Unlocked iPhones in US For $649 334
Endoflow2010 writes "Apple on Tuesday started selling an unlocked version of its iPhone 4, starting at $649. A 16GB unlocked iPhone 4 will set you back $649, while a 32GB version is selling for $749. Both are available in black or white; the black will ship within one to three business days, while the white is available in three to five days, according to the Apple Web site. The benefit of an unlocked phone is that you are not locked into a two-year contract with a particular provider. But it also means that you don't get the subsidized pricing provided by someone like AT&T or Verizon. The same phones with a contract cost $199 and $299."
Data plan cost the same (Score:5, Insightful)
The data plan will cost the same as buying it on a contract. Only TMobile gives a $10 discount. The govt should make this practice illegal like it's done in the EU.
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The data plan will cost the same as buying it on a contract. Only TMobile gives a $10 discount. The govt should make this practice illegal like it's done in the EU.
Exactly, except that I don't think an iPhone will work on T-Mobile's network (or Sprint's).
Re:Data plan cost the same (Score:4, Informative)
It will work on T-Mobile's network since both are GSM phones. But since T-Mobile uses a different technology for 3G speeds, it will only work at Edge (2G) networking speeds. But for many people that will be fine.
It will not work on Sprint's network because only GSM phones are being sold unlocked, and Sprint uses a CDMA network, like Verizon. (But there is every chance that next year a dual-mode phone will exist instead of two different single-mode phones, and an unlocked version of that could well work on Sprint.)
Re:Data plan cost the same (Score:4, Informative)
Small correction: Same technology, different frequency band.
Since it doesn't support T-Mo's 3G bands, there's not much point to it unless you'll be doing a lot of international travel. If it's only going to be fully functional on AT&T, you may as well go for the contract, since you won't be saving any money on service.
One minor advantage (Score:2)
Small correction: Same technology, different frequency band.
Since it doesn't support T-Mo's 3G bands, there's not much point to it unless you'll be doing a lot of international travel. If it's only going to be fully functional on AT&T, you may as well go for the contract, since you won't be saving any money on service.
I have an unlocked iPhone 4, on T-Mobile's US service.
Edge is slow, but it's very reliable and doesn't use much power. Sure, I'd like to have 3G speed but I guess I'm not really missing it much since most everything works acceptably on Edge (no Youtube, but again I don't think I'm missing much there). I have had other 3G phones, and and I have a 3G iPad on AT&T, so it's not like I don't know the difference. The lower monthly cost and better customer service from T-Mobile outweighs the speed deficit f
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To make a point, I suppose? I bought my N900 outright even though AT&T doesn't give discounts, mostly because there was no chance in hell that any US carrier would make it available.
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Re:Data plan cost the same (Score:5, Informative)
I wonder why Apple is offering this if no carrier has an appropriate pricing plan to support it? This is like paying cash for a car and STILL making a payment on it every month. Why?
The short answer is: because people want it.
(it's funny, people bitch about phones being carrier-locked, then act confused when a phone is offered without a carrier-lock)
The longer answer is:
- So you don't have to enter a 2 year contract.
- For use overseas, being able to buy a local SIM instead of paying AT&T's high international roaming rates
- It makes the iPhone more readily available in countries and on carriers which it's not currently sold on
Which is to say, because people want it.
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If nothing else, maybe Apple's entry into prepaid phones for such a popular model will create market forces for the carriers to offer more attractive "bring your own phone" plans. I really hate this forced "rent-to-own" model. I wouldn't buy a TV or couch that way, and I don't want to buy a phone that way.
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AT&T is well-known to use a database of IMEI numbers to detect iPhones and other smartphones, so that it can force them onto specific plans and to require the addition of expensive data packages. This also includes entirely rejecting detected smartphones straight off of pre-pay plans and requiring them to go post-pay only, though they just this past April finally added a pre-pay smartphone plan (however, only a single AT&T-branded sm
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I wonder why Apple is offering this if no carrier has an appropriate pricing plan to support it? This is like paying cash for a car and STILL making a payment on it every month. Why?
