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Apple Hardware

Mac Mini Receives First Overhaul in Four Years; New iPad Pro With No Home Button Announced (venturebeat.com) 257

Posted by msmash from the shiny-new-objects dept.
Apple is turning its attention to a range of devices it has not upgraded in recent years. Alongside the new MacBook Air that the company unveiled on Tuesday, it is also upgrading the Mac Mini for the first time in four years, and also has a new iPad Pro in the offering. Regarding the new Mac Mini: It has Intel's 8th generation processors -- in four- and six-core i7, i5, and i3 flavors -- and 60 percent faster graphics. The processor's paired with up to 64GB of RAM (8GB comes on standard) at 2666MHz and up to 2TB of SSD storage -- double the capacity of previous Mac Minis. Overall, it's up to 5 times faster than the previous-gen models, Apple claims, and can drive 4K and 5K Thunderbolt displays and output in three formats. In terms of ports, there's plenty to go around: two USB-A, HDMI 2.0 video, four Thunderbolt USB-C, an audio out port, and a Gigbabit Ethernet port (you can add up to 10 Gigabit Ethernet, if you so choose). Also onboard is Apple's T2 chip. It's a 64-bit ARMv8 chip -- a variant of Apple's A10 -- that runs Apple's custom BridgeOS 2.0 operating system (an Apple watch derivative). The new Mac Mini starts at $799. Regarding the new iPad Pro: After months of rumors, Apple has today announced a completely redesigned iPad Pro with slimmed-down bezels, Face ID, a USB-C port, and far more powerful specs than its predecessor. Just like prior years, the new iPad Pro comes in two screen sizes: 11-inch and 12.9-inch. The 11-inch model has essentially the same proportions as the prior 10.5-inch model. And the 12.9-inch model puts the same-sized display into a much smaller form factor. The new iPad Pro starts at $799 for the 11-inch and $999 for the 12.9-inch. Preorders begin today and it ships November 7th. The new Pro is the company's first iPad not to include a home button, which allowed Apple to extend the screen vertically for a much more immersive experience. The bezels have been downsized on all four sides. [...] But something else has been removed, too: the headphone jack. There's no 3.5mm port visible on any of the device's sides, meaning that buyers will need a USB-C-to-headphone dongle to listen to music through wired headphones. The 11-inch iPad Pro starts at $799. The 12.9-inch version starts at $999. It goes on sale today and ships on November 7.
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Mac Mini Receives First Overhaul in Four Years; New iPad Pro With No Home Button Announced More

Mac Mini Receives First Overhaul in Four Years; New iPad Pro With No Home Button Announced

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  • "32GB Comes Standard" (Score:5, Informative)

    by willaien ( 2494962 ) on Tuesday October 30, 2018 @10:28AM (#57561899)

    What? No. 8GB is standard. 32GB is $600 more - almost the full price of the base model.

    • Re:"32GB Comes Standard" (Score:4, Insightful)

      by alvinrod ( 889928 ) on Tuesday October 30, 2018 @10:34AM (#57561957)
      Apparently the RAM is user upgradable, so why you'd want to pay Apple's obscene markup to install a few DIMMs for you is beyond me.

      • Sure, if I were buying it and wanted 32GB, I wouldn't be paying $600 for sure. Just complaining about the inaccurate article (or summary) that claims 32GB is "standard" on the product. If that were the case, then the $799 price point wouldn't actually be that bad.

        • Re: (Score:2, Interesting)

          by alvinrod ( 889928 )
          Fair point, but still doesn't change the fact that if you can upgrade the memory yourself there's no point at all to pay the Apple tax. I haven't checked recently, but you should be able to get 32 GB for well under $300.

          Apple always makes the entry tier for their products crappy so push people into the next product wrung where they charge an extra $200+ for components that cost them maybe $20, so that it's pretty much pure profit. Then they've got the high-end model that's even more expensive, but isn't

          • Re:"32GB Comes Standard" (Score:5, Interesting)

            by hawk ( 1151 ) <hawk@eyry.org> on Tuesday October 30, 2018 @12:03PM (#57562703) Journal

            > there's no point at all to pay the Apple tax.

            The reason that you *consider* paying apple memory prices is that apple's specs for memory are something like a half a standard deviation higher than other good memory.

            I don't find it worth it, but the reality is that meeting apple's specs is more expensive.

            Then again, a few years ago when I brought my iMac in the third time for crashes, they returned it with my bank of aftermarket memory in a bag--with the offending stick labeled . . .

            hawk

            • The reason that you *consider* paying apple memory prices is that apple's specs for memory are something like a half a standard deviation higher than other good memory.

              Except you get basically zero performance benefit for it, so no.

