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China Iphone Apple

Apple iPhones Found to Have Violated Chinese Rival's Patent (bloomberg.com) 130

Beijing's intellectual property regulator has ordered Apple to stop sales of the iPhone 6 and iPhone 6 Plus in the city, after it found that the design of Apple's iconic smartphone is too similar to a Chinese phone. The aforementioned handsets infringe on a Chinese patent for exterior design held by a company called Shenzhen Baili for its 100C smartphone. From a Bloomberg report: While the decision covers only Beijing, future lawsuits against Apple could take the case as a precedent, potentially influencing the outcomes of litigation elsewhere in China. Baili is one of scores of smartphone brands trying to cash in on the country's mobile boom. [...] "If the position by the Beijing IP office is upheld and Apple doesn't appeal further, then in theory they wouldn't be able to sell the iPhone 6 and iPhone 6 Plus," IP specialist Ted Chwu said. The iPhone 6, and iPhone 6 Plus were launched in 2014. What took them so long?
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Apple iPhones Found to Have Violated Chinese Rival's Patent

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  • Interesting (Score:5, Insightful)

    by bondsbw ( 888959 ) on Friday June 17, 2016 @09:05AM (#52335601)

    I didn't know that China understood the concept of design protection.

    • Re:Interesting (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Winckle ( 870180 ) <mark&winckle,co,uk> on Friday June 17, 2016 @09:08AM (#52335645) Homepage

      They feel differently when it's a Western company "violating" a Chinese company's patent.

      • The iPhone 6, and iPhone 6 Plus were launched in 2014. What took them so long?

        The wheel of (in)justice turns slowly... unless someone grease the wheel.

        • by Kozar_The_Malignant ( 738483 ) on Friday June 17, 2016 @10:21AM (#52336357)
          The Chinese model wasn't invented until this year. Duh!
          • Some mornings it's hardly worth chewing through the restraints to get out of bed.

            You have misquoted Emo Phillips. The correct quote [azquotes.com] is: "Some mornings, it's just not worth chewing through the leather straps."

            • Some mornings it's hardly worth chewing through the restraints to get out of bed.

              You have misquoted Emo Phillips. The correct quote [azquotes.com] is: "Some mornings, it's just not worth chewing through the leather straps."

              That's entirely possible. However, it is also possible that he is misquoting me, since I have been using that tagline since the days of logging into BBSs using Telix on a 286 in the late 80s. I am sure that I copied it accurately from the guy I swiped it from, because my tagline management program was really good at that.

              • Some mornings it's hardly worth chewing through the restraints to get out of bed.

                You have misquoted Emo Phillips. The correct quote [azquotes.com] is: "Some mornings, it's just not worth chewing through the leather straps."

                That's entirely possible. However, it is also possible that he is misquoting me, since I have been using that tagline since the days of logging into BBSs using Telix on a 286 in the late 80s. I am sure that I copied it accurately from the guy I swiped it from, because my tagline management program was really good at that.

                Oh, so HE misquoted Emo. ;-)

                I just noticed because I've used that line off and on since I first heard it around 1990 or so (I think).

        • The iPhone 6, and iPhone 6 Plus were launched in 2014. What took them so long?

          The wheel of (in)justice turns slowly... unless someone grease the wheel.

          I've heard that only matters to the people on the rim.

      • by PopeRatzo ( 965947 ) on Friday June 17, 2016 @09:47AM (#52336001) Journal

        Isn't a more interesting question, "How far has Apple fallen that they now have to copy Chinese designs?"

        • Isn't a more interesting question, "How far has Apple fallen that they now have to copy Chinese designs?"

          That's sarcasm, I assume.

          • That's sarcasm, I assume.

            No, Mr Cook, I'm being serious. Ever since the iWristwatch, Apple has had the stink of desperation on it.

            • Re:Interesting (Score:4, Insightful)

              by macs4all ( 973270 ) on Friday June 17, 2016 @02:17PM (#52338521)

              That's sarcasm, I assume.

              No, Mr Cook, I'm being serious. Ever since the iWristwatch, Apple has had the stink of desperation on it.

              I think Apple did the Apple Watch because everyone EXPECTED them to do it; not because they thought it was the greatest new thing ever.

              The issue is not "Desparation", so much as "Having most, if not all, of the "boxes" checked already."

