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First Person Shooters (Games) Businesses Apple

Doom 3 Announced for Mac 307

Posted by samzenpus from the shooting-apples dept.
thelemmings writes "Aspyr today announced that it will (finally) publish Doom 3 for the Macintosh. The game is scheduled for release Q1 2005 and the system requirements indicate that a G5 processor will be required, which seems quite surprising as it will leave iBooks and Powerbooks owners on the side of the road. Too bad iD Software didn't release a free OSX client like they previously did for linux version of the game."
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Doom 3 Announced for Mac More

Doom 3 Announced for Mac

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  • Whatcha need (Score:5, Informative)

    by Davak ( 526912 ) on Thursday November 04, 2004 @09:01AM (#10722238) Homepage
    Well, Apple guys/gals... you'll need these...

    Complete List of Doom 3 Console Commands [tech-recipes.com]
    List of Common Doom 3 cheats [tech-recipes.com]

    To Run it you'll need this...

    Mac System Requirements:
    Mac OS X 10.3.6 or later
    PowerPC G5 1.5 GHz or faster
    384MB RAM (512MB recommended)
    2.2 GB free disk space
    ATI Radeon 8500/nVidia GeForce 3 or better
    32MB of Video Ram (VRAM)
    DVD drive required to install and play

    And you'll have to wait until..

    Aspyr Media Inc. on Wednesday announced plans to publish id Software's Doom 3 for the Macintosh. The game is currently in development for the Mac by id, and will be released in February, 2005.
    Source [macworld.com]

  • Reload? (Score:5, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday November 04, 2004 @09:03AM (#10722251)
    Does reloading involve dragging the clip into the trash can?

    • Re:Reload? (Score:2, Funny)

      by djdanlib ( 732853 )
      Don't forget the keyboard shortcut: Apple-E
  • I mean how big a market share Linux gaming has today, and how big Mac gaming.

    Did try to look up things on the web, but seems all the things I find point at old info saying basically linux Nil, Mac close to Nil.

    The funny party is still some companies release these games, so there must be a market... Maybe..

    • Re:the whole thing makes me wonder market shares (Score:4, Interesting)

      by MoonFog ( 586818 ) on Thursday November 04, 2004 @09:11AM (#10722297)
      For most other ID software games (afair) they've just released a Linux executable. You still use the same CD that came with the Windows package. So I guess the market is easy to reach once the game is developed.
    • It's a chicken or the egg problem - gamers won't switch to linux/mac due to very little games, game producers won't make games for linux/mac due to very little gamers.

      I think there's a trend of the 'better' gaming companies to break through this circle. Another advantage is that at the time that Mac and *nix *will* have mature gaming support, they already have a significant advantage over competitors due to their experience with porting those games...

      • Re:the whole thing makes me wonder market shares (Score:2, Interesting)

        by Anonymous Coward
        The problem really is that games won't switch to linux/mac because they see no reason to. Games work on the machine I already have and glory be it does everything else I need to. And since I've yet to get a virus or spyware and since Win2000 I don't see blue screens anymore why would I switch?
      • An interesting question is, WHY should gamers switch to linux/Mac? For once the major criticisms levelled at Windows/x86 (often with some justification) seem to bounce back as strong arguments for why a Windows PC is the best option for games by a country mile:

        - bad at multitasking: I have one task, blasting hell knights in 3D

        - controlled by evil Windoze Empire (tm): good, so the Evil Windoze Empire will make sure I have up to date drivers and a relatively good 3D API to run my games with for the widest p
        • Those are not the major criticisms levelled at Windows, nor are those the key strengths of either Macs or Linux. In fact, I don't know what that list is supposed to be, and I will leave it at that.

          But few people seriously claim Mac and Linux systems are prime gaming platforms, and encourage switching because of it. The opposite is common, ie. people saying they would switch if it weren't for gaming. And some people recommend switching in spite of gaming not being as viable.
        • An interesting question is, WHY should gamers switch to linux/Mac?

          Because very few people are solely a gamer or an artist or a business user. For a very large number of people, Linux or Mac OS are the OS best suited for them--unless they are also avid gamers (such that games become a secondary, but real, barrier between them and their ideal OS).

          So that leaves us with a number of gamers who want to switch but are discouraged by the (relative) lack of games.