            • Comment removed based on user account deletion

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Octorian ( 14086 )

        Many years ago, when I bought an Apple laptop, I ordered my extra RAM stick separately from Crucial. (way back when you could still do this)
        Much to my surprise, the "much cheaper" RAM I got was the SAME brand and part number as what Apple was shipping the machine with!

  • will changing the ram void the warranty?

    it does have so-dimms

    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by willaien ( 2494962 )

      Legally, no. https://www.ftc.gov/news-event... [ftc.gov]

      Will apple claim it will? Probably.

      • will they try to lock the ram to the T2 chip?

        • Re:will changing the ram void the warranty? (Score:5, Insightful)

          by alvinrod ( 889928 ) on Tuesday October 30, 2018 @10:57AM (#57562133)
          Why would they bother making it user upgradable if they were going to lock it down like that?

          If they were going to do that, they'd just solder the RAM to the board so they could shave an extra .5 mm off the height of the product.

          • > Why would they bother making it user upgradable if they were going to lock it down like that?

            The cynic in me would suggest they'd do that to teach their customers an expensive lesson. Like their Genius Bar currently does with small repairs they no longer bother diagnosing and just lie about the cause and recommend a new unit instead.

    • Given that the RAM is user upgradeable, just as it was in many of the previous generations (though not the last gen or two), I'm going to go with a resounding "no".

    • will changing the ram void the warranty?

      it does have so-dimms

      No. Never has. Never will.

      And for all the Haters that have posted hand-wringing bullshit about Apple "not listening": Well, witness the result of Apple listening!

      (MUCH!) Better CPU (up to a SIX core i7)? Check!

      Upgradeable RAM? Check!

      Up to 64 GB RAM? Check!

      Upgradeable SSD? Possibly (PCI-e Based)

      Up to 2 TB SSD? Check!

      10gigE Option? Check!

      USB-A AND HDMI (plus FOUR USB-C/TB3 Ports)? Check!

      And it STILL has a 3.5mm Headphone Jack...

      This is one FANTASTIC Upgrade!

      But I'm sure the Haters will STILL find SOMETHING t

  • seems a bit high even for Apple. And it's probably a laptop chip version of the i3 based on the form factor...
  • This T2 chip raises all kinds of security and thirt party OS support concerns here, After all the Intel ME and other backdoor stuff we need less hidden System Management Controler state and attack surface, not more. Especially in such consumer devices where not many use any extra functionality added by those.

  • be nice to have 10-gig switches come down in price. Small hope for a big roll out of US ISP's to have 1G/1G much less higher any time soon.

    • If history of Apple including things has been any indication, they will.

      USB hubs and devices used to be rare and expensive, until Jobs rolled out the iMac and told Apple users to deal with it.

      The computer I took to college in 2001 had a gigabit port and switches finally came down in price to use the full gig.

      "Airport" was pretty revolutionary at the time, now there's 802.11 everywhere. Prices for PC components started coming down, most using the same Atheros(?) chipsets as the first airport devices.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by guruevi ( 827432 )

      You can get a managed 24 port 10G switch sub-$8000. Unmanaged 4 ports are ~$500. If you want to go cheaper, Huawei has some decent gear for less than Netgear.

  • Comment removed (Score:5, Funny)

    by account_deleted ( 4530225 ) on Tuesday October 30, 2018 @10:37AM (#57561975)
    Comment removed based on user account deletion
    • I suppose there's two sides to that. If you buy now, you don't have to feel like something better will just come out next year, at least not if you're just going to stick with Apple no matter what and not consider getting a PC. And to be fair, given how little Intel has progressed with their CPUs until very recently, there hasn't been a lot of reason to upgrade.

      What I'm most interested in is the SoC in the new iPad. It's probably more powerful than what they put in the new Air, so I'm wondering how much

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Kjella ( 173770 )

        What I'm most interested in is the SoC in the new iPad. It's probably more powerful than what they put in the new Air, so I'm wondering how much longer until Apple ditches Intel entirely. You have to think that they've been planning for it for some time now.

        They might just be waiting for better capacity and higher yields, the A12 and A12X are still relatively small and max out at four high performance cores. It's impressive for a tablet but to replace the whole non-pro Mac line they'd probably want at least an 8-core and more GPU to drive big external monitors. They have the building blocks but when you look at the iPhone/iPad prices it might not be the time for an even more expensive SoC. Once AMD/nVidia are able to make big GPUs though the door is open for a

    • That is the real problem with Apples Macintosh lineup. Where we use to have a yearly upgrade they seem to fall every 4 years. And their price doesn't seem to go down the next year. There really isn't a good time to buy one. The Air and the Mini, are already under-powered new (About a year old tech). Which isn't bad, but if you are going to keep it for 4 years or 8 years then these will be miserably out of date during your next upgrade. And you can't wait a year or two to get it on the cheap.

