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Media (Apple) Businesses Media Apple

iPod on Windows 328

Posted by pudge from the always-a-follower-never-a-leader dept.
niola writes "A story on Yahoo mentions the XPlay -- a cool software package that allows a Windows box with a FireWire port to mount the iPod as if it were a drive (gives it a letter too) so that you can upload songs to it. Looks really cool and has the ability to integrate with Windows Media Player." Will Apple sue over this? I guess it'll depend on whether or not they stand to lose money in lost Mac sales or gain money in extra iPod sales.
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iPod on Windows More

iPod on Windows

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  • Huh? (Score:4, Interesting)

    by MaxVlast ( 103795 ) <maximNO@SPAMsla.to> on Tuesday March 26, 2002 @06:53PM (#3231249) Homepage
    Why would Apple sue? It's not in any sort of violation of their copyrights, etc. Unless there's something funky in the license, people can use their hardware whenever and wherever and however they like. It's not like it's a song, it's a song player.

    How different is this from connecting my Apple USB keyboard to my PC?
    • Being unfamiliar with the Ipod, I'll throw this one up...

      Does the iPod have any kind of copyright protection mechanism whatsoever? If so, and this product can bypass it, then it's in the same position as decss, right?
      • It's just a hard drive. If you can read HFS+, you can have your way with it.
        • Is reading HFS+ on a non-mac device considered anti-circumvention? That's a significant question. I used to work for a company that specialized in reading various graphic file formats, both open and closed ones. I can't help but wonder if that's legal anymore.

          • Re:Huh? (Score:2, Informative)

            by sabi ( 721 )
            The HFS+ filesystem code in Darwin is open. Linux also reads (but
            does not write) HFS+. I doubt there'd be an issue.
      • The iPod does not allow you to copy mp3s off of it, because they're in a hidden directory that you can't easily see, therefore you can't use it to copy music.

        However, there are a ton of freeware apps that allow you to copy the mp3s off it, because they can read the hidden directory, and therefore it is Joe Shmoe's freeware app "stealing" the music, not the iPod.

        Apparently, it's sufficient to outsmart the RIAA goons. Cool.
  • Is there a Linux program that can do the same as this Windows application?

    Does it work under Wine if not?
  • "I guess it'll depend on whether or not they stand to lose money in lost Mac sales or gain money in extra iPod sales."

    You trying to tell me people buy macs just to use the ipod?

    • Re:Uh...what? (Score:3, Interesting)

      by foobar104 ( 206452 )
      I can't tell if you're being sarcastic, but the answer is yes. Sort of. I know several people personally who wanted to get into the whole digital media thing: MP3s instead of portable CD players, digital cameras instead of film, digital camcorders and DVDs instead of plain old videotape. The combination of OS X plus iPhoto, iTunes, iMovie, and iPod won them over. About $2,000 bucks later-- counting the iMac and the camera and iPod and whatnot-- they were in business.

      I've seen it happen more than once among my little circle of friends.

      • Yeah, I suppose the circle of people for whom $2000 is pocket change is pretty little.

        • Re:Uh...what? (Score:3, Interesting)

          by foobar104 ( 206452 )
          Who said $2,000 was pocket change? I have three friends who each wanted to get into the whole digital media thing. One of them is about to have a baby, one of them just did, and one of them is just kind of a gadget freak. Then there's me, of course.

          We each decided to buy (new or first) Macs for pretty much the same reasons: iPhoto, iMovie, iTunes, et cetera. For my friends the parents, it was to have an easier way to document their kids. For my gadget freak friend, it was so he could listen to MP3s while he rode his bike. (Not the safest thing maybe, but he's a grown-up, so it's not my problem.)

          None of us thought $2,000 was pocket change. If we were just throwing money away, we probably would have bought some high-end PC, because depending on your point of view you do get more bang for your buck that way. But the thing we all had in common was this: none of us wanted to waste time or effort. Make it easy, we said, and we'll buy it.

