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Desktops (Apple) Apple

Apple Store Reopens With Many New Products 519

An anonymous reader writes "After being down for a couple of hours, the Apple store reopened this morning. All of the speculation has turned out to be a reality with Apple dishing out many new products and among them are; iMac 20", three iMac 24" models, two Mac Mini models, and two Mac Pro models — with one including an ATI Radeon HD 4570 graphics card. Also as rumored, there was the new Airport Extreme, and Time Capsule in 1TB. The Mac Pro is the granddaddy of them all. The lower-end Quad Core system includes a 2.66Ghz Quad-Core Intel Xeon processor, 3GB of memory, 640GB hard drive, 18x double-layer Superdrive, and a NVIDIA Geforce GT 120 with 512MB of memory priced at $2,499. Finally, we have the 8-core system which includes two 2.26Ghz Quad-Core Intel Xeon processors, 6GB of memory, 640GB hard drive, the 18x double-layer Superdrive, and of course the NVIDIA Geforce GT 120 with 512MB of memory priced at $3,299."
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Apple Store Reopens With Many New Products

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  • by Joe The Dragon ( 967727 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @10:55AM (#27051033)

    Weaker video all around next to the old systems and a even bigger mac pro rip off $2500 for a core i7 based system with ONLY ONE CPU and nvidia 9500 video as the GT 120 is a 9500. What a ati card pay $200 more for a 4870 512 makeing it cost $150 + $200 = $350 makeing it about $100 more then other places you can get core i7 systems with better base video and the same cpu speed FOR ABOUT $1000+ less some even with 6gb of DDR3 ram. And why mini DP on a full size video card why not full DP with a DP to mini DP cable?

    The old $1,199.00 $1,499.00 level imacs used to have ATI Radeon HD 2400 XT with 128MB memory and ATI Radeon HD 2600 PRO with 256MB with a NVIDIA GeForce 8800 GS with 512MB memory in the $2,199.00 one now they have slower and weaker NVIDIA GeForce 9400M graphics on board video in the $1,199.00 $1,499.00 ones and NVIDIA GeForce GT 130 with 512MB memory in the $2,199.00.

    The mac mini is still a ripoff $599.00 for 1 GB OF RAM? $50 more for 2gb and $150 more for 4gb?

    # [Add $150.00] for a 2.26 cpu

    120GB is still small.

    The $799.00 mini has the same 2.0 cpu but 2gb of ram and a 320gb hd. It should have at least 128 - 256 vram that does not come from system but it does not.

    For about $500 you can get a X2 7750 and 790gx board with 128 side port ram with 4gb of ram apple should of put more in to the mini.

  • by Chaos Incarnate ( 772793 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @11:01AM (#27051115) Homepage
    The remote isn't bundled; it's a $20 option. But if you already have a remote from another Mac in your house, it'll work just fine with the new Mini.
  • Apple never dropped prices for the UK when the dollar tanked against the British Pound, but this rise is due to fluctuations in the exchange rate (which sees the British Pound more or less back to where it was against the dollar before the dollar tanked)? Hell, I'm a heavy Apple user and I'm not even that much of an apologist!

    The new Mini is expensive, and there's little justification for it at that spec level.
  • by mkiwi ( 585287 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @11:17AM (#27051317)

    If you've bought an iPod touch or an iPhone in the past 2 years, apple has a free program called "Remote." It lets you browse all your music/movies from iTunes over wifi, do coverflow from your mini to the iWhatever, etc. Then you tap on your movie/music and it plays it through the computer.

    It absolutely love it; It can be found in the App Store.

  • by fuzzyfuzzyfungus ( 1223518 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @11:42AM (#27051597) Journal
    You might want to try reading a little more closely. People are discussing the prices in various non-US markets. Quoting a bunch of USD prices is, at best, irrelevant.
  • Re:Eh (Score:2, Informative)

    by binary paladin ( 684759 ) <<moc.liamg> <ta> <nidalapyranib>> on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @11:42AM (#27051599)

    Insightful? *rolls eyes*

    While I agree that it's a big gap (I've always hated iMacs, mainly because my monitors tend to have a much longer lifespan than the rest of the computer), who is an expandable mid-ranged desktop targeted at?

    Geeks and gamers.

    Who is Apple not targeting?

    See above.

    They have home user machines and workstations. All of these machines are capable of running World of Warcraft which is the only game anyone plays on the Mac anyway.

