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iPhone Interest Still Going Strong 339

Posted by ScuttleMonkey
from the dead-horses-and-flogging dept.
Even though the iPhone has already been released into the wild, the amount of excitement surrounding this device doesn't seem to be subsiding by any measurable degree. Many readers have submitted their favorite reactions to the shiny new gizmo including a BusinessWeek report that suggests the iPhone only costs around $220 to make, a user review from MacScoop, one user's top 10 interface mistakes, a roundup of early security concerns, and details on the hardware behind the phone. Read on for more details.

Only $220 to Make an iPhone. Bomarc writes to tell us BuinessWeek is reporting that according to a recent analysis the new iPhone only costs Apple in the neighborhood of $200 ($220 for the 8-gigabyte model) to manufacture.

iPhone User Review. Alexandros Roussos writes "It has been an unforgettable week-end for the first iPhone buyers and MacScoop will now put the focus on one of them who provided to a complete review of Apple's very anticipated gizmo."

Mistakes in the iPhone Interface. Rakesh writes "I love the iPhone. It 's here to stay as my primary cell phone. But I've come across a bunch of things that make me think Apple rushed at the end to get this thing out there. Here's my list of the top 10 mistakes Apple made with the iPhone interface."

iPhone Security Roundup. An anonymous reader writes "Although some security researchers noted problems getting their iPhone activated, others wasted no time tearing the new device apart. Seth Fogie, from Airscanner, reported passwords can be found for the device from running strings obtained from the backup images through a password cracker. Robert Graham, from Errata Security, writes about Safari and Bluetooth bugs on their blog."

iPhone Hardware Details. abdulzis writes "Engadget has the scoop on the iPhone's hardware specs through a leaked firmware. 'Sascha at Gear Log seems to think given the recently discovered Samsung chip in the iPhone, perhaps the processor in question is a Samsung S3C6400, a recently-produced 667MHz ARM1176JZF-based CPU that seems to fit the bill.'"

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iPhone Interest Still Going Strong

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  • No, really? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by borizz (1023175) on Monday July 02, 2007 @02:23PM (#19720851)
    It's been out for what, a day or two? Longer? I wouldn't have expected it to die out so soon. Especially because it's an Apple product and they really rule at building up some hype.
  • by timster (32400) on Monday July 02, 2007 @02:24PM (#19720861)
    Big difference, unless you'd be happy with a big 'ol bag of iPhone parts.
    • Apple clearly spent a lot on development of the device and on the software especially... not to mention all of the prime-time ads. I bet it will take a while before those costs are covered and they start raking in the big bucks with the $380 'mark-up'.
    • Are they even taking into account bulk purchasing??? Obviously the manufacturer is buying the parts in bulk, if the estimated cost of the parts is based on the cost of each part individually, then the total cost of the iphones parts may be significantly less when those parts are purchased in bulk.

      Of course the cost of the parts does not take into account assembly, or the research and development that went into the iphone, which if you ask me, those R&D folks should be canned for making so many obvious
      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by timster (32400)
        those R&D folks should be canned for making so many obvious mistakes and omissions on the released product

        Actually, I wonder if many other product designers fall into a trap of non-omission, that is, a need to include everything. After a few days with an iPhone I can say, sure, there are things that aren't there, but the things that are included are very good. For instance, there is no MMS, but the SMS is great. I figure that every product design team has limited resources, and maybe it was better to
        • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

          by MCSEBear (907831)
          I kind of think an iPhone user would have to be retarded to want to use SMS or MMS at all.

          There is an unlimited data provision for email in all the iPhone plans. You can send email instead of SMS or email with a photo attachment instead of MMS all day long and pay no additional fees. Using SMS or MMS just removes money from your pocket and sticks it into AT&T's.

          Happily, the iPhone is software upgradeable, so you can look forward to the addition of an IM client to give you even more free ways to sling
      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by Overzeetop (214511)
        At $5/GB of flash ($20 for the extra 4GB of flash in the 8GB iPhone), I presume they are taking bulk purchasing into account.
    • First I agree. There's more to the phone than a bag-o-parts. In addition to all the engineering and custom software they are leveraging the enormous implicit value of the already developed OS. The latter is free to them but would cost a competitor plenty. (how much do other phones pay to use windows?). Also factor in the giant risk costs. What if there's a defect that requires a recall. What if it's craters like a newton. Not every project succeeds and you have to amortize the losses over the ones th
      • by gnuman99 (746007) on Monday July 02, 2007 @04:22PM (#19722309)
        http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/embedded/aa714410 .aspx [microsoft.com]

        Says about $90/device for Windows XP Embedded.