For travelers who want to use their iPhone internationally this makes it a lot easier than before (assuming you can get micro-SIMS easily). Instead of having to carry two phones when you travel one will do.
To those who say: Jailbreak/unlock!1 yes - but with this you are not at the mercy of the cat and mouse game between Apple an the jailbreakers.
Know, if there was a way to copy the needed software to create an "officially" unlocked iPhone, using this phones software, from carrier locked ones life would real
Re:Data plan cost the same (Score:5, Interesting)
It's interesting actually.
Every iPhone4 is manufactured the same (I'm talking GSM ones, not counting the Verizon/CDMA ones). They're loaded with software and shipped out to Apple. Every serial number issued is recorded.
What happens when you buy an iPhone4 is this. For carrier sold phones, Apple records the serial numbers of every phone they ship out, and in their database it's marked as "Carrier locked". For phones sold at the Apple store, if you pay for a contract-free one, it's marked in the database as "unlocked", else if you buy it carrier locked/subsidized, it's marked as "carrier locked" as well. The baseband at this time only has the iMEI and nothing else.
Now, the next step is important, and it doesn't matter if it's done by the carrier in store or by you. The phone is plugged into the PC and it talks with iTunes. The phone queries the baseband and asks it what the carrier ID of the SIM that's inside is. It passes this information to iTunes along with its serial number, which contacts Apple and Apple looks into the database to see what phone it is.
If it's an unlocked phone, Apple ignores the carrier ID, and passes back a baseband configuration blob that basically keeps it unlocked. If it's a locked phone, it takes that carrier ID and produces a baseband configuration that locks the baseband to that carrier ID.
Note that the only time the phone knows it's locked is during the initial "Connect to iTunes" phase, which is why you must have a SIM inside for it (iTunes complains if there's no SIM). Subsequent times (during a restore, say), having a SIM inside it doesn't matter.
This also means that the carrier locking only happens during this period as well. You can buy a phone from AT&T, stick in say a Rogers SIM card, connect it to iTunes, and you'll have a phone locked to Rogers instead of AT&T.
These blobs are probably signed by Apple to ensure that replay attacks aren't possible, and are keyed to IMEI.
This may mean that right now, it's not possible to re-configure the baseband with a new blob. I expect iOS 5 to allow this capability though with a new baseband firmware. The use of iCloud would mean a user would purchase the unlock option, then restore their phone - iCloud backs up the data, the phone erases user data and restores itself to default, then the user set up begins while it fetches a new configuration blob. iCloud then restores the phone.
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Forget that, the government should make it illegal to charge a premium to have an unlocked phone. In the US, the average smartphone is $500 unlocked. Apple wants it even higher? Fuck that. The cost of these phones is nowhere near reality, considering that subsidized on contract is essentially not even half.
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Screw that, the government should just provide everyone with smartphones. Why should I have to pay greedy profit driven corporations in order to have the basic right of communications. They should nationalize the wireless carriers and offer subsidized phones for all at reasonable prices. Or even free to the disadvantaged. Screw the profits of the fat cat money leaches.
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Mobiililaajakaista Mini 0,5 Mbit/s 4,90 eur/month
Mobiililaajakaista Perus 1 Mbit/s eur/month
Mobiililaajakaista Nopsa Up to 15 Mbit/s 13,90 eur/month
No monthly limits, if that matters.
Re:Data plan cost the same (Score:5, Informative)
http://www.wireless.att.com/cell-phone-service/cell-phone-plans/pyg-cell-phone-plans.jsp [att.com]
I don't use the phone part much so my calls are only a few dollars a month. I only use data for email and web browsing so use less than 100 MB a month.
My cost is usually about $20 a month.
