Apple iMac Pro Goes on Sale December 14th (engadget.com) 278
Apple vowed to ship the iMac Pro in December, and it's making good on that promise. From a report: The company has confirmed that its workstation-grade all-in-one will be available on December 14th. It has yet to reveal the exact configuration options, but the $4,999 'starter' model ships with an 8-core Xeon processor, 32GB of RAM, 1TB of solid-state storage and a Radeon Vega graphics chipset with 8GB of RAM. You can option it with up to an 18-core Xeon, 128GB of RAM, a 4TB SSD and a 16GB Vega chipset, although video creator Marques Brownlee notes that you'll have to wait until the new year for that 18-core beast.
I still think it's a dumb idea (Score:4, Insightful)
Xeon CPUs and powerful GPUs inside a pointlessly thin computer with a built-in display? What for? Who the fuck asked for this?
Either the internal heat will kill components prematurely or the thing will make even more jet noise than an old PowerPC G4 tower.
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Those of us who look longingly and our cheese grater stuffed in a box somewhere and wish, really wish, Apple could, you know, improve on the concept of a high end, expandable Mac instead of something that looks like Jony Ive's idea of an ashtray.
Well, we didn't exactly ask for that. But I suppose it will be all we get.
No it's not all you will get (Score:2)
But I suppose it will be all we get.
Why do you suppose that? Apple has already said they are working on an updated Mac Pro as well. The iMac pro is just for people that want a more contained unit they never messed with.
In theory we should see the new Mac Pro in 2018, but I'm thinking maybe the end of 2018... but in the meantime if you need more performance from the Mac the iMac Pro seems like a pretty good system.
A faster horse (Score:5, Insightful)
Xeon CPUs and powerful GPUs inside a pointlessly thin computer with a built-in display? What for? Who the fuck asked for this?
Henry Ford said it best when he said "If I asked my customers what they wanted they would have said a faster horse". Perhaps you are right and nobody wants this but Apple does have a pretty good track record of making products people didn't know they wanted. We'll know soon enough.
Either the internal heat will kill components prematurely or the thing will make even more jet noise than an old PowerPC G4 tower.
I'm glad you could clear that up for us without ever having seen the product.
HP-Z apples mac pro needs to be kick ass and price (Score:2)
HP-Z apples mac pro needs to be kick ass and priced at the same level as Dell and HP pro workstations.
Starting at $1499 - $1700 (desktop cpu class) (lower end pro / gamer system)
Starting at $1999 (workstation cpus)
With choices like
UP TO High end CPU's (maybe duel) with lower rage video.
Lower end CPUs starting point with UP TO high end WORKSTATION CARDS (room for duel X2 wide video cards)
As low as 256GB flash storage (boot / os / apps) with UP TO 4TB-6TB+ 3.5 HDD's storage SAS / SATA at least 2 bays. Can als
You are guessing (Score:2)
HP-Z apples mac pro needs to be kick ass and priced at the same level as Dell and HP pro workstations.
Why? People shopping for this machine probably aren't in the market for a Dell or HP. If they wanted a Windows machine they would buy one.
I have no idea if this new Apple Pro machine will sell well or not. Nor do I really care. But it's hardly inconceivable that it might sell very well. Time will tell if there is a market for it or not. Anyone pretending they know if it will succeed or fail right now is simply guessing.
this was apples idea to replace the mac pro. (Score:2)
this was apples idea to replace the mac pro.
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Either the internal heat will kill components prematurely or the thing will make even more jet noise than an old PowerPC G4 tower.
I'm glad you could clear that up for us without ever having seen the product.
Well I do hope they get it right. I had a 27" iMac (the last gen with the DVD) that died because of heat. It was always extremely hot at the vents and then the graphics card failed. Apple wanted 700 CAD to fix it (apparently it required a mother board replacement), out of warranty. One place told me that a reflow could help and it did, but that only bought me two months, since it failed in the same way again.
If I was putting money down, I would be asking how hot it got and what sort of warranty there was.
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Dare I say it, I think Apple has probably considered these things and have done appropriate things to ameliorate the issues you've raised with the iMac Pro.
My concern is similar to the Trashcan Mac: Yup, it's absolute gorgeous. But what happens in two years when Intel puts out a new line of Xeon CPUs that run a little hotter.
I mean, I'm probably not spending $4999 for it now. But I might be in the market in a couple of years. When I buy a "Pro" machine and I fork over that kind of money, I expect to be
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Xeon CPUs and powerful GPUs inside a pointlessly thin computer with a built-in display? What for? Who the fuck asked for this?