        For Qtopia, it is somewhat less but I can't find any info on TT's site about the actual pricing. It is about $200 for the SDK. I *think* I saw that it was about $20-$30 per device some time ago. Much cheaper than Windows.

        Of course, you could just hack X+Gnome and be 100% "free" (not really for free, costs money to hack the thing for a phone). But I guess some other WM would be better than having Gnome there.

        As for Apple Stock, it actually fell 0.6% today to $121. Their P/E ratio is about 38 which means even if they have a 30% jump in profit, that means their P/E ratio will drop to about 29. That is still relatively high. Companies like Microsoft and IBM have their P/E ratios at about 21 and 16 respectfully. Currently there seems to be a 15% anticipated increase in profits for next year over current year. If that does not materialize, Apple stock will drop.

        Apple may be a better company to invest in today than MSFT though. I'm not sure if the price is warranted though (they'll need to double their earnings to be at the same price as MSFT is right now)
        • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

          by jaseuk (217780)
          Windows XP Embedded is a cut down version of Windows XP and is generally used in POS / Instrumentation / Appliances etc.

          The Smartphone / CE / PocketPC OS can't realistically be any more than $5 a unit.

          Anyway don't fool yourself that the iPhone is OSX. It's running on an ARM device, iPhone is as much OsX as windows smartphone is windows XP.
          • by Watts Martin (3616) <layotl&gmail,com> on Monday July 02, 2007 @07:21PM (#19724027) Homepage
            Your observation is fairly, well, obvious, but important to state -- the iPhone's OS is called "OS X 1.0" (it sends back crash reports through iTunes that someone's already dissected, of course), and it clearly has the same heritage as Mac OS X, just like Windows Mobile has the same heritage as other Windows. Windows Mobile has a lot of the same API as "real" Windows, but, well, it's hardly identical, and the crash reports show intriguing differences from iPhone OS X to Mac OS X (and intriguing similarities).

            This is important to note, if nothing else, for those who go around saying things like, "If it's OS X, I should be able to load Mac applications on it." Yeah, we'll get back to you on that after you load World of Warcraft on your Treo, Einstein.
  • suggests the iPhone only costs around $220 to make

    This shows how Apple is really good at playing the game, where it's often about cheaper is better. They show style and quality is worth it. Most people will buy Fords, but some with the money will pay a premium to own a Mercedes. Apple is just the Mercedes of computing.

    • This shows how Apple is really good at playing the game, where it's often about cheaper is better. They show style and quality is worth it. Most people will buy Fords, but some with the money will pay a premium to own a Mercedes. Apple is just the Mercedes of computing.

      Funny, I was thinking more along the lines of new cloths for the Emperor.

      To each their own, I guess.
    • by AndersOSU (873247)
      You must not have been paying attention. Most people buy Toyotas*, a few shell out for the Ford and get hosed, while fewer still fork over the big bucks for the Mercedes and are generally happy.

      *ok really most people (in the US) still buy GMs, but Toyota is second, Ford is third, but my way is funnier
      • by MightyYar (622222)
        Toyotas, Fords, GMs... no matter - that's what the rabble drive - the free phone that comes with your plan, if you will. :)

        (I don't even have a car, so I'm lower than rabble I guess.)
    • This shows how Apple is really good at playing the game

      No, it shows that the people who figured it cost 220 bucks have no clue. Apple's profit margins have always been around 20-30%. I would be extremely surprised if they suddenly sold a 220 bucks device for 600 bucks.

      People always guesstimate iPod margins way too high, and invariably, they turn out to be wrong during the next Apple analyst call.

  • by arivanov (12034) on Monday July 02, 2007 @02:26PM (#19720895) Homepage
    That does not include essential and unavoidable licenses which in the GSM world push the BOM by further 30-40$ (depending on volumes). Add to that licenses related to digital media playback (encoders, decoders) and the phone BOM approaches 300+. That is all before the cost of developing the software. So while the margins are very "applelike", they are nowhere as obscene as the article suggests.
    • by jcr (53032)
      I don't know what the licenses are for AAC offhand, but the H.264 license is extremely cheap. It's around a nickel per codec.

