Apple iWork Screenshots 396
applextrent submitted a story with a bunch of screen shots of Apple's new iWork package, including Keynote 2 and Pages, the new Apple word processor. Nothing particularly surprising here.
Everybody needs a little love sometime; stop hacking and fall in love!
"Nothing particularly surprising here" (Score:5, Interesting)
If the former, *sigh*
Re:"Nothing particularly surprising here" (Score:5, Insightful)
Anyway, yes, since it's not in italics, it's from the editor.
Re:"Nothing particularly surprising here" (Score:2)
Good point, however, I had assumed CmdrTaco was leveraging his (infamous) editing trademarks :)
Right.. (Score:4, Insightful)
Where's the "Stuff that matters"?
Re:Right.. (Score:5, Insightful)
As I said before [slashdot.org], I'm asking the same question.
The really interesting link for this topic is here [apple.com]
Re:Right.. (Score:3, Informative)
Apple Screenshots (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Apple Screenshots (Score:5, Funny)
iDontWork (Score:5, Funny)
Are you kidding? (Score:5, Funny)
Are you crazy? You must have missed the 'i' in front of iWorks- These screenshots are nothing less than spectacular!
Document Format (Score:2, Interesting)
Is the document format for Pages open or proprietary?
Re:Document Format (Score:2)
Re:Document Format (Score:4, Informative)
Of course someone knows. Apple, for one, know... and they've been kind enough to tell us all on their web site. At the URL http://www.apple.com/iwork/pages/compatibility.ht
It'll save to RTF, PDF, DOC, HTML and Plain Text.
Re:Document Format is XML (Score:3, Informative)
Does the suite the OASIS-format or not? (Score:5, Interesting)
And even if hot: will iWork at least be able to import from and/or export to OASIS?
Both OpenOffice and KOffice will be supporting OASIS and bringing Apple aboard will probably be crucial in order to establish a serious alternative to the Microsoft file format hegemony.
Re:Bogus (Score:5, Insightful)
I switched to Mac about 3 years ago and really for the first 6 months, Apple Works 6 did just about everything I needed. Then I started getting to where PowerPoint was a must have for presentations and the spreadsheet would export data to excel but not the equations. So I bought Office V.x and frankly was plesantly surpised with an MS product that worked.
I work as a consultant and being able to share information with clients is a must! While we can debate the goods/evils of file formats etc. here in the world of geekdom, in the real world communication is key to me being able to put food on my table.
If apple supported OASIS, all the better, but until people are actually using the format it's not going do very much. It is a chicken or the egg arugement.
Re:Bogus (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Bogus (Score:2)
I have MS Office on my PC, and I've got to say that MS Word is far too compl
European Union is considering OASIS, I think (Score:2)
If I remember correctly, the European Union is considering making OpenOffice XML an ISO standard. Sun is really pushing this, of course. With a population easily larger than that of the U.S., we're talking about one very, very big egg. Apple would be stupid not to support it, as it is free.
But then we all know that Apple doesn't do too well when it
Re:supporting DOC != using it as its native format (Score:3, Interesting)
Likely it is an open file format just like Keynote (v1) and likely not that greatly different from it. They just haven't publish the information yet (the product hasn't shipped yet for one).
Keynote (v1) technote [apple.com]
Apple has no reason to keep it proprietary and many reasons to publish the format in the open (it helps the product if others can
Re:Does the suite the OASIS-format or not? (Score:5, Informative)
Oh yeah, and Keynote's file format is XML, and it's very well documented here: http://developer.apple.com/technotes/tn2002/tn206
Re:Does the suite the OASIS-format or not? (Score:2)
What it uses natively hasn't been announced yet but since the have published info about Keynote (v1) format I would expect the same information for iWorks once it gets close to shipping.
A brand new Apple XML mystery format that's theoretically importable to everywhere else but no one practically bothers to write support for? Or OASIS format, which everyone should support but few do?
You relize in many ways what you said can easily be said about OASIS.
