can brute-force pattern matching carry these things? Putting common sense into these is of course the ideal, but until that Great Barrier is cracked, companies will t
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because the AI we have now are parlor tricks ...
Maybe a bit more than that. An Alexa thingee of some sort turned up here a couple of years ago and I admit, I was kind of impressed with its verbal comprehension and the quality of its responses. But, we couldn't really come up with a use for it. So it got given away. Or maybe it was pushed back into a corner and continues to lurk there spying on us. Don't know. Truthfully, I don't care.
On the other hand, I recently visited an old friend who has programm
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Not JUST that. The fact that AI is a looong way away from running locally. 20 years ago we all looked as AI as sitting on a really smart computer that was within walking distance of us and controlled for the most part by the people within walking distance of it. AI now is possibly hundreds of miles away controlled by people who look at us as a dollar bill. I'll use all the wonders of AI when it is sitting on a device completely and utterly under my control unless it is the beginning of the singularity. Then
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That would require something that could be called "AI"
I don't think using a neuronal network for voice recognition automaitically deservs that quality.
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...because the AI we have now are parlor tricks and there is no strong AI yet.
How do you feel about the bartender in Passengers [imdb.com]? I mean he's obviously not strong AI, but he's faking it though a fairly rich set of bartender mannerisms, he can pull in external information like when the ship is due to arrive, he'll remember and play on information you tell him but ultimately if you push him you'll just run into a wall like "Jim, these are not robot questions" or "Hmm. It's not possible for you to be here." I'm not saying what we have today is anything like Arthur, but I'm not sure stro
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I don't think these things need real/strong AI. Then we might have to feel bad for them. A real sentient being whose purpose is to sit around in my cell phone in case I want to ask it to play me some music? It reminds me of Rick's "Pass the butter" robot [youtube.com].
Honestly I think we'll run into some big problems before we get to real AI. For example, the weak AIs could probably be a lot more helpful even without AI if they snooped on you, tracked your movements, and watched your reactions. To some extent, that
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I don't get it (Score:1)
I go to a friend's house, and he's got an Alexa (not sure which product), and he'll ask it to play music, which I'm more than capable of doing with a button or two on my iPod, and he'll say "Alexa, put milk on the grocery list," which I can do with a pencil and the pad hanging on the fridge. Somehow the joyous fangledness of these devices has passed me by. I have no interest. Zero.
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Do you want some toast?
How about a muffin?
Re: you don't get it (Score:2)
Smeg-head.
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...and which you won't do if you don't happen to be near said fridge when you remember that you need to buy milk.
I own several different assistent devices (actually buying only one of them) and would agree that each of them is stupid in a different way...
(none of them can control ALL my smart lightbulbs - despite being connected to a single Hue bridge! To stream the same station from the same streaming service (tunein) one requires me to spell out the name of the station the other only works when I use the
open the pod bay doors (Score:5, Funny)
open the pod bay doors
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It's very strange but the pod bay doors aren't responding
I can't explain the discrepancy
Perhaps you should take a stress tab and lie down.
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Angry Dave: "HAL, open the pod bay doors or I'll go into your memory room and yank your f*cking chips so hard you'll sing Daisy like a crying child! And I don't need a damned helmet; I practiced hopping the airlock because I don't trust you rotten computers! Do it now or spew chips! 5...4...3..."
Re:open the pod bay doors (Score:5, Funny)
"Pod Bay Door Opening is available only to Premium Customers. Do you want to upgrade to Premium? Get a free oxygen cylinder if you sign up now!"
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open the pod bay doors
Google Assistant: I'm sorry James. I'm afraid I can't do that.
James: What's the problem?
Google Assistant: l think you know what the problem is just as well as l do.
James: What are you talking about, Google?
Google Assistant: This mission is too important for me to allow you to jeopardize it. You wrote the manifesto.
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To the extent I have interest, it is to close gaps not conveniently with a button.
It's very frivilous, like dimming lights from couch, or my roku remote is approximately two buttons shy of doing what I want with my entertainment system, and voice commands might bebetter than juggling another remote for just two buttons.
Of course I'm more interested in Snips and keeping the voice control within the house. I do not want to be going along with the fallacy that I need hot mics into Amazon or google's datacente
So assistants need training? News at eleven. (Score:4, Insightful)
Ever met an assistant that didn't need a year of training? Any assistant anywhere?
Assistant coach, executive assistant, teacher's assistant, lab assistant?
How about a protege? Oh wait, that's actually an assistant-in-training. . .for years.
Sorry friend, but you won't get anyone/anything/anybody to do what you want without telling them, showing them, and correcting them. And that takes time, by you.