          For us, that $2,000 or so was a sort of investment. The proposition was basically that I gave Apple an extra $600 to promise me that managing my MP3s and movies and pictures and whatever else would be as simple and foolproof as humanly possible. So far, they've kept up their end of the bargain.
          • For us, that $2,000 or so was a sort of investment.
            I can't for the life of me consider spending anything on a new computer an "investment". A purchase, sure, but not an investment. The original Apple 1 turned out to be an investment, but certainly didn't look like one at the time.
            The proposition was basically that I gave Apple an extra $600 to promise me that managing my MP3s and movies and pictures and whatever else would be as simple and foolproof as humanly possible. So far, they've kept up their end of the bargain.
            OK, I'll conceed that point!

            • I can consider the purchase of a new computer an investment, but then I'm a contractor/consultant, so I make money with my computers. Which is a pretty good definition of an investment.
    • I would... i'll take just about any excuse to get a new mac

    • Re:Uh...what? (Score:3, Informative)

      by cravey ( 414235 )
      Yes. Apple Stores began to see an increase in sales after the iPod was released. You an probably find more detail on Apple's site or by calling your local Apple Store. I believe 125k were sold in the first two months. Many of those were sole with new macs to former PC users.

    • Re:Uh...what? (Score:2, Insightful)

      by binaryfeed ( 225333 )
      I did just that THIS PAST WEEKEND. Since there doesn't seem to be any STABLE iPod support for Linux yet, and since I hate Windows and since I REALLY wanted an iPod, I bought a Mac. Granted, I was _considering_ buying one anyway, but the iPod (firewire) was the final selling factor.

      You know, I *HATE* Windows. It sucks in all aspects. It's a lousy development system and a lousy consumer system. The only "advantage" is that it is fully "interoperable".

      I use Debian for all of my real "work".

      The new iLamp^H^H^H^HMac with OSX is GREAT for my girlfriend who wants ease of use. And I can burn my own DVDs, I can install most of my favorite software [sourceforge.net] and, if I absolutely HAVE TO, I can read the Micros~1 Office Documents that people send me. All this, for just over $2k. You CANNOT do that in the Wintel world for that price. And even if you could, the sofware would suck. Apple has GOOD designers for ease of use. Admit it.
  • Comment removed based on user account deletion

  • Analogy? (Score:1, Flamebait)

    by Zach` ( 71927 )
    This would seem to be rather analagous to the whole DeCSS fiasco. If a user purchases a DVD, he should be able to watch it on whatever platform he chooses - Win32 or *nix. Similarly, if a user purchases an iPod, he should be able to use it on whatever platform he chooses - MacOS or Win32.

    Apple certainly might *try* to sue, and they might be successful in a legal sense, but the geek backlash would not be conducive to their bottom line.

    Also, does anyone know if Apple is taking a loss on the iPod? That might be likely, if they're counting on racking up additional hardware sales... just like MS/Sony selling their consoles at a loss, obviously expecting to make the money up when people purchase games.
    • 1. There's no encryption in the communications protocol to the iPod (as far as I know) so this wouldn't be the same as DeCSS, since that involves cracking encryping to get around copyprotection, and that's against the law

      2. Apple has been planing on releasing their own iPod software from the beginning, so from there, your hardware theory is flawed

    • Re:Analogy? (Score:2, Insightful)

      by ColdForged ( 453024 )
      Apple certainly might *try* to sue, and they might be successful in a legal sense, but the geek backlash would not be conducive to their bottom line.
      Fudgepucky. Apple's bottom line would be unaffected by any imagined geek backlash.

      This is Yet Another Post that overestimates /.'s and geekdom-in-general's effect on anything to do with Apple. Sure /. might have the power to bring Joe Dialup's web site down simply by linking to it, but affecting Apple's bottom line actually requires people to speak with their wallet. In case you haven't noticed, Apple ain't too popular with And33 5kr1pt K1dd13 (or even Dr. Linux, or Mr. Open Source, or just about every other denomination, save the Apple faithful). So, Apple isn't losing sale one to these people... they were never customers. Sure, they might love to nip away at the fringes... people leaning a bit toward the edge. But the diehard's that might raise a flap if Apple were to sue based on this? Not even remotely.