              Honestly, can you think of another new CLASS of product that would fall logically into Apple's wheelhouse (or any company making similar products?) that anyone has come up with in the past 5 years or so? The Smartwatch is pretty much "it".

              Virtual Reality/Augmented Reality is just now becoming sorta interesting. Rumor has it that Apple has been snapping-up talent in that area for about the past year or so.

              But computer improvements in general (hardware-wise) have been slowing down across the board; same with mobile. It happens.

              For example, when was the last big improvement in home entertainment systems? Product classifications and industries (and consumer tastes) change and mature over time. High-tech stuff is no different.

              If Apple is desparate, it is because the entire industry is desparate.

              If you can find me another company in a similar product-space as Apple that is truly burning-up the press with stuff that is more than just incremental improvements to existing products, that truly changes the way all similar products look and act, like the iPhone did for cellphones, or are truly a new CLASS of product, I'm all eyes.

            • That's sarcasm, I assume.

              No, Mr Cook, I'm being serious. Ever since the iWristwatch, Apple has had the stink of desperation on it.

              Clearly you missed that Apple's phone was released almost 2 years before the Chinese manufactured phone. China copied it and waited until they had a product on the market and then banned the Apple version. That's how China works. They copy, copy, copy and keep copying and when their shit copies aren't being purchased they outlaw the foreign competition by banning or suing them.

        • Re:Interesting (Score:5, Insightful)

          by AmiMoJo ( 196126 ) on Friday June 17, 2016 @12:12PM (#52337397) Homepage Journal

          I doubt the deliberately copied it, they just created an environment where companies feel that rounded corners are worthy of protection and litigation. Karma is a bitch, huh Apple?

        • Not quite as far as Samsung.

      • Re:Interesting (Score:5, Insightful)

        by slack_justyb ( 862874 ) on Friday June 17, 2016 @09:59AM (#52336149)

        They feel differently when it's a Western company "violating" a Chinese company's patent.

        Exactly this, calling the Chinese Judicial system an actual Judicial system is playing extremely loose with what those words mean. I mean, there is justice, but about as much justice that could be meted out with weighted dice in place for actual judges, if the dice are weighted against you, you might as well hang it up and find out how to get your own set of weighted dice. More than likely Apple will pay whatever "operating cost" they need to pay and move on with their lives. More so, this is exactly how business as usual runs in China. There are certain "operating costs" that have to be paid before you sell something/build something/enslave someone there and failure to do so has you running afoul with the Judicial system.

        This isn't Apple's first rodeo in the Chinese legal system and they're well aware of what needs to be done. Doing business in China is a balance of how much are you willing to pay off people and how much you stand to profit. The more you want to profit, the more of that profit you need to "invest" in the Chinese legal system. The Chinese don't see it so much as bribery as the do what they tend to call it "investments". People who sell products in China, need to be vested in the unique interest of China in order to sell their wares there. Or at least that's how the logic works that I've been explained. But I must say that it sounds like it would be dreadful to do business in that country.

        • Doing business in China is a balance of how much are you willing to pay off people and how much you stand to profit. The more you want to profit, the more of that profit you need to "invest" in the Chinese legal system. The Chinese don't see it so much as bribery as the do what they tend to call it "investments". People who sell products in China, need to be vested in the unique interest of China in order to sell their wares there. Or at least that's how the logic works that I've been explained

          It's actual

        • Re:Interesting (Score:5, Insightful)

          by AmiMoJo ( 196126 ) on Friday June 17, 2016 @12:14PM (#52337407) Homepage Journal

          So it's basically like the US, where patent holders always sue in this one corrupt court that never seems to favour their foreign rivals, like Samsung. Got it.

      • They feel differently when it's a Western company "violating" a Chinese company's patent.

        Especially when the President of that Western company's country just had a meeting with a political enemty of the Chinese goverment. It's all about petty revenge.

      • They feel differently when it's a Western company "violating" a Chinese company's patent.

        Apple feels differently when it is on the receiving end of a design patent suit?

    • by Anonymous Coward

      Sure they understand it: If the Chinese designed it, it deserves protection. :P

      • by Anonymous Coward

        How does that differ from US design protection? Each country protects the patent they have issued. Rounded edges... as if that's such a huge design accomplishment.

        • by Anonymous Coward

          Apple does not have a patent on rounded edges. They have a design patent where rounded edges is one of 20+ other distinctions.

