Microsoft Dismisses Apple's iTunes for Windows 916
fewnorms writes "Microsoft's general manager for the Windows Digital Media division, Dave Fester, yesterday dismissed the new iTunes for Windows version, saying it was too limited for the average Windows users. Choice quote: "[Apple's music store] ... is a drawback for Windows users, who expect choice in music services, choice in devices, and choice in music from a wide-variety of music services to burn to a CD or put on a portable device." Of course Apple doesn't feel to worried about this, simply stating their products will (and have) lived up to the hype." The points made are all valid- but contradictory to standard Apple product design where simplicity always takes priority over flexibility. Besides, iPod is growing market share, and iTunes will be the best choice for windows users who own it.
The best choice? Guess again. (Score:2, Informative)
Can't disagree with the first point, but the second? Not really. There's at least one other jukebox app [musicex.com] that has a substantially better feature set [macobserver.com] than iTunes and is just as easy to use. I tried iTunes for a day and got frustrated with its limitations. Other than purchasing the occasional track from the iTunes Store, I can't see myself firing it up again. (And no, I'm not one of those people who had sta
Re:The best choice? Guess again. (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:The best choice? Guess again. (Score:5, Insightful)
Exactly what limitations are you referring to, mr. vague? The only limitation I can possibly think of is the use of AAC for the music store files, but those can be easily transcoded into just about any format you want (wav, mp3, even wma by using an intermediary step). I'd hardly consider that a limitation. Yeah, you may lose *a bit* of quality by recompressing, but if you use a high enough recompression quality setting, you can really minimize that to the point it is a non-factor. Care to elaborate on the limitations now? I mean it rips into a multitude of formats (with very high levels of control over compression), it burns to DVD, CD in many different formats (MP3 CD, Audio CD, and Data CD), and has some of the best streaming support I've found in any music player, not to mention the ability to easily share your tunes over a network with no configuration outside of clicking a check box. I think it is a fantastic product, mac or windows, and I give kudos to Apple on a job well done.
Re:The best choice? Guess again. (Score:4, Insightful)
"Unless Apple decides to make radical changes to their service model, a Windows-based version of iTunes will still remain a closed system, where iPod owners cannot access content from other services," said Fester. "Additionally, users of iTunes are limited to music from Apple's Music Store
The gist of this is that people want to be able to interface with other systems and that because Apple doesn't let you do this - which is something Windows users expect - the service is "dismissed".
Well, well, Microsoft double-speak at its best again. Pass me some of whatever you're smoking, will ya? Because last time I checked, users of instant messaging want the same thing - interoperability - and Microsoft isn't letting them have it with their IM service.
Conclusion: Microsoft is pointing at a "flaw" that they would actually like to have in their own system once they reach the critical mass that iTunes has.
no scripting required (Score:3, Informative)
Re:no scripting required (Score:2, Insightful)
or
or
etc etc etc.
re-read my post. yes there are lots of things you can do with smart playlists, but to get any sort of genuine boolean logic in there req
Re:no scripting required (Score:5, Funny)
MC9 Offers Smartlist Scripting (Score:3)
If you want to play with serious Smartlist configurability, I suggest you check out JRiver's Media Center [musicex.com], and refer to this earlier comment [slashdot.org]. [slashdot.org]
Oh yeah.... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Oh yeah.... (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Oh yeah.... (Score:5, Insightful)
You can't? Last time I looked you could package any music as an mp3, aac, wav, or aiff and the iPod would happily play it without a hitch.
Re:"Open up?" (Score:5, Interesting)
IIRC, AAC is actually an ISO standard and is used in MPEG4 and is significantly better than mp3s which are at much higher bitrates. WMA is wholly owned by Microsoft and doesn't seem to offer appreciable sound benefits over mp3s.
Re:"Open up?" (Score:4, Informative)
Surprise [apple.com], surprise [apple.com].
Oh, and where exactly are you finding all this Dolby 5.1 music? Or do you just spin movie soundtracks at parties?
