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Businesses Apple Technology

Apple Hired Scores of Ex-Tesla Employees This Year (cnbc.com) 108

According to CNBC, citing current and former Tesla employees and LinkedIn, Apple has hired scores of employees from Tesla since late 2017, including manufacturing, security and software engineers, as well as supply chain experts. The report mentions that they're hiring Tesla employees not just for the company's Project Titan self-driving car project, but for its other products too. From the report: In 2018 so far, LinkedIn data shows Apple has hired at least 46 people who worked at Tesla directly before joining the consumer electronics juggernaut. Eight of these were engineering interns. This year Apple has also hired former Tesla Autopilot, QA, Powertrain, mechanical design and firmware engineers, and several global supply chain managers. Some employees joined directly from Tesla, while others had been dismissed or laid off before joining Apple. Some ex-Tesla employees who joined Apple this year have not yet updated their public social media profiles with their new career info. That includes Apple's most noteworthy hire, Doug Field, Tesla's former Senior Vice President of Engineering. Tesla disputes CNBC's report, saying that voluntary attrition has decreased by one-third over the last twelve months, and that it has recently added talent from Apple and other companies. Regarding competition with Apple for talent, a Tesla spokesperson said, "We wish them well. Tesla is the hard path. We have 100 times less money than Apple, so of course they can afford to pay more. We are in extremely difficult battles against entrenched auto companies that make 100 times more cars than we did last year, so of course this is very hard work."
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Apple Hired Scores of Ex-Tesla Employees This Year

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  • by Kokuyo ( 549451 ) on Friday August 24, 2018 @02:07AM (#57184744) Journal

    So basically Screw the lazy asses?

    Could have put a little bit more grace and a little bit less butt-hurt into the statement but I'll agree on one thing: How is it news that a few of your employees are hired by Apple unless the number represents a major chunk of your workforce?

    • by mark_reh ( 2015546 ) on Friday August 24, 2018 @05:38AM (#57185292) Journal

      It's news because it indicates that Apple and Tesla didn't collude to set salaries and benefits like other Silicon Valley companies do every day.

  • by WindBourne ( 631190 ) on Friday August 24, 2018 @02:14AM (#57184768) Journal
    Google and Apple have the funds to build a new car line. So far, nothing out of either of them.
    This hiring shows that Apple might finally be getting ready to do so. One question would be, will they stay in the states?

    Another would be would Apple consider buying a company like Rivan?
    • Google had worked on a self-driving electric car. Then they decided that build the whole car was madness and that they should pivot that project into a sepearate company that is now working on developing self-driving cars based on existing cars with added hardware.
      It's called Waymo and they're making great progress, they make Tesla's efforts seem like childsplay.

    • Google and Apple have the funds to build a new car line. So far, nothing out of either of them.

      Why should they? The automotive industry is all about MASSIVE volume (millions of cars a year, not 100,000) because the margins are so low, making 6.2% net [nikkei.com] is the high bar. It takes literally tens of billions of dollars of investment and decades of building up a supply base and industrial capacity to, at the end of it, hopefully make 6 bucks on every 100 dollars of revenue - provided you can sell more than a few hundred thousand vehicles a year.

      • Are you sure [ferrari.com]?
        Total shipments of 8,398 units, up 384 units (+4.8%)
        Net revenues at Euro 3,417 million, up 10.0% (+11.2% at constant currencies)
        Adjusted EBITDA(1) of Euro 1,036 million, margin at 30.3% (29.8% without FX hedges(2))
        Adjusted EBIT(1) of Euro 775 million, 230 bps margin increase to 22.7% (22.1% without FX hedges(2))
        Adjusted net profit(1) up 26.4% to Euro 537 million
        Net industrial debt(1) down Euro 180 million to Euro 473 million
        Dividend distribution proposal of Euro 0.71 per common share(3)
        • If Tesla wanted to be a niche, specialty maker - then they should never have bought NUMMI, it's too big. Now look at companies that build more than 700 cars a month...
          • The automotive industry is all about MASSIVE volume (millions of cars a year, not 100,000)

            Who cares what Tesla wanted to do. You premise is incorrect.

            • No, it is not. You pointed to a tiny outlier; the industry as a whole is tickled to make 6% return. Tesla currently makes -18% return. They have a LONG way to go to even break even, let alone reach typical industry returns of 5-6%. Ferrari takes a full year to sell what Tesla does in ~2 months; and Ford sells in 1 day what Tesla does in a month.
              • The automotive industry is all about MASSIVE volume (millions of cars a year, not 10

                Your premise is wrong. There are different types of car companies.

  • by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 24, 2018 @02:21AM (#57184792)

    If you open the door to an Apple car, do you void the warranty? Do you get to replace the car battery, or do you need to drive to your nearest Apple genius?

  • by Mr. Dollar Ton ( 5495648 ) on Friday August 24, 2018 @02:29AM (#57184810)

    Apparently, working for Tesla is now officially a shit show: https://nypost.com/2018/08/23/... [nypost.com]

  • ...because they're used to shit employment terms and conditions, so they'll be cheap and easy...
    • Also don't forget: ... because Tesla had a layoff two months ago that was felt disproportionately in non-car-production positions. You know, exactly the kind of workers that Apple is probably looking for.