      • There is not enough information is TFA. When did the Chinese company file for a patent?

        It used to be that one (inventor or applicant) must prove where the invention idea came from when files for a patent. It was changed a while back and now it is "first to file" which is stupid. One conspiracy theory is that the Chinese company stole the design idea from Apple (using the loop hole in patent filing). An enforcible patent must be filed in the country it is enforced (or covered) in order for claims to be valid

        • by Gr8Apes ( 679165 )
          Actually, rounded corners not withstanding, that looks an awful lot like the 2007 iphone. And, iphones were already in manufacturing in June, 2014, so the design came earlier. It's much more likely that Shenzhen lifted the design from the specs sent to Apple's manufacturers.
          • Actually, rounded corners not withstanding, that looks an awful lot like the 2007 iphone. And, iphones were already in manufacturing in June, 2014, so the design came earlier. It's much more likely that Shenzhen lifted the design from the specs sent to Apple's manufacturers.

            It doesn't matter in Chinese court. When you are a foreigner you won't win. That's why most corporations set up a shell company inside China who acts like a partner to sell your products.

    • I didn't know that China understood the concept of design protection.

      Only when it serves a suppressive country's interest in controlling communication.

    • I didn't know that China understood the concept of design protection.

      They do when it benefits them to do so.

  • by Shoten ( 260439 ) on Friday June 17, 2016 @09:06AM (#52335611)

    It took them that long to file the patent...once the iPhone 6 was released.

    Let's face it: "Chinese Intellectual Property Law" is an oxymoron.

    • It took them that long to file the patent...once the iPhone 6 was released.

      Let's face it: "Chinese Intellectual Property Law" is an oxymoron.

      Their phone was released 6 months before the iPhone. Unless you think that they invented time-travel, the odds are that their design was completed long before the iPhone in question was released.

      • Their phone was released 6 months before the iPhone. Unless you think that they invented time-travel, the odds are that their design was completed long before the iPhone in question was released.

        Yeah, it probably was, but can you say that these two designs [macdailynews.com] really resemble each other?

        • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

          by Anonymous Coward

          They look about as much alike as the models in the Apple v Samsung design lawsuit, which eventually resulted in Samsung owing Apple $400M+.

        • by Anonymous Coward

          Their phone was released 6 months before the iPhone. Unless you think that they invented time-travel, the odds are that their design was completed long before the iPhone in question was released.

          Yeah, it probably was, but can you say that these two designs [macdailynews.com] really resemble each other?

          They both look like an iPhone 4 to me. or maybe an iPod touch.

          On second thought, they really do look like a Palm PDA without the buttons.
          Yep. I'm going with they're both copies of the Palm.

        • Yeah, it probably was, but can you say that these two designs [macdailynews.com] really resemble each other?

          Nope, but then it does have round corners so by legal precedence they are identical.

        • Hmm, both of them look a lot like my Samsung phone. Maybe Samsung should sue them both.
        • Their phone was released 6 months before the iPhone. Unless you think that they invented time-travel, the odds are that their design was completed long before the iPhone in question was released.

          Yeah, it probably was, but can you say that these two designs [macdailynews.com] really resemble each other?

          More to the point is just how different can the exterior of smartphones actually be - especially from a practical standpoint? The devices are only so big, intended to be held in identically-shaped hands and used in the same way. Many internal components, like batteries, are very much alike and limited in shape and size, so components can only be arranged in certain configurations. Buttons, cameras and microphones (etc) are limited in their locations due to usage needs. From a practical standpoint, it woul

          • From a practical standpoint, it would seem that these devices must be more alike than different.

            Imagine if car manufacturers sued each other for similar design attributes.

            You have four wheels. The steering wheel is on the left side. You have a key to start your vehicle. I'm suing you because your design is so similar to mine.
            • From a practical standpoint, it would seem that these devices must be more alike than different. Imagine if car manufacturers sued each other for similar design attributes. You have four wheels. The steering wheel is on the left side. You have a key to start your vehicle. I'm suing you because your design is so similar to mine.

              Precisely.

        • Their phone was released 6 months before the iPhone. Unless you think that they invented time-travel, the odds are that their design was completed long before the iPhone in question was released.

          Yeah, it probably was, but can you say that these two designs [macdailynews.com] really resemble each other?