Re:"Open up?" (Score:3, Insightful)
I like OSX, so I hate to say this...
Do you have ANY idea the number of features in OSX that FIRST appeared in a MS OS?
Should we start with CUI and GUI basics like Select and Modify concepts and move all the way to the newer features being added to Panther?
We could even mention Chrome and other things from the MS research
Re:Not at all a fair comparison (Score:3, Interesting)
You are totally missing the issue. With WMA, the devices themselves do not HAVE to support the protection mechanism, just like the IPOD itself does not support the protection mechanisms.
It is when the WMA files that ARE protected are transferred to the devices that any protection is considered. Either via Windows Media Player or third party applications like AUDIBLE.COM's audible manager.
The
Re:Not at all a fair comparison (Score:3, Interesting)
The devices are nothing more than a medium, just like a CD, and even protected content can STILL be copied to these devices or to a CD if the protection of the content allows for it.
Of course they are copyable - but are they playable? Are you saying that WMA files with a restriction "No transfer, no r
Re:I know what you mean (Score:3, Informative)
From that article:
will the MS/MSN music store offer a choice? (Score:2)
Microsoft Logic bad, all DRM stuff bad. (Score:4, Interesting)
Our users expect flexibility, therefore we will make sure nothing we make talks to ipod or itunes.
Itunes is too limited for our users who are so complex they only want M$.WMA.
Poop on all the closed source DRM gimped up garbage. Zaurus cost $200, plays mp3 and ogg and takes non DRM'd compact flash. Get Open Zaurus and you can mount up a nice ext2 filesystem for all your long filenames, archiving and all that. Get a $100 wifi card and the thing can talk to any music server you would like to set up. Now that is total flexibility, why would anyone settle for less?
Music Player Selection (Score:5, Funny)
>>if you use Apple's music store along with iTunes, you
>> don't have the ability of using the over 40 different
>>Windows Media-compatible portable music devices.
Oh, shoot. I mean, that's really a big problem for me. I like to use my Rio on Monday, and Samsung mp3 player on alternate Wednesdays, and the Nomad for Friday afternoon... What am I going to do if I can only use my iPod? Horrors!
Re:Music Player Selection (Score:3, Insightful)
This is mistake that a lot of people make when compareing Microsoft and Apple; they assume that, like MS, Apple is a software company. They're not. Apple is a hardware company. All of their software products are linked to one of their hardware products. (And they sell the hardware, while they give the software away for free. Imagine that.)
Mac OS - Mac Computers (obviously)
iTunes (specificly iTunes 2+) - iPod
iChat AV - iSight
iDVD/iMovie - DVDR/CDRW Superdrive
They have n
Please remember. (Score:5, Insightful)
Obligatory Princess Bride Quotation (Score:5, Funny)
"You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means."
but you do have choice! (Score:5, Insightful)
Lets see, Airport [wireless + modem] iPod, apple cinema displays...all work with PCs too...but work even better with a mac. When apple REALLY figures this out [and they're starting to!] MS will finally have to pay the piper for abusing their market!
Re:Please remember. (Score:5, Insightful)
The Microsoft exec's comments are FUDful, as always - "choice"? Giving Windows users iTunes and the iTMS just gives them another choice (or set of choices), rather than taking choices away. Windows users can get iTunes and/or iPod (they don't have to use one to use the other, and don't have to use the iTMS to use either) and use them with other options.
It's true iTunes and the iPod don't play WMA files (DRM'ed or otherwise), but how is that different from other Windows players (software and hardware) not playing AACs (or Ogg, or whatever)? It's also true the iTMS files don't play on players other than iTunes and the iPod, but how is that different from BuyMusic's (or similar services') files not playing in anything except Windows Media Player and DRM WMA-capable portable players? (Ok, there is a bit of difference there, since there's a greater variety of portables that play WMA files, but one might argue none of them are as good as the iPod anyway.) The point is that Apple's "vendor lock-in" for Windows iTunes/iPod customers isn't substantially different, if different at all, from that of most other legit music download outfits for Windows (at least, ones that offer lots of major label major releases). Moreover, iTMS files have far less obnoxious restrictions than most of them.