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10 cents a minute is pretty good. but those data rates are insanely expensive. If you used an iPhone the way a typical geek does, the data plan will cost a fortune.
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What practice is that exactly? I'm not quite clear what you want changed (though I agree, unlocked phones don't make much sense in the US give the plan structures)
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In some countries (like here in Mexico), if you want an iPhone 4* this means paying $600.00usd up front and then signing a $50usd monthly plan for 12 months.
Fail to see the advantage here.
*Similar, if slightly cheaper upfront charges apply if you want a DroidX or a Samsung GalaxyS
Re:What the market will bear. (Score:5, Insightful)
It isn't quite so simple. This is a common argument (especially from republicans) but it relies on an actual free market. Cellular phone carriers do not qualify in the US, because they have government-enforced monopolies* on the spectrum that the cell phones use. They use that power to force unfair pricing strategies on the consumer. Usually they do this while saying that they are striving to lower prices for the consumer. They are lying.
* Actually a duo-opoly, with ATT and Verizon sharing the exclusive access. The reason they don't have to compete is because they don't share phone technology. EDGE, HSPA, EV-DO, LTE, etc. Users of one network can't take their business elsewhere.
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There is nothing wrong with the pricing that I can see. Apple can charge what they like. And the cellular providers can charge what they like, clearly they are giving a discount to be tied into a contract.
There's absolutely nothing wrong with this and I see no reason for government interference.
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The original problem is that if you buy a subsidized phone, and I don't, but we both sign up for 2 year contracts, our contracts cost the same. So why, if I buy the phone for full price, isn't the contract less expensive then?
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So don't buy the phone for full price. That's like complaining there are different prices for a car for lease, vs payments, vs cash purchase. It's up to the manufacturer to set the price how they see fit. If you don't like it buy something else, send a complaint letter, whatever. Don't go whining to the government because you think it is unfair.
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Actually I agree with AC (and I'm no Rebublican)
There is nothing wrong with the pricing that I can see. Apple can charge what they like. And the cellular providers can charge what they like, clearly they are giving a discount to be tied into a contract.
There's absolutely nothing wrong with this and I see no reason for government interference.
While there might be strong need for government interference, the 2-year-contract slows change in the market. People who sign up for a phone plan today are not on the market (as potential customers) for 2 years. This means that for any given month, maybe ~4% of the market is capable of changing carriers (not counting seasonal variance, pending releases, or people who don't renew). In a contract-free market, one carrier could over-turn the market in months if they came out with either a new feature or bet
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And in Europe, there are no government-enforced spectrum monopolies, right?
Europe uses limited bands, 900MHz and 1800MHz mostly, and 2100MHz for data, which makes it much easier to roam.
The European cell market is vastly different from the US market, so much so that comparisons are not very helpful. It seems, to me, that the cell industry in Europe is managed as a utility, including singificant regulation and interoperability. In the US, handoffs and network connections are the limit of interoperability, s
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Apple should price their stuff at whatever the market will bear
The discussion isn't about Apple's pricing, it is about the carrier's contracts.
The govt should stay the fuck out of the free market
2) It isn't a free market. The carriers are government-created monopolies and the prices are fixed.
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For a change I agree with an AC spouting "free market!". Even though the telephony market is contracting and will soon be a duopoly in the states. Unless you believe a smart phone should be the common baseline for communications, that is. Unless you think it's impossible to support yourself in any way without a smartphone.
And even if a smartphone is necessary to live (ha!), Boost mobile (for example) has non-contract Android service, IIRC.
Unless cell becomes the only way, until Apple and the big carriers
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So you work in a job that requires you to have a smartphone but doesn't provide it, and if you are self employed you 'absolutely' need one but can't write it off, and it MUST be an iPhone?
I call bullshit.
Re:What the market will bear. (Score:5, Interesting)
No.