      -jcr

    • It wouldn't surprise me if it was selling at near-cost at retail once you factored in the costs of activation on the network, the store supply chain, tax and so on. If Apple have a good deal with the telco then they may be getting a cut of the network fees. The exclusivity suggests this might be the case; even if it's not most phones on contract are effectively subsedised by the telco and they recoup this semi-loan over the term of the contract. And then there's iTunes, ring tones, accessories and what not.

    • Not to mention the R&D to create the phone, write the software, and create a new business unit to manage and market the device. The money has to come from somewhere.
    • by megaditto (982598)
      220 for parts, 80 to licenses, 100 in R&D, and 200 for the marketing/astroturfing hype... Sounds about right once you add the iMusicStore & the two-year Cingular lockin.
  • by RealGrouchy (943109) on Monday July 02, 2007 @02:27PM (#19720909)
    Are you kidding me? It's been three fucking days!

    Has society's attention span gotten so short that we are surprised when news reports on a high-profile new product spans past the Friday it was introduced through the weekend following its introduction?

    Or are we just surprised that the iPhone has managed to steal a few seconds of airtime from the whole Paris Hilton thing?

    - RG>
    • by truthsearch (249536) on Monday July 02, 2007 @02:39PM (#19721081) Homepage Journal
      Short answer: yes.

      Long answer: yes. (I'd post more but my attention span is too short)
    • Has society's attention span gotten so short that we are surprised when news reports on a high-profile new product spans past the Friday it was introduced through the weekend following its introduction?

      What does attention span have to do with paid-for advertisements? The Apple marketing campaign for the iPhone has been stellar, it's a thing that they truly excel at.

      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by Altus (1034)

        Im sorry but I really think the hype over the iPhone has gone way past apples marketing. People keep acting like apple is driving this hype machine but they really aren't. They barely talk about the iPhone compared to how much everyone else seems to talk about it.

        Apple doesnt drive that hype machine because they don't have to. Not since the iPod came out.
        • Apple has a fan base that exceeds that of the Commodore and OS/2. And I get the same creepy feeling from the Apple fans that I did from the others.
    • by Kohath (38547)
      This post is still modded up?

      I know it seemed Insightful at first, but that was so half-an-hour ago.

      I'm going out for a latte.
    • I mean it has been three days and we still do not know if Paris Hilton has purchased an iPhone.

      And they call themselves journalists.
    • by lennier (44736) on Monday July 02, 2007 @04:49PM (#19722581) Homepage
      "Has society's attention span gotten so short that "

      YES

      Next!
  • by svendsen (1029716) on Monday July 02, 2007 @02:27PM (#19720913)
    Where is the article that does the in-indepth coverage of:

    1. First iPhone user looking at porn
    2. First iPhone user sitting on toilet and surfing web
    3. First iPhone user to get laid because of it (those with significant others don't count).
    4. First person to have an orgasm just by touching it (it being the iPhone you sicko)
    • Where is the article that does the in-indepth coverage of:
      1. First iPhone user looking at porn

      I'll let you handle that.

      2. First iPhone user sitting on toilet and surfing web

      Mission accomplished.

      3. First iPhone user to get laid because of it (those with significant others don't count).

      Done.

      4. First person to have an orgasm just by touching it (it being the iPhone you sicko)

      I'll let you handle that one, too.

    • 3. First iPhone user to get laid because of it (those with significant others don't count).

      Those who purchase an iPhone and have a significant other will probably NOT get laid because of purchasing it.
  • ...so many slashdot readers are praying for iPhone to go down in flames.

    Who cares. It's another product. It'll make some people happy, some not. Don't get so wrapped up in the drama.

    (And no, I won't provide links or references. This is my opinion. I don't have to prove it.)

    • by Kohath (38547)
      You don't understand how important their opinions are. The iPhone has to succeed/fail. Because they want it that way and their opinions matter.
    • by glesga_kiss (596639) on Monday July 02, 2007 @03:05PM (#19721415)

      ...so many slashdot readers are praying for iPhone to go down in flames.

      They are a vocal minority. The phrase I heard recently to describe everyone else was "circle-jerk". That's never something I'd ever even considered and I promised myself that I'd use the phrase again.