In the rea
Re:Does the suite the OASIS-format or not? (Score:5, Funny)
Its even worse. (Score:2, Insightful)
Damn, I can't run it... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Damn, I can't run it... (Score:2)
Yep. It's sometimes amusing that people here like to show they've been around by saying things like "I remember when Appleworks was called Clarisworks" -- When Appleworks was an integrated package on the Apple ][ seems to have been when most of these people were in nappies.
Re:Damn, I can't run it... (Score:2)
I'm looking for an OASIS (Score:4, Insightful)
Also I am a bit surprised that Apple didn't go with an existing software base for their Office suite. It is obvious that what they are doing is a defensive maneouvre against the possibility that MS will drop Apple support for Office, like they did with IE. Apple had to have some non-IE backup plan and they chose to take Konqueror and turn it into Safari. Good choice Apple. But they could have done the same thing with iWorks. There are two code bases they could have picked: the obvious OpenOffice, and also KOffice. Actually KOffice is quite good, considering that it's a "small" project. And if they liked Konqueror then maybe KOffice would have also been appealing to them.
One interesting thing about this is that it is indicating that office software is becoming a commodity. There are currently half a dozen office suites out there (MS Office, iWorks, OOo, SoftMaker, KingSoft, KOffice and probably a few more I'm not remembering right now). I actually hope that iWorks is also ported to Linux, but that seems very very unlikely.
Re:I'm looking for an OASIS (Score:2)
Re:I'm looking for an OASIS (Score:5, Interesting)
Article [simson.net] on it.
I wonder what happened to that software?
Re:I'm looking for an OASIS (Score:3, Informative)
Re:I'm looking for an OASIS (Score:2)
Re:I'm looking for an OASIS (Score:2)
Are you under the delusion that Open Office doesn't run on Windows?
If it's OS X you were thinking needs work, NeoOfficeJ will give you OoO on OS X without the need to install Apple X11. Not 100% integration yet but it's coming along.
"Hey, Bill, it's Steve. Steve Jobs. How you doing? How's Melinda?... Yeah, I was just thinking... why don't you two take some time off, maybe have a cou
Looks like adding a photo to a page of text (Score:5, Interesting)
If that is indeed the case, it's great - one of my pet peeves with Word is how annoying adding a photo+legend to a page of text is. You basically have to redo the layout every time you change the text.
BTW, if I am wrong and there is a way to include a picture and its legend in text with the text flow being auto-adjusted, please reply with explanations on how to do it instead of modding me as a troll
How about Keynote? (Score:2)
This is a really important capability to the more mathematically inclined among us, who would like to have inline equations. The number of hours I have spent moving my equations around when I change the text is really disturbing.
(Actually, if this works in any presentation software that runs on a mac besides LaTeX, I'd love to know about it. Especially if I can save slides as PPT for my advi
Re:How about Keynote? (Score:2)
And as to the money question. The answer is definitely yes: $79.
Re:How about Keynote? (Score:2)
If a pdf was inline, then I could just drop an equation in, say HERE, and keep editing. As the text moved around on the slide the equation would keep moving around with the text. Right now, one has to move ALL of the equations on a slide as one edits, as the text keeps moving around.
I was hoping
Re:How about Keynote? (Score:2)
... based on demos/conversations at the Apple booth.
Re:How about Keynote? (Score:2)
Re:Looks like adding a photo to a page of text (Score:2)
In Word 2003, if you highlight a picture and then click "insert -> text box", it will draw a text box around the picture.
I'll agree that this is far more annoying that it should be. There should be an option to make this the default item for captions.
OTOH, it's no more annoying that OOo slapping text boxes around all of my floating tables.
No better in OOo, IMO (Score:2)
Then again, I haven't had much better luck with OpenOffice. I can't help but suspect that their primary goal is Word compatability, and that costs them the flexibility t
Re:Looks like adding a photo to a page of text (Score:2)
Looks like adding a photo to a page of text will be very easy in Pages, with the text adapting automatically.
The text flow is done in real time, as was demonstrated during the keynote [apple.com]. It looks very slick.