"For many self-employed people some sort of cell phone is necessary. It wasn't true some time ago, but nowadays you often need to be able to answer the phone no matter where you are. It doesn't have to be an iPhone, but it does have to be signed up with a cell phone carrier. "
Yes, perhaps - but if necessary, it can be written off. And you don't need to get a cell phone with a contract, and it doesn't have to be an iPhone, so I don't think that line of reasoning applies.
"This means that, as a practical necessity, many people need to sign a contract"
No. Contract-free phones are available and cheap. This thread was about unlocked phones having little effect on what is paid for access, while increasing what is paid for the phone. Even further, I do believe there are contract-free Android smartphones.
"This means that the free market doesn't work"
What most free marketeers call a 'free market' is more like an unfettered market. They take an extremist's view. That is NOT my view, however. From what I have seen, the free market works best when there are limits and regulations. Let businesses duke it out, sure - but keep them in the ring. Keep them from using knives and guns or other items that may harm the audience. Keep the audience from doing the same and harming the competition.
The free market works. Unfettered markets don't.
For an unfettered market to work,all things must be luxuries (consumers must be free not to buy), all transactions must be perfectly reversible (poisoning the water the land or air for a quick buck - or killing workers - must be 'fixable' for the same price or less as the profit made), and all markets must be infinite (labor must always be free to go get another job, for example). Having no regulation means that businesses in the course of maximizing profit will minimize competition. And when competition is marginalized or eliminated, there will be no motivation to improve or keep a lid on price, ultimately leading to economic disaster.
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First, this isn't about Apple (they can charge whatever they want for all I care). It's about the cell telcos.
I'm a huge free market person, but the problem here is a classic case where the free market simply doesn't work. The cell telcos require access to a finite public resource to even go into business (and that business is protected by the gov - trying putting up your own cell tower at typical cell freq and see how long it takes for you to be shut down). Part of giving/leasing the telco a public reso
And, yet, AT&T won't unlock current locked iPh (Score:4, Interesting)
So, knowing better than to waste my time, I called AT&T today and, as expected, "Apple still doesn't allow us to unlock iPhones." Anyone have a clue if this policy is ever going away?
Re:And, yet, AT&T won't unlock current locked (Score:5, Insightful)
Apple not allowing unlocking is a load of nonsense. All across the world there are multiple careers who offer unlocking of iPhones, so obviously Apple is not the culprit, but rather AT&T is. There are some countries where multiple careers offer iPhones and in these places you will find iPhones unlockable through a particular service provider, while another tries to lock you in by not offering that service.
Here in Germany, I had T-Mobile unlock all my iPhones thus far after the contract expires or is terminated. It is nothing but the absolute greed of AT&T that stops them from asking Apple for unlocks.
Apple has nothing to lose with a carrier asking them to unlock an iPhone. The carrier, AT&T, does. Do your own math on who is more likely to be responsible.
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AT&T is actually not bad about unlocking phones. They do all their other phones after (IIRC) 6 months in good standing.
But it is on them to tell Apple to unlock, not the other way around. As I understand it, the iPhone asks the Apple server on activation whether it should be locked or not - but AT&T can tell Apple to change the flag and they'll do it, based on the fact that, well, they do in other countries.
So it's very weird.
Re:And, yet, AT&T won't unlock current locked (Score:4, Informative)
There are some countries where you can buy an unlocked iPhone by buying it directly from Apple instead of from a carrier.... Canada is one of them, and the Canadian version most definitely will work with ATT (since it works on Telus, Bell, and Rogers, who all use the same technology and frequencies as ATT).... of course, I ended up buying an LG phone for half the price with more features. :)
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The only possible difference between the Canadian iPhone and the AT&T iphone is the language and locale settings. In all other respects, every iPhone except the Verizon one is the same hardware all over the world.
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Hmmm (Score:2)
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International travel, increased resale value, and the ability to switch over to a prepaid plan/carrier if you want. There are plenty of reasons to want an unlocked iPhone. The real question is, why *wouldn't* you want your iPhone unlocked by AT&T, given the choice?