      It's not that people like me want to see it go down in flames. Quite the contrary, I've been waiting for a device like the iPhone for many years. My problem is that I got that device two and a half years ago and I'm still happy with it. I welcome the competition in the market and I value Apple's UI design highly so hopefully they will drag the entire industry forward with them. I've been a mobile early adopter since GSM first came out, so to hear that another large, respected manufacturer has entered the industry is fantastic.

      What annoys some of us is that it's being presented as revolutionary. It's not. It might be, if it takes off and in the future changes most peoples outlook on phones. It took the iPod to bring mp3 players to the masses but it wasn't really an evolution change in technology. It was more marketing and design, such as the white headphones serving as a constant "join us, it's great!" advertisement.

      The iPhone seems to be advertised to be a leap forward. Now, it may not be Apple doing this, there is a lot of grassroots support for it as is clear based on the volume of news around it, and they may be generating this meme that it's all powerful. The problem is it's not. It would be a downgrade for me. From what I hear it has the same UI problems as the first smartphones. Having to write down numbers for example as there is no cut and paste or hyper-linking of phone numbers in text. Lot's of little quirks have been ironed out over the years; I've been running homebrew ROMs on my mine, so I've seen it at it's worst and at it's best. From reading about people using it, some of the UI is an improvement but it needs work in many places.

      This is what annoys us. Sure, for most people the iPhone is a leap forward and it's sure silenced most of the "a phone is just a phone" crowd that I have discussed this with on many previous occasions on Slashdot whenever there is a story about new phone technology. So, for the majority of people, great! Enjoy it. Having the internet in your pocket is awesome, as is the lack of needing to carry around a separate media player. The integration of SMS and email is also very handy. Google maps is great, though personally I prefer things like TomTom that keep the data locally. And so on, there are so many things you can do with a device with this.

      Just stop making it sound like you are the first to be doing it! :-)

      • by Dan Ost (415913)
        Can you give us the details of the hardware + software that you're currently using?

        I haven't delved into mobile computing yet and am curious where to begin. I'm afraid of the iPhone mostly because it's useless to me if I can't open an ssh connection from it.
        • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

          by glesga_kiss (596639)

          Can you give us the details of the hardware + software that you're currently using?

          I've got an HTC Blue Angel, which is also known as a Orange SPV2000 or T-Mobile MDA2s. I think! The problem is that the company that makes them (HTC) has only recently began selling phones under it's own brand. The rebranding from telcos makes it complicated and has definitely killed brand recognition in their products. Don't bother with this one, it's not far off being three years old now and there are better ones availabl

      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by Dekortage (697532)

        What annoys some of us is that it's being presented as revolutionary. It's not. It might be, if it takes off and in the future changes most peoples outlook on phones. It took the iPod to bring mp3 players to the masses but it wasn't really an evolution change in technology. It was more marketing and design, such as the white headphones serving as a constant "join us, it's great!" advertisement.

        Actually the iPod starting its dramatic take-off before the slick advertising began, but you can remember it your

  • by backslashdot (95548) on Monday July 02, 2007 @02:31PM (#19720969)
    I bought the iPhone, but I don't own apple stock. I am happy the iPhone is doing well. I hope it spurs the industry to have a spurt of innovation.
    It seems that other manufacturers "test the waters" by making a half-ass web feature enabled phone .. obviously it fails with zero sales.. and then they assume nobody wants to web browse on the phone and stop innovating.

    Come on, a high res screen for web browsing and touchscreen.. we've been wanting that for a while .. why didn't the other manufacturers come out with a decent one?
    • I bought the iPhone

      You bastard! What are the rest of us going to do now? And why did Apple only make one of them?

      All joking aside, the way you phrased that says something interesting about how a lot of consumers view the iPhone. Not as a commodity (I bought a monitor) but as a singularity (I bought the iPhone). Maybe I'm reading into a bit too deeply, but it seems to me that it reflects a valuation of the iPhone as something more than a thing.