Re:Looks like adding a photo to a page of text (Score:3, Interesting)
That's one of my biggest peeves with MS-Orifice and OOo/SO. It's a pity since Word (and clones as OOo Writer) have yet to come up with what was quite easy in a 13 year old verion of Island Write, which was:
Create a container that can be locked to the page or text
Set the container format to: crop; scale proportionally; scale non-proportionally
Import graphics file
If cropped, use "hand" cursor to move graphic in cont
Any ways to put a caption? (Score:2)
Anyway, thanks for the help
Very Pretty, but... (Score:2, Interesting)
Do people think this is because we have evolved to the design to something which is useful and "optimal", or because people are no longer willing to change a paradigm which may alienate new users? Are there any wor
Office 2006 / Longhorn will copy (Score:4, Insightful)
It looks like Apple did a beautiful job. Now I'm starting to think that getting a MAC would be a good idea.
Re:Office 2006 / Longhorn will copy (Score:5, Funny)
My Mac is a 15" Powerbook.
Re:Office 2006 / Longhorn will copy (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Office 2006 / Longhorn will copy (Score:2)
When will taco learn..... (Score:2, Insightful)
Why am I not particularily surprised.
Reconsidering (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Reconsidering (Score:4, Interesting)
Don't get me wrong the app looks nice and the template are beautiful, but unless Apple hired the MS engineers who developed the
Unique Layout technology (Score:2)
It seems like over 50% of companies use the same MS Word Fax Cover sheet. etc. etc.
I wish someone would come up with some machine logic so that you design a template through a wizard, not just insert data.
So your end product, is unique, catered to you, but still meets the objective.
I know it wouldn't be easy... but please, no more cookie cutter wizards.
Its all Latin to me! (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Its all Latin to me! (Score:4, Informative)
Re:Its all Latin to me! (Score:2)
Re:Its all Latin to me! (Score:2)
http://www.lipsum.com/ [lipsum.com]
Re:Its all Latin to me! (Score:2)
Apparently he can't, which is unfortunate. If you'd like to generate your own random Latin text, try this [lipsum.com].
It looks like you're writing an iLetter (Score:5, Funny)
Spreadsheet? Database? (Score:2)
And yes i have RTFA... as well as Apple's pages, but they arent overly informative on features ( unless the feature list really has dwindled to 2 modules )..
Re:Spreadsheet? Database? (Score:2)
Observed iWorks at MWSY 2005 (Score:3, Informative)
Pages is a word processing and limited, albeit very powerful, page layout application. Pages is excellent for writting papers, making small multi-page brochures, menus, etc. It is not a Quark / InDesign replacement and was not intended to be, as one of the UI designers stated to me at the exhibit ( I think he is telling the truth, as I did study at Uni with him and he has always been very truthful). Pages is not Word, there are several features currently absent from Word (as previously stated in this thread) that professional writers would need, version tracking is one of those features.
Notice that there isn't a Spreadsheet application in the iWorks suite? Me too. However, Appleworks 6.x still has this functionality, and it imports most MS Excel docs, plus it is much cheaper than Excel (US$49.00, I think).
By the way, there are several word processing applications available for Mac OS X: TextEdit (Apple), AppleWorks (Apple), Pages (Apple), Mariner Write (Mariner), Abiword, MS Word, and 2 applications by Nissus (there main App is feature rich / high end, the other very basic, more features than TextEdit). These are what I am aware of, please add to the list if I have not listed all.
There are several Spreadsheet applications as well, Mariner Calc, a few from open source, AppleWorks (as listed earlier), and that MS Excel Application. Again, if there are any I have left out, please add these in.
I do know that there is a java Office Suite applicaion available, I just don't remember it by name. The "open" office suite application that I have read about (sorry, I forgot its techy name)
is not really an application for most Apple users, as it requires a rather cryptic installation process, not very apple-like, and so I would refer to it as a kind of prototype software, not ready for non-techys (I am refering to the majority of computer users out there who need to do work with their computers, not get their computers to work) those people who do not have the time or interest in learning how to make a computer work. These are the
same people who do not upgrade thier refridgerators, TVs, washing machines, toilet, or water heater, unless they are broken, or want to re-model the house, these are the same people who buy software by the way. These same people are
also the ones who fix that broken plumbing, electrical, and so
on. ( Sorry had to rant a bit their as I read so much elitist garble
on
It seems as though Mac OS X will have nearly as many USEABLE (whatever this really means I am not sure) office productivity applications as are available for MS WIndows users. Is this the same situation as well, where 95% of people use the dominant application and the remaining applications fight for market share scraps?