    • I suspect Apple is now making $200 per iPod.
      The Firefly from SmartDisk uses the same 5gb disk mechanism as the iPod and sells for $200 vs the iPod's $400

      6 months ago, the Firefly was $400 and the iPod is $400. Apple must now be picking up the difference :)
  • I really want an "mp3 player" that looks as good as the IPod, but that uses ogg vorbis encoding. I onlyencode at >320kbps using ogg vorbis for my hd stored music.
  • whether or not they stand to lose money in lost Mac sales or gain money in extra iPod sales.

    will people really buy a mac just to use an ipod? No WAY i'd spend the extra $$ for a mac(and loss of some software selection and hardware support) just to use an MP3 player... I should think more ppl will buy ipod if it works with their existing, or cheaper systems. I know i would if it works with my linux box...

    i need to get out more... never seen this slashdot theme before.. nice :)

  • Apple wont sue (Score:5, Informative)

    by Geekboy(Wizard) ( 87906 ) <(spambox) (at) (theapt.org)> on Tuesday March 26, 2002 @06:56PM (#3231276) Homepage Journal
    Apple has reviewed their software, and has (sorta) blessed it. It even has the same copywrite controls that the mac software has, preventing you from copying the audio tracks from the iPod.

    That's NOT to say that you can't use it as a hard drive. You CAN copy stuff to and from it, in hard drive mode, but if you copied mp3's to it in hard drive mode, then you can't listen to them, and if you can listen to the music, then it's not in hard drive mode.

  • Will apple sue? (Score:5, Informative)

    by Sc00ter ( 99550 ) on Tuesday March 26, 2002 @06:56PM (#3231279) Homepage
    Uhh, considering that the people that make XPlay have an agreement with Apple, and have for YEARS to work on Mac compatible stuff for Windows, I wouldn't count on it. Also, at least a beta of this has been out since the iPod was released, so they must of had some information about how it works before it was released to get the software out there that fast.

    In fact, from their site, other then asking them to change the name from XPod, they don't seem to care, and they've known about it for a while:

    December 10, 2001
    Mediafour commits to demonstrating both XPlay and MacDrive in booth 4021 at Macworld Expo; exhibit runs January 8-11 at Moscone Center in San Francisco

    November 30, 2001
    Product name is changed to XPlay at urging of Apple

    • One small note, If you read about what Media Four actually did, it wasn't really a hell of a lot of work, relatively speaking. They could already read and write mac partitions, and windows supplies the firewire support, so they just reverse engineered the mp3 storage format, which is NOT just on the raw File system, and interface it with windows. Case closed. As for the Apple technology, there was very little to find out.

  • Ephpod (Score:4, Funny)

    by sphix42 ( 144155 ) on Tuesday March 26, 2002 @06:57PM (#3231283) Homepage
    His Web site (http://www.ephpod.com [ephpod.com]) has received over 37,000 visits to date

    I bet that changes really quick

  • Sounds like a win for Apple to me (Score:5, Insightful)

    by jandrese ( 485 ) <kensama@vt.edu> on Tuesday March 26, 2002 @06:57PM (#3231285) Homepage Journal
    I can't imagine too many people were buying Macs because the iPod software was only written for the Mac; however I can see the huge numbers of Windows users who would love to get the iPod. With this software Apple wins two ways:
    1. Windows people start buying the iPod, which increases the sales.
    2. Apple doesn't have to support the moving target that is Windows, instead this other company can deal with all of the support headaches while Apple makes money hand over fist.

    I'm having trouble seeing why Apple just didn't outsource this eariler, unless Jobs is trying to make the Windows users feel like the Mac users have for so many years with the "That looks really cool, too bad it's for the platform I don't run." envy.
  • Hmmm, this reminds me of the two [wired.com] stories [wired.com] Wired did on Ipod-related piracy.