          THAT'S why (some) gamers might want to switch t
          • While there is no overwhelming reason to switch from Windows to play games, there are plenty of reasons to switch from Windows in general, and many people already have (or have never ran Windows at home to begin with).

            w3School's stats show XP's market share doubling in two years from 30% to 60%, Linux and the Mac combined from 4% to 6%. OS Platform Statistics [w3schools.com] The evidence is pretty clear, I think, that home users migrate to newer versions of their Windows or Mac OS and not to alternative operating system

    • Re:the whole thing makes me wonder market shares (Score:5, Interesting)

      by swordboy ( 472941 ) on Thursday November 04, 2004 @09:26AM (#10722385) Journal
      Please read [azillionmonkeys.com] about Carmack's battle with D3D and Microsoft. The bottom line is that he's the main reason that we've still got OpenGL. This technology enables game developers to deploy 3D gaming engines to multiple platforms quite easily.

      Make no bones about it - there is no substantial non-Windows gaming market. No sir. Carmack does this for two reasons - because he can and because it really throws mud in the eye of Microsoft.

      As a side note, if you haven't purchased this game, then go out and do so... even if you won't use it. Without id software (and some other keys), gaming would be Windows-only right now.

      • Re:the whole thing makes me wonder market shares (Score:4, Insightful)

        by Zangief ( 461457 ) on Thursday November 04, 2004 @10:04AM (#10722633) Homepage Journal
        Make no bones about it - there is no substantial non-Windows gaming market. No sir. Carmack does this for two reasons - because he can and because it really throws mud in the eye of Microsoft.

        As a side note, if you haven't purchased this game, then go out and do so... even if you won't use it. Without id software (and some other keys), gaming would be Windows-only right now.

        Mmm...I suppose those PS2, Gamecubes, and Gameboys SPs are used to do text editing, web browsing and email only...

        However you are right. The guy has almost singlehandledly keeped OpenGL support alive in the industry.
      • All the companies that publish games for the Mac and for Linux aren't doing it because they're good guys. It's pretty expensive to license and port good games. They're doing it because they think they can make money doing it. And apparently they are, because more games get ported all the time.
      • So who should I buy it from to count as a Linux sale?

        (Haven't bought yet for that reason, and that I need a bigger/better video card)
      • Um, why would I buy a game I'm not going to use? If ID isn't releasing games I want on a platform I own, then they should go out of business.

        If it turns out the market doesn't care about OpenGL for games, the people have spoken. If that means MS wins, well they played their cards right, I suppose.

        But why the hell would I spend $50 just to make a statement no one will hear and, frankly, no one outside the set of people who do that would care about?

      • Re:the whole thing makes me wonder market shares (Score:2, Interesting)

        by Anonymous Coward
        It may be the only reason we have OpenGL for games, but openGL is never going to go anywere.

        Why?

        Because DirectX only works on Windows, the industry of 3-d imaging, movies, 3-d applications like MRI type stuff, rendering clusters...

        All Unix (and now Linux). All OpenGL.

        Also remember that OpenGL and DirectX are not equivilent. OpenGL deals with 3-d only, DirectX deals with 3-d + keyboard/mouse + sound + much more. Typical monolythic Windows mentality vs Unix specific tools/software abstraction layers.
      • Make no bones about it - there is no substantial non-Windows gaming market.

        I could have sworn you could still buy game consoles like X-box and PS2.

        Speaking of game consoles, I don't understand why there simply isn't a better one out there that you can hook up to a computer monitor, HDTV, or a regular TV. I see no need for a top of the line computer for games.

        But then again, I'm not a gamer.

    • Re:the whole thing makes me wonder market shares (Score:4, Interesting)

      by arasinen ( 22038 ) on Thursday November 04, 2004 @09:26AM (#10722387)

      What matters is profitability, not market share.

      The costs of porting a game are significantly lower than creating the game in the first place. Aspyr need not worry itself with level design, for instance. (I'm not saying it is easy to port a game but it's easier.)

      It is also possible that due to the relatively low Mac market share, warez isn't such a big issue in Mac gaming market. (Dunno about the numbers, I'm pulling this out of my hat.) And of course, if you can afford a Mac, then how can you not afford a game?

      I am of course only speaking for myself, but if a suitable game (such as Rome: Total War or Star Wars Battleground) would be released for the Mac, I'd buy it in an instant. In the meanwhile I play Master of Orion 2 on an emulator :-)

    • Aspyr does a very good business porting Mac games. The problem is, the Mac market is actually quite profitable, especially the home/soho market, but the PERCEPTION is that it is not, and the few companies who make good money in that market BECAUSE of that perception have no incentive to change that perception.