    • by d3vi1 (710592) on Monday July 02, 2007 @04:16PM (#19722231)

      Actually only the cell-phones in the US are half-ass web featured ones. Two years ago, the coolest cell in the US was the brain-dead, RAZR, granted it was sexy, but it was also brain-dead. On the other side of the planet, there were touch-screen phones that ran Linux and had Opera 7.5 as a pretty decent browser. They still rule because they can run Doom and Quake, and can render most pages without a problem. Come to think about-it, most of what the iPhone brings, you can get from a Nokia N800 with a basic GSM phone that also has Bluetooth in parallel. Actually the N800 is a lot better than the iPhone. I have an excelent IMAP client on it (Claws), I have Pidgin for IM, I have a very decent Opera 9 with flash and a lot of other goodies. The great thing about-it is that it only takes an incredibly small amount of time to port ANY gtk application to the Maemo platform that the N800 uses. The multitude of applications that have been ported to the N800 only proves that it's a better platform than most of the others.

      I will give the iPhone the following:
      1) Multi-touch. It sounds like it's more than a simple touch-screen. The Nokia N800 has a nice feature that detects if you touch with the stick or a finger and adjusts the input method and the menus accordingly, but I doubt that it's as cool as the one on the iPhone. I am sure that the Nokia N800+1 could easily implement something like this.
      2) Screen rotation sensor.
      3) Phone

      Flame follows: (3) is actually one that can be put in both good and bad. The iPhone is an Edge phone on a 3G world. Granted that the network coverage for 3G in the US is a joke compared to Europe or Asia. Actually, the network coverage in the US is more like a joke. In Romania, the country that only a few years ago was under communist ruling, we have basically 100% coverage for the cell phone networks, and a lot of 3G, and nation-wide GPRS on Vodaphone (they are introducing 7.something Mbps HSUPA later this year) and EDGE on Orange (same as Vodafone). Vodafone currently has 2.8 Mbps HSDPA, and Orange has 3.6 Mbps HSDPA. In Germany it's even more impressing, you have almost full 3G coverage for the whole country.

      Zapp, our only CDMA operator, has EVDO 2.4 Mbps since 2004, and they are going for an upgrade later this year. Now, allow me to be disappointed by the lame EDGE options available to the US market. I am also disappointed by the fact that Apple didn't allow the buying of unlocked phones and gave AT&T exclusivity.

      BTW: The rates for Cell phone is the US are also huge. In 2005, a prepaid card from Cingular gave me "free calls" in the US, but having to pay an airtime rate of $.25/min for both outgoing and incoming calls. In Romania in 2005 the prepaid rates were somewhere around $.20 for outgoing calls, and free for incoming. I also found the fact that you get charged from the second that you make the call, even if the other party doesn't answer, to be a little disturbing, especially since a call to Romania costed around $.90 + airtime tax, and would usually take around 45s to connect to the Bucharest based operators. I've called Cingular and asked for my money back for the situations in which it didn't connect at all. Based on their pricing details I expected to be charged $0.25 in that minute until the person answers and until the call connects, and after that $0.25 + $0.90 for the call, but I was charged almost an extra dollar for each call. I find this wierd because in Europe, if the person doesn't answer, you don't pay anything, and if you receive a call (except for roaming), you don't pay anything. In the US, if someone hates you they simply have to send you a lot of Text messages, because they also cost if you receive them.

      Anyway, to make a long story short, in the US the mobile phones are a lot more expensive and dumb (literally), the rates are a lot worst and the network coverage is a joke. This is coming from a guy that lives in Romania, not in the UK or France or Germany. I talk my ass off on my cell phone (and we all have a cell phone), and I never exceed than $45, except when I'm out of the country.

      Coverage information is available at Coverage Maps [coveragemaps.com].

  • Breaking story: Apple employs some of best UI developers, programmers in world, saves money to pay them (as well as assemblers, shippers, distributors, management, etc). This kind of mark-up is rather typical for brand name products with warrenties.
  • Even though the iPhone has already been released into the wild, the amount of excitement surrounding this device doesn't seem to be subsiding by any measurable degree.

    Perhaps "the amount of media hype and saturation" would be a better description... Going by Slashdot's reaction, you'd think they'd invented an orgasmatron or something.
    • by Macthorpe (960048)
      Agreed.

      I'm worried about reading the comments when this thing [wikipedia.org] comes out.

      Dealing with Apple geeks is one thing, dealing with Linux geeks with their own OSS phone will be quite another.
      • by jb.hl.com (782137)
        The only wonky Linux geek that matters is most likely getting all hot and bothered over the Neo right at this moment, at least judging by his comments about it.... ;)
  • Huh (Score:2, Insightful)

    by suv4x4 (956391)
    Only $220 to Make an iPhone. Bomarc writes to tell us BuinessWeek is reporting that according to a recent analysis the new iPhone only costs Apple in the neighborhood of $200 ($220 for the 8-gigabyte model) to manufacture.

