Apple Fined $2 Million in Brazil for Selling iPhones Without a Charger (engadget.com) 97
Brazil's consumer protection agency Procon-SP has fined Apple nearly $1.92 million for selling iPhone without a charger, reports Engadget (citing two technology blogs.)
Apple's move was a violation of the country's Consumer Defense Code, according to the watchdog.
Procon-SP told Apple about the alleged violation in December. Apple responded by reiterating its environmental angle, arguing that it would reduce CO2 emissions and rare earth mining. It noted that many customers already had spare chargers. The agency clearly wasn't satisfied with that answer, however. In issuing the fine, Procon-SP executive director Fernando Capez told Apple it needed to respect Brazilian law.
The fine also covers allegedly misleading water resistance claims. Apple supposedly declined to repair iPhones that had suffered water damage under warranty despite touting the devices' ability to survive immersion for extended periods.
Procon-SP told Apple about the alleged violation in December. Apple responded by reiterating its environmental angle, arguing that it would reduce CO2 emissions and rare earth mining. It noted that many customers already had spare chargers. The agency clearly wasn't satisfied with that answer, however. In issuing the fine, Procon-SP executive director Fernando Capez told Apple it needed to respect Brazilian law.
The fine also covers allegedly misleading water resistance claims. Apple supposedly declined to repair iPhones that had suffered water damage under warranty despite touting the devices' ability to survive immersion for extended periods.
I would almost be on Apple's side (Score:5, Insightful)
I would almost be on Apple's side here, since just about everyone has multiple USB chargers lying around by now, except:
1. Apple doesn't use a standard USB port, meaning you have to have their special cable.
2. Starting with the iPhone 12, rather than including their special USB-A to Lightning cable (the one that would work with the pile of chargers you already own) they moved to a USB-C to Lightning cable, meaning that if you have a pile of chargers already, you probably can't use them to charge your new iPhone.
So basically, you either need to run out to buy a cable that will work with all the USB stuff you already own, or you'd need to run out and buy a charger to work with the cable they included.
Had Apple been bundling USB-C compatible chargers for years I might think differently (haha), but - well, they haven't.
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One would assume that if you have a supply of chargers that you also have a supply of Lightning cables for them.
I mean, eventually the cables wear out, and even outside of that I tend to keep the cables in various places (ie, one in my home office, one at work office, one by my bed, and one in my car). Heck I would have assumed that if they were ditching including the charger they would have stopped including a cable too.
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Oh yeah, that's the other thing, the Apple Lightning cables seem to be made out of disintigratium and fall apart ridiculously easily. I don't know what they use to wrap the cable with, but it just falls apart after a bit. The Lightning part of the cable also tends to crack and due to bad design, every Lightning cable that has seen a bit of use will have a bit of scorching on the power pins on the Lightning side. No, seriously, that's a real thing [ioshacker.com]!
I don't know if they're literally designed to fall apart, but
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I don’t know anyone with problems like this. I myself also never experienced anything of what you describe, and I’ve been using these cables since the iPhone 6 came out.
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I don’t know anyone with problems like this. I myself also never experienced anything of what you describe, and I’ve been using these cables since the iPhone 6 came out.
I guess your mother’s basement doesn’t too many visitors then because I have had the damn things fall apart too.
Maybe I’m holding them wrong?
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Maybe you are, because I've never had a cable fail on me either and I've been using iPhones since the 3GS.
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You must be, because my mother doesn't have a basement and I let other people use the cables too.
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I don't have a huge amount of experience on the subject, my step daughter is the only person I know that uses these devices. I do have to replace charge cable about once a month however. I will at least admit that I refuse to spend what apple charges for them when the gas station sells compatible ones for about $7. The gas station luckily has a policy where they replace the worn cables for free, so I only have to shell that out again when she actually looses the cable.
I do wonder if this might be a case
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If she does lose the cable, you may want to consider an Anker replacement. They make pretty durable stuff. I also tend to buy wrapped cables for my stuff, which tend to last quite well as the wrapping protects the cable inside from damage from any number of sources. Since buying wrapped cables for my kids, I have had no issues with cables needing to be replaced in years. Just the hassle alone may make the price worthwhile after a couple of the warranty replacements you have used.
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I've worked at two firms that give out iPhones as company phones. The failure rate on cables in both firms was high. We didn't give out cables that came with replacement phones by default, but we got through enough cables that in addition to the cables we got with phones (then issued out when needed) we were buying
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One would assume that if you have a supply of chargers that you also have a supply of Lightning cables for them.
Someone who recently switched from Android to iPhone over having landed a job developing iOS applications is likely to already have a supply of USB A to micro-B or USB A to C cables, not a supply of USB A to Lightning cables.