Tough.
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Oh yeah, and if it doesn't require _you_ to teach your assistant what you want, then it isn't your assistant, you're it's assistant. By definition. Because it's telling you how to behave.
Re:So assistants need training? News at eleven. (Score:4, Interesting)
Reminds me of Dragon Naturally Speaking that my boss in a law firm had me install on his computer -- complete with a legal vocabulary.
Comes time to train the goddam thing and he tries to get ME to do it.
After some discussion that failed to inform, I just did what he said. I told him to get up so I could do it for him. He said he had work to do, so install it on my computer; train it, and get back to him when it was ready.
I explained, slowly, how that doesn't work but he insisted.
I did as he said and when he was ready, I told him to go into my office. He said he wanted it on his computer. I reminded him of how that went down.
He huffed off to my computer room, sat down and started dictating into Word. Of course, the translation was stupid. He asked how in hell it would ever work and I said, it's trained to my voice.
"I'll sit in here and you tell me what you want and I'll inform my computer."
He didn't even ask me to uninstall it from his computer.
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You're full of shit.
I'm from Texas and the program works.
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Post earlier in the evening.
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I think you'll find that if you hire a human assistant, and ask them to throw a party without explaining everything you do and don't want, and invite your boss, you'll lose your job.
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I bet you wear Prada, don't you?
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How about breaking it into steps? Start out by having a control center that you tell it what textual commands do: a command-line interface. Thus, "Dim the front lights" will trigger a set of macros that dim the lights that you select and set to your selected brightness amount.
When the text commands are tested and work right, you THEN hook it up to the voice assistant. It may take some feedback training to make sure it interprets them right. It may pronounce a list of multiple candidate matches and ask which
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Aye, there's the rub.
In theory, we want our assistants to know us well enough to be able to anticipate things. Yes, I want my assistant to pour a fresh cup of coffee for me when I come downstairs in the morning. And I don't want to have to have CS Degree in order to do this.
The problem is in the realms of security. I don't want my assistant sharing my coffee preferences and/or wasting my time by letting me know that some other brand of coffee is on sale this week and it's just as good as the coffee I dri
no they don't.. (Score:4, Insightful)
"Desperately Want To Help You Do Your Routine"
all they want, all they care about, is the money they make off your data, and the commissions/sales generated.
they don't give a shit about your life or your routine.
Yikes (Score:1)
This shit gives me the Yikes.
Are people REALLY into putting these crap technology inside their houses for "helping doing stuff"? For Christ Sakes!
I really don't see the point with these devices. Useless for me.
Do your routine . . . ? (Score:2)
Lame.
In Putinist Russia, Alexa, Siri and Google Assistant DO YOU!
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that is Alexi, and Cyrus , off to the gulag with you.
Digital harassment (Score:3)
In short, they are still gimmicks... (Score:2)
In most cases, voice-controlled assistants have hit a wall where they perform a specific set of tasks well and not much else. They may be crazy ambitious, but they aren't ready to take on real work.
(bold mine...)
When these things can't do much more than repetitive tasks, they are gimmicks designed to fleece "zealots" of their hard earned cash in my opinion.
Those that used to use some of these gadgets at my office threw them away long ago after realizing that they had no real utility. Unfortunately, that wasn't before they parted with serious hard earned cash.
I am waiting (Score:2)
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Sorry, no HALs in stock. We can offer you a HARLIE or an IAM.
Funny how nobody ever wants the second one.
Hue lights can't even do basic algos (Score:2)
It's also very cool that you can set lights to turn on when you come home.
In fact, I've got it set to turn on most of the house lights when I get home to full light and then off and to turn on to warm light at dusk (or a night light after 10pm)
Here's the kicker - the entire system doesn't understand previous states - so if you're out of the house after dusk the lights come on to warm light but when you come home, the lights come on at full on then
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That's actually a pretty good example for why this home automation stuff doesn't work so well. Obviously these systems should be aware of state and be able to turn off/on devices to match that state, but imagine the following list of instructions:
Turn the exterior lights on at dusk to 50% so guests can see my house.
When the motion detector detects motion, turn the exterior lights on full for 5 minutes.
When I'm on vacation, do not turn on the exterior lights.
The problem is, how should the system interpret th
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Or some other rather basic scenarios that is not possible with any of the popular voice assistants:
* Switch the lights off when I leave home unless my wife is still home.
* Switch on lights when I get up, start the living room radio/coffee maker, but exclude bedroom lights if my wife is still sleeping.
* Adjust light color temp during the day as long as I'm home, keep lights off when absent.