  • by kinnell ( 607819 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @11:44AM (#27051635)
    Perhaps because this site isn't solely devoted to providing personalised news for you and nobody else? The irony is, you could customise slashdot so it doesn't show apple stories if you were so inclined.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @11:48AM (#27051683)
    The 24" iMac is Good Enough for anyone who isn't a media producer. It's certainly a decent software development machine, although a Mac Pro is better since it can do multiple screens

    The iMac supports video spanning [] - you just need to get the right video-out adpater. The new ones even allow dual-link DVI.
  • Re:Eh (Score:5, Informative)

    by SoupIsGoodFood_42 ( 521389 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @11:58AM (#27051811)

    I don't think people who want to install an eSATA or SCSI card in a mid-ranged Apple computer are in the majority. I'm sure it sucks for those that need to, but that wasn't my point.

  • by MBGMorden ( 803437 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @12:07PM (#27051953)

    The U.S. dollar sucks right now and europeans should be paying much more for U.S. products. I was in europe last summer and it cost me a tremendous amount of money, just because of the exchange rate.

    Um, no, if the US dollar is down, then while you (as noted) should be spending a lot more in Europe, they in turn should see much LOWER prices (in their terms) for US products.

  • by Stormwatch ( 703920 ) <> on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @12:07PM (#27051955) Homepage
    At last! I don't suppose the mini is anything high-end, but the Intel GMA is pretty much WORTHLESS for gaming.
  • by MBGMorden ( 803437 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @12:10PM (#27051993)

    So you're getting twice as much graphics memory that is also faster graphics memory.

    Well, due note that SHARED BY MAIN MEMORY bit. It's important. Essentially, you're not really getting ANY graphics memory. You're just getting slightly faster main system memory, and the graphics chip is now willing to carve out twice as much of that main memory for it's own use.

  • by UnknowingFool ( 672806 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @12:12PM (#27052013)
    Laptops are like cars. There are features for every price range. If your #1 priority is price, Apple laptops are not for you. However you can't compare the Acer $499:
    • 1.86 GHz Intel Celeron M processor 540
    • 533 MHz FSB
    • 1 GB of DDR2 system memory
    • Intel GMA X3100
    • 160 GB hard drive, 5400 rpm
    • CD-RW/DVD-ROM combination drive
    • 15.4" 1280 X 800 screen
    • 802.11g wireless
    • 2 hr battery life
    • 13.11 lbs

    With the MacBook Air $2499:

    • 1.86GHz Intel Core 2 Duo
    • 1066 MHz FSB
    • 2GB DDR3
    • 120 GB HD, 5400 rpm
    • NVIDIA GeForce 9600M GT 256MB GDDR3
    • 13.3" 1440 by 900 screen
    • 802.11n wireless, Bluetooth
    • 4.5 hr battery life
    • 3.0 lbs

    And complain that the MacBook Air is more expensive because it is designed for ultralightweight applications yet has a faster bus, more memory, better graphics, etc. Apples to oranges.

  • by MadCow42 ( 243108 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @12:48PM (#27052583) Homepage

    I've been doing that with my 24" white iMac for a couple years now. I have Windows running in Parallels full-screen on one monitor, and Mac OSX full-screen on the other. It's a great cross-platform development environment, as well as a home machine.

    Macs handle multi-screen pretty cleanly - no mucking about needed. Trying to get it to work well on my Dell laptop is another matter... every time you undock it it gets farked up and you have to re-set all the settings.


  • by fwingo ( 1011995 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @12:56PM (#27052709)
    A comparable PC laptop (like a Lenovo X200T) would be $800 to $1000 cheaper.
  • Re:Eh (Score:4, Informative)

    by makomk ( 752139 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @01:13PM (#27052945) Journal

    Amazingly, that now pretty much describes the bottom end Mac Pro...

    ...Except for the price tag.

    Except for the price tag and the use of overpriced server-class components, yes. The really screwy thing, of course, is that the 24" iMacs all have 4GB of RAM, whereas the hideously expensive quad-core Mac Pro has only 3GB (and you can bet Apple will charge through the nose for more).

  • by primalamn ( 716272 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @01:19PM (#27053029)
    iMac can do multi screens, just add the proper adapter [to DVI/VGA] and plug in your new monitor. Easy.
  • by UnknowingFool ( 672806 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @01:21PM (#27053063)
    For a smaller screen, a lower video chip, more weight, and on sale, yes, it is $800 to $1000 cheaper. Base price it is only $100 or so cheaper.
  • by MBGMorden ( 803437 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @01:23PM (#27053099)

    It's important because in both cases it's removing all that memory from your main memory.

    In a system with dedicated graphics RAM, if it says 1GB RAM with 256MB of graphics memory, then my system ram is 1GB, and they're providing me with an extra 256MB of graphics RAM.

