Apple Hired Scores of Ex-Tesla Employees This Year (cnbc.com) 108
According to CNBC, citing current and former Tesla employees and LinkedIn, Apple has hired scores of employees from Tesla since late 2017, including manufacturing, security and software engineers, as well as supply chain experts. The report mentions that they're hiring Tesla employees not just for the company's Project Titan self-driving car project, but for its other products too. From the report: In 2018 so far, LinkedIn data shows Apple has hired at least 46 people who worked at Tesla directly before joining the consumer electronics juggernaut. Eight of these were engineering interns. This year Apple has also hired former Tesla Autopilot, QA, Powertrain, mechanical design and firmware engineers, and several global supply chain managers. Some employees joined directly from Tesla, while others had been dismissed or laid off before joining Apple. Some ex-Tesla employees who joined Apple this year have not yet updated their public social media profiles with their new career info. That includes Apple's most noteworthy hire, Doug Field, Tesla's former Senior Vice President of Engineering. Tesla disputes CNBC's report, saying that voluntary attrition has decreased by one-third over the last twelve months, and that it has recently added talent from Apple and other companies. Regarding competition with Apple for talent, a Tesla spokesperson said, "We wish them well. Tesla is the hard path. We have 100 times less money than Apple, so of course they can afford to pay more. We are in extremely difficult battles against entrenched auto companies that make 100 times more cars than we did last year, so of course this is very hard work."
What Tesla is saying (Score:3)
So basically Screw the lazy asses?
Could have put a little bit more grace and a little bit less butt-hurt into the statement but I'll agree on one thing: How is it news that a few of your employees are hired by Apple unless the number represents a major chunk of your workforce?
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Don't worry, you can also find stories today where they found a couple disgruntled salespeople to complain about the company, being reported as front-page news all over the place. One was mad that someone emailed a picture of the couch Musk sleeps on. Another was mad that people are nice to Elon in meetings.
Given that the company has ~40k employees, they can surely run hit pieces like this every day, all year long.
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Elon doesn’t sleep on that couch. He takes week long vacations then lies to the media saying he hasn’t had a vacation in years [bloomberg.com].
Re:What Tesla is saying (Score:5, Informative)
The very article you linked says things like "The Tesla CEO has sacrificed sleep and worked into the wee hours on the factory floor, against the conventional wisdom of mental-health advocates and CEO coaches".
Nobody has said that Elon hasn't had a vacation in years. He very publicly went to Israel with his kids early this year, and posted photos from it. He hasn't taken more than a week off at a time in years. He basically goes through long bursts with little sleep up until specific deadlines, then gets away for a couple days, a couple times per year. The only time off since the Israel trip was his brother's three-day wedding in Spain, arriving in the morning on the same day as it started - as confirmed by the flight records. There was a several hour stopover in Belfast on the way back.
Numerous people at the factory, both on and off the record, have confirmed that he does sleep on that couch.
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He basically goes through long bursts with little sleep up until specific deadlines, then gets away for a couple days, a couple times per year.
Maybe he should stop stretching himself so thin. Projects like Hyperloop and his Boring company are big wastes of time when he's already in charge of an electric car company and a space company.
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Numerous people at the factory, both on and off the record, have confirmed that he does sleep on that couch.
My housekeeper's husband who works there as a welder also told me this before it was widely spread news.
Some people do say that overwork is the sign of a failed business model and I believe that as well. However my guess is that someone of Elon's mindset doesn't consider that overwork. He is doing something extra-ordinary (and has already achieved many such things) and there is no question he is personally willing to personally do what it takes to make Tesla successful.
And someone wants to replace a CEO
Errr, (Score:2)
I don't know if you've ever worked for a startup that crashed and burned and ruined everyone's mental health and finances and spawned multiple lawsuits and wasted gigantic amounts of seed money,
but CEOs of those invariably sleep on couches as well.
It's not proof of anything except the _inability_ to effectively delegate - whether for systemic reasons, or deleterious personal preference.
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1) Actually, by design, he tries to interact with as large of a portion of the company as possible. He's strongly of the philosophy that a CEO should personally experience all parts of a company's business to get a real understanding of what's going on and what's required.
2) Sales people complaining about emails not sent by him are not personally "interacting with" him.
3) Get your shorts in! Keep your skin in the short game through the Q3 earnings report ;)
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Yeah, a pile of scrap cardboard for recycling caught fire. OMG, stop the presses!
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Fires like this don’t happen at competent car companies. Competent car companies remember to install all the bolts [investopedia.com].
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The average Tesla Model 3 is still almost $60K. Far from the mass market under $40K car promised, and no signs they can make a profit under $40K for years to come.
https://insideevs.com/asp-tesla-model-3-59000/
And yes, losing some employees is no big deal. But losing key leaders is, particularly at a time when the CEO is struggling to adequately manage the operations, and cash is becoming a huge concern.