      So, while folks on slashdot go on and on about how miniscule the Mac market share is, blah, blah, blah, companies like Aspyr, Ambrosia, Mark/Space, the Omnigroup, Unsanity, etc. run solid businesses w

  • Good to see... (Score:5, Funny)

    by jmcmunn ( 307798 ) on Thursday November 04, 2004 @09:05AM (#10722266)

    Good to see that now that the election is over people move back to talking about the important things in life...like Doom 3 on the Mac?

    Anyway, that's good for Mac users I guess. Now I guess my excuse of "I can't play any games that I want to on a Mac, so I use Windows instead" is not 100% correct. Except I have never been a huge Doom fan. Or a FPS fan in general. I did love FarCry though.

    When is GTA San Andreas coming out on the Mac? That's what I really need to get me to switch to mac.
    • When's it coming out on PC, for that matter? It's not even an X-Box title, you can ONLY play it on PS2

      • I have read on several sites that it is scheduled for release on the PC by next June.

        Bad news though...no confirmed release date for the Xbox. And I dare not think about it ever being on the Mac.

        However, since rumor has it that the next-gen Xbox development is being done on Macs, the theory goes that porting games to the Mac should not be difficult. Unfortunately, I think MS would have different ideas about that happening.

        And to reply to a post further down...yes it is an exclusivity deal that holds th

  • Good thing about Mac gaming: (Score:5, Funny)

    by palad1 ( 571416 ) on Thursday November 04, 2004 @09:05AM (#10722268)
    At least with the delay, we all know doom3 isn't worth it.

    That's the only time it ever felt good to be a Mac gamer!

  • No Surprise (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday November 04, 2004 @09:06AM (#10722271)
    ...indicate that a G5 processor will be required, which seems quite surprising as it will leave iBooks and Powerbooks owners on the side of the road.

    Given the horsepower required by Doom 3, it's no surprise. Don't forget, you also need world-class video to run the game well.

    Being that the gameplay sucks, it really doesn't matter.

  • OS X 10.3.6 (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Ballresin ( 398599 ) on Thursday November 04, 2004 @09:06AM (#10722275) Homepage Journal
    It's funny they say you need 10.3.6... because it doesn't exist yet.

    Nice thing is, this means the iMac G5 can play Doom 3.

    • Re:OS X 10.3.6 (Score:5, Informative)

      by adzoox ( 615327 ) on Thursday November 04, 2004 @09:16AM (#10722331) Journal
      Actually it's been final seeded to developers (about a week ago) - it is inevitable that it will be out before February.

      Aspyr is saying this because Apple is completely rewriting the video drivers in this next point release.

    • Re:OS X 10.3.6 (Score:5, Interesting)

      by execom ( 598566 ) on Thursday November 04, 2004 @09:20AM (#10722350) Homepage Journal
      It's because of bugs [opengl.org] in the OpenGL drivers, that seem to be fixed in the 10.3.6 version
      I guess ID Software and Apple have worked together on theses problems.

      As for Linux version (with the poor ATI support for Doom3), I'm really glad that such application like Doom3 shed the light on bugs and force the constructors (like nVidia, ATI or Apple) to improves their OpenGL implementations.
      This is a benefit for all the OpenGL developers, especially on OSX, where alternative to OpenGL is out of question.

  • I would like to see justification for this (Score:4, Interesting)

    by adzoox ( 615327 ) on Thursday November 04, 2004 @09:06AM (#10722277) Journal
    I would like a small blurb on the Aspyr website as to why this very assertive requirement was necessary.

    I hardly see why a 1.25 Ghz G4 with a 64MB or better video card could not handle this game.

    A 1.25 G4 with 512MB RAM and a 64MB video card is equivalent to the PC and Linux requirements - at least as far as speed and price point equivalency (benchmark tests would indicate so)

    I especially can't see why Aspyr can't write something for Dual G4 optimization like Unreal and Call for Duty have.

  • Linux/x86 (Score:4, Insightful)

    by RAMMS+EIN ( 578166 ) on Thursday November 04, 2004 @09:07AM (#10722282) Homepage Journal
    Of course, the Linux client is an x86 binary, so running Linux on your mac won't help. That is, until we get really good binary translators, which might just happen, given the work that's being done for JVM bytecode and .NET IL.

  • I'm gonna go out on a limb here... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by harikiri ( 211017 ) on Thursday November 04, 2004 @09:11AM (#10722298)
    And say the reason you need a G5 is because Aspyr can't be bothered optimising for G4 systems. Simple solution - require G5's.
    • Except, according to both the first post and Aspyr's website, the game is being developed by iD while Aspyr is the publisher.