    In a shared memory situation, if it's 1GB RAM with 64MB of "graphics memory", then my system ram isn't really 1GB anymore - it's 1GB - 64MB. If it's 1GB of RAM with 128MB of shared "graphics memory", then my system ram is now 1GB - 128MB. In both cases, I didn't "get more graphics memory" - they just changed a setting that allows the graphics card to steal away more memory from the main system. The net memory in the system is unchanged. So you didn't get anymore then you had before. Indeed the base model USED to come with 960MB of usable system RAM before, but now since the graphics card is taking twice at much it only has 896MB of usable RAM.

    Put it this way - if you change your retirement plan to now take 6% of your total paycheck rather than 3%, do you go on bragging about "how much more money you're getting now". Of course not - that money was simply reallocated. The increase in one area was at the expense of another area and there was no net change in your income. On the other hand, if your employer instead matched your 3% without taking anything more from your normal salary, THEN you can get happy.

    AND PS: Any shared graphics memory will be slower that comparable dedicated. Benchmarks aren't available because generally the same chips aren't available with both, but when a graphics card has it's own dedicated memory it can access it directly. When it's shared it has to communicate with that memory over the system bus. That's slower with far more layers to go through. It's no accident that all high end graphics cards have dedicated memory whilst the low end stuff leeches system ram.

  • by rsmith-mac ( 639075 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @01:32PM (#27053197)

    You're looking at the wrong CPU/Mobo combo. The Mac Pro would have a 2-way Xeon processor in it (you pay a premium for 2-way and higher) and an appropriate motherboard with two sockets, 8 DIMM slots, etc. It still doesn't add up to too much, but you would need to slap something around a few hundred dollars on to that price tag (exact value unknown, the Nehalem Xeons aren't for sale yet).

  • by Shivetya ( 243324 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @01:33PM (#27053209) Homepage Journal

    because it isn't even remotely easy for the average user. It isn't fun for those of us who don't mind ripping them apart.

    The iMac is not meant to be open, now replacing a drive in a notebook isn't that hard because even Apple has a hard time dictating what notebook layouts are like

  • by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @01:58PM (#27053645)

    A Mac Mini looks to be a decent media center if you get a wireless keyboard+mouse and download HandBrake+VLC.

    The Mac Mini also has a built-in infrared receiver, so you can use it with a remote as well including the Apple remote, some universal remotes, and the Harmony remote. Also, there are some great media center applications for Mac including Boxee [], Plex [], and XBMC [].

  • Re:Eh (Score:2, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @02:37PM (#27054203)

    Too bad for your rant that the Mac Pro does come with two 16x slots []-- one occupied from the factory, and one open.

    And too bad that it's actually been that way for over a year [].

    Oh well, never let the facts blah blah blah.

  • by imsabbel ( 611519 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @02:49PM (#27054393)

    Come on. There is at least some limit to idiocy.
    ANY system will support 8Gbytes.
    You can get a system with a tyian board supporting 128Gbyte for less than one of those new Mac Pros.

  • by sneakyimp ( 1161443 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @03:01PM (#27054579)

    * 2.66 GHZ Nehalem 920, overclocked to well over 3.2GHZ.
    * ASUS p6t6 mobo with LOTS of features like SAS ports, RAID 0/1/5/10, at least 3 PCI-X x16 slots, eSATA connectors, etc.
    * ATI 4870 with 1GB DDR5 RAM
    * 12 GB RAM capable of 1600 Mhz (rather than 1066 avail on the Mac)
    * 750 Watt Corsair PSU with gobs of connecting cables
    * not one but FOUR WD 640 GB drive configured as RAID 0/1/5/10
    * LG Bluray burner
    * Acer 23" monitor
    * Windows vista 64
    * mouse, keyboard

    Anyone know when Nehalem Xeon chips might be available for the rest of us? Then we'll compare apples to apples. Damn Mac tax!

  • by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @03:08PM (#27054693)

    No kidding.

    The Mac Pro spec as priced out on newegg:

    Western Digital Caviar 640GB 7200 RPM SATA Hard Drive $69.99
    Intel Core i7 920 Nehalem 2.66GHz Quad-Core Processor $288.99
    EVGA 01G-P3-N959-TR GeForce 9500 GT 1GB Video Card $69.99
    ASUS P6T Deluxe Motherboard $289.99
    LG 22X DVD&#177;R DVD Burner Black SATA $22.99
    LIAN LI PC-60USB B2 Silver Aluminum Case $119.99
    G.SKILL Value 1GB 184-Pin DDR SDRAM $29.99 ea x 3 = $89.97

    And that right there is where you lose any hope of being relevant. You've picked plain DDR, which not only ISN'T the kind in the Mac Pro (DDR3 ECC), but won't even WORK in the mobo you've listed.

    Add to that the fact that the CPU is NOT an i7 920, but rather the Nehalem update to the Xeon. You'll note a distinct lack of dual-socket i7 setups, as it isn't supported. The Xeon versions have the additional QPI links

    To use a car analogy, this is