I think variety is a very good thing, as is competition, so hopefully, these applications will find their respective niches and only have overlap in reading each others formats and basic features.
Cheers!
Spreadsheet and Database Modules? (Score:2, Insightful)
corrections... (Score:5, Interesting)
Keynote 2 seems to finally be able to compete with PowerPoint on a number of new levels, especially now that it has, for example, presenter display.
Keynote 1 had this and did it quite well (better than PowerPoint X and about on par with 2004).
Honestly, I found that using keynote was a delight to work with when compared to powerpoint once you got accustomed to the way it worked and the minimalistic interface which I've come to love. Palettes are much easier to work with than toolbars. Despite having an interface which is FAR less cluttered than powerpoint, I have yet to come across a feature powerpoint had that keynote 1 didn't.
As Icing on the cake, keynote will import or export to just about anything. And, as with any OS X application, PDF Export works by default. I particularly liked the Quicktime Export feature, and Flash export should prove to be interesting.
To rave just a bit more about keynote, the templates are simply beautiful and the transitions are very smooth and look beautiful (although they're by no means distracting/annoyinh like those in powerpoint).
Other awesome features -- snap-to centering both for the slide and the content pane. Transparency, rotation, and cropping work for virtually all image types. Tables actually look nice, and charts are also pleasant to look at.
I'm looking forward to the new animation tools in Keynote 2. The first version is one of apple's best kept secrets.
Presentations are all about looks and.... presentation. I've never understood how powerpoint was able to be successful while producing some of the ugliest presentations i've ever seen.
Wow! (Score:2)
Only one question: does Pages have a live wordcount? 'Cause if not, well, maybe I'll wait for iLife '06...
Now add Sheets... (Score:5, Interesting)
Apple recognizes the threat here - if MSFT withdraws their Office from Mac software market Mac as a platform will suddenly become a lot less desirable for tons and tons of users. All they need to do to lessen the impact is release their own office suite with 20-30% of features of competing office suite that customers use 95% of the time and most importantly get their import/export from PP/Word/Excel just right. And make it look nice (this is one of the things Open Office failed miserably at).
There you go, one less dependency.
Re:This does not belong here.. (Score:2, Funny)
Re:This does not belong here.. (Score:2)
Geeks want to see screenies of Apple's apps. Eye-candy wins. Deal with it.
Updating? You mean releasing... (Score:3, Informative)
Sure, it "replaces" AppleWorks - but is by no means an AppleWorks update, as you might have been able to tell by the completely different name. It's all new code, new interface, etc. etc.
Re:Updating? You mean releasing... (Score:2)
Re:Updating? You mean releasing... (Score:5, Informative)
Keynote?
Re:Updating? You mean releasing... (Score:5, Informative)
More interestingly, Pages (the word processor) appears to be an update of a software package of the same name [simson.net] that was released for NeXT in 1994 by a company called Pages Software. So here we have yet MORE benefits of the NeXT purchase, albeit delayed by 8 years...
From the linked 1994 NeXTWorld article: The software, three years in the making, takes a new approach to word processing that doesn't include such conventional tools as rulers, font panels, and style sheets. Pages is being positioned as an easy-to-use word processor in light of NeXT's de-emphasis on publishing and a lack of available word-processing software for NEXTSTEP.
"The early view of the product was that it was more of a publishing product," said Larry Spelhaug, CEO of Pages Software. "Internally, we always assumed that it would have full word-processing capability but that wasn't perceived outside the company."
Pages' extensive feature set, roughly equivalent to the latest versions of WordPerfect and Microsoft Word, was entirely implemented in object-based code. The software uses design templates to ease document creation."
Re:Updating? You mean releasing... (Score:2)
Re:Updating? You mean releasing... (Score:2)
Actually, the name may be the same, but it's brand new.
Re:Updating? You mean releasing... (Score:2)
I remember reading that Keynote was an update of an old NeXT software package, even though it has never been marketed as such. I don't think Apple would concede to it if asked.