  • Cygwin (Score:3, Funny)

    by geogeek6_7 ( 566395 ) on Tuesday March 26, 2002 @06:57PM (#3231289) Homepage
    So does this mean cygwin users have to watch out for the rm -rf /* bug?
    • There is no rm -rf /* "bug". It was a typo in the install script that would have the same effect under any *nix and was removed in iTunes 2.02.

  • Apple probably won't sue. (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Binky The Oracle ( 567747 ) on Tuesday March 26, 2002 @06:57PM (#3231291)

    My bet is that Apple will let the software stand and continue to add features that aren't available on the Windows side. I don't remember anything in my iPod documentation that prohibited me from using the hardware with some other OS, that seems like more of a Microsoft thing. I'll bet they won't give Win users any tech support, though.

    The Windows connection software will almost always be a step behind, though. Especially if you take things like firmware updates, etc. into consideration.

    The whole point of Apple releasing the iPod as Mac-only was to give the Mac an advantage. While I don't think they'll sue over 3rd party software on another OS, I also don't think they'll give it any help until they decide to buy it up and/or release their own Windows client.

  • Useful (Score:5, Funny)

    by fobbman ( 131816 ) on Tuesday March 26, 2002 @06:58PM (#3231304) Homepage
    Does anyone know if this will come pre-installed on the floor machines at Comp USA or will I have to install it myself?

  • Doesn't update iPod playlists? (Score:3, Informative)

    by nedron ( 5294 ) on Tuesday March 26, 2002 @06:58PM (#3231306) Homepage
    This doesn't appear to update the playlists on the iPod itself.

    So far as I can tell, it's basically just using the iPod in FireWire target mode, where the device is basically just a harddrive.

    I would guess that XPlay doesn't allow you to update the iPod playlists in the same manner that you do on the Mac, which means that anything you do only works so long as the iPod is attached to the PC.

    I think most people are assuming this will work identically to the integration between iTunes and iPod, which doesn't sound likely.

    • Re:Doesn't update iPod playlists? (Score:5, Informative)

      by Sc00ter ( 99550 ) on Tuesday March 26, 2002 @07:06PM (#3231363) Homepage
      From their site:

      What exactly is XPlay? Is it a complete music library manager, or just an interface for moving files back and forth? Does it work with Windows Media Player?
      XPlay is three things. First, XPlay includes MacDrive technology, which makes your iPod appear as a normal drive under Windows for the sharing of data files. Secondly, XPlay makes your songs, playlists, artists and albums appear in custom folders in Explorer, so they're easy to access and manipulate, and organized similarly to how the iPod organizes them. Lastly, XPlay makes your iPod appear as a portable device in Windows Media Player, so it's easy to move your existing song collection to the iPod and enjoy it on the go.

      If you read the site deeper you'll see that XPlay works with Windows Media Player. It does sync all your stuff.

      • If you read the site deeper you'll see that XPlay works with Windows Media Player. It does sync all your stuff.
        Windows Media Player. Sigh. Well, it's not quite as flaky as WinAmp. It's not quite as poorly designed or hard to use as MediaMatch. It's not quite as bad at RealPlayer at manipulating you or your system (and fucking up the latter) or conning you into spending money you don't need to. It isn't quite as stupid as RealJukebox at managing playlists. It doesn't quite have as many weird bugs as the Windows version of FreeAmp.

        Still, WMP manages to be reasonably obnoxious in each of these areas. It's the best of a bad lot -- but that's a very bad lot. You'd think with all the money to be made off of digital media, somebody would put a little thought into their product. The only Windows media player I've encountered -- freeware, shareware, adware, or commercial -- that doesn't drive me to distraction is a modest little CD utility called WhopSee [pandora.be].

        Oh well, at least its motivation to spend more time working with Linux. Has anyone gotten around to writing a sound driver that works around the infamous CS4232 "pop" bug?