    • Re:I'm gonna go out on a limb here... (Score:5, Informative)

      by grag ( 597728 ) on Thursday November 04, 2004 @09:23AM (#10722369)

      Actually, the system requirements are preliminary. We usually guess higher, and then readjust the requirements the closer we get to Final Candidate. I believe this happened to RTCW for Mac, but I would have to ask someone who was the project lead for RTCW for Mac.

      This is done to prevent customers making a preorder for the game, only to find out that the requirements have been raised at the last minute.

    • I'm going to get modded down to hell and back but I think Aspyr's ports (coincedentally) are less optimized than from different publishers. Maybe they have different requirements, I don't know. It seems macsoft and others have much more complete and functioning ports.

      It's a sad state when they first release a game and it has bugs after these things have been on the pc side for so long. Knights of the Old Republic was the first game that I bought from them that had such a bug. The autosaves were broken
      • I'm going to get modded down to hell and back but I think Aspyr's ports (coincedentally) are less optimized than from different publishers.

        I have the same feeling. The most annoying part is that they often don't behave Mac-like (for example, command-q often doesn't work as quick quit). How much I miss the good old days, when Mac ports of games like Doom had even Mac-like "file" menu, with command-s for save etc! Nowadays they just take console/Wintel game and port it "as is", without any Mac modification
    • The issue is that almost all the G4 machines do not have a required 3D card. The quicksilver G4s had a GeF4MX if I recall correctly, which is theoretically sufficient for D3, but if you try to play with it, it's just not doable : as soon as there is a 3+ monster fight, the stuttering is so much that you can't aim properly anymore.

  • G5 Requirement... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by autojive ( 560399 ) on Thursday November 04, 2004 @09:15AM (#10722322)
    Could it be that Aspyr/id only made the Doom3 client for Mac with 64 bit code? Would that be the reason to require a "G5 or better"?

  • Huh (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Morgahastu ( 522162 )
    If only they released a free client like on Linux? It's not free, you still need to buy the game and then download the linux client.

    • Re:Huh (Score:5, Interesting)

      by TheRaven64 ( 641858 ) on Thursday November 04, 2004 @09:45AM (#10722495) Journal
      This does, however, make moving platforms easier. I have a copy of the original Quake. It came with a DOS executable. Later, I started using WinQuake and playing it in Windows NT 4. When I got a VooDoo^2, I downloaded the GLQuake executable and got 3D acceleration. When I started using FreeBSD on my `work'station I was able to compile and install the GLQuake executable for X, and continue playing. When I got a Mac, I downloaded another GLQuake executable and, again, continued playing. Since the game engine code (progs.dat / qwprogs.dat) for Quake 1 was interpreted bytecode, I was able to move between CPU architectures without any problems - at most a download and compile. No other game that I've bought has had this much portability, and since I no longer own a Windows machine, a lot of the games I own are useless.

  • cultural differences (Score:5, Funny)

    by dynayellow ( 106690 ) on Thursday November 04, 2004 @09:36AM (#10722446)
    Too bad iD Software didn't release a free OSX client like they previously did for linux version of the game.

    Don't be too confused; it's just because Mac users are willing to, you know, pay for software.

  • Good discussion on IMG (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday November 04, 2004 @09:37AM (#10722453)
    There is a good (heated) discussion on IMG (Inside Mac Games) about why Doom 3 for Mac has much higher requirements than on other platforms. Basically there are two sides:

    1) Because, as usual, the Mac port by Aspyr sucks rocks or
    2) Becasue, as usual, the Mac port by Aspyr sucks great big rocks

    Actually, there are also people who think it is "normal" for a port to require vastly more processing power, but those posts are from people who like bloated crappy software.

    Here is the link:

    http://insidemacgames.com/news/comments.php?Arti cl eID=10390

  • John Carmack (Score:3, Informative)

    by haxor.dk ( 463614 ) on Thursday November 04, 2004 @09:39AM (#10722460)
    Is this the same DOOM III game that John Carmack went on stage at MacWorld to present a few years ago, saying that would be out for the Mac, first?

    What a crock....

  • AWESOME! (Score:5, Funny)

    by Eric_Cartman_South_P ( 594330 ) on Thursday November 04, 2004 @09:40AM (#10722466)
    The number of good games on the Mac just doubled!