Fester's comments are just so much FUD, like most public comments by MS officials. I wouldn't trust anything they say any farther than I could comfortably spit an elephant.
Re:Please remember. (Score:4, Interesting)
This is just about Microsoft worrying about their licensing revenues for WMA, and their reflex rejection to any standard or protocol they don't fully own. That's why you can't even rip to MP3 with WMP9.
Re:Please remember. (Score:3, Insightful)
The point is, the only reason Apple is palatable at all, is that they weren't good enough to capitalize on the market like MS. I don't know if that's a good reason to support a company. I'm really not trying to start a flame-war here, and I'm sure I'll be attacked for casting any asper
Re:Please remember. (Score:3, Insightful)
One could argue that if Apple had the majority market share, they wouldn't be trying as hard, or innovating as much, since they wouldn't need to. And Microsoft would either have much better products or be dead and gone, because their whole strategy r
Who is Microsoft to talk? (Score:5, Insightful)
Um, yeah, this coming from the company that's offering exactly *how* many music downloads?
Re:Who is Microsoft to talk? (Score:5, Funny)
Really? Perhaps you haven't seen their hit single "Developers! Developers! Developers!" You're missing out. Search for it with iTunes.
It seems to me that.. (Score:5, Insightful)
If Apple can keep things a little simpler, and a little more limited, and offer the flexibility that they do (burning audio copies to CD, etc), as much as we geeks might complain, it's probably easier for the average consumer to grasp.
Sure, I'd love to see a mainstream offering with a huge library selling DRM-less MP3s, but that doesn't seem likely to happen, and it's certainly not going to come from Microsoft.
Choice in devices? (Score:2)
A wide variety of devices do not support WMA, mp3 being the most popular format. Who wants a DRM-enabled format anyway?
Has anybody noticed... (Score:4, Interesting)
I was just wondering if anybody else had similar problems. I mean, the interface is great, but if I can't code in VS while listening to music, then it's not very worth it to me.
None at all (Score:2)
Re:Has anybody noticed... (Score:3, Interesting)
Further, iTunes is the first pay service I've felt the desire to install and buy music from.
Re:Has anybody noticed... (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Has anybody noticed... (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Has anybody noticed... (Score:5, Insightful)
That is probably a hardware/OS problem. Your sound card IRQ is being shared with your video card's IRQ. You can check this by running MSINFO32 --> hardware resources --> conflicts/sharing.
And that, ladies and gentlemen, is why Apple will not sell OS X for PCs.
Re:Has anybody noticed... (Score:3, Interesting)
not for me, but i've heard similar complaints (Score:3, Informative)
I have heard skipping complaints, though, mostly from friends with older hardware, but there was one dude with a shiny new Athlon XP 2800+ that was getting some skips.
My guess is there's some driver conflict somewhere, because the skips don't seem to occur with all hardware or with just "slow" hardware. (And it runs fine on a 266 MHz G3 in Mac OS X).
Re:Has anybody noticed... (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Has anybody noticed... (Score:2)
Re:Has anybody noticed... (Score:2)
iTunes hasn't skipped at all, even when scanning two drives for MP3 files, or when I'm opening movies or (accidentaly) launching Winamp while Firebird is loading.
In fact, at the moment, it's using about 1.5% CPU use (average, it switches between 1% and 2% every update).
I think your system might have issues. Maybe the problem is accessing the hard drive? Maybe it's memory issues? VS.Net, Mozilla, and XP Pro are not exactly lightweight, and you're likely to have craploads of crud sucking up ram that y
Re:Has anybody noticed... (Score:3, Informative)
I've noticed that iTunes.exe does seem to be very sensitive to the amount of horsepower available, and ram in particular.