  • If I was apple, I would not sue them. Instead, I would integrate Mac ads
    into every iPod sold from now onwards, and even bundle Mac stickers, t-shirts,
    and extra Macism's.

    People buy into new gadgets/hobbies, when the have freebies to sart with. Imagine
    if the blonde prom queen, wears her shinny Mac t-shirt to school, or if Jack cool guy
    puts a funny mac sticker on his bumper sticker?

    Kids would copy like hell. Besides, the thing looks good and it has alot of "cool"
    factor attached to it.
  • If Apple runs true-to-form, they will simply buy Xplay. Just like they bought iTunes from a third party and re-branded it. I predict that the product will be renamed "iTunes Lite for Windows", and will incorporate its own MP3 player component.

    I really doubt that they have the basis for a suit here, and they know that. The interoperability layer here is not much more than a firewire disk driver.

    • Re:Apple will buy Xplay (Score:4, Informative)

      by foobar104 ( 206452 ) on Tuesday March 26, 2002 @07:16PM (#3231432) Journal
      I predict that Apple will not buy XPlay. Why should they? They're already selling iPods faster than they can make 'em, so there's no benefit to Apple to release and support iPod software for Windows. Apple is really good at writing Mac software, either from scratch or acquired from somebody else. iTunes and Final Cut Pro were acquired; as far as I know, iPhoto was written from scratch.

      Right now, Apple's in the best possible situation. While they don't sell XPlay, or officially support it, they don't discourage it in any way, either. Those people who would buy an iPod but won't buy a Mac have an option, albeit not a great one. And all the while Apple gets to point at the iTunes/iPod combo, with all of its functionality, and say, "Only on Mac."

      Buying and releasing XPlay would be a waste of effort.

  • Apple condemning it? Quite the opposite... (Score:5, Informative)

    by neema ( 170845 ) on Tuesday March 26, 2002 @07:09PM (#3231385) Homepage
    I actually just received my 10 gig iPod today. I had ordered the 5 gig and returned it when I heard of the 10. At one point of time during the few times I called the customer representitives, I mentioned that I was debating whether to wait for Apple to perhaps release a windows version of the iPod or simply get this one.

    The rep quickly told me about XPlay (which I had known about before anyway).

    From what I read on some iPod websites, it's fairly common for them to refer PC customers to MediaFour and I believe they have had agreements with MediaFour in the past.

    I also find it interesting that the iPod (or at least Apple media) has it's own section now.
  • Namely EphPod in conjunction with either MacDrive or MacOpener. The links can be found in this comment [slashdot.org] I posted for another iPod story, but it applies more to this one.

    EphPod [mentaljewelry.org] has really come a long way in a short period of time. The listserv runs pretty strong and there is a growing group of people helping this 1 developer find bugs and suggest improvements.
    There's also a guy trying to get it to work on Linux [neuron.com]... help him out.

    I have had my iPod working great since February, and it has never touched a Mac.

    BTW: There's also a Windows firmware updater. Check the link to my other /. post for the URL. He got it to work with v1.1 within a day or two of its release.. pretty sweet.

  • Apple won't sue--its a mutual benefit (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Spencerian ( 465343 ) on Tuesday March 26, 2002 @07:16PM (#3231431) Homepage Journal
    Apple generally does not litigate against third-party applications of their products. That would be silly--it would ultimately discourage software and hardware additions such as PCI cards and software which might augment the Mac OS or its hardware. A computer is a computer, and Apple learned long ago to allow other companies to play when the rewards work both for Apple and others.

    Other products which have had third-party adaptations, although not necessarily with the tacit blessing from Apple that XPlay has includes:

    --the original iMac (an early expansion slot was used for video cards, although Apple discouraged use of the port and discontinued it on later models)
    --LinuxPPC, other operating systems
    --USB floppy drives (when the iMac dispensed with them)
    --The Outback (the first, but unofficial, Mac portable, which used the ROM from a Mac Plus)
    --Basilisk (PC software which emulates an early Macintosh, ala Virtual PC for Macintosh)

    Apple tends to keep to themselves unless someone appears to be directly violating their copyright, trademark, or intellectual property rights. Using the iPod is, well, using an iPod. Apple probably expects other companies to adapt it for their work. Saves Apple the trouble of manpower to create any software, but also releases them from supporting the iPod since a third-party (and non-Apple) product is in use, which may be a warranty violation.