Re:Updating? You mean releasing... (Score:2)
Re:Updating? You mean releasing... (Score:2)
I think it's worth pointing out that Keynote is not a new application at all. It was in heavy use at Apple internally for several years before it was productized and released to the public. It was so well received, for a 1.0 product, that Apple started working on a document-authoring application using some of the same basic ideas.
Re:Updating? You mean releasing... (Score:2)
Like there is ( was ) for appleworks?
Re:Updating? You mean releasing... (Score:2)
Re:This does not belong here.. (Score:5, Insightful)
spare us the MacArrogance (Score:3, Funny)
That's the usual Macintosh arrogance. Get used to it: Gnome and KDE are serious competitors to Windows and Macintosh on the desktop.
Re:spare us the MacArrogance (Score:2)
Re:spare us the MacArrogance (Score:2)
I don't mean that in the "I don't like them" sense. I mean it in the sense that both of them are built on 20th-century ideas that seem so bafflingly dated today.
Spend some time using a Mac, learn about the new ideas that went into the Mac OS, and see if you still think Gnome is even on the same planet.
(You know, when the Mac was first introduced, Apple had a "test-drive a Mac" program. They should reinstate it. It w
Re:Apple Message Board Migration (Score:5, Insightful)
That was the case with classic MacOS. OSX is Unix at the core, supports multiple languages, integrates Java better than most other platform, and much of it is open source. Even if you use the "one true toolit" Coccoa, your code can be portable to Next, GNUStep, OpenStep etc. If you buy Apple, you are buying fluff. It is not the "GUI" pioneer. It is not "the fastest PC". It's closed source GUI is a complete anathema to geeks.
If you buy a linux distro, you are buying fluff. You are not buying a Unix Pioneer, or an Open Source Pioneer. It is not the "fastest OS." Its a rewrite of a platform orginally developed in the 70's in New Jersey.
Apple is for the digital illiterati.
Apparently Linux is for the digital elitist in your eyes.
Re:This does not belong here.. (Score:5, Insightful)
I've seen articles on OpenOffice, AbiWord, and NeoOffice J. This article fits in with that theme.
Do you have a particular anti Apple sentiment that makes this article particularly disturbing to you?
Re:Format (Score:5, Informative)
If both Keynote 2 and Pages uses the same principle on their document formats as the original Keynote, it's nothing but open.
The Keynote documents (.key) are actually directories, not files, which have an XML file (presentation.apxl) and all the images, textures and data files used on it, on its original format (PNG, TIFF, etc.)
So I don't see how could this be 'another propietary Office format'. Given the facts just mentioned anyone could potentially write a Keynote viewer for Linux or whatever OS he/she might choose (or think of a Keynote to Magicpoint converter). Even the transition effects could be somehow recreated using OpenGL, as they're also into the XML file.
Regards,
Re:Format (Score:4, Informative)
well, I think ... (Score:2, Interesting)
OO is huge and cluttered. It's hard to change it's features to smoothly fit into Apples GUI-concept. It's UI is still stuck at the beginning of the 90s.
why apple dont you push mozilla more upfront
Konquerer hat the cleaner code. So Safari was based on KHTML and it was a good choice. Using Safari is bliss (but not ignorance).
why apple dont you push a native and complete workable FTP client more upfront with UTF-8 character set support!!!
Mainly because
Re:I dont understand! marked|pt (Score:5, Insightful)
Because, from a Mac user's point of view, Open Office is just terrible, terrible software. It isn't even a Mac application. It has to run under X11, a windowing environment that isn't installed by default and that most Mac users will never need or want. It doesn't support Mac givens like drag-and-drop or advanced typography. Hell, it doesn't even support cut and paste!
Put a computer user down in front of Open Office on the Mac, and the response is going to be "This sucks." Apple, understandably, doesn't want anybody to have a reason to say "This sucks" while sitting in front of a Macintosh.
why apple dont you push mozilla more upfront
See the above answer, minus the part about X11. Mozilla (Camaro, Firebird, whatever the hell they're calling themselves this week) just sucks compared to Safari.
why apple dont you push a native and complete workable FTP client more upfront with UTF-8 character set support!!!