Either the internal heat will kill components prematurely or the thing will make even more jet noise than an old PowerPC G4 tower.
They are redesigning the Mac Pro to be modular again. They want to cash in on their desperate customers with the iMac Pro before they release it though!
And still no Mac Pro. (Score:3)
Re:And still no Mac Pro. (Score:4, Informative)
Still planned for 2018 AFAIK. Non-trashcan modular design.
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Rubbermaid sells stackable trash cans.
Just say'in.
and clones are better for apple workstations thin (Score:2)
and clones are better for apple workstations. Then this thin and looks that apple has been doing.
The old mac pro tower was ok (hold over from the old g5 that needed the monster heat syncs.) but HP and dell have made cool towers that may not have the best looks but are easy to work on. Also pro users will put up with an loop back cable to route video card DP out to an ADD in TB card.
enterprise needs easy to remove storage (Score:2)
enterprise needs easy to remove storage. Dell and HP let them DESTROY HDD's under warranty as well.
Just wait for some movie in post production getting leaked out of the apple repair shop when they can't remove the local storage.
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Who does video post on internal hard drives? The Trashcan Mac Pro was notable because it has 6 Thunderbolt ports, to which you connect your disk arrays and perform your work. Thunderbolt is more than fast enough to handle the transfer speed of disk arrays that you'll be using. (After
high cpu workloads do not need an 8GB video card (Score:2)
high cpu workloads do not need an 8GB video card.
apples start points are too high and like the 2013 mac pro to much on the video side at the base level.
Harumph (Score:2)
Still no touch screen.
And yes I would use it if it were there. For scroll/zoom if nothing else.
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Thimk Different (Score:2)
Show of hands, please:
How many of you believe that the people who buy this $5000 iMac will be the same people who actually need a $5000 iMac?
I'm thinking nah.
Does it have a headphone socket? (Score:2)
n/c
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I'm actually considering buying one...
I like the 5K screen, and need a beefy machine to run something like DaVinci Resolve [blackmagicdesign.com] for video editing, color grading, etc....especially if I start working with 4K footage.
I'm working on old hardware (MBP late 2011, with 16GB ram, SSD card replacement main drive, external thunderbolt work and cache drives)....and even with Photoshop, if I'm working with compositing several RAW files, I can bog my system down.
So, no...you don'
Re:Imagine (Score:4, Insightful)
Needs beefy machine.
Runs 2011 MBP.
Do I fail the fanboy test here or does that not make any sense? A (very) small segment of the user population needs a workstation class machine. For those who do and want to run OSX...welp break out the corporate cards. For everyone else, you can get more for less AND not have such a high level of lock-in. Maybe Apple will even let you upgrade this system...!
Re:Imagine (Score:5, Informative)
Well, I've been struggling with what I have for a number of years....and right now, the old system doesn't do what I need.
Not to mention, for big purchases, I like to save my nickles and dimes and buy what I want/need with cash and have no buyers remorse...therefore rather than make lots of small purchases, I save up and buy big and best as I can periodically.
Currently, I can bog the little systems down for DAYS at a time with a heavy After Effects render.
And I can't do much with Resolve before it halts things to a snails pace.
So, yes, I'm looking for dropping some coin on a high end workstation type unit, that will hopefully get my preferred workflows going at a manageable speed, and hopefully, last me for a few years to come.
Again, I've looked at something comparable, as recommended by Blackmagic Design, for running Resolve (linux or windows) [blackmagicdesign.com] with the HP Z840 [hp.com]...which also get $$$ very quickly.
I did a very quick comparable on the HP z840 to the base iMac pro and it was about $4665...it isn't exact, but is close to what Apple purports the base iMac pro to be. And also, the iMac pro includes the 5K 27" monitor which you would have to add to the HP or other comparable unit.
No, not everyone needs this type of workstation, but if you are wanting to do a good bit of quality video, SPFX and even some high end photography compositing, etc....a nice high end system can make your day and workflow work for you.
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I did a very quick comparable on the HP z840 to the base iMac pro and it was about $4665...it isn't exact, but is close to what Apple purports the base iMac pro to be. And also, the iMac pro includes the 5K 27" monitor which you would have to add to the HP or other comparable unit.
But you also get expandability, and of particular interest in your specific case Resolve leverages multiple GPUs so if things start to slow down you can simply add another GPU to the HP system and you're good to go, to improve the performance on the iMac you have to scrap the entire system, including the display, and buy a new one.