  • For what it's worth (Score:3, Funny)

    by mattdm ( 1931 ) on Tuesday March 26, 2002 @07:17PM (#3231443) Homepage
    I have a coworker whose girlfriend gave him an iPod for Christmas, so he promptly went out and bought a new Titanium Powerbook.

    • Re:For what it's worth (Score:5, Interesting)

      by mattdm ( 1931 ) on Tuesday March 26, 2002 @07:50PM (#3231659) Homepage
      Since my post is apparently +2 interesting and +1 funny (even if a bit -1 overrated) I might as well elaborate.

      Said coworker is a programmer-geek type, not a sysadmin-geek type. He hates all things Microsoft with the appropriate level of passion, and has been using Linux for a while, with mixed happiness -- very impressed with the power and flexibility, totally happy with the *nix environment, but a little underwhelmed by the lack of polish on the graphics and multimedia end of things. (No flames please -- these aren't my opinions; I'm just conveying.) He'd been eyeing OS X for a while in a casual sort of way, but not with much seriousness.

      When he got the iPod-gift, I suggested that hey, we might be able to play with some stuff to try to get it working on his Linux box -- there's others out there working on it [neuron.com]. Hmmm, he said.

      But then he came in the next day with his new Powerbook. :)
  • I got the iPod and have been using it with my Dell Inspiron laptop for a while now. Very easy to use interface, and the software has improved a lot since the early preview releases. I simply drag and drop entire directories to the xplay songs directory in the iPod Drive and it copies them without a hitch. Way way faster than usb too. A few annoyances are that It doesn't copy them with the directory structure. Simply copies all the mp3s into one gigantic directory. It works through WMP well with a copy to portable device option and I believe that it supports playlists through WMP (I'm not sure since I use winamp). Another annoyance is that I believe the firmware for the system is updateable through the mac clients and xplay doesn't support that.
  • Some people have commented that nobody would buy a Mac jsut so they could use an iPod; that's insane. Consider, though: an iPod costs $400, and that's plenty insane right there. For only twice that much, you can buy a whole computer (500MHz G3 CRT iMac).

    I just bought a CD MP3 player for $50 and it suits me just fine. If I had a bit more money lying around, I'd have gotten an iPod instead, to connect to my Mac.

  • Reasons Apple WON'T Like This (Score:4, Interesting)

    by sfgoth ( 102423 ) on Tuesday March 26, 2002 @07:27PM (#3231497) Homepage Journal
    There are several reasons why Apple won't think this is the greatest news.

    1) People really are buying Macs just to use the iPod. I know that the slashdot crowd doesn't fit that mold, but if you go into an Apple store and actually ask one of the salespeople, you'll hear story after story about customers that heard about the iPod, and walked out with an iBook to go with it.

    2) This might raise Apple's support costs substantially. Every call to Apple's support line costs money, even if the customer doesn't really deserve the support. Does someone who buys an iPod knowing Apple doesn't support using it via Windows deserve 90 days of toll free assistance from Apple if XPlay corrupts data on the iPod? Should Apple have to support callers who are having problems with their FireWire ports on their PC? These are just examples, but keep in mind that Apple exists because these are exactly the kinds of problems PC users have all the time. What should Apple tell the users who call support with these problems?

    Now, I don't think Apple should sue anyone over this software. But this isn't the excellent news most people think it is. Apple will be making less money per iPod sold because of this. The iPod's reputation of no-brainer ease of use might be tarnished.

    In the end, hopefully Apple will sell more units, make more money, and get positive exposure to new customers.

    -pmb
    • Well, considering that Apple has known about XPlay since it was XPod and was first developed. And has been at a few Macworlds.. I don't think they have anything to worry about.

