Fake Apple Stores Mushrooming In China 241
siliconbits writes "A new worrying phenomenon has cropped up in China and Apple has been its first victim; meet the first fake Apple Stores, entire buildings that have been designed to look like the real ones. Chinese companies have long been known for being master copiers but this takes the concept of plagiarism and copying to a whole new level. As expected, everything, from the architecture of the building, the colour of the paint, to the products, the T-shirt worn by the staff down to the logo and the badge design come from Cupertino."
Incoming Bad Taste Wrong Ethnicity Joke (Score:3, Funny)
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Name (Score:5, Funny)
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Hardware also? (Score:2)
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I think Apple Stole sounds more like it.
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But the 'r' can only be found in a restricted set of syllables (at least in Mandarin, I have no idea about the other languages of China), so Chinese people still substitute 'l' for 'r' when speaking English. Perhaps less often than Japanese people do; I wouldn't know.
Re:Name (Score:4, Funny)
STFU, pedantic asshore.
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Rebuttar?
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Not new but still worrisome... (Score:4, Informative)
In 2006 NEC found that a group in China had cloned the NEC corporation [nytimes.com]. They had factories, office buildings, stationary... the whole nine yards.
They were even receiving royalty payments.
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There's one difference between that and this:
This is one single piddly country crossing the Cult of Steve.
Expect a single, buttonless, brushed-steel smoldering iCrater across Asia, while white-earbud-wearing acolytes swoop in to seal the land.
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The government will shut these places down as soon as Apple calls them up and says "So, do you like us producing all of our products at Hon Hai?"
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The government will shut these places down as soon as Apple calls them up and says "So, do you like us producing all of our products at Hon Hai?"
Unlikely, the gov't there is so corrupt and moves so slow it could never effectively shut all these operations. The real takeaway here is that Apple now gets to realize the true benefits of outsourcing all its manufacturing to China. Namely that they have little power to really control their inventory and supply chain.
Seriously, only in an environment where the gov't was complicit or completely corrupt and lazy could you have enough grey and black market goods to supply not only a single store, but an ent
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The government will shut these places down as soon as Apple calls them up and says "So, do you like us producing all of our products at Hon Hai?"
"Okay, we still make all your products and sell them for less. You blink first."
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So what you're saying is that China would not care one iota about losing one of the world's largest PC hardware manufacturers, maybe the largest single manufacturer of hardware in the country? They would not care at all about losing them to shadebone counterfeiting operations that give them no taste at all? Communist China would not notice the phenomenal loss of revenue Apple generates for them?
I think someone needs to take your little red book away...
Re:Not new but still worrisome... (Score:4, Insightful)
That is correct. Apple does not have the balls to pull it's manufacturing out of china. To get the manufacturing up and running elsewhere will do two things.
1 - bankrupt the company.
2 - force a triple price increase.
China has apple completely by the balls. Go ahead, get your iphones made in the USA,Europe,India or South america.. Oh wait none of them have the industries needed to make the device...
Ohhh so sorry!
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Yes, but that's because the government is both corrupt and tyrannical. It has nothing to do with marxist ideology.
Every Marxist government is corrupt and tyrannical.
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Wow - I'm surprised they didn't just give the guys running that operation jobs. After all, they were coordinating everything from supply chain to R&D and marketing. They're probably more effective than the real NEC executives. If they're willing to work for less than the current CEO the board would be crazy not to hire them... :)
I am not worried (Score:5, Insightful)
Worrying phenomenon for who? Not for me, for you? No? Then it ain't worrying. A new famine looms in Africa, China swears to brutally surpres discent in Tibet, hundreds are tortured and/or killed in Syria, the western world is embroiled in a near global war now and I am supposed to be worried about some stores in China that might mean Steve Jobs income is a few dollars lower? He didn't worry much about all the loss in income to westerners when he outsourced all production to China but I am supposed to worry when what everybody warned would happen (what is produced in China is copied in China) is happening?
Tell it to the marines, cry me a river, talk to the hand because the face ain't listening. I could go on but that might show I cared. Which I don't.
Cue Apple fanboys defending their gadgets being produced in slave labor camps with reaganomics.
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hi,
You're thinking of POTUS Richard Nixon in 1971 and 1972, with Henry Kissinger as the National Security Advisor, and George H.W. Bush as the US ambassador to the UN.