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Starting with the iPhone 12, rather than including their special USB-A to Lightning cable (the one that would work with the pile of chargers you already own) they moved to a USB-C to Lightning cable, meaning that if you have a pile of chargers already, you probably can't use them to charge your new iPhone.
And you would be wrong [pcmag.com] without even bothering to check: "This means you can use an existing Lightning cable and traditional USB-A power adapter to charge your iPhone 12"
So basically, you either need to run out to buy a cable that will work with all the USB stuff you already own, or you'd need to run out and buy a charger to work with the cable they included.
This is not true. It comes with a USB-C to Lightning cable. If you have any USB-C ports, you can use that cable. If you have older USB A/Lightning cables, you can use them.
Re:I would almost be on Apple's side (Score:5, Insightful)
You didn't get the point. Most people have USB-A chargers. Most people don't have lightning cables. Most people don't have USB-C chargers.
So, if the average joe go buy an iPhone 12, he likely can't charge it. Unless maybe from a new PC with USB-C ports (which again, most people don't have), but that's not always convenient.
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You didn't get the point. Most people have USB-A chargers. Most people don't have lightning cables. Most people don't have USB-C chargers.
You mean besides every other iPhone owner since 2012? And you clearly did not read. He said:
Starting with the iPhone 12, rather than including their special USB-A to Lightning cable (the one that would work with the pile of chargers you already own) they moved to a USB-C to Lightning cable, meaning that if you have a pile of chargers already, you probably can't use them to charge your new iPhone.
He clearly said if you have an old USB-A charger you can't use them. That is wrong. You still can use an old charger.
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Well we got an Iphone SE. You want to argue what came in the package I'll tell you. One Iphone. One USB-C to lightening cable. Bunch of papers and an apple sticker. You want to charge it a USB-A charger isn't going to physically connect. A USB-C charger will. Simple as that. There's nothing to argue unless you're blind as a bat. Not everyone is starting with a history of apple, and has a pile of apple hardware to work with. Even on android you get a charger even if you have a history of android.
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I have a USB-charger that came with my Android phone, plus another I bought so I could charge it at work, plus one I bought for the car, plus another that came with my USB-C power bank. So what's the problem?
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My Lenovo laptop also has USB-C, which I normally use for an external monitor, but I'm sure it could charge an iPhone.
Re: I would almost be on Apple's side (Score:2)
My Samsung S21 came without a charger, but with a USB-C cable. So same situation: I can use my old USB-A to USB-C cable, or use the new cable on a newly bought charger (or my notebook PC, or my car (which offers both usb a and c).
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Not everyone is starting with a history of apple, and has a pile of apple hardware to work with.
That sound you just heard was the sound of 5,000 iPeople’s heads exploding simultaneously.
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Of course, if you're switching to Apple, you don't have an old cable. Or if your old cable wore out.
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Of course, if you're switching to Apple, you don't have an old cable. Or if your old cable wore out.
Fuck the cable, If you’re switching to Apple shouldn’t you be more concerned that your testicles suddenly stopped working?
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I'm a step behind so even USB-C wouldn't be in my repertoire. Fortunately USB-A to C cables are easily available for those who bring their new phones over. Same really for those with a lightening connector.
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The connector on the phone/tablet is most likely a USB-C connector but the connector on the charger is probably still a USB-A connector (for Android products). I'm sure there are a few Android products that ship with a USB-C connector charger but most of the ones I have seen are still USB-A. Shipping a USB-C to USB-A cable with the phone/tablet will still allow you to use your old chargers.
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Re: I would almost be on Apple's side (Score:3)
Irrelevant. They need to obey laws, not flout them. If they disagree with the laws then they need to get them changed, not just ignore them. This is yet another example of American corporate arrogance.
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Yes, let's all stop paying taxes and see how far that gets us as a society.
P.S. Just to make it clear I'm being sarcastic.
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Sure everyone stops paying taxes and we end up with no water, electricity, roads, food, healthcare, etc.
I guess you could revert to a hunter gather society but I doubt many people would want to join you.
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I would almost be on Apple's side
How is this any different than the "Batteries not included" toys most of us grew up with as kids? It's not a wild goose chase to find a compatible charger for these phones. I've also seen inexpensive wireless charging pads in the impulse buy bins at check-out of both Walmart and Target.
Yeah, it's kind of inconvenient and a little cheapskate-ish of Apple to not include a charger, but illegal? Come on. Pretty much all this proves is that Brazil is very corrupt.
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"How is this any different than the "Batteries not included" toys most of us grew up with as kids?"
It's not, except there wasn't a law requiring anyone to include batteries with your toys. But that's a pretty big difference.
"Yeah, it's kind of inconvenient and a little cheapskate-ish of Apple to not include a charger, but illegal? "
Yes, illegal, because there is a law being broken. What part of this is confusing you?
