Emulator Project Aims To Resurrect Classic Mac Apps, Games Without the OS (arstechnica.com) 74
An anonymous reader quotes a report from Ars Technica, written by Sean Gallagher: Want to be able to run classic Mac OS applications compiled for the Motorola 68000 series of processors on your ever-so-modern Mac OS X machine? Or maybe you'd rather run them on a Raspberry Pi, or an Android device for that matter? There's an emulation project that's trying to achieve just that: Advanced Mac Substitute (AMS). Advanced Mac Substitute is an effort by long-time Mac hacker Josh Juran to make it possible to run old Mac OS software (up to Mac OS 6) without a need for an Apple ROM or system software. Other emulators out there for 64000 Mac applications such as Basilisk II require a copy of MacOS installation media -- such as install CDs from Mac OS 7.5 or Mac OS 8. But AMS uses a set of software libraries that allow old Mac applications to launch right within the operating environment of the host device, without needing to have a full virtual hardware and operating system instance behind them. And it's all open source.
I got a demo of AMS from Juran at Shmoocon in Washington, DC, this past weekend. He showed me an early attempt at getting the game LoadRunner to work with the emulator -- it's not yet interactive. A version of the project, downloadable from Github, includes a "Welcome" screen application (a sort of Mac OS "hello world"), Mac Tic-Tac-Toe, and an animation of NyanCat. Applications are launched from the command line for now and are executed by the emulation software, which interprets the system and firmware calls. Unfortunately, there's still a lot of work to be done. While AMS works on Mac OS X up to version 10.12 -- both on Intel and PowerPC versions of the operating system -- the code currently won't compile on MacOS Mojave. And the Linux implementation of AMS does not yet support keyboard input. I was unable to get the front end to execute at all on Debian 9 on Intel.
I got a demo of AMS from Juran at Shmoocon in Washington, DC, this past weekend. He showed me an early attempt at getting the game LoadRunner to work with the emulator -- it's not yet interactive. A version of the project, downloadable from Github, includes a "Welcome" screen application (a sort of Mac OS "hello world"), Mac Tic-Tac-Toe, and an animation of NyanCat. Applications are launched from the command line for now and are executed by the emulation software, which interprets the system and firmware calls. Unfortunately, there's still a lot of work to be done. While AMS works on Mac OS X up to version 10.12 -- both on Intel and PowerPC versions of the operating system -- the code currently won't compile on MacOS Mojave. And the Linux implementation of AMS does not yet support keyboard input. I was unable to get the front end to execute at all on Debian 9 on Intel.
so in essence... (Score:4)
this is Wine for classic Macs?
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No, more like Cider.
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Sort of... Well, DOSBOX really.
Except that MacOS is a GUI OS and hence a lot more effort than DOSBOX.
(DOSBOX is a combination 32 bit x86 processor, MS-DOS and BIOS emulation all combined. Wine doesn't actually include a CPU emulator [winehq.org].) This does, to allow M68k code to run on other chips.
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Not really. This is just emulating the processor and supporting MacOS system calls but does not emulate any of the Mac hardware other than the processor. This works because MacOS applications do not access the hardware directly but instead use system calls and let the operating system make the changes to hardware registers. DOS Applications on the other hand usually use System calls mainly for disk access but will mostly directly manipulate the video and sound card hardware and also often do things like rea
Re:so in essence... (Score:5, Informative)
The project does have to include WINE-style implementations of OS behavior; but much more like DOSbox the relative lack of clean abstraction between the OS and and the lower level platform bits means a need to emulate that aspect as well. There may be bits of WINE that have to lie about a BIOS(I suspect some win32 software freaks out if WMI inquiries related to win32_computersystembios and friends don't produce coherent answers); but the OS and the platform details were much less entangled at that point.
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Given how much of old-world mac Toolbox behavior was in ROM; and how this project's plan to not require ROM dumps to run(as the current classic macOS options do); it sounds a bit more DOSbox than Wine.
IIRC The older MacOSes didn't do a whole lot as far as APIs went. There were some menu management routines, printer drivers, networking and some hooks for desktop accessories, but most of the heavy lifting was done by the toolbox. This left more memory for applications and bitmaps, as the old macs were pretty RAM constrained.
Once the Mac Plus came out and you could have 4MB of RAM, you saw the MultiFinder introduced, and some rudimentary APIs showing up as well.
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System 7.1 booted off a SCSI Zip drive is fine on a 2.5MB Mac Plus. A SCSI hard disk is fine, too. It's not like everyone just used the built-in drive.
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System 6 and earlier did a few tricks to help with memory. Until the Mac //x, they didn't have a PMMU, so normal VM paging didn't work (the Mac // got an upgrade for it eventually.) Pages of the application's code was stored in segments, and each segment was loaded and unloaded, similar to .OVL files in MS-DOS. The QuickDraw routines and the Toolbox did pretty much everything
Of course, with System 6 came INITs and control panel devices, the closest equivalent these days would be .kext files or Linux kern
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Mini VMac already does this, and very well.