And now we are seeing reports of poorly constructed cars, not surprising given the over-extension of capa
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Actually, by design, he tries to interact with as large of a portion of the company as possible.
Is that how he met you, the intern that shills for Tesla on slashdot?
Get your shorts in!
I'll cover at $4.20, no worries ;)
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Unfortunately for a company that is trying to push out new Ideas. There is a a tight line of power, with very little room at the final decision making for debate.
This usually means the Boss is a Power Mad Dick. Because he is completely focused on his vision, and needs people to help complete it, but doesn't want their vision to pollute his.
This pollution or consensus building that employees tend to like because it gives them the feel of having more power, often will make too many compromises and make produ
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Musk lamented having barely enough time to savor the moment, with the newspaper reporting that he arrived two hours before the ceremony and returned to Tesla’s factory immediately after. (Bloomberg News pieced together the details of his trip from Musk’s tweets and flight data.)
So, Musk claims to have rushed in and out for the wedding only; but the data - tweets, locations, and flight data - show otherwise. I guess this is as reliable as the funding secured at $420, right? Less than 3 quarters of cash in the bank, time to enjoy the good life while you can!
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It actually was a Tesla representative that replied. Musk wasn't quoted. From TFA:
Tesla's full statement about talent competition with Apple follows:
"We wish them well. Tesla is the hard path. We have 100 times less money than Apple, so of course they can afford to pay more. We are in extremely difficult battles against entrenched auto companies that make 100 times more cars than we did last year, so of course this is very hard work. We don't even have money for advertising or endorsements or discounts, so must survive on the quality of our products alone. Nonetheless, we believe in our mission and that it is worth the sacrifice of time and the never ending barrage of negativity by those who wish us ill. So it goes. The world must move to sustainable energy and it must do so now."
So I guess tangentally it's on Musk for Tesla having an idiot who gave a shitty official quote to a non-story.
Re:What Tesla is saying (Score:5, Insightful)
It's news because it indicates that Apple and Tesla didn't collude to set salaries and benefits like other Silicon Valley companies do every day.
the future is going to be interesting (Score:3)
This hiring shows that Apple might finally be getting ready to do so. One question would be, will they stay in the states?
Another would be would Apple consider buying a company like Rivan?
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Google had worked on a self-driving electric car. Then they decided that build the whole car was madness and that they should pivot that project into a sepearate company that is now working on developing self-driving cars based on existing cars with added hardware.
It's called Waymo and they're making great progress, they make Tesla's efforts seem like childsplay.
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Google and Apple have the funds to build a new car line. So far, nothing out of either of them.
Why should they? The automotive industry is all about MASSIVE volume (millions of cars a year, not 100,000) because the margins are so low, making 6.2% net [nikkei.com] is the high bar. It takes literally tens of billions of dollars of investment and decades of building up a supply base and industrial capacity to, at the end of it, hopefully make 6 bucks on every 100 dollars of revenue - provided you can sell more than a few hundred thousand vehicles a year.
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Total shipments of 8,398 units, up 384 units (+4.8%)
Net revenues at Euro 3,417 million, up 10.0% (+11.2% at constant currencies)
Adjusted EBITDA(1) of Euro 1,036 million, margin at 30.3% (29.8% without FX hedges(2))
Adjusted EBIT(1) of Euro 775 million, 230 bps margin increase to 22.7% (22.1% without FX hedges(2))
Adjusted net profit(1) up 26.4% to Euro 537 million
Net industrial debt(1) down Euro 180 million to Euro 473 million
Dividend distribution proposal of Euro 0.71 per common share(3)
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The automotive industry is all about MASSIVE volume (millions of cars a year, not 100,000)
Who cares what Tesla wanted to do. You premise is incorrect.
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The automotive industry is all about MASSIVE volume (millions of cars a year, not 10
Your premise is wrong. There are different types of car companies.
To enter or not to enter (Score:5, Funny)
If you open the door to an Apple car, do you void the warranty? Do you get to replace the car battery, or do you need to drive to your nearest Apple genius?
Re: To enter or not to enter (Score:5, Funny)
Android manufacturers are waiting for Apple to release a car they can copy.
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But it will be priced like a Lexus; so thats pretty innovative.
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And you can only get in if you have an Apple-shaped ass. How courageous!
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Re: To enter or not to enter (Score:2)
And then Samsung will unveil an identical car with confusing and unresponsive controls
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Android manufacturers are waiting for Apple to release a car they can copy.
They may be waiting for an Apple to copy, but when released they'll be able to Paste too.
Why shouldn't they leave? (Score:4, Interesting)
Apparently, working for Tesla is now officially a shit show: https://nypost.com/2018/08/23/... [nypost.com]
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According to one of the narratives, your calling the media names, blaming the messengers for the bad news and complaining about "fake sources" is quite similar to the way a Trumpy would do it.