My fiancee and her sister have near-identical Toshiba laptops. Both have 1.4ghz Celeron chips, both are running WinXPsp1. The software and configuration on the two machines is similar in most respect. The only difference is RAM: my fiancee's has been upgraded to 512mb, while her sister's is at the stock 256mb.
My fiancee's higher ram machine has no problem establishing a connection to m
Cat got your tongue? (Score:5, Insightful)
This surprises who? (Score:3, Interesting)
You can save an Excel document in RTF, but you can't open it in any other program in the world. And try opening one of today's Word files in an RTF interpreter made two years ago. Lousy, non-formatted, and occasionally crash-inducing.
Yes, Microsoft created RTF... you can tell.
-fred
Dismissed, or just Dissed? (Score:2)
From my point of view it is the usual MS garbage of disparaging any other system where they don't have a competative alternative in place. It's completely phony, and I hope people refuse to buy into it.
Advanced features in Media Player (Score:2, Insightful)
Microsoft is scared (Score:5, Interesting)
ROFL! Talk about naked FUD. Choice, choice, choice. Yeah, that's the Microsoft Way, isn't it? NOT. What hypocrisy!
It's not even accurate. You CAN burn iTunes Store music to a CD. Rip it again to MP3, put it on any device you want. Oh wait, iPods are just about the best device you can use, so I'm just guessing that if you have an iPod you don't have too many other devices you care to have. For that matter, no matter what device you have, you probably don't have too many others. Why would you? Use what works and done with it.
Choice in music? Well, the biggest choice is probably Kazaa, but that's beside the point. We're talking about the pay sites, and iTMS has 400,00 and growing. Not much of a problem, and becoming less so as time goes on.
Apple just signed with Pepsi and AOL to do cross-marketing. That's some big partners to get the word out. But the word is out already. I see so many iPods in use it's amazing. In short, Apple did something right and Microsoft is running scared about it. With only the Mac market so far, Apple captured, what, 30% of paid downloads. Now the other 90% can use their service, so watch out Microsoft.
Re:Microsoft is scared (Score:5, Informative)
With only the Mac market so far, Apple captured, what, 30% of paid downloads. Now the other 90% can use their service, so watch out Microsoft.
No, with only the Mac market, iTMS has 70% of the paid music downloads. Imagine what they'll have after Pepsi will have given 100 000 000 songs for free!
30% is the iPod market share, and they have 50% of the revenues for portable digital players.
Re:Microsoft is scared (Score:2)
Now if only I could get it in Canada. I'd be responsible for quite a few more legal downloads.
The domination of Apple in the music industry (Score:5, Insightful)
iTunes is a nice start, but to have it for both platforms AND the best mp3 player on earth AND have every AOL user on the planet instantly be abel to use the ITMS (it uses the credit card from the AOl account) AND have Pepsi do a huge push during the Superbowl to give away 100 million songs (and at the same time having literally millions of people install iTunes in short order) AND having a means for parents scared of lawsuits to provide music for kids (allowance) AND to have thousands of audiobooks and other great content like NPR shows...
Apple has set a goal of 100 million songs downloaded in the first year of iTunes (starting in April). But frankly I think they have set their sights way too low. I think 200 million by next April is not out of the question, and probably really low.
One other benefit that Apple has, is that the musicians themselves are generally rooting for the store. I don't know how much of an effect that will have, if any... but a groundswell of artists demanding to be on ITMS cannot hurt.
I have to say, if I were trying to start up another music store right now I would be quivering - even if I were Microsoft, and none of them are! I have to wonder how long it will be before Microsoft sees the whole industry slipping from them and offers a music store directly screwing over all the partners based on WMP.
I don't understand why Dell is trying to do it's own server and doesn't just cut a deal to install iTunes on all Dell desktops. There's a plan for Gateway - are you listening?