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Nonsense - my carrier (ie, not in the US) will quite happily unlock an iPhone. That Apple would prevent it is just not accurate, unless they have some strange carrier-specific terms in the US. Given that it was AT&T doing the strong arming in that initial contract, perhaps that is the case. I get the sense that if they told you that it was down to Apple, their collective nose is now growing.
They look to be much cheaper (Score:3)
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Also cheaper than here in Egypt (Score:2)
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Apple makes stuff, what a surprise! (Score:2)
Most of the "subsidized price" discount is never directly paid but instead offered as a small take on the monthly contract. Apple sees this as a way to get a more direct cash flow bonus while letting those willing to buy them take their chances getting them hooked up to AT&T or Verizon since I'm fairly sure the GSM antenna doesn't support T-Mobile's frequency though I may be wrong. All this really points to is that Apple is definitively a manufacturer and wishes to remain that way.
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since I'm fairly sure the GSM antenna doesn't support T-Mobile's frequency though I may be wrong. All this really points to is that Apple is definitively a manufacturer and wishes to remain that way.
I believe the AT&T iPhone supports the T-Mobile edge frequencies... just not the 3G frequencies.
So you can get a signal and make calls, but forget about doing anything data-related without WiFi unless you're really patient.
The same thing with the old Nexus One (in reverse) made for T-Mobile. You could put it on AT&T network but data was limited to edge.
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It's just like being on an old dialup line, except that back when we all used dialup, websites weren't the MB/page fat-asses they are today.
Will AT&T unlock then? (Score:2)
So will AT&T unlock our iPhones like thry do ther phones. I think the reason they had is now gone.
Who does this? (Score:2)
From TFA:
"Get all the features of iPhone 4—FaceTime video calling, Retina display, HD video recording, and more—in a phone that you can activate and use on the supported GSM wireless carrier of your choice, such as AT&T in the United States," Apple said in a note. "If you don't want a multiyear service contract or if you prefer to use a local carrier when traveling abroad, the unlocked iPhone 4 is the best choice."
So as an American, you either need to be someone who wants to spend $649 on a smartphone but intends to use it for less than 2 years (perhaps, planning on moving to the moon?) or you need to be someone who is so frequently overseas that you have your own overseas SIM and would like to be able to switch between networks with ease. How many people is that? Any hands in the slashdot crowd?
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Well they can't win, can they? Everyone is yelling at them for having a locked phone, then they release an unlocked one in the US (in the rest of the world this is a non-story - welcome to the 21st century USA) and now a large portion of this thread is talking about how no one would possibly want that.
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Why the chorus of slashdot nerds decrying choice? Isn't "choice" the battle cry around here?
Oh, it's Apple that's offering choice? Well, that changes everything!
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I'm not that worried about the cost for an unlocked phone. Why? The secondary market. If I keep the iPhone in a case and have it in good condition, an unlocked phone will be easily worth $500-600 on eBay. Some auctions get so crazy that people actually may pay for more than what the phone is worth, although one has to be careful because of potential cheats [1]. So, if I sell my iPhone 4 after picking up the next gen, I'm really not out $600... but out $100-$200.
[1]: It is an old trick for scammers to
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I travel often enough to have sim cards from UK, Germany, Hong Kong, China, India, Thailand and Vietnam in my kit. Unlocked cellphones really are useful, not only if you travel abroad but also if you decide to switch a different carrier. Freedom is good.
Yes, and chances are if you travel that extensively, you've likely got the "freedom" of not being concerned about your cell phone bill either, as your employer is likely picking up the tab...if you're traveling that extensively for personal reasons, you likely can afford any locked or unlocked option anyway.
I merely bring this up as the overall cost is a sticking point in this entire discussion.
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Too bad the US networks don't give you full service. There's no competition, so your service speeds are limited by the frequencies your phone can receive.