Be that as it may, we know from different sources that a bunch of staff has left Tesla, and that since the likes of Apple hire them they are pretty good. These independent observations corroborate the nypost story.
If you have facts that negate it, please post them instead of throwing insults and FUD, it would be a more
Apple Hired Scores of Ex-Tesla Employees This Year (Score:1)
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Also don't forget: ... because Tesla had a layoff two months ago that was felt disproportionately in non-car-production positions. You know, exactly the kind of workers that Apple is probably looking for.
Shocking that a handful of them would end up in Cupertino, what with it being oh-so-far away from Fremont, and suddenly available for full-time employment...
Weird hiring practices (Score:2)
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Nice practice, but... (Score:2)
One button (Score:1)
Does this mean that Tesla and Apple didn't (Score:2)
collude to set job descriptions, benefits, and salaries in order to "maintain stability" in the work force? I'm shocked at this is very un-silicon valley-like behavior.
Corporate truth.. Amazing... (Score:3)
What a wonderful, unfiltered, nugget of truth put forth by that spokesperson. Refreshing.
You always bleed some talent after a startup has some success. People move on for cushier positions because startup employment is hard work.
Apple went through something similar in the mid to late 90s. The people who stayed were said to "bleed six colors". The return of Jobs put and end to that :)
Nothing new here- except someone told the truth. Wonderful!
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In the mid to late 90s, Apple was considered a shit show by everybody except the evangelists, up to and including Steve Jobs.
Let's Consider the Numbers (Score:5, Interesting)
Apple has about 123,000 FTEs:
https://www.google.com/search?... [google.com]
Tesla has about 37,500:
https://www.google.com/search?... [google.com]
The article quotes that Apple hired "at least 46 people who worked at Tesla directly". Almost "four scores", which would have been historically interesting.
Oh, and some had already been laid off or left Tesla.
So, Apple hired a staggering 0.123% of Tesla's folk (46/37,500).
Given the # of people that work at Apple, they probably hire far more than 46 people on a given day (maybe even a given hour).
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A dozen is 12; a score is 20.
46 is almost 4 dozen (48) but nowhere near 4 scores (80).
But what matters most is that Apple is hiring electric car engineers. Of course we can't tell if these engineers are working on an electric car project or some other random thing.
dom
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Add to this that software engineering has one of the highest turnover rates of any profession. More than 13% of software engineers change their jobs in any given year.
Assuming that Tesla is representative, and that it does indeed have 37500 engineers, you'd expect 4875 of them to get new jobs each year. So Apple would have hired a little less than 1% of the Tesla engineers coming onto the job market.
It doesn't look like Apple is making a wholesale effort to snap up Tesla expertise. But that doesn't pre
Scores of them? Really? (Score:2)
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hah. Like Slashdot moves the needle on relevance anymore.
Name Calling? (Score:3)
It's like the remember the old Marine ad campaign that essentially said "we do more hard stuff before 6 AM than most everyone does in their entire day." People were like, "And that's a recruitment ad?! That's supposed to want to make me join?!"
It did... or rather, it targeted their demographic. Employers who do this kind of ex post facto version by disparaging employees who quit and (gasp!) get a job somewhere else are just douchey.
Source: I once had an employer's reaction to me quitting was that 'some people just don't like the updated pace since we were acquired,' No, jackass, I didn't like the fact that I was promoted a year ago, told at the time the acquisition meant salary freeze... when the freeze was lifted my as-of-yet-unknown raise would be paid retroactively. Finally lifted, good news: my 1% salary increase would be paid retroactively. My previous boss - whose job I took - made double my salary. The 1% was an insult. Best part: she was genuinely surprised, then angry, when I quit. I understood the acquiring company paid less for the same positions and I was already in the promotion's band but... yeah.... I couldn't keep up... but the three people hired to backfill probably did OK.
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Employers who do this kind of ex post facto version by disparaging employees who quit and (gasp!) get a job somewhere else are just douchey.
Or it means that they aren't able to retain adult HR people. It's easy enough to just say "Different people have different needs in their lives, and it is not our place to share confidential information about ex-employees". Done. You can have the bestest company in the world, doing the most interesting or important work, and people's needs and goals are still going to differ from what the company wants them to do.
Speaks well of Tesla then (Score:2)
Waiting for the iRocket (Score:2)
Obviously the return flight would be an in-app purchase.
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You get the unfounded FUD-of-the-day award.
The engineers may get overworked, but as this article proves, they always have the option of going elsewhere if they feel they are underpaid. And you state that you know people that left in order to correct the overworked bit too.
What the fuck does the cafeteria have to do with anything? And which cafeteria? At the factory? At one of their larger office buildings around the Fremont area? The one in Palo Alto? The design place in LA? Some other damn thing so
depends on which employees... (Score:2)
I'm no fan of Tesla, but when you read the article,