What, you mean like Transmit from Panic Software?
If you consider that there are about 35 million Mac users out there, the fraction of them who ever need to use an FTP client is vanishingly small. If all you need to do is download files, the Finder takes care of that for you: FTP URLs are handed off to the Finder. For the one-in-a-thousand who need to upload, Panic has your number.
safari miserably fails to complay with w3c standards
Um? That's
fail to run properly javascript
Again with the wrong.
fail to run properly flash apllications
No, also not true.
I think the problem here might be related to the fact that you haven't got the foggiest idea what you're talking about. I think that might be a part of it.
Re:I dont understand! marked|pt (Score:3, Insightful)
You had me until here; Gecko (the Mozilla rendering engine) is generally regarded as the best rendering engine available. It's not the fastest, mind you, but it's the most developed with regards to web standards. Safari isn't far off, but some of it's quirks [alistapart.com] can get a bit annoying [quirksmode.org] at times. Just ask Gmail users what they thought of Safari up until about 2 months ago.
As a web developer, I'm gen
Re:I dont understand! marked|pt (Score:4, Funny)
You're absolutely right. I should have spent more time on the fact that "Ricardo" is an illiterate mouthbreather who hasn't got the first idea of what he's talking about. I definitely should have been more clear about that. My apologies.
do you real know what you are talking about?
Yes, I "real know."
do you real use a computer for work?
Yes, a two-year-old Power Mac G4.
they sure can do better on
Um. I'm gonna go real slow here, because apparently your meds started to kick in while you were writing your comment: Apple has released a new product. The new product is called iWork. iWork consists of a word processor and a presentation program. The word processor is called Pages. The presentation program is called Keynote. These are good programs. Apple made them, and they are good. Apple has, in other words, "done better."
Kay?
i love when you say ppl dont need ftp, and the native one is enough, came on.
I guess it would be too much to ask that your comments either contain an idea or intelligible writing, huh? I'm not greedy. I'd be happy with either one or the other.
do you real tryed to upload files at least once?
Yes, I "real tryed" just a couple of weeks ago, in fact. Somebody asked me to upload some digital pictures to his FTP server because he was too baffled by the concept of trying to download them from my iDisk. So I downloaded Transmit and did what I needed to do. (Thanks, Panic, for offering a free trial.)
are macos users so naive or inacessible that they dont pull stuff from ftp servers?
Um. I think you've kind of got that backwards. The Internet has moved on. Most stuff isn't stored on FTP servers any more. To access the occasional stuff that is, the Finder handles connecting to and downloading files from FTP servers. If you need to upload, Transmit is the program of choice.
came on give me a break!
Okay, I will "came on" and give you a break. You got it.
Re:I dont understand! marked|pt (Score:3)
Gopher support is even worse. Where's the outrage?
10 AM Where? (Score:2)
Re:XML? SVG? MathML? OOo? LaTeX? (Score:2)
Re:XML? SVG? MathML? OOo? LaTeX? (Score:2)
TeXmacs requires X11, IIRC.
Neither of which is anywhere close to something I would use for production as part of a suite of applications.
Re:Where's the meat? (Score:2)
Apple is also highly unlikely (at this stage) to stick its oar into the OOO pond. Maybe they have given some token support for the formats (I haven't seen iWork up close, so I don't know. Keynote is based on an open, well documented XML format so it wouldn't be too hard to fill in the blanks). Apple won't be porting OOO themselves though - for a start it's a long,
Re:Where's the meat? (Score:3, Funny)
"Brian, there's a message in my Alphabits! It says 'Ooooooo.'"
"Peter, those are Cheerios."
Re:Where's the meat? (Score:2)
Native Aqua OOo (Score:3)
As far as OOo being the future of office apps, I dunno. There's something to be said about simplicity and OOo inherits all of M$'s bad habits, specifically more is more. I do agree witht he open file format approach tho.
Frankly, I'd like some office apps with core functionality and that's it. That's why I like Keyno
Re:Ligatures in Pages...? (Score:3, Informative)