    Someone's forgetting software development, R&D, support, distributing, warranties, shipping, licenses, patents, and around a 50-60 other things like that, which go into a product you buy from the local shop.
    • that include that stuff... you have to figure labor to build them in China amounts to about $0.50
  • IIRC, the firmware is available from an Apple website
    And they've cracked the root password for the iPhone OS
  • The night before the launch I noticed several reports of people saying AT&T seemed to have opened up their network quite a bit. I have been searching for any confirmed network speeds on the phone.

    Also, would like to know if anyone has been able to make the thing work as a bluetooth modem for internet on a laptop.
    • Re: (Score:2, Interesting)

      by Charliems (764942)
      I did a speed test today, got around 190kbs, no idea what it was before in my area. As for the bluetooth, no it can not be used as a modem. It actually can't do anything with bluetooth except a headphone. According to the apple bluetooth wizard thing, there are no services at all the laptop can use.
      • by ryanw (131814)
        That sux about the bluetooth modem thing. Probably that way because AT&T feared their network would melt with the surge of iPhone net users... I would hope that over time once the network usage stabalizes that this restriction is lifted.
  • by guspasho (941623)

    Even though the iPhone has already been released into the wild, the amount of excitement surrounding this device doesn't seem to be subsiding by any measurable degree.

    And when did the product come out? Oh that's right - yesterday! I know it's just an introduction and it's just tech "reporting" (read: hummers) but stupidity like that should be painful. Should the general population become bored with a product as soon as it has launched? No, and we would all prefer it if the tech media wasn't either. I, f

  • by mergy (42601) on Monday July 02, 2007 @03:25PM (#19721597) Homepage
    I didn't buy into all the hype but my boss came in today with it and after setting it up on our WPA wireless network, getting his mail running to our servers via IMAPS, etc. it is a VERY nice device.

    The EDGE network blows. But, browsing off of it from our wireless network is a breeze. The screen is solid and I was amazed at the clarity of the screen with fonts, images when zooming really close. After setting it up on the network, it does need a few things.

    1. ActiveSync or something to sync to our mailserver so the user can get contacts, calendar and mail.
    2. IPSec VPN ability - maybe Cisco will get a client in this?
    3. Open Office documents (Excel, Word)
    4. Open PDF docs.

    I am sure this will get better as it goes. But, far far better than I would have expected as a first gen device. It does make my Treo 700p look poor.
    • by soft_guy (534437) * on Monday July 02, 2007 @03:55PM (#19722007)

      1. ActiveSync or something to sync to our mailserver so the user can get contacts, calendar and mail.
      2. IPSec VPN ability - maybe Cisco will get a client in this?
      3. Open Office documents (Excel, Word)
      4. Open PDF docs.
      1. It already syncs with Outlook. Although I'm guessing you want it to pull these directly from Exchange. Still, you can put Outlook contacts onto iPhone.
      2. I have no idea.
      3. Already opens Word/Excel files.
      4. Already opens PDF.

      I heard there was a bug related to PDF, but not sure about that as I haven't tried it yet. I would expect a bug fix software update for several issues soon.

  • The number one design choice I don't get so far is the non-replacable battery. From the tear-downs [appleinsider.com] it seems like a trival (and relatively inexpensive) bit of engineering to have altered the back shell to allow for a clip-in battery. Is Apple really that desperate for their cut of battery replacements? They could even have designed around a smaller battery trusting that heavy users would buy a backup anyway.
    • If I want a longer use duration (say, international flight), I can use one of the many iPod external battery packs.

      Otherwise, who really needs to replace the battery that easily? I fully expect to get many years of use out of this one. I don't see making the case less sealed than it might be a good tradeoff for something I will almost never want to do.

      I thought the same thing, back when I purchased my Palm V - I had no need for a removable battery then, nor do I now. I prefer the longer battery life that
  • The interface blog entry is worth the read. If only for the dicking er the clicking.

    I don't know if it's my layout or what but the font he uses has literally no whitespace between a 'v' and the next letter. So clicking becomes . . .
  • by Colin Smith (2679) on Monday July 02, 2007 @03:31PM (#19721709)
    Not here it isn't.