          Screen, speaker and mic in front - check.
          Front-facing camera and rear-facing camera with flash - check.
          Rounded edges - check.
          Uses an operating system that allows the installation of apps - check.

          Got to admit it, the iPhone 6 does share those innovative and unique features. /s

        • Their phone was released 6 months before the iPhone. Unless you think that they invented time-travel, the odds are that their design was completed long before the iPhone in question was released.

          Yeah, it probably was, but can you say that these two designs [macdailynews.com] really resemble each other?

          Six months? How long before release do you think Foxconn was making iPhone 6 prototypes for Apple?

          People around here have absolutely no concept of how long product design cycles are.

          I wouldn't be at ALL surprised if Foxconn was making iPhone 8 prototypes right now.

        • Adblocking bullshit popover warning on that link.

          Recommend you just don't click it at all.

      • Uh huh? And you don't think they had some inside information about upcoming iPhone designs, which are also manufactured in China? Gosh, they'd never resort to wholesale industrial espionage, would they?

        Sorry China, but you don't get to play this both ways. Well, you DO, since it's your country, but we'll at least call bullshit on it. And in fact, we can't look too smug, since our own system is fucked up enough as it is, just not quite as fucked up as theirs.

        This will probably result in Apple having to b

      • I think the patent system in China and in the US (now) is First to File. Discovering first or shipping first does not matter. So all that matters is the dates of the patent applications.
        • I know nothing about Chinese patent law, other than that WTO membership requires China to have one. But in the United States, the switch to "first to file" did not abridge the novelty requirement. Anything published, even other than as a patent application, before a given patent application is filed is considered prior art and therefore "filed".

          • I know nothing about Chinese patent law, other than that WTO membership requires China to have one. But in the United States, the switch to "first to file" did not abridge the novelty requirement. Anything published, even other than as a patent application, before a given patent application is filed is considered prior art and therefore "filed".

            No one said prior art no longer exists. The point is that Baili shipping first is not necessarily meaningful. If Apple filed before Baili shipped, and or course before Baili filed, then Apple "wins". Apple shipping second is not necessarily a problem as long as Apple filed early enough.

            • by tepples ( 727027 )

              True, if Apple filed before Baili filed, shipped, or otherwise published its own design, Apple wins. But since the America Invents Act was announced, a lot of other Slashdot readers have posted comments under the mistaken impression that the replacement of interference proceedings with first-to-file somehow abridges novelty by allowing only patent applications to be prior art. For example, had Baili published a photo of its design before Apple filed, Baili might win.

              • As I understand it, the point of first to file is to avoid me saying "I invented it first, ask my buddies, we were down the pub last Christmas, honest. And this notebook, look, it has dates written in it with a different pen and everything" after you file. If it ain't externally verifiable it doesn't count.

                It's simply easier to administer. Sucks if two guys are working on it independently at the same time in their sheds, but them's the breaks.

    • It took them that long to file the patent...once the iPhone 6 was released.

      Let's face it: "Chinese Intellectual Property Law" is an oxymoron.

      The verdict against Samsung copying Apple came 3-4 years after the infringement. What took Apple so long?

      To paraphrase you: I guess Apple needed time to copy Samsungs original design?

      Either that or court cases take time.

  • by RogueWarrior65 ( 678876 ) on Friday June 17, 2016 @09:08AM (#52335639)

    If Jobs were still alive and at the helm, he would tell the Chinese to go pound sand.

    • And they'd reply

      "Good artists copy; greate artists steal".

      Besides, Apple's stance towards patents on appearances is well-known (see the rounded corners debate). If some legitimate court finds that the specific iPhone appears too similar to the 100c, what's Apple going to do? Complain that patents on appearances are bullshit?

      • Prior art. If there is any shred of normalcy in the Chinese patent system, this will fall apart fairly quickly. ... Of course, we can easily spend all day speculatively fearmongering about corruption on the part of the people who let this case happen in the first place, which may not be insubstantial.
    • If Jobs were still alive and at the helm, he would tell the Chinese to go pound sand.

      Are talking about the same company that brought lawsuits over a rectangle with rounded corners?

      Apple's chickens may be coming home to roost.