Re:The domination of Apple in the music industry (Score:4, Interesting)
AND have every AOL user on the planet instantly be abel [sic] to use the ITMS (it uses the credit card from the AOl account)
This is an interesting part of the deal, to be sure. Does anyone know if this means that AOL will ship iTunes for Win on their CDs? Or what? Not being an AOL user, can someone explain how this looks to them? ie Does one find the music they like (listed by AOL), click on the button--which takes the user to the iTMS, purchase the music--and then what? Do you have to download iTunes then? How much clue is given that this is required? Or does the iTMS music play in a AOL media jukebox?
I think that iTunes for Win is especially interesting, because, if I'm not mistaken, to install it a Win user also gets Qucktime installed--which is a trojan to a lot of other media opportunities for Apple. So, if AOL starts shipping iTunes for Win on their CDs, and then by extension, every AOL user has the latest version of QT installed--all of a sudden, QT is a market leader, or damn close.
Will someone who admits to the use of AOL elaborate on the default tools?
Re:Microsoft is scared (Score:2)
No need to burn to CD first.
If the Windows version is identical to the Mac version, just select the downloaded AAC songs in your library, then go to the menu Advanced->Convert Selection to MP3
Easy.
Re:Microsoft is scared (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Microsoft is scared (Score:5, Insightful)
They should be scared.
August 2002 I bought an iPod. Loved it so a month later I bought a PowerBook, my first ever Mac.
September this year I bought a DP G5.
And I plan to replace my wife's PC with a Mac sometime soon.
Without the iPod I would never have even considered a Mac. Microsoft should be scared.
News at 11 (Score:2, Funny)
Why is this even news?
How about QA problems... (Score:2)
I encouraged my father to install this on his Win XP laptop. Found out a few hours later that it managed to completely hang his system on boot, trying to set up his "drivers and devices" after he restarted after installing iTunes.
He had to hit F8 during boot, choose last-known-good configuration- and then he was able to get back into his system. iTunes launched, but complained it couldn't access his burner and such. It uninstalled cleanly and completely, near as he can tell, but he's flat-out refused t
Windows Media Format vs. AAC (Score:5, Interesting)
Please allow me to Troll (Score:2, Interesting)
What typical Microsoft FUD!
That is a complete and boldfaced lie! You are absolutly NOT limited to music that you purchase from the ITMS if you use iTunes. I installed iTunes for windows the day it came out and today I have about 1.6 gig of music in my library. Guess how many
Stop wasting your time on lousy software (Score:5, Insightful)
Who wants crazy flexibility when you don't even use half of the extra options and they just clutter up the user experience? I'm ditching the other jukeboxes I've been suffering with all year and sticking with iTunes. It may even influence me to buy an iPod -- if it works as seamlessly and easily as iTunes, sign me up.
I'm tired of frittering away so much time trying to overcome the learning curves of PC software and trying to get programs to work and play together. I'm not into computers because I'm in love with jerking around in advanced options settings all day long, I'm into computers because of what they can do for me. My job already pays me to spend 10 hrs a day getting computers to work, I don't want to spend the rest of my free time doing the same thing.
Mac stuff works, first time, every time, it does what you expect it to do. I think that just might be worth paying for. I think I'm going to start saving my pennies for a nice little PowerBook.
Re:Stop wasting your time on lousy software (Score:4, Interesting)
I use my iPod for listening to music but I can tell you that's only part of what I like it for. I am constantly using it to store information I need to shuttle from one computer to another. I have contact information on there so I can call up a persons phone number or address in a second. It is great for storing little notes such as directions or shopping lists. The best thing is that all of these features can be displayed without a computer, they appear on the iPod display. So no carrying around address books or little pieces of paper, I shove it all on the iPod. Now you are able to do voice recordings and store digital photographs on the iPod. Very cool additions that I can see a million uses for.
As far as getting a Macintosh I have always said that people should get the computer they feel most comfortable with. I can personally say that for me Macs have the perfect balance between simplicity and complexity. If you want to just stay in the GUI then pretty much is simple and just works, if you want to use the Terminal then everything is as geeky as you want it. It's a great balance and I enjoy both sides of Mac OS X.