Seems High (Score:2)
Considering that you can buy a 32GB ipod touch for $300, an extra $450 to add phone functionality seems really steep. But they're looking to maximize their profits, so I guess they figure that someone will pay it.
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That's already what they charge. We just haven't been directly exposed to that price here in the US. And the iPhone is much more than just an iPod touch with a cell phone.
iPhone > iPT + phone? Please elaborate. (Score:2)
Re:iPhone iPT + phone? Please elaborate. (Score:2)
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It's also got GPS, a much better camera, and an IPS screen. And antennae and 3G chips aren't free in either component or integration costs. But really, yeah, it's the value (not cost) of the phone that increases the price the most.
I have one, eh? (Score:2)
I bought unlocked iphones for wife and I because she doesn't want a data plan or caller-ID, and I don't want things like voice mail, call waiting, visual voice mail, etc etc... So we pick and choose our features instead of being tied to our providers' "iphone plan"... Our total monthly bill is about half what it would be if we went on-contract for a subsidized phone... Over 3 years (minimum contract period for an iphone here in Canada), we save far far more than the difference between the subsidized and ful
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Who's your provider?
Corp Procurement (Score:2)
The price is ridiculous (Score:2)
I don't make a lot of calls, so I'm on a pay-as-you-go plan. This means - without hacking, anyway - my only smartphone option is an Android phone.
Now I've used iOS in the past (iPod Touch), and now that I've used Android for a while... frankly if I could get a reasonably priced (and supported on prepaid) iPhone I'd drop Android in a minute - but this price is ludicrous. I realize it's not top-end hardware, but my LG Thrive cost me $149.99 - that's with no contract! LG has managed to make a decent touchscree
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Your problem is that you have the budget for a Smart [smart.com] car but the desire for a Aston Martin [astonmartin.com].
Nothing new... (Score:2)
How about unsubsidized phones? (Score:2)
I don't care that much about having an unlocked phone. I mostly want an unsubsidized phone. I'd like to buy a phone without the subsidy and then get a lower rate as a result, so that if I continue to use the phone after two years, I'm not continuing to pay the subsidy. The way it's set up now, you're wasting money with every monthly bill if you don't go buy a new phone as soon as you're able to.
Being in NZ (Score:2)
I know where I'll be buying my next iPhone. Over here the pricing is as follows:
16GB = $949 NZD 32GB = $1129 NZD
Direct conversion USD -> NZD
16GB = $793 NZD 32GB = $915 NZD
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Freedom isn't free.
It costs a hefty fucking fee.
That's right freedom costs a buck 'o five.
Well, in this case, it costs $450.
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Kris Kristofferson, actually.
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'Outrageous is 16gb for $100. SD Cards are too mainstream.'
I suppose component cost has almost nothing to do with it. The 32Gb iPod Touch goes for $299. Sure, the iPhone costs more to make, but $450 more..? They charge whatever they can get away with charging, and the 32Gb phone is the 'premium' model.
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You should see the prices for unlocked top-tier Android phones!
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Just where do you expect to find a pay phone?
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Apple would prohibit you from putting it on the App Store and then sell it to you themselves in six months or bundle it with the next release of IOS.
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Durr hurr... I bet they'd also eat his children, too. lol!
There's absolutely no reason Apple wouldn't allow a payphone finder on the App Store.
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Wait... TOS Update coming shortly from the Jobsians in California.
It's official, Apple no prohibits Pay Phone finding apps. Kill switches have been initiated. In other news, Kids are now on the menu as well at the new Apple Space Center Cafe. They're called Soylent Green bites.
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You're paying $70 a month for fees because at least half of this are installments for the price of the phone and the remaining fees for the actual service are artificially high because there's no real competition in the US.