     
  • All the same, I never saw a chart that said "distribution" more clearly than this one:

    http://www.marketwatch.com/tools/quotes/intchart.a sp?symb=AAPL&sid=609&dist=TQP_chart_date&freq=1&ti me=3mo [marketwatch.com]

    "But don't take my word for it, go and see for yourself" (RD Laing).
  • Will they work with stereo bluetooth headphones for music playing? And can you use one with bluetooth to browse the Internet with a Laptop? Seems pretty certain now that there isn't a SIP client on 'em which you could connect to an arbitrary VOIP provider while connected to wifi. Nor does it seem likely that a third party will be making one anytime soon.

    I'd be willing to consider one if they had bluetooth laptop tethering but that doesn't really sound like the sort of thing that AT&T would go for.

  • I've been thinking about this for the last day or two. When Microsoft releases a product, lets call it Vista, large segments of the computing world whine about what an unfinished product is. They laugh at Microsoft users and call them beta testers for an unfinished product that was pushed out the door sooner than it should have been.

    Lets contrast that with Apple, and their beta product, the iPhone. It is still lacking some features. Other features aren't polished. Very few people clown the iPhone adopt

    • by cowscows (103644) on Monday July 02, 2007 @04:43PM (#19722523) Journal
      Microsoft has been making OS's for decades, has insane resources, and spent many years getting vista out the door. They also promised the moon and a half for Vista back in the early longhorn days, and delivered something with a way-trimmed down feature list, and it still didn't work all that great for a lot of people. Sure, many complained, but many are also using Vista and being happy with it.

      Apple is making their first mobile phone ever, and while only the foolish expect it to be perfect, there are already tons of people talking about how much better the interface is than any other phone they've ever had. Many of them are also sharing what they see as the flaws in the device. And while I have no doubt that many of those people waiting in line were hardcore Apple fanboys, they're probably closing in on one million phones sold already, and I doubt there are that many Apple fanatics in the US.

      To sum it up, MS needed around five years to put out a mediocre new version of their flagship product, after tons of feature cutting and multiple embarassing delays. I don't know how long Apple had been working on the iPhone, but it came out the day they said it would come out, and people seem to be genuinely impressed by it.

      Apple has made it to where they are primarily by developing products that its customers think are great. MS has made it to where they are by developing products that are just good enough (and some wise business decisions). The two companies are judged differently, sure, but only because each has earned its reputation.

  • by fm6 (162816) on Monday July 02, 2007 @04:18PM (#19722265) Homepage Journal
    The main icon for this story is the one for the handhelds category [slashdot.org]. Which makes sense, except that the icon is a photo of a Palm V, or something similar. Sadly, a pure PDA is no longer a representative handheld. More typically, a PDA is some kind of feature-bloated "smart phone." The iPhone's a good example of that, and probably the best candidate for the new handhelds icon.

    Not to trash the iPhone. It just isn't something I'm ever going to want. I want a simple phone, with easy-to-use PDA functionality. (I'd prefer to have separate phone and PDA, but that train has left the station.) If I want to watch video, I'll get out my LE 1600 [motioncomputing.com].
  • Software Updates? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by ShamrawkNRoll88 (1113451) on Monday July 02, 2007 @05:44PM (#19723091)
    On a different forum that I post on I brought up an (I like to think) interesting (if speculative) point. The iPhone is OS X people, and its totally under Apple's control, they can do whatever they want with the hardware they have by releasing software upgrades... and in a lot of cases the hardware is there, they just need to release the software. The bluetooth isn't physically limited, its limited by software, so syncing can be added. A whole bunch of other goodies can be tossed in using the Apple Updater that comes with iTunes. Which brings up another interesting point to ponder, Apple took teams away from Leopard so that the iPhone would be somewhat stable and usable for its release, and most of its bigger core functions are in place. Which isn't to say that everything that was supposed to make it in by June 29th actually did make it. I imagine we'll be seeing quite a few updates in the close future, and probably a few new features from the Apple and the Google side of things that were supposed to be on the phone originally but didn't make the cut or ran out of time. Personally, I believe Apple has vested too much interest in the iPhone to leave it (software or hardware) in the state it is in at the present time. And we'll probably see numerous (and better) revisions in the months to come. If, however, that is the case, it makes me wonder about Apple's release schedule/marketing strategy.

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