Re:Stop wasting your time on lousy software (Score:4, Interesting)
I have not Turned it off in over 6 months, just reset after Dling updates, and rest of the time, shut it and go, then open it back up and within a second or two it powers up and ready to go.
I work as a small business consultant (technology mainly) and I tell every one to spend the extra money on a Mac. So far I've only had 1 out of about 23 clients not like mac, because "it doesn't have solitare". Everyone else likes them because they don't crash, everything works, easy to use, and gets them the basic software they need. Quickbooks, MS Office, and even Point-of-Sale software that is easy to use with an USB hand scanner and cash drawer.
SONY Should be the Angry One Here (Score:5, Insightful)
Funny how they still sell so many CD-burners and blank media though, isn't it?
if you're using iTunes for windows... (Score:5, Informative)
This is too stupid for words (Score:2, Informative)
untrue
Most of this guy's comments seem to be based aroundthe fallacy that iTunes can only listen to music from the iTunes Music Store. No, it can listen to absolutely anything you, or your programs, or your perl scripts choose to import into iTunes. The only conditions is it doesn't support RealAudio or WMA. Oh, but that's what this is really all about, isn't it?
Re:This is too stupid for words (Score:2)
http://qtcomponents.sourceforge.net/ [sourceforge.net]
[sourceforge.net]
http://sourceforge.net/projects/qtcomponents/
What Choices? (Score:2)
No, I don't like the idea of integrating the music store with the music player, but I guess 1 choice is better than 0. Personally I'm not an ITunes customer because of DRM, but I don't expect Microsoft to offer anything more free... think about it, if MS did offer a music service, it just w
And here's the form: (Score:2)
Did you really expect something else from Microsoft? That form filler could have been used about Windows vs OS X, WMP vs iTunes or pretty much everywhere they compete. My take is: Give me one good service (with like mainstream music) first, then we can talk
just one more player (Score:2)
Perhaps the reason for that (Score:2)
...is well all know Apple is going to do it right, as opposed to the other services?
Re:just one more player (Score:2)
That's Microsoft's big point of obsession, isn't it?
"Integration"?
3.) Profit! (Score:2)
Microsoft to reverse-engineer? (Score:2)
What crack is this guy smoking? (Score:2)
Closed system? What, closed like Office file formats? Like middleware portions of the OS? Like network communications? Like the MSN Messanger service? Like pretty much everything Microsoft has ever done?
Where iPod owners cannot access content from other services
Wrong. If said other services allow users to burn CDs or download MP3s then yes, they can. If said o
MP3, RIP (Score:4, Informative)
Microsoft's main complaint is that AAC is a closed format, which is only useful with iTunes, the iPod, Apple's Music Store, and QuickTime, and throwing the stone that the Windows Media Player format is compatible with 40 devices and several download sites... but let's face it, WMA is a closed system to. The WMA system has a few more choices, but not an unlimited number.
What I really see is a future where you're about to lock yourself into the music network you pick today. If you buy your music by AAC, then you're stuck in the Apple products universe, if you buy your music by WMA you'll get stuck in the Windows Media products universe. If you want to stay with MP3s, you'll either have to buy CDs or risk the P2P cops finding you...
Yeah, there are you options. How would you like to pay today?
A windows convert, possibly... (Score:4, Interesting)
Let me say that over the years, I have tried dozens of MP3 players, only to keep coming back to Winamp. And yes, I'm one of the few that admits to liking version 3 more than 2.x.
Anyways, I've been searching for a long time for an app that will create a good, reliable, playable index of all my songs. I remember when Freeamp came out, its big claim to fame was the ability to build an index of songs according to their ID3 tags. Unfortunately, the app would ALWAYS crash while indexing. I went back to Winamp.