    • "Now, I don't think Apple should sue anyone over this software. But this isn't the excellent news most people think it is. Apple will be making less money per iPod sold because of this. The iPod's reputation of no-brainer ease of use might be tarnished.

      In the end, hopefully Apple will sell more units, make more money, and get positive exposure to new customers."

      Eeeh.. you are sort of suggesting that financial concerns of Apple is any of our business. Why should I care that Apple makes less money?
      This is excellent news for the consumer, because it brings choice, and a very fine product to the Windows world as well as the Mac-world.

      In the end Apple will hopefully make enough money to keep creating good products, anything else I seriously don't care about.
    • You're actually believing what the sales people tell you in an APPLE store? Since when were the floor monkeys at CompUSA and Fry's an authoritative source on the time of day, let alone what people are buying things for? An salesman will tell you that the product his is pushing will cure cancer if it will get you to buy.

      Lee

  • Flamebait (Score:5, Insightful)

    by maggard ( 5579 ) <michael@michaelmaggard.com> on Tuesday March 26, 2002 @07:35PM (#3231554) Homepage Journal
    Will Apple sue over this?
    Let me guess, page views down for the quarter so /. needs to bump 'em?

    Apple sues over violations of their copyright, trademark, and trade dress. As everyone here should be well aware by now if you don't actively defend them you lose them.

    The ability to talk to a device of theirs isn't an issue. As to more iPods/fewer Macs who knows, I doubt Apple has a strong concern as they've supported the product and stand to make money whichever way. However it is sad when that kind of flamebait is gratuitously tacked onto a story.

  • XPlay Observations (Score:5, Informative)

    by Chrimble ( 7748 ) on Tuesday March 26, 2002 @07:35PM (#3231556) Homepage
    The initial preview releases of XPlay were very basic and somewhat flaky, and could do little more than copy mp3s to the iPod. You couldn't even delete anything, let alone manage any playlists.

    But Mediafour have been gradually adding functionality over the last few months, and the last release (preview 5) is easily the best yet - it's the first release that actually delivers most of the functionality you'd have on a Mac, albeit with a "Windows" spin.

    I suspect the biggest problem currently delaying the full release of XPlay is the dreaded "write behind" error rather than any legal wranglings by Apple.

    Basically there appears to be a bug in some (but not all) IEEE 1394 chipsets commonly used in notebook PCs/firewire cards which occasionally causes the trashing of the database containing the mp3 data. The upshot used to be that your iPod was rendered useless until a reformat - wiping all data from the device and requiring you to retransfer your music (hoping another "write behind" didn't happen again in the process).

    Preview 5 handles these "write behinds" by providing a facility to rebuild the database, so you don't have to re-transfer your music. It's not pretty but hey, it works 8).

    But overall, the product is shaping up to be pretty good. Whilst it's not quite as easy to use as iTunes (well, it *is* PC software!), it certainly fulfills its purpose when it comes to accessing the device under Windows, and I'll definitely be buying the release version when it arrives.
  • I think ordinarily Apple would have sued, but after that comment that Eisner made about Apple's 'Rip Mix n Burn' campaign, I don't think Apple has any intention of doing anything to help either of these industries.

    I tell you what, if Apple doesn't attack this product, I would seriously consider getting one. Anything to help them fight the SSSCA. (I can never remember the acronym of the new version. When I pronounce it it sounds like a kid learning how to talk.)
    • Remember this...

      Steve Jobs is still the CEO of Pixar. He has an interest in the MPAA just like Disney does. Maybe not to the same extent, but interest nevertheless.
      • "Steve Jobs is still the CEO of Pixar. He has an interest in the MPAA just like Disney does. Maybe not to the same extent, but interest nevertheless."

        You make a good point, but arguably Jobs had a lot to do with Mac becoming what it is today, a multimedia machine. Heck, they even want you doing video editing using Firewire on their laptops. Remember that commercial with the guy editing videos on a plane?