      • And some of that comes from "design over all else." You make a beautiful machine and then, next year, CPUs change and the thermal system can't handle it without a redesign. Redesigns are expensive, so Apple doesn't do it and keeps cranking out the same stuff as last year.

        I'm waiting to see what happens when Intel comes out with the next generation of Xeons and how long it takes for Apple to update the iMac Pro. As I've said before, if I'm spending $5000 for a computer, I expect it to have the latest and

  • I wanted to buy a Mini a few years back, but for the same money, I could buy a much higher spec Intel NUC box as a Hackintosh, so that's where we went. The Hackintosh has worked well, though it has a few glitches, and I'm afraid to install upgrades in case it breaks something.

    It looks like with this upgrade, the equation stays the same. If you're willing to do a Hackintosh, you can get something much better at a lower cost.

    • Mac Mini just releasing hardware with Intel NUC [amazon.com] specs that's been out for some time now.

      Maybe I'll just buy this NUC8 beast instead for half the price and dualboot both.

      -dk

    • If you're willing to do a Hackintosh, you can get something much better at a lower cost.

      I kind of question much better.

      Are you going to have much better storage speed for a lower cost? I'm not sure about that. Also much better connectivity? I don't think so. Much better fan noise? Also not too sure on that front.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by jedidiah ( 1196 )

        If you're doing a Hackintosh then you can ditch the whole low profile thing entirely and have a MUCH better range of available options.

        Even with a NUC, you probably still have a much better range of available options.

        The limiting factor is the small subset of the available PC options that MacOS will actually support.

    • Maybe a lower monetary cost, but you've already pointed out the other factor: you're time and stress. How much is that worth to you?

      For me, if I wanted to be afraid that my whole computer would be bricked because of an update, I may as well just use Windows 10. Then I'd at least be able to play the latest games on it too.

  • SSDs do go bad. Now, with Moore's law gone, those machines could have lasted longer than they will now. If Apple cared about the environment more than their money, they would make them repairable.

    I create content, and 10% of my Samsung 850 SSD life is used up.
    • That makes me think of my Samsung 850... what's the easiest way to check the estimated lifespan? Haven't made it a habit in a long while, used to use SpeedFan to check SMART info but that's not a thing for SSDs, right?

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by TXJD ( 5534458 )
        Have you tried Samsung's own SSD Magician software? it gives a lifetime estimate. https://www.samsung.com/semico... [samsung.com]

      • SMART is definitely a thing for SSDs. The only quirk is NVMe drives, they don't access the drive controllers in the same way so some SMART software doesn't work with them.

        SSDs report metrics such as total read, total written, unexpected power loss, power loss protection failure (if an SSD has it), or the one of interest to the GP: 231 - Life Left, 231 - Endurance Remaining, or 233 - Media Wearout.

        My NVMe drive reports two temperatures, the controller (which should stay cool) and the NAND (which should stay

    • They are repairable (Score:4, Insightful)

      by SuperKendall ( 25149 ) on Tuesday October 30, 2018 @11:36AM (#57562453)

      SSDs do go bad. Now, with Moore's law gone, those machines could have lasted longer than they will now. If Apple cared about the environment more than their money, they would make them repairable.

      What makes you think they are not repairable?

      At least by Apple they will be. But on the iMac Pro the SSD chips are removable [macobserver.com] so I don't see why that would change on the Mac mini.

      Also the systems are fully recycled by Apple, no it's meaningless to complain about caring for the environment because the system might die.

      I create content, and 10% of my Samsung 850 SSD life is used up.

      That's kind of an older SSD drive (I have one as well). At this point I would say lots of other system components are going to go before the SSD chips do.

      • Recycling takes energy and has environmental concerns of its own. The best form of "recycling" for the environment is the ability to continue to use the hardware for a longer time. Swappable SSD and RAM help this immensely -- if one fails, you're recycling a 1 x 2 inch board, not the entire fucking computer.

        • Swappable SSD and RAM help this immensely

          Which the Mac mini has (for sure the RAM, maybe the SSD). But they do not "help immensely" if they are never done during the life of the device. As I said, I think with newer chips the SSD will probably outlast most other components in the system.

          Recycling takes energy and has environmental concerns of its own.

          I think you are confusing what Apple is doing with the way others "recycle". Apple is reclaiming all minerals from recycled devices so they can use them in

          • And melting things down or leaching minerals from ground up ICs doesn't take energy or produce toxic waste?