Eventually, the app I found that came the closest to doing what I wanted was MusicMatch jukebox. The problem came in its sorting - it would sort by album/artist/whatever, but I wanted an app that would sub-sort the songs in the order they appeared on the album.
For the record, I have about 300 albums' worth of songs. Each album has its own folder, and the songs are numbered in the order they appear on the album. I'm a big stickler for listening to songs in the order they were intended to be heard.
So I download iTunes. No, I don't want it to be my default audio player. You gotta earn that trust. No, I DO NOT want Quicktime to be the default video player! Why the hell are you asking me this? I tell it to index all my music, and not to copy the songs into the My Music folder (this is just plain dangerous for people that don't know how to organize their local files. I see lots of disks filling up due to copies of their songs living in multiple folders).
I fire it up, and nothing. Go into prefs, tell it where the songs live, and RE-TELL it not to associate Quicktime with my movie files (sigh).
This time it indexes all my songs. Pretty slick, if HUGE, interface. Still doesn't sub-organize songs by order on their album. But wait! Edit - Options - view track number! Huzzah!
Since my MP3 ripper of choice automatically puts the track number into my ID3 tags, suddenly I can see what order the songs are in! And it automatically sub-sorts by track number! This is huge!
The longest I used an MP3 player other than Winamp was probably the 2-day stint I did with Sonique back in 99 or so. But iTunes just might break that record. I'm very happy with it thus far. The only complaint I have is that it doesn't appear to have a 'compact' mode, where I can shrink the player to a reasonable size. Instead I have this huge monstrocity of an app on my desktop. But if it's the price I pay for a reliable, indexing MP3 player, so be it.
Re:A windows convert, possibly... (Score:4, Informative)
IIRC, the Maximize/minimize buttons don't work the same as regular Windows UI buttons do. On the Mac, the "Maximize" button effectively toggles between mini-mode and full size mode. Try that.
Re:A windows convert, possibly... (Score:4, Informative)
Re:A windows convert, possibly... (Score:3, Informative)
Troll. (Score:4, Interesting)
I *have* choice, damnit! (Score:3, Interesting)
I already have choices, and I choose iTunes, the iTunes Music Store, and the iPod. I've looked at other options, and with rare exceptions, they all suck. Some of them (like Buy.com's music downloads), sucked really fucking hard. If Microsoft (or anybody else) wants me to choose anything else, they should try creating something that doesn't suck, instead of telling me that I'm being "locked-in" when I choose to use iTunes.
Choice (Score:4, Interesting)
First, Apple is the current "innovator" in this market.
All jukebox hardware devices are compared to Apple's iPod. The iPod is clearly the leader in the market and defines the scale by which all others are measured. Apple leads the market with an outstanding combination of features, user interface, and overall design - from the iPods compact size to its pleasing, slick look.
The same same is true of the iTunes Music Store. Apple was the first to deliver a service that offered a decent selection, at an acceptable price, with acceptable DRM restrictions. With this service, one is able to not only get a quality download, but retain some degree of ownership; more if you're willing to jump through the very clear loopholes created by the service. Which isn't to say Apple's service got all all right - more on that later.
Apple does have its competitors - and there are clearly products coming out that are designed to directly compete with the iPod and iTunes Music Store. But if Windows users want to take advantage of the leading products, iTunes is the gateway. In this context, choice is not the issue.
But what if choice is important? Users will need to avoid DRM restrictions. And they'll want to use standard formats like MP3 and (now growing in popularity) Ogg Vorbis that can be played on a wide variety of software and hardware.
The iPod is still an option in this case... if your choice of format is MP3. But you'll have to look elsewhere if you prefer Ogg Vorbis. Some of the iPod competitors offer that choice - a distinction that may cost Apple some sales.
When it comes to music service, neither Apple's offering nor any service featuring Microsoft's technology offers the end user real choice. There are some small label services that manage to deliver a fairly nice catalog of music from non-RIAA affiliated sources. But then, the selection is indeed limited if the end user expects to find their old favorites.