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I didn't say it was confusing. I implied that it takes a corrupt shithole country to outlaw something that basically has never been a problem.
For phones sold in Brazil, Apple should just pull a Tesla and include a charger that's so slow it's basically unusable [tesla.com]. Yes, you read that right - if you want your Tesla to charge at anything resembling a usable rate, you have to buy the charger separately. Where's the outrage over that?
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Besides being a completely different situation than charging a small smartphone over USB, you're actually blaming Tesla for charging very slowly over a regular 110 volt outlet? Do you even know how electricity works?
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Come on. Pretty much all this proves is that Brazil is very corrupt.
While I agree with your assessment that Brazil is indeed corrupt, this has NOTHING to do with corruption. Brazil's consumer laws are WAY better than the US and Canada (and yes, I've lived in all three countries). And the government body that issued the fine is very, very consumer-friendly, which is good, as it tries to balance out the little guy vs the big corporations.
Re:I would almost be on Apple's side (Score:5, Insightful)
I think that everyone knows by now that the real reason that Apple doesn't include a USB charger with their new iPhones is because they want you to purchase the new MagSafe wireless charger separately. That extra $40 is the REAL "green" that Apple is concerned about.
Ikea (Score:2)
I'm using a $15 wireless charger from Ikea. Works just fine.
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If Apple really cared about the environment they could make their phone batteries last a lot longer, and then offer an affordable way to change them.
For example, 20W charging is great when you are in a hurry but most of the time you would be better off with 2.5W charging. High power charging warms the battery up and wears it out faster. Unfortunately it's very difficult to actually buy a 2.5W charger anymore, but there should be no need. The phone itself should limit charging power automatically if you plug
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The fact that my motorola charges in 30 minutes with the fast charges was just awesome when I was traveling. Not every plane had a USB socket I could plug into.
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I've used it while travelling too, with a mobile battery that supported 18W USB-C charging. Very handy.
Most of the time I charge at 2.5W wirelessly. I need to sort something out for my car because it's only got fast charging.
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If Apple really cared about the environment they could make their phone batteries last a lot longer...
Apple did add the "Optimized Battery Charging" feature a few releases back. If you leave your phone on the charger overnight, it won't top it off until approximately when it thinks you'll be waking up. I'd estimate that cuts the time my iPhone spends at full charge by at least 70-80%, which is great for the lifetime of the battery.
...and then offer an affordable way to change them
Apple will do it for $50-70, depending on model. Depends on your definition of "affordable" I guess, but it seems reasonable given that the iFixit battery replacement kits cost
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I seem to recall Apple were doing battery replacements for $25 due to the iPhone 6 problems, so presumably that is near cost for them. Seems more reasonable.
$70 appears calculated to push people towards replacing the phone, because as phones get older people are more likely to baulk at spending significant cash on them to get another year or two. They are probably already running slow by that point, and crazy as it sounds that's how consumer psychology works.
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I'd *really* like them to take this a step further, and let me specify to not charge past 70% (or whatever) unless I direct it to make an exception.
It is *very* rare for me to go through half a charge in a day.
hawk
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With USB-C in the charger-end, Apple uses the official USB standard USB Power Delivery for fast charging. For full power, it requires the connector to be USB-C.
Fast charging with USB-A at the charger end is supported only by different smartphone vendor's various proprietary protocols. There are all sorts of different brands which may be more or less compatible with one-another. Some protocols are not even compliant with the USB standard. (that is: breaking, not merely extensions)
The industry as a whole is g
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I would almost be on Apple's side here, since just about everyone has multiple USB chargers lying around by now, except:
That's a terrible way to think about it. I used to have multiple USB chargers lying around, until I was inundated with devices that ship without them. Alarm clocks, [amazon.com] night lights, [amazon.com] now cell phones. They keep showing up in my house, mostly as gifts, without the USB charger. It pisses me off!
The slippery slope has become a reality.
Water damage (Score:2)
Makes no sense (Score:2)
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Few people, even in South America, are buying their first phone. Most are going to have USB C chargers and the iPhone comes with a cable.
I thought the newest iPhone needed a special cable anyway? Well, unless you had a very specific iPhone already, I forget which one.
Re: Makes no sense (Score:2)
It's irrelevant if it makes sense or not. It is not up to Apple if they obey laws or not.
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Most are going to have USB C chargers
No, most people don't. Even in richer countries. Pretty much only some Google phones came with USB-C chargers. My current Samsung came with USB-A charger. Not sure if they switched.
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Iphone SE had a USB-C to lightening cable. Most people have Android chargers (USB-A).
In our case it was a run to Walmart to get a USB-C wall charger. A USB-A cable to lightening was also available for about the same price as the charger. Either way the AT&T store should have been aware of the "no charger included" situation and let the customer know.