Ford and Carter later reaffirmed the policies which had already been set in motion.
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Its funny when they clone an apple store to the tiniest detail. Not so funny when they get around to cloning a vaccine manufacturer, or any other pharmaceutical, except skipping that expensive testing part.
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Just look at the H1N1 vaccine that was released in 1/4 the time it usually takes. Testing is just overhead anyway. (I skipped the vaccine, came down with H1N1, and then got better.)
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Well, the melamine wasn't actually a substitute for the milk. Water was the substitute for milk, but melamine was used to get the resulting substance to past the quality tests (watered down milk would test low for protein). The problem with most compendial quality tests is that they are designed to control normal manufacturing variances, not detect outright tampering. If your process could contaminate a product with arsenic then you test for it. If your process doesn't involve cyanide at any point, then
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True - bickering over details.
Supply chain integrity matters a lot more than most people realize. The average company has to trust their suppliers - even in critical industries like health care. You can audit, but audits rarely catch intentional deception unless they are very invasive. And, if you're going to go to the trouble to keep that much of a watch on your supplier, why not just make the stuff yourself?
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if they clone the vaccine factory 1:1, they don't need to do testing, that particular vaccine is already tested. you're going to tell them that they can't produce vaccine?
did these guys know they were cloning a specific brand though and not just a generic cool store? what hw are they selling, that's the point. shouldn't give a rats ass about what architecture they thought was cool. that's where american culture export is failing nowadays, trying very hard to promote things but then slapping people w
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if they clone the vaccine factory 1:1, they don't need to do testing, that particular vaccine is already tested. you're going to tell them that they can't produce vaccine?
While I generally agree with your sentiment, even 1:1 clonage still leaves the issue of quality control open since that's ultimately a human process. That's where Chinese stuff seems to fall down, cloned or not - e.g. the melamine in the mlk, chinese drywall, lead in toys, etc.
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What's interesting is that you seem to see this stuff more out of China even though they will fucking kill you for doing it. Of course, with that whole Agent Orange thing, we're probably still in the lead.
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Not so funny when they get around to cloning a vaccine manufacturer, or any other pharmaceutical, except skipping that expensive testing part.
"Except"? I find your faith amusing.
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Yeah, this tests pretty low on my 'give-a-fuck-ometer' as well.
You move your entire production to the counterfeiting and piracy capitol of the world to increase your profit margins and this is what happens. Too bad, so sad.
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Re:I am not worried (Score:5, Insightful)
Just so you know: anything bad that happens to you (whether rape, murder, theft, whatever) also measures pretty low next to famine in Africa, China in Tibet, torture in Syria, etc. I hope you use similar logic to remind people that they shouldn't have the least bit of concern for you no matter what the circumstances are.
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Oh yeah? Today the Chinese are cloning Apple products. Tomorrow they are cloning the world.
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That will certainly help alleviate their population problem.
(Well, that and their utterly fucked-up population pyramid and massive gender imbalance.)
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You're still not looking at the big picture.
Two identical earths.
Two copies of every person.
Rebecca Black would be able to duet with herself.
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I don't think anyone is saying this is some horrible world changing catastrophe.
I'm guessing Steve Jobs is.
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I agree. Apple should take the lead, by moving production of their electronics to the US. We need the jobs.
If Apple isn't going to bother to help our economy, then I don't give a shit who rips them off. They sowed the field, now they get to reap it.
Not worried at all (Score:2)
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If he keeps building that wall higher, eventually no one will be able to get in. Then it will be torn down by androids.
Art installation? (Score:2)
Maybe someone didn't get the memo -- after you build a NuPenny store [boingboing.net] you're not supposed to open the doors ;-)
CEO (Score:4, Funny)
Is the CEO of the Fake Apple Stores Fake Steve Jobs? [fakesteve.net]
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Is the stock ticker for fake Apple APPR?
I think you mean AAPR
( incidentally AAPR is apparently the ticker symbol for Alcoa who make aluminum )
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You could make a computer outa' aluminium.
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Modern cargo cult? (Score:3, Interesting)
Decades ago, when military groups landed in places unfamiliar with airplanes and other technologies, groups would form with mocked up crude simulations of the things they saw. From imitating outfits, things they carried, etc. These people knew they wanted the same things these strangers had, and this was the best way they knew how to get to something like what they had. They just didn't have any grasp on the steps really needed to get there.