      Shocking that a handful of them would end up in Cupertino, what with it being oh-so-far away from Fremont, and suddenly available for full-time employment...

  • Why do they hire in lots of twenty people at a time?
    • Because that was the way to make the headline sound like a bigger deal than it really is. When the two companies involved have tens of thousands of employees, one company having hired 46 of the other's former employees is both insignificant and boring. It's not news for employees in one big high tech company to move on to another one.
  • ...be careful not to hire Elon Musk when he quits.
  • Real fun figuring out a one button car.
  • collude to set job descriptions, benefits, and salaries in order to "maintain stability" in the work force? I'm shocked at this is very un-silicon valley-like behavior.

  • by beheaderaswp ( 549877 ) * on Friday August 24, 2018 @05:37AM (#57185290)

    What a wonderful, unfiltered, nugget of truth put forth by that spokesperson. Refreshing.

    You always bleed some talent after a startup has some success. People move on for cushier positions because startup employment is hard work.

    Apple went through something similar in the mid to late 90s. The people who stayed were said to "bleed six colors". The return of Jobs put and end to that :)

    Nothing new here- except someone told the truth. Wonderful!

  • by turp182 ( 1020263 ) on Friday August 24, 2018 @06:38AM (#57185462) Journal

    Apple has about 123,000 FTEs:
    https://www.google.com/search?... [google.com]

    Tesla has about 37,500:
    https://www.google.com/search?... [google.com]

    The article quotes that Apple hired "at least 46 people who worked at Tesla directly". Almost "four scores", which would have been historically interesting.

    Oh, and some had already been laid off or left Tesla.

    So, Apple hired a staggering 0.123% of Tesla's folk (46/37,500).

    Given the # of people that work at Apple, they probably hire far more than 46 people on a given day (maybe even a given hour).

    • by Anonymous Coward

      A dozen is 12; a score is 20.

      46 is almost 4 dozen (48) but nowhere near 4 scores (80).

      But what matters most is that Apple is hiring electric car engineers. Of course we can't tell if these engineers are working on an electric car project or some other random thing.

      dom

    • by hey! ( 33014 )

      Add to this that software engineering has one of the highest turnover rates of any profession. More than 13% of software engineers change their jobs in any given year.

      Assuming that Tesla is representative, and that it does indeed have 37500 engineers, you'd expect 4875 of them to get new jobs each year. So Apple would have hired a little less than 1% of the Tesla engineers coming onto the job market.

      It doesn't look like Apple is making a wholesale effort to snap up Tesla expertise. But that doesn't pre

  • Who wrote this headline, Abraham Lincoln?
    • Easiest way to tell if a person is either historically aware or "of a certain age" is to describe your age in scores. Saying "I am two score and 10" leaves most of those under 25 scratching their heads...
  • by tungstencoil ( 1016227 ) on Friday August 24, 2018 @08:35AM (#57185944)
    It really makes me question the culture and conditions when someone in a Position of Authority claims that person/people left because the work is 'too challenging' (unless the person leaving explicitly states that). It not only obviously casts a bad light on the previous employee, but it speaks to someone's naive thought that it paints them as scrappier/smarter/more interesting.... Spoiler alert: you almost certainly aren't.

    It's like the remember the old Marine ad campaign that essentially said "we do more hard stuff before 6 AM than most everyone does in their entire day." People were like, "And that's a recruitment ad?! That's supposed to want to make me join?!"

    It did... or rather, it targeted their demographic. Employers who do this kind of ex post facto version by disparaging employees who quit and (gasp!) get a job somewhere else are just douchey.

    Source: I once had an employer's reaction to me quitting was that 'some people just don't like the updated pace since we were acquired,' No, jackass, I didn't like the fact that I was promoted a year ago, told at the time the acquisition meant salary freeze... when the freeze was lifted my as-of-yet-unknown raise would be paid retroactively. Finally lifted, good news: my 1% salary increase would be paid retroactively. My previous boss - whose job I took - made double my salary. The 1% was an insult. Best part: she was genuinely surprised, then angry, when I quit. I understood the acquiring company paid less for the same positions and I was already in the promotion's band but... yeah.... I couldn't keep up... but the three people hired to backfill probably did OK.
    • by shess ( 31691 )

      Employers who do this kind of ex post facto version by disparaging employees who quit and (gasp!) get a job somewhere else are just douchey.

      Or it means that they aren't able to retain adult HR people. It's easy enough to just say "Different people have different needs in their lives, and it is not our place to share confidential information about ex-employees". Done. You can have the bestest company in the world, doing the most interesting or important work, and people's needs and goals are still going to differ from what the company wants them to do.

  • If your people are worth poaching, you've got good people.
  • Obviously the return flight would be an in-app purchase.

    • 1. FTA: "Eight of these were engineering interns." So the real number is 36.
    • 2. also FTA: "...others had been dismissed or laid off before joining Apple." So the real number is fewer than 36. i.e. they needed a job.
    • 3. FTA: "This year Apple has also hired former Tesla Autopilot, QA, Powertrain, mechanical design and firmware engineers, and several global supply chain managers..." We don't know who these people were or how vital they were to Teslas operation.
    • I'm no fan of Tesla, but when you read the article,

Some people manage by the book, even though they don't know who wrote the book or even what book.

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