$70 a month... Elsewhere in the developed world you can keep a whole family using smartphones including data and tethering for that kind of money. "Bring your own phone and pick one of half a dozen carriers with dozens of plans and switch to another one at will" is a market. What the US h
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You're paying $70 a month for fees because at least half of this are installments for the price of the phone
And T-Mobile is honest about these fees. If you buy a phone up front and go into any T-Mobile store, they'll put you on the SIM-only plan for $10 (voice) or $20 (voice+data) per month less than the contract plan.
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Doesn't even cost that much more to switch to cell, actually... you can get unlimited local plans in Canada for $25/mo from some carriers (and $35/mo from the "fight brands" owned by the major players). Compare that against a home phone that'll cost you minimum $20/mo not including call waiting, call display, or voicemail, and the math's easy. In the US, as long as you don't want data, voice doesn't cost *that* much more, from my research...
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Motorola RAZR. Dumb enough for ya?
I still have a Motorola DynaTac lying around somewhere. But they bricked it when they knocked out analog service. Too bad, they were a great phone for emergency use. If you couldn't get 911, you could beat an attacker to death with it.
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If you really want something that runs iOS, then get an iPad2 with Wi-fi+3G, then get a cheap phone. The iPhone has become very unattractive, as of late, and it is not getting any better. You can spend another $100 and get a much bigger screen and 64GB of storage.
Yeh, but I'm a big guy and yet even I don't have pockets big enough for an iPad. /sarcasm
But I wouldn't be surprised if it was cheaper to use the iPad and some IP thing like Skype.
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I would also ditch AT&T, while everyone is at it, and go to Verizon. At least Verizon treats its customers marginally better.
[Citation Needed]...
At least AT&T offers their customers the "freedom" to choose how much data they want to use, and to pay accordingly. Personally, I would love the option to pay $15 a month for 200MB given that I rarely am out of WiFi range and could easily adjust my usage to stay below that limit. Instead, on Verizon, I MUST have a $29 "unlimited" data plan regardless of how I want to use my own, paid for, not-under-contract smartphone. Yay Verizon.
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I don't know what Verizon site you are looking at but I didn't have any problem finding smaller data plans than unlimited...
http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/mobilebroadband/?page=plans [verizonwireless.com]
The phone plans are a bit more difficult to point to, but they have roughly the same data plan costs.
Though it seems much more difficult for me to even look at the data plans anymore, but when I bought my DroidX a few months ago, the option was definitely there to pay less for less data, but I just feel unlimited is the bett
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The 64GB IPad2 with all you mention is about $830 on Best Buy's web site.
I do agree with you on smart phone prices but since people will line up to just have something with an Apple logo on it, then high prices will prevail.
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I really do not understand unsubsidized prices of phone anymore.
Here's my mystery equation:
$186 ipod touch (a fair price) + $29 virgin mobile pay as you go phone (a fair price) somehow = $649
Truly a mystery. Of course you don't really need the phone if you've got wifi coverage and facetime, which makes it even weirder.
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You know, I thought about that, but I look really silly trying to put an iPad two my ear when I try to make a phone call.
Verizon treats is customers better than AT&T? Is that one of those "double all of the volunteer's wages" jokes? Face it, they both suck rocks.
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I agree with the treatment comment Montezumaa made, but it is true that being the better of the two isn't a great goal when they both suck...
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The 32 gb iPod Touch is basically the same device and only costs $300. The iPod lacks a modem, GPS and camera, but that hardly accounts count for the extra $450.
My ipod touch has a camera and microphone and all that. I used facetime for about 30 seconds until I got bored with it.
Does the iphone have a GPS inside it, or is it the deal where it triangulates off the cell towers to guess where it is, and to the masses, any electrical device that tells you where it is, is a "GPS" (even ancient LORAN machines are "GPS", etc)
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Maybe you're subsidizing some bribes to Canadian politicians you didn't know about?
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Yeah, but the rest of the world has sane patent law. In the US what he said wouldn't surprise me. I say everyone should sue for patent infringement as much as possible to show how very broken the system is.