The difference is that many folks in China do know how to get there... but they also understand realistically they can't provide the same things with the tools they have so far. But mimicking is still the most logical path under the circumstances - provide what they can, and use the income to grow to make that mimicry reality, like most emerging economies playing catch-up end up doing.
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Except in this case if they are supplying current Android phones they are actually doing BETTER than Apple ;)
Not so hidden cost of outsourcing (Score:5, Insightful)
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maybe now you will see the dark side of outsourcing to a country like China.
What does the place of manufacture have anything to do with fake retail stores? Wouldn't this be just as news-worthy if this was happening in Latvia?
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maybe now you will see the dark side of outsourcing to a country like China.
What does the place of manufacture have anything to do with fake retail stores? Wouldn't this be just as news-worthy if this was happening in Latvia?
Presumably the cost of surreptitiously acquiring the merchandise for unauthorized resale is much easier when it is manufactured in the same country, particularly if that country is known to be a relative safe haven for dubious business practices conducted at the expense of Western interests.
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Presumably the cost of surreptitiously acquiring the merchandise for unauthorized resale is much easier when it is manufactured in the same country, particularly if that country is known to be a relative safe haven for dubious business practices conducted at the expense of Western interests.
Why are you assuming that the fake store is selling the real products? If the fake store is selling counterfeit products, then it really doesn't have anything to do with offshoring.
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Why are you assuming that the fake store is selling the real products?
Why are you assuming they're not?
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Why are you assuming they're not?
I'm not assuming that.
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Why are you assuming that the fake store is selling the real products? If the fake store is selling counterfeit products, then it really doesn't have anything to do with offshoring.
Makng fake iPods probably costs more than buying real ones from the factory owner.
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Making fake ipods in the same factory as the factory owner with lower quality parts and the already trained manufacturing personnel, re-using the exact same packaging, documentation, etc. would let you make some really REALLY cheap ipods.
Which parts do you plan to replace to make it really cheap? It won't be anything digital, because you're not going to be rewriting the software to work with different hardware, and I'm guessing they make up most of the manufacturing cost of an MP3 player these days.
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If the fake store is selling counterfeit products, then it really doesn't have anything to do with offshoring.
There is a market in China for tech schematics and other trade secrets. Companies in China do have Apple's schematics for their devices, so it's entirely possible that someone acquired those schematics, analyzed them to figure out which things they might be able to swap out for cheaper parts, and produced something that looks and acts real enough to sell. It might not be the same thing Apple is selling, but it's still based on Apple's schematics that they sent to their manufacturers in that country. In o
Re:Not so hidden cost of outsourcing (Score:5, Insightful)
Do I actually have to draw a line between the shady as all fuck manufacturers that apple contracted with and the counterfeit products? Or are you simply unaware of typical Chinese manufacturing process? I can help there too. See, Manufacturer takes contract to run 12 hours a day at 150 units an hour. They use your source material, and their hardware to do the production run. Then, at the end of 12 hours, they shut down your production run and do another 12 hour production run, expect this time they use their own source material, and their own hardware, and they sell the fakes out the back door. Now, I know what you are thinking, this is BS, this isn't really how it happens. But it actually is.
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Wouldn't this be just as news-worthy if this was happening in Latvia?
Maybe so, but how about this: why is this happening in China and not Latvia? Do you think it's just a coincidence that the devices also happen to be made in China?
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Because no one wants Latvian iPods [radiomuseum.org]
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Is very good, yes?
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No one wants Chinese iPods either. That's why they're selling fake American ones.
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Often counterfeit goods are made by running the real production lines for an extra shift or whatever. If you give some factory the plans for an iPhone and pay them to make a million of them for you, how do you know that they aren't running off a million more?
Re:Not so hidden cost of outsourcing (Score:5, Insightful)
Yes, because nobody's seen a fake rolex since it's manufactured in Switzerland. Sure, manufacturing makes it easier to get blueprints, machinery, parts, make extra production runs and so on but China will continue to imitate, even if you bring the production home. You'll never be able to sell to China as long as they continue to ignore IP law. They might give it lip service from time to time but on the whole they know ignoring it is good for their economy.
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They could still fill the store with stolen/fake products even if apple had nothing to do with China.