  • The first iPhone I ever bought was a cheap Chinese copy that I got at the dirt market in Malaysia. It came in perfect Apple packaging and included a certificate of authenticity, but when I opened the box up and switched it on, I thought, "Hey, I remember being so impressed with my buddy's one, but I don't recall it having a radio like this".
  • Apple will simply assert that they were copied, do their best to prove it... and if they lose they just appeal after having a back room meeting with somebody that matters advising China that they are more than happy to take their production elsewhere if somebody doesn't step in and make this little problem go away.

  • by ChunderDownunder ( 709234 ) on Friday June 17, 2016 @09:16AM (#52335711)

    Chinese company sues,
    Apple onshores factories.

  • When I was in Beijing my favorite thing was seeing all the people wandering around with their "Nikee" or "Hilfinger" branded clothing. It might even have come out of the same sweatshop. So if someone can find a "iFrone 6" that's a clone of the iPhone 6, I'd happily pay $50 for it.
    • When I was in Beijing my favorite thing was seeing all the people wandering around with their "Nikee" or "Hilfinger" branded clothing. It might even have come out of the same sweatshop.

      My lady bought me a "FUB" shirt at the local Grocery Outlet in Lakeport, CA. I think it was actually the only one that was wrong, maybe that's when the sweatshop closed down or something, right before embroidering the last "U" on the front of my shirt. It wasn't much crappier than a real FUBU shirt and it was fairly hilarious so I wore it. It's not easy finding shirts in my size, since I'm a double-tall, and most shirts aren't even single-tall.

      • Re: (Score:2, Funny)

        by PopeRatzo ( 965947 )

        It's not easy finding shirts in my size, since I'm a double-tall, and most shirts aren't even single-tall.

        I have the same problem with condoms.

  • Easy, they had to back date their patents and then bribe all the public officials to sign off on those backdated documents. That is why they 'waited' two years to file. Ever been to China? that's how it works there.
  • I for one DON'T welcome our new Chinese overlords...color me surprised as well....I normally welcome our new overlords, wherever they come from....

  • http://www.macrumors.com/2016/... [macrumors.com]

    Personally, the iPhone 6 doesn't appear to look anything like the 100c, except perhaps the ring around the back camera.

  • Probably the same tactic as all patent infringement cases: wait until the product gets huge, then sue for the damages (i.e., the profits made by the infringing party). There's no value enforcing patent protection *before* the product gets big, since the realized damages are so small. Only after a few years (sometimes many, many years), once those realized damages grow, does it make sense to throw money at lawyers to get back what you, as a patent holder, think you're entitled to.
  • The Real Issue (Score:5, Insightful)

    by brwski ( 622056 ) on Friday June 17, 2016 @09:30AM (#52335859)
    The real issue is probably something utterly unrelated. Beijing is simply using this as leverage to get something else out of Apple that they want (which is probably an end-around when it comes to encryption). It's all about the long game.
  • It might just be all about money. Apple has it. They want some.

    Patent trolling works both ways? Who knew!
  • Well here's our 'rounded corners' patent back at ya!

  • "... for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword."

  • by Anonymous Coward

    The Chinese make a living by stealing from others, even stealing from their own Chinese companies.
    They even copy the brand names, because they are so unoriginal.
    And they swap out the expensive parts for cheapest crap on Earth.
    Do you think anyone gives a damn about Chinese copyrights?

  • The shape of the iphone 6? Insane. You mean a rectangle with rounded corners? This sounds like karma for apple suing others for using icons with rounded corners.
  • I'm glad to see our Chinese friends could take some time out of their commercial sabotage to bicker about being commercially sabotaged ...
  • by seven of five ( 578993 ) on Friday June 17, 2016 @01:26PM (#52338057)
    Affected company apparently has no website, phone, or email [cnbc.com].
    • @seven of five

      Allow me to correct you, because the term "patent troll" is unknown in business circles, largely dated, prejudicial, defamatory, and may open you up to legal action.

      What you really meant to say is that the Chinese company affected is one that specialises in monetising Valuable Intellectual Property, by which means it spurs Innovation, while not necessarily being a practising entity.

      There, fixed that for you.

  • I'd feel a bit sorrier for Apple is they hadn't sued over round cornered rectangles...and won against a foreign company in a US court.

  • by PPH ( 736903 ) on Friday June 17, 2016 @06:34PM (#52340509)

    1. A portable communications device: Where said device is manufactured by child and prison labor.

UNIX enhancements aren't.

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