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Apple were told to include USB-C chargers (instead of their version of connector) for their phones in the EU, and they didn't want to, so their solution was to sell phones without any charger.
It's a good ol' fashion tantrum that they've tried to turn into a "positive for the environment" thing, and it sounds like you've taken the bait.
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Can't it be both? I mean, it's more profit for Apple and less useless e-waste for 90%+ of users.
good idea, bad execution (Score:2)
They could have won a major PR victory by selling the phone with the AC adapter by default, but offer a no-adapter package at a slight discount. This could still be used to tout a lower price tag (not that important probably) but also they could claim they were trying to reduce e-waste. I would have also thrown in a postage-prepaid envelope to mail back your old phone fo recycling if you had one to get rid of. That would have gotten them a lot of favorable PR, and probably forced other vendors to do the
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Re: good idea, bad execution (Score:2)
Re: good idea, bad execution (Score:3)
Apple Meeting for this issue (Score:5, Insightful)
VP Finance: How big is the fine?
VP Legal: 1.92 million
VP Finance: Next topic please, we're losing more money than that just by discussing it
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Not to mention the money saved by not including a charger, the smaller packaging, the smaller weight and volume per iPhone shipped, etc.
Nanny state? (Score:2)
It's stupid to not include the charger, but at the same time it's up to the consumer to not buy stupid phones that come without the charger. I don't think it's up to the government to decide what feature set -- other than reasonable safety precautions -- should and shouldn't be included in a product. If the people are so stupid that they canâ(TM)t choose a phone without handholding by the government.. how can the government they elect be trusted?
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Perhaps they disagree with you and elected a government to implement the law as they see fit. You don't live there, it's not your call.
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Is there a "mobile phone charger law"?
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Include a coupon (Score:2)
Include a coupon with all iPhones sold in Brazil. With the coupon code, you can get a free charger at any Apple store or order one online with free shipping. Or you can redeem the coupon for $5 in iTunes credit. Raise the price of the phone to cover the actual costs, and then they meet the law in Brazil, while avoiding the waste problem of providing chargers that people don't really need.
Of course, this assumes the coupon strategy would be enough to satisfy the legal requirements. I'm not going to inter
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So far nobody have quoted the law in question, so for now we have to assume that this is down to interpretation of a more general law. If it is down to interpretation of a more general consumer protection law, it is quite understandable, and normal, that a law can be interpreted in several ways.
M
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"So far nobody have quoted the law in question"
The Brazilian government has put out a publication with details on their violation in December 2, 2020. https://www.procon.sp.gov.br/n... [sp.gov.br]
Procon-SP understands that, when buying a new device, the consumer has the expectation that not only will the iPhone present better performance, but also the power adapter (charging the device faster and safer); remembering that the device is an essential part for the use of the product.
Apple does not demonstrate in its respo
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Here you go. Hope you publish your opinion so we can determine if it is the same or different from the Brazilian Supervisory Board that already did it and determined Apple was in violation. http://www.planalto.gov.br/cci... [planalto.gov.br]
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Little to none... (Score:2)
Ceramic capacitors and maybe some coils contain some rare earth metals.
But compare to a neodyme magnet it's next to nothing.
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Charginium, of course.
All this talk of cables (Score:1)
I realize Slashdot's core demographic is getting long in the tooth, but the iPhone has had wireless charging since the iPhone 8. You don't even need a cable to charge the phone, but leave it to the folks here to be out of the loop as technology marches on. There's a good possibility someone buying a $700+ phone already owns a wireless charger, even if they are switching over from Android.
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Charging without cables? What's next? Internet and audio without wires?
Missed headline opportunity ... (Score:2)
Apple Fined $2 Million in Brazil ...
Taking a cue from Rick Sanchez: Apple fine is in the Brazilians [youtube.com] ...
shakedown (Score:2)
Apple has to comply, but it's a shakedown in the grand tradition of government officials
requiring a bribe to get anything done. The money goes into a few people's pockets.
None of it is going into the public coffers.
Otherwise, they would be open to reasonable negotiation.
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Remember this the next time you hear a politician spout off about an industries "windfall profits."
The Modern Courtroom (Score:1)
(Brazil) "You stand accused of stripping your product, and leaving us with the bare naked essentials. How do you plead?"
(Apple) "We were going...for a Brazilian?"
(Brazil) "I'm sorry, but last years Flattery is this years Cultural Appropriation. Prepare to be...Cancelled."
My hair clippers come with a charging cable (Score:1)
Funny (Score:3)
EU: We're fining you because you included a charger with every phone!
Brazil: We're fining you because you didn't include a charger with every phone!
Can we maybe agree that regulating this level of detail is diminishing returns? At most require a label on the box "requires charger, must be purchased separately" and trust people to not be morons.
I'm actually surprised iPods (remember them?) didn't come with a warning "requires music, must be purchased separately."