Where has anyone said that they're selling fake Apple products?
There's a big difference between making your own MP3 player with an iPod label on the front and going to the iPod factory and buying them in bulk from the owner without telling Apple. The former could be done anywhere, the latter is vastly easier if the factory is in the country where you plan to sell them.
T Shirt and Badge Design (Score:2)
So Apple actually exported something to China? I'm impressed!
They've already copied an entire town (Score:3, Interesting)
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Real bones are almost certainly cheaper in China.
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(Yeah, I'm making a joke about all the people saying China couldn't clone Apple Stores if Apple didn't outsource there.)
You smell that? (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:You smell that? (Score:4, Funny)
Yes, now Apple knows how Xerox feels.
No joke about copying intended there...
"Highest revenue of 323 Apple stores worldwide" (Score:2, Insightful)
The firm has only four stores in China, two in Beijing and two in Shanghai; these four stores in China have generated on average the highest traffic and highest revenue of any of the 323 Apple stores worldwide according to a statement by the Chief Financial Officer peter Oppenheimer back in January.
I know revenue isn't everything, but maybe Apple should be learning something from these guys, and not the other way round...
when you don't pay for software or maybe hardware (Score:3)
when you don't pay for software or maybe hardware then it's easy to high revenue.
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Those are the real stores. And if you only have four stores in an entire country they're going to tend to have high revenue. If I want to go to an Apple store there are probably 4 within an hour's drive here. If there were only one it would get a lot more business, but probably not as much as all four combined. So, more at one store isn't always better.
I was under the impression this is a third party (Score:2)
reseller which is similar to a setup in Singapore.
After all, unless they are selling copies of Apple products where is the money? They would have to jack up the prices.
Why is this worrying? (Score:2)
Why is this worrying? I really don't see the issue.
Let them use GPL software instead.
That's the sad part (Score:2)
Just imagine how FLOSS would flourish if the people bootlegging proprietary products were applying their resourcefulness to developing FLOSS, to the benefit of all.
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They do... they ignore the GPL licenses the same way they ignore everything else they perceive as a problem...
The best part - they can't do shit about this. (Score:2)
When you move all of your manufacturing to China to save a buck, eventually they'll take what they learned building your shit and build their own. If that means stealing your name, logos, store designs etc., so be it. That design stuff seems to be working for Apple, after all. And Apple can't do anything about it since their business is entirely dependent on China's electronics manufacturing base. What, y
Not a new phenomena (Score:2)
This is not new at all. In China you've had 4 Nokia shops in the same street for ages (0 to 1 being real, the rest fake). Even large stores like Carrefour and Wal-Mart have been copied.
I love Apple, but they weren't "first" at this one.
past experience with China (Score:2)
Past experience tells me the products could very well be the real deal.
What's the problem? (Score:2)
I got the impression that these stores are selling actual Apple products. Is that not the case? If they are Apple products that the stores bought wholesale from Apple, what is the alleged problem? We have other stores where we can buy Apple products in the US. These stores in China just appear to suck less than Best Buy or Walmart. Building stores that are elegant and provide an agreeable customer experience is not something that is the "intellectual property" of Apple.
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Even better is that half the replies still tell the person to use floppy disks.
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I prefer punch cards.
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This means that private property is "sacred" to a level above t
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But do they sell actual apples or do they sell tech gear.
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It's been my observation that the quality of the "geniuses" at the Apple stores varies wildly. Some of them are quite clueless. I work at an AASP, and we have repeatedly had a "genius" tell a customer they could bring their ipod in for a warranty repair, or that they could bring their iMac back they bought online back to us for a full refund.
Sometimes, "genius" they aint
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He did say "repeatedly"...so if said associate had been told multiple times about the company policies and still gave out the wrong information, it WOULD reflect on that individual's intellect.
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Yep. [japanprobe.com]
Another like-minded developer made on in homage to Blizzard. [gamesradar.com]
More relevant than even those, however, is the entire fake mall [mirror.co.uk] that opened in 2009. Genuine imitation brands only! Get your McDnoald’s hamburgers, Bucksstar Coffee, and a Pizza Huh (not Hut) Pizza all under one roof! A Google search for fake mall also nets a 2007 YouTube video of an all-fake mall; I don't know if it's the same one (YT blocked by firewall).
Really, this Apple store shouldn't surprise anyone.