If consumers want true freedom and choice, they will have to continue using the current collection of illegal music swapping systems. And that has been the problem all along. When it comes to the business of music, choice has never been a consideration. It still isn't. The irony of the situation is that this mind set has created an increasing market for "pirated" data - a market industry trade groups become more and more vocal about and have taken more and more drastic actions to curb. What this does to consumer mindshare is fodder for other discussions.
Microsoft is correct to point out choice. But they're wrong in how it applies to the situation at hand.
CHOICE!! (Score:3, Funny)
iTunes is Open (Score:4, Informative)
Why?
Because all the decoding of the AAC files - both DRM'd and non-DRM'd - is completed through the QuickTime libraries (NOTE: this is also a way to get iTunes to play ogg/vorbis encoded tracks). ANY application that makes the appropriate calls to the QuickTime API [apple.com] can decode and play tracks ripped by iTunes into AAC and tracks downloaded from the iTMS (assuming the computer is authorized to play them).
So, in theory, it's possible to get WinAMP to play files downloaded from the store if you don't want to use iTunes as your player software. Toast for Mac already can burn tracks ripped by iTunes and/or downloaded from the iTMS onto an audio CD [roxio.com].
The only problem is audio device support, but Apple likes it's iPod sales and Hell already froze over, so we probably won't be seeing WMA support on the iPod or iTMS compatibility on 3rd party devices ever - or at least not until iPod sales start slipping in a major way.
Here is choice, MS style, for you. (Score:3, Interesting)
Try to rip tracks of perfectly legal CD to disk.
Try to find way of *chosing* mp3 format in place of the default WMA, MS owned, format.
Realize *there is not choice of format* by default.
Find out in the net that you need a third party plugin for this.
Install another application to achieve what you want.
Thank MS for the choice they have given you by completely ignoring the most widespread format to store music in digital format.
You're screwed either way. (Score:2, Insightful)
When Microsoft opens their music store in a few months be prepared to lock-in to The MS Way. Don't expect any form of standards or even support for all devices. Don't believe me? Look at the past for some insight to the future.
Again, iTunes is great if you have or want an iPod... or if you don't want any sort of music playe
BOTH apple and M$ are fucked. (Score:2)
Re:BOTH apple and M$ are fucked. (Score:2)
Re:itunes? naah... (Score:2)
Re:itunes? naah... (Score:2)
-Tom
Re:g0t ir0ny? (Score:2)
Now, whether or not they'll play DRM-enabled AAC files from the iTMS is another story...
Re:Microsoft has a point, but not a solution (Score:2)
The format is AAC, and it's a standard format, not something that Apple invented...
Huh? (Score:4, Insightful)
Nice sentence. Anyway... iTunes will let you burn your music to CD-ROM. You can then re-rip this (with iTunes no less) to unprotected AAC or MP3.
Besides, iTunes is a free application intended for iPod users. You don't see me bitching that Kodak's digital camera software won't work on my Canon Elph.
No (Score:2, Interesting)
WMA is far more flexible and portable, open, closed, or otherwise.
More flexible and portable than mp3? How is WMA "portable", last I checked it worked on 1) Windows 2) Macintosh, but very very poorly. If you're talking about AAC, no, you can play AAC on all platforms too, it's just at the mom
Re:iTunes not best for Windows users! (Score:2)
Re:iTunes not best for Windows users! (Score:2)
It installs QuickTime because iTunes is written to require QuickTime. I don't know, but I suspect part of this is because QuickTime for Windows contains a partial implementation of the Carbon APIs, and iTunes for Mac is a Carbon app, so relying on QuickTime would make porting much easier.
Re:AAC ripped CDs: unprotected? (Score:2)
They're unrestricted.
Re:For me its a fun poke in the eye to mr Gates (Score:4, Informative)
Re:iTunes for Linux? (Score:5, Informative)
When the linux developers start caring about interface design as much as they care about kernels.