That's not going to be the case for everybody but certainly in your case the choice of something expandable is definitely the right one. If you really just want an Apple then hold
Re:Imagine (Score:4, Informative)
But you also get expandability, and of particular interest in your specific case Resolve leverages multiple GPUs so if things start to slow down you can simply add another GPU to the HP system and you're good to go, to improve the performance on the iMac you have to scrap the entire system, including the display, and buy a new one.
That is not true -- macOS High Sierra supports external Thunderbolt 3 connected GPUs [apple.com].
Yaz
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Needs beefy machine.
Runs 2011 MBP.
Do I fail the fanboy test here or does that not make any sense? A (very) small segment of the user population needs a workstation class machine. For those who do and want to run OSX...welp break out the corporate cards. For everyone else, you can get more for less AND not have such a high level of lock-in. Maybe Apple will even let you upgrade this system...!
You say the "You can get more for less", and then proceed to NOT prove it.
Good job!
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You good, bro?
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I had actually considered doing a DIY build of a thread
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Re:Imagine (Score:5, Insightful)
I believe it's actually ECC RAM, which is much more expensive than the conventional desktop variety.
The thing between Microsoft and Apple is, with Apple, you know right from the beginning that they're going to gouge you, but after that they're pretty good. Quality is good. Reliability is good. You don't have to deal with bullshit. (Well, historically this has been true... this past year Apple has done a fantastic job of shoving their reputation through a woodchipper).
Microsoft, on the other hand, will screw you each day, every day, and you will either learn to accept it or throw your hands up and switch to something else. Their quality is shit. Their QA is shit. They demand that they have control of your machine, but they don't want to take responsibility for your machine, with the end result that your computer can go tits up one day through no fault of your own.
As obnoxious as Apple is, there has never been a report, for example, where all Macs across an entire continent were suddenly yanked off the net due to a bad dhcp update. Microsoft has had so many bad updates that have hosed entire fleets of machines, that it's shameful. But because Microsoft has a monopoly, they can get away with it.
Of course, I shouldn't speak too soon because so far I am very unimpressed with High Sierra, iOS 11. They have been buggy messes. And don't get me started on what they've done to their macbooks in recent years. The only reason I haven't gone back to Windows is because Apple and Microsoft seem to be in a "Hold My Beer" competition, and I can't predict how things are going to shake down, so I'll stick with the costs I have already sunk.
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Suddenly Windows 10 doesn't seem so bad. I bet I could even get XCode running in a VM on an Asus laptop if I had to.
Found the Troll...
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And hey...it is a business write off!! Yet another good reason to incorporate yourself.
I don't know how it works in your jurisdiction, but here in Canada there is no need to incorporate to claim business expenses on your taxes. A computer would be depreciable property though, so you wouldn't be able to claim it all in one year.
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It makes it much cleaner in the US to incorporate yourself to write off business expenses. And here I can most definitely write off and claim the entire amounts in the year purchased.
My CPA says I can, so I do....so anything computer or camera related (hell most any
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Sounds fishy to me. A business expense is a business expense, it isn't intended to subsidise your hobby. You might get away with claiming your golf clubs - if your main business is teaching golf.
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No, I try to be quite careful.
It does just so happen, I want to monetize something that also is a personal interest (which often start off as a "hobby" ).
But I have made genuine efforts to monetize the results of those equipment and software purchases.
While I have earned some money off them to date, it isn't ne
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You absolutely don't need to incorporate (or form an LLC--the more common option for individuals. An LLC is NOT a corporation), but they do make accounting and taxes cleaner.
As a sole proprietorship you just add a tax form Schedule C and you can deduct and expense what you need. You have the option of deducting many expenses (like a computer) using "Section 179" deductions that let you take the whole amount in the year of purchase, as opposed to depreciating.
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Well, being that as it may...like you said, it is cleaner to do it if incorporated.
If you're doing ANY type of even remotely significant business, you should incorporate, the sole proprietorship thing is about the worst o
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Yep, S-Corp all the way. I'll be saving about 10K this year on Medicare and SS payroll taxes.
Hopefully this time next year I'll be writing off a big *Mac* Pro expense.
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Have you heard anything about a Mac Pro release?
I have been waiting a LONG time already and really need a better AV system to work on....
Not sure I want to wait another WHOLE year for the Mac Pro that may or may not be coming out in 2018.....
But yes....I like writing off new computers...every little bit helps!!!