Somebody already resurrected the only worthy game (Score:2)
The Fringe:
http://www.sealiesoftware.com/... [sealiesoftware.com]
I got bored at level 348 with 30+ extra guys left
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I remember an old Mac game (although I'm not sure whether it was on OS 6, 7, or 8) where you controlled a line which rotated around points on a grid. The controls allowed you to change the direction of rotation and grab onto the point that your free end was about to swing past. If anyone else remembers it and can tell me what it was called, I would be grateful.
It's Lode Runner (Score:2)
And Sean Gallagher [arstechnica.com] was right in the middle of that era, so he can't even play the clueless Millennial card....
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Indeed, the game is about digging and finding lodes (veins of ore). Though I have to admit, I can't remember it having a real relation to the game itself.
You'd make your character dig holes in front of him, so as to either thwart the bad guys, or to jump in the hole and escape them. But to my knowledge, you wouldn't collect any ore.
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Collecting gold was the primary objective of the game (you then had to navigate to the top of the screen after collecting it all). There's a fairly playable emulation of the original Apple ][ version here [crazygames.com]. One of the best action/puzzle games of its time in my view.
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It might be an unlicensed clone. I remember a widespread LodeRunner clone for classic Macs called "LodeRummer". I wouldn't be surprised if there's one called "LoadRunner" as well.
So, kinda like Executor? (Score:4, Informative)
Sounds a lot like the old (original?) mac emulator called Executor I used to run some System 6 applications on PC's in the early 90's.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executor_(software)
Re:So, kinda like Executor? (Score:4, Informative)
This is exactly what I was thinking. ARDI Executor. I would bet that a good deal of the code could be made use of.
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There is 20 year old software that does this (Score:5, Informative)
A nearly 20 year old piece of software did this. It was called Executor and is now open source in its older iterations.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executor_(software)
https://github.com/ctm/executor
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but they are doing this with the current apple philosophy....
copy what someone else has done, and make it out like your doing something new
Full Apple Emulation achieved, then.
Re:There is 20 year old software that does this (Score:4, Informative)
I still use it (on Linux). It works fine. Executor is nice because there is no gray area ROMs to deal with like some of the other emulators. Is it bug-for-bug compatible with particular Apple hardware? No. Does it run most old Mac apps? yes.
The architecture of their 68K processor emulation is a pretty interesting read, in that it can both interpret instructions or be compiled to do a sort of virtualization by catching instructions natively (like if you want to run Mac on another 68K like an Amiga)
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I destroyed a Mac IIci so I don't consider myself to have a ROM problem. And you can download the classic MacOS directly from Apple, so I don't have an OS problem either. So what's the problem?
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Mac system software is only licensed for use with Apple hardware, so even if you're allowed to download it you're still infringing the license if you use it in a different way.
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Luckily a license agreement isn't part of the terms of sale, at least in the 1980's and under universal commercial code. The main limitation is in his rights to copy, so he can't duplicate it except for personal use. The ROMs are probably not transferrable to another party once they are outside of the original hardware, but it's hard to say for certain without knowing the case law. (so .. gray area)
Long live the classic Mac (Score:2)
I'm really happy to see that the vintage Mac community is alive and active as these machines still have so much creative potential. I restored my Mac SE/30 just in time for the 30th anniversary of its release and have been using it to make pixel art with MacPaint and 8 voice music [youtu.be] with Super Studio Session.
I once had it on the Internet with an Ethernet card on the PDS slot, but ever since the hard drive died, I haven't bothered setting up the Internet connection again because I've discovered that the func
Cue Apple cease and desist in 3...2... (Score:2)
Because Apple is well-known for being lenient when it comes to their IP.
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History doesn't seem to bear that out - ARDI Executor has been around for years SheepShaver and Basilisk II have been left alone for just as long (and they require ROM images).
Heck, System 7.5 disk images have been freely available off Apple's web site for ages now too.
The only time Apple's really sued for something like this was when that company was making clones using Hackintoshes. And even then the Hackintosh community was cheering
SheepShaver (Score:4, Informative)
Realmz (Score:2)
First Shareware game I ever bought.
Why re-invent the wheel? (Score:4, Informative)
ARDI Executor did this decades ago, building an emulator with a clean-room reverse engineered Mac OS 7 compatibility layer. Nobody has touched it in many years, but after it died off the author released it under the MIT license.
Wouldn't it make more sense to have modernized and improve Executor rather than starting from scratch?
Ob (Score:2, Troll)
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web banner (Score:1)
Hmmmm (Score:2)
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"Classic Mac Games"? (Score:2)
Let's do it for OS/2 !!! (Score:2)
Spaceship Warlock (Score:2)
I just want to play Spaceship Warlock, with sound. That is all.
What's a 64000 Mac? (Score:2)
I've never heard of that CPU...
MacPlayMate resurrected! (Score:2)