    *I own a Powerbook, I'm allowed to love and hate it*

  • For a Mac port announcement, not bad (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Spencerian ( 465343 ) on Thursday November 04, 2004 @09:51AM (#10722524) Homepage Journal
    Doom 3 came out only in early August. Knowing how id Software makes fairly tight code, it should not take Aspyr more than 2-3 months to port this baby, based on my experience with how they port. In the Mac world, that's not a bad wait; although Blizzard holds the best release record with Diablo 2 in my mind since the Mac version was out maybe 6 weeks after the PC game release.

    Some games Aspyr have ported, like Splinter Cell, took freaking forever to migrate--I would guess that the game used a lot of proprietary code within its XBox and Microsoft game origins. DirectX is a blessing on the PC side, but a curse on Apple gaming since OS X has no successor or counterpart to its past GameSprockets technology in Mac OS 9.

    Older Quake-engine games such as Return To Castle Wolfenstein, Jedi Academy and, of course, Quake 3 itself run very well on Macs, even with menial 16MB video cards since the computer processor and video processor try to share the load better, in my opinion, than some stock PCs. It's not surprising that this game will need some real horsepower in video rendering that even challenges the typically graphic-happy Macs.
    • DirectX is a blessing on the PC side, but a curse on Apple gaming since OS X has no successor or counterpart to its past GameSprockets technology in Mac OS 9.

      I beg to differ:

      • Direct3D - OpenGL [opengl.org], cross platform.
      • DirectSound - OpenAL [openal.org], cross platform.
      • DirectShow - QuickTime [apple.com], Windows and Mac. I don't know of any truly cross platform (Windows, Mac and *NIX) alternatives.
      • DirectPlay - OpenPlay [apple.com], cross platform.
      • DirectInput - SDL [libsdl.org], cross platform.

      Developing a game using DirectX means you can target Windows and


  • Too bad iD Software didn't release a free OSX client like they previously did for linux version of the game.

    Excuse me? [slashdot.org].

  • Where's the Linux version?


    (for those who didn't get it, yes I am making fun of all the people who asked "where's the mac version?" in response to the announcement of Doom 3 for Linux. And, yes, I already know there's a Linux version [tuxgames.com])

  • This will certainly spell the end of the Mac as a commercial/production machine. Instead using it as a serious business tool, employees will now spend their days playing doom3. The Mac advantage, the ability to remove components such as WMP, IE and the like, and thus avoid unnecessary vulnerabilities and distraction for staff and production workers, will be annihilated with this one game.

    I long for the days when we Mac user had the freedom to simply create, compile, and compute without these application

  • Nothing new here (Score:4, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday November 04, 2004 @10:34AM (#10722906)
    Doom has been anounced for Apple at least once a year since 1985.
  • Every time id comes out with a new game you have to buy a new computer or at least a new video card. Am I the only guy around that doesn't have money to buy new hardware?

    It's like I'm at a fast food joint buying Doom3 when the pimply faced teen asks if I would like a processor with that. Damn it! No! I can barely afford the burger. I can't afford fries too!

  • Jason Fox will be happy (Score:5, Funny)

    by tunabomber ( 259585 ) on Thursday November 04, 2004 @11:11AM (#10723328) Homepage

    See this week's Foxtrot [ucomics.com].

    Although, if that Stephen Hawking shoot-em-up he's working on ever gets released, maybe whether or not we have Doom3 on Mac will be a moot question.
  • Well, I had to buy a PC a couple months ago for a project that needed proprietary PC software. Since my Mac is a DP 1GHz G4, I knew full well there'd be no way I'd be able to run Doom 3 on my Mac until I get a G5. So, I bought a new copy from www.gogamer.com for $29.95 for the PC.

    I think my Mac has reached the end of it's useful life as a game machine, but it's perfectly usable for everything else... guess I need to buy a G5 to play the latest games. For example, my current Mac is the MINIMUM system requir

  • Mac Users Should Pay (Score:3, Insightful)

    by IAmATuringMachine! ( 62994 ) on Thursday November 04, 2004 @05:52PM (#10728709)
    I know a lot of folks like to pirate games, and I'm not going to pass judgment there. But one note is that Mac games companies need volume to succeed and to want to port games. If you are going to run a game on a Mac, please reward the publisher for their work, so that the publishers do not go out of business or start producing shoddy work. Similarly, when you buy a printer or whatever, make sure to send in the registration card (even if you fake the address, etc.) so that they know that Mac users do buy the hardware, to keep development of drivers active. Samsung was pretty surprised when a lot of people freaked out when they said they weren't going to make drivers for 10.4, thinking nobody used their kit... (I am still begging them to reconsider...)

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