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Why... thought? I mean buying a product at $5,000 and it comes with a graphics card, that's two generations behind? Because of some weird brand-love that Apple wants to have with AMD? There's truth in that Apple people don't need the top-end hardware, and then there's truth in fucking over your customer with a high energy consumption, louder, shittier product in all respects.
They explained that "brand new love" when the MBP 2016 came out.
It has to do with the number of 4k and 5k displays that can be driven, and since you can take advantage of that with TB, and considering that this is much more likely to be used as a high-end GRAPHICS machine, rather than a Polygons-per-second GAMING machine, the decision makes perfect sense.
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Keeping the same number would be timid. Increasing it would be downright cowardly!
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In general if you build a system Spec per Spec to try to match the Apple Product you are going to pay about the same price +/- $100. However the real question is how many of these features you are matching do you really need or want. Where you can build a system at less of the specs and save a good amount of money.
Apple isn't over charging for their products, but they are not offering a lot of choices that would meet our needs per price.
This is a very old argument. However it still holds up.
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Of course it doesn't mean free....
But a % savings on my tax bill is always a welcome thing, and I have to buy equipment anyway, so, nice to save a bit wherever I can!!!
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Please link me to one
Notice, they NEVER do...
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Assuming you're posting from the U.S., get over it. Christmas is a holiday recognized by the federal government. If you choose not to enjoy it, that's your business. But it's not culturally insensitive. You're just culturally intolerant/oversensitive.
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You might consider moving into Federal Govt. IT contracting...it can be very profitable.
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I like working in government IT. We keep the terrorists from taking away our freedoms.
Instead, nowadays, we just have your Overlords to do that...
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And his forth mistake was not being Christian, and being eternally damned in the afterlife.
Re:$5,000? (Score:5, Funny)
Two pops and one push. Or two pushes and one pop.
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dup swap pop pop .
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Pay attention.
Re:Hahahahaha (Score:5, Informative)
Legally run OS X.
For some folks, that's justification.
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Sucker.
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don't confuse the law and Apple EULA
Apple is a software company (Score:2, Insightful)
Legally run OS X. For some folks, that's justification.
You may be joking but that is actually 100% correct. Steve Jobs himself pointed out that Apple is a software company [youtube.com]. Their hardware is nice but nobody would pay a premium for it if it ran Windows or if the iPhone ran Android. The hardware for a Mac or an iPhone is not meaningfully different from any number of their competitors. So that means that the reason people seek out Apple products is based in what they do differently and that is software.
People get confused about what sort of business Apple is be
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Legally run OS X. For some folks, that's justification.
You may be joking but that is actually 100% correct.
Which is quite odd when you consider how much pro software is actually Mac-exclusive. Photoshop & friends have run on Windows forever and the only OS X-exclusive video editor is Final Cut Pro X. Every time I look at the "pro" Macs I get the impression this is a form of squeeze play by some artsy, fickle folks in the marketing department where they don't want to run an uncool Windows PeeCee and the employers figure it's better to just pay up than to lose good people over what's ultimately not that much r
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If only they would make the one thing I'm interested in:
A goddamn tower with space for lots of hard drives (at least 4, 8 would be better), multiple video cards, free memory slots and a cooling system with lots of thermal overhead.
But they will. not. make. that.
WTF apple?
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It's just a fancy name for "work bench", a.k.a. the place where you put your 3D printer and Arduino projects.
Re: Hahahahaha (Score:4, Informative)
Here, let me help [wikipedia.org]:
It's fun to call our Chromebooks a "workstation", but traditionally that's not remotely what it means.
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It's fun to call our Chromebooks a "workstation", but traditionally that's not remotely what it means.
Yeah, traditionally we'd call that kind of computing power a "supercomputer". Unless it has some special hardware for those "technical and scientific applications" like one of those Titan V compute cards I find there's really nothing that makes it a workstation anymore, it's just a high performance general purpose computer. Unless you count ECC RAM as the "workstation" feature...
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> I can't imagine what these things do that justify that price tag
Well... I'm just going to throw out the suggestion that Apple has a really, really strong brand loyalty factor going for it, and there's going to be an Apple logo on these things...
Re:Hahahahaha (Score:5, Insightful)
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And our workstations cost 1/20th of what these cost.
1/20 of $4,999. So your workstations cost $250? That's nice.
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You workstations cost $250 with a monitor? What kind of work, typing?