            • And melting things down or leaching minerals from ground up ICs doesn't take energy or produce toxic waste?

              See: Subject line.

              You seriously think getting minerals out the earth is way easier or involves LESS toxins than anything in a computer?? Come on.

              You've obviously never seen the outside of an old mine... with bright orange streams of water nearby.

              • We're not comparing mining de novo to recycling. We're comparing recycling to continued long-term usage.

                • And as I already pointed out, long term usage is not affected on the new Mac mini either, so why you would carry on down that irrelevant point is beyond me.

                  However you are also incorrect in one regard - even just ruddying yourself of an old device can provide supplies used to build a new one for someone else instead of mining.

                  I'll let you have the last response since you seem stuck on a track.

                  • as I already pointed out, long term usage is not affected on the new Mac mini either

                    That depends on how long Apple will continue to make new versions of Xcode compatible with this Mac mini model. Someone who doesn't need an Xcode license could probably just buy an Intel NUC and install GNU/Linux.

    • > If Apple cared about the environment more than their money, they would make them repairable.

      thatsthejoke.jpg

  • iPad Pro update is what I hoping for (Score:4, Interesting)

    by SuperKendall ( 25149 ) on Tuesday October 30, 2018 @11:11AM (#57562245)

    I really liked the Mac mini refresh, but what I really loved was the iPad Pro update.

    I had the first larger 12.9" iPad Pro before, which I liked quite a lot for photo editing.

    Now though, the newer one has FaceID - was nicer with a device you can hold in any direction than trying to find the home button. And the power seems really impressive, the demo they gave showing editing a 3GB PSD was the most impressive thing I saw at the Apple event.

    The USB-C connection also is great for connection to external monitors and other things I already have accessories for... and the redesign of the pencil to simultaneously clamp onto an edge (I think any edge?) and charge at the same time is a great touch.

    Also if you look at it from a pure travel standpoint, the new MacBook Air is 2.75 lbs - but the largest iPad Pro is just 1.25lbs or so!! That is a huge difference in what you have to lug around, as long as what you need to do can be done on the iPad Pro. For photo editing when traveling this device is pretty much perfect now.

    Perhaps finally Apple will bring Xcode to the iPad Pro...

  • I thought that the new processor in the new ipad pro seemed very convincing (traditional speed test to confirm). I have the previous model ipad pro which is already pretty quick, and this is a step up, plus it has a co processor for machine learning apps as well.
  • That abomination of a connector needs to die a slow, painful death... And with it, the $2+ that the Lightning Apple Tax costs accessory makers.

    • I don't know why you say that. IMO the lightning connector was a brilliant design. Fully reversible and very hard to ruin. It was, in every aspect, vastly superior to the existing USB connectors.

      The only problem is that Apple kept it to themselves. If they had offered it to the USB standards group it could have become the next USB connector.

      • Putting pins in the phone is the WORST thing you can do, you want the pins/wipers (those are the parts that wear out) on the cable, since that is cheaper to replace. Pads go in the phone, pins in the cable. Not the way that Apple did it, which is backwards.
  • ... but I might be tempted to spend some of my Christmas money on one all the same ;-) ... very excited by it. And love the colour.

  • Apple craps on education and music again... (Score:3)

    by greenwow ( 3635575 ) on Tuesday October 30, 2018 @12:14PM (#57562791)

    They're forgetting that education made the company originally and music saved it later. Dropping headphone jacks will be a huge pain and expense for education. I teach a high school comp sci class twice a week, and it's already a huge pain to keep the iPads charged. There's no way the school will be able to afford BT headphones and deal with the hassle of keeping them charged. Also, the best headphones are all wired.

  • While the Apple Pencil appears to be a better design, it still is flawed. Apple has a real problem with treating accessories as total after thoughts. Magnetic attachment to the side? That's fine I guess until I want to put it away or carry it or do anything besides gently put on on a desktop and not touch it. Knocking it off the edge will be stupid easy. Even worse if you want to carry it somewhere without worrying about it falling off. How about a design that won't fall off/out with the slightest pro

  • Someone mentioned the Mini on the MacBook Air thread, and I responded there forgetting which thread I was on, even though I only discussed the 2014 Mac Mini catastrophe.

    Because a small number of people read these threads months later, here's a link:

    https://apple.slashdot.org/com... [slashdot.org]

    • Idared (Score:2)

      by epine ( 68316 )

      Funny story.

      My wife named her 2008 iMac Idared [wikipedia.org].

      Idared is a type of apple cultivar from Moscow, Idaho, United States. Variety is characterized by a non-uniform skin color.

      But it can also be read as iDared.

  • Comment removed based on user account deletion

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