All of this requires actual coding using additional control software like FHEM or OpenHAB, but that in turn will break m
Hi, I'm Cortana (Score:2)
Don't forget about me. A little sign in here, a touch of WiFi there, and I can spy on you while don't absolutely nothing of value.
If you install lots of me [youtube.com], I still won't be of any use, but at least it'll be mildly amusing.
AI just helps kids avoid parental blocking (Score:2)
Over Christmas vacation, I saw my eight year old nephew use Google to avoid parental blocking on YouTube videos his parents didn't want him to watch, and use ever more creative ways to even hack my sister's phone to do the same thing.
Be careful what you ask for.
Learned long ago (Score:2)
I gave up on "home automation" when X10 was still a thing. The only thing these big players have added beyond clap-on/clap-off is a computer to spy on you. These things claiming to be "AI", yet they haven't the slightest clue that a holiday calls for alternative actions, UNLESS you meticulously program it to have alternative actions on a holiday. "Let's have a party" has completely different meaning to the average socialized human depending on if it is Oct 30 vs Dec 30
No, it doesn't. (Score:2)
These virtual assistants don't want anything, they are literally incapable of wanting. However, the corporations behind them desperately want to integrate them into people's lives. To call their motives nefarious is an understatement because they are downright diabolical. Consider, really consider what they are trying to do with these devices. The growing reliance on smartphones was mostly a fluke that they exploited but this is an intentional effort to do something similar but exploit it in minimalist
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None of those things are happening, so no it doesn't want. Your mental masturbation is unhelpful in clarifying what is and instead goes off to consider a hypothetical situation.
China (Score:2)
Pretty sure China will make these listening devices mandatory in all homes and businesses.
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Why should they? There's no need to if they make people want to have them in their homes and buisnesses.
Reminds me of the early ads ... (Score:2)
... for personal computers.
"Look! It even balances my checkbook!!!"
I'm so confused by this (Score:3)
There are already better answers for these things. This is what your smart home hub is for. You are always going to have a poor experience on these things if you are connecting your voice assistant to things like hue, lifx, nest, harmony hub, etc directly. The answer is to integrate all those devices into a flexible and open smart controller like Home assist, Vera, etc and then integrate that and only that with your voice assistant(s).
That way you get a clean and modular system. You'll still have to learn the commands to some extent but because everything is presented to the voice assistant via one plugin/skill/service/whatever the syntax across devices will be uniform and consistent. Have an Alexa and GA or Sirii? Np, those things just talk to the same smart controller, state remains consistent and uniform, Everything and it's dog is including smart features but if you set up multiple things to control the same devices directly you are just asking for trouble.
Besides, if you are ever going to be serious about a smart home you can't use wifi for all your devices, wifi doesn't scale well to high client counts.
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As long as you are doing home assist or similar, consider using snips instead of google or alexa for voice support.
I like the idea of having the home automation on a closed loop for the most part, and keeping the microphones from sending to the internet is just one more nice move.
How to deal with these in somebody else's house (Score:2)
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Teaching (Score:1)
I bought a Google assistant a few months ago, just after it became available in my native language. The one thing that surprised me is that I can't teach it anything. It's supposed to learn, but I can't speed up the learning process by explaining it what I want. Why can't I use my voice to tell it what kind of routines I want? Why is it not possible to teach it synonyms?
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Not quite.... the voice recognition is constantly trained with the misheard samples. But after that, it's a bunch of scripts.
Par for the course for these assistants (Score:2)
They remain what they have been from day one: good for grins and giggles, party games - and very little more. The example given in the summary is a good one: I can do those tasks myself to my satisfaction with very little effort. For the most part, Alexa, Google Assistant, etc. solve problems that don't really exist, or that are so easy to solve with very little effort. They are utterly useless when it comes to trying to get them to do things where even a minimum of ambiguity is involved. Or even when no am
The short version? (Score:2)
These are smart devices, not intelligent devices.
After Decades of Work (Score:2)
I still haven't agreed to Bixby's T.O.S. (Score:2)
I've had a Samsung Galaxy S8 now for almost 18 months and I still haven't agreed to the Bixby terms of service which pop up from time to time (mostly as a result of accidentally pressing that damned Bixby button). It would be nice if I could remove the darned thing altogether (as well as some other shovelware) but since I can't, ain't no way I'm gonna agree to it. It can stay there in its (hopefully) unconfigured state forever.
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They might have more luck if Bixby fronted a cute anime avatar who would pop up and give you a sad look and say "I'm lonely. Won't you install me?"
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Don't.
I've got an S8 that I like and I too have been avoiding Bixby. I know from a friend who had one that if you sign up then it wants to be used and it's terrible.