Re:Overpriced (Score:4, Informative)
According to Apple's web site the iMac pro has:
4xThunderbolt 3(USB-C), suppotring 2 additional 5K kmonitors
1X10Gb ethernet (Nbase-T 1,2.5,5,10Gb support)
4XUSB 3
SDXC card slot
and a mini-headphone jack
Re:Overpriced (Score:5, Funny)
No FireWire 400.
Lame.
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No SCSI. Hell, I'll bet it doesn't even have a parallel port
Wikipedia article here [wikipedia.org] for those not old enough to remember this bit of communication history.
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Ah yes, the parallel port. The port I used to connect almost anything except a printer.
Remember LPT 8-bit DAC?
Remember LPT SNES gamepad?
I 'member!
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IIRC the joystick connected to a 15-pin game port/midi port. But yes, I had one of those logitech gamepads. It was a good pad.
Re:Overpriced (Score:4, Interesting)
WTF, how am I supposed to connect my Zip drive then?
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Well I guess I don't need my Firewire 400 to 800 adaptor anymore.
Re:Overpriced (Score:5, Funny)
and a mini-headphone jack
They didn't eliminate it? What a bunch of cowards.
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"...and a mini-headphone jack"
I wonder if it can be moved to an iPhone.
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No courage went into building this machine I see. I'll have to pass then!
Re:Overpriced (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Overpriced (Score:4, Funny)
Dude, the Mac mini is only $499 and also has four USB ports. At only $125 per port, it's a much better value!
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For me it's not the shame of the white stickers, but the fact that my Pontiac is white, and so the sticker won't show up very well.
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At least you get a free monitor with it.
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Me: "free"
Michael Eisner: Thank you DontBeAMoran, that was the joke.
Re:Overpriced (Score:5, Informative)
Is it?
Xeon W-2145 - $1113
Cheapest LGA-2066 board available with 10Gb ethernet - $650
32GB DDR4 - $400
1TB 3.2GB/s PCIe SSD - $500
Radeon Vega 56 - $600
5k 27" monitor - $1300
PSU, WiFi + Bluetooth card, wireless keyboard, wireless mouse, thunderbolt card, CPU cooler, case - ~$400
Total - $4963
Seems like it's pretty much in line with how much it would cost to build the same system yourself.
don't need wireless in a desktop and reuse screen (Score:2)
don't need wireless in a desktop and reuse my screen.
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added MS crapware, no thanks. Linux might work, except my time is worth more than pfutzing with Linux...no time to delve into that world. Get this, os x costs money to develop.
Re:Overpriced (Score:5, Insightful)
Very few people have any use for a system like this though, particularly if it's not running Windows.
I fail to see what "running Windows" has to do with the argument. It's obviously aimed at a market point that you have no knowledge of. Multiple 5K displays are most likely of use to people in moving image processing, this relatively big data needs this spec as an absolute minimum nowadays.
I doubt very many will be bought for gaming.
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This makes a decent dev machine. Especially if one is writing code that uses Vagrant and is tested on multiple VMs (app servers, a DB server, etc.) Something like this can handle the vagrant on/off/destroy cycles with ease, especially if one is prototyping a more complex configuration (DB servers, load balancer, app servers, etc.) If the Vagrant environment tanks, who cares... just drop the VMs and rebuild.
Even if someone doesn't use that much active VM work, having multiple VMs on the desktop is useful
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Heck, for that price, I can get a velocitymicro system with dual 16-core Epyc processors, 32gb ram, and onboard 10gigE.
Got me thinking... maybe it's time to replace my dual 8-core Xeon and dual 16-core Opteron systems.
32 to 64 $800 and no you don't get keep the 32 (Score:2)
32GB to 64GB $800 and no you don't get keep the 32. Big rip off when for $800 you can get an 64GB ECC kit.
https://www.newegg.com/Product... [newegg.com]
Re:Good night (Score:5, Informative)
No, the CPU (Xeon W-2145) alone is more expensive than your 1/5th estimate for building it yourself.
Here's a rough sketch of what you'd need to buy to match this system:
Xeon W-2145 - $1113
Cheapest LGA-2066 board available with 10Gb ethernet - $650
32GB DDR4 - $400
1TB 3.2GB/s PCIe SSD - $500
Radeon Vega 56 - $600
5k 27" monitor - $1300
PSU, WiFi + Bluetooth card, wireless keyboard, wireless mouse, thunderbolt card, CPU cooler, case - ~$400
Total - $4963
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amd has more pci-e lanes so for pci-e storage syst (Score:2)
amd has more pci-e lanes so for pci-e storage systems it's better. Hell if not needed to be redundant one system loaded with pci-e disk can power a full VM stack.