        If this heavy handed legislation passes, Mac's entire product line could be in jeopardy. Even if Steve Jobs is completely cut from Apple, he still has quite a stake in the popularity of the machine.

        I have a feeling he'd be tilted more towards Apple than the MPAA, in this case.

    • Re:The RIAA and the MPAA are enemies of Apple. (Score:4, Interesting)

      by Refrag ( 145266 ) on Tuesday March 26, 2002 @08:28PM (#3231890) Homepage
      Go ahead and order [apple.com] your iPod [apple.com] then.
      What happened to the "XPod" name? Why did it change? [mediafour.com]
      Apple Computer, a company with which Mediafour has always had an amicable relationship, expressed concern over our use of the name "XPod", due to its similarity to the "iPod" name. We chose to change the name to XPlay early on in the project.
      Apple didn't ask them to cease and desist, they merely requested that it undergo a name change.
    • I'm going to buy one as soon as I can just to rip ALL my old CDs and maybe fit an mpg movie on there too.

      Just to piss off the --AAs.

      The non productive Luddite bastards.

      Fuck'em where they breathe.

      Send Jack Valenti to hide in a cave with Mullah Omar and Osama.

  • Apple's blessings (Score:4, Informative)

    by Refrag ( 145266 ) on Tuesday March 26, 2002 @08:04PM (#3231740) Homepage
    Apple has given MediaFour their blessings to work on the application. Apple merely requested that they not call it XPod as they had intended, MediaFour complied and now calls it XPlay.

  • Quality Control (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Curt ( 37359 )
    This product caught my eye at Macworld Expo SF in January (are you guys a little far behind at Slashdot submitting land?) Mostly it just scared me that they let an XP machine in Macworld Expo (the natives hate it) - but I thought it was good that if Apple wasn't gonna do it, someone would. That's what third party stuff is for, right?

    Pudge. Get real. They aint gonna sue.

  • Apple is aware of the XPlay project (Score:3, Interesting)

    by very ( 241808 ) on Tuesday March 26, 2002 @09:06PM (#3232098) Journal
    From Mediafour website [mediafour.com]:

    " What happened to the "XPod" name? Why did it change?

    Apple Computer, a company with which Mediafour has always had an amicable relationship, expressed concern over our use of the name "XPod", due to its similarity to the "iPod" name. We chose to change the name to XPlay early on in the project."
    read more, click here! [mediafour.com]

    Yes Apple is aware of this, and I believe that Apple will benefit from XPlay.
  • I've noticed a few people complaining that you can't update your Ipod's firmware with Xplay. If your looking to update your Ipod's firmware via windows, check out Ipodtronic's updater [podtronics.com]. They also have the source code for the updater available here [podtronics.com], maybe someone can port it to Linux.

  • Our market just increased tenfold.

    That just doesn't sound right. This is not bad for Apple. You know, depending on the status of FireWire for Linux, we should be seeing the nearest sda's as lovely white boxen...

  • I replied to someone about this the other day on the "Apple wants your input" article. http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=29971&cid=3219 401 [slashdot.org]

  • 4 years of waiting with baited breath for the articles that say "obscure hardware item X now works under Linux -- the Windows software has been succesfully reverse engineered, and now we have 25% functionality in Linux" --- and now we have taken a step back -- We are waiting with baited breath for a piece of hardware to be usable under Windows....Hell what is the chance that this will ever be usable under Linux??
  • While checking out the iPod in the local CompUSA the salesdroid was nice enough to give me the URL for EphPod and I splurged and bought it. After a week of being frustrated with EphPod while also *loving* the design and user interface of the iPod I headed back to CompUSA.

    Mac OS X intrigued me... I'd owned a cheap Quadra back in the early 90's and couldn't stand the lack of a command prompt. OS X seemed to address a lot of the earlier issues I had with Macs, so I walked out of there with a new 933Mhz G4 and a 17" studio display.

    So, yes, people are buying Macs due to the iPod. (that's what happens when you have yearly bonus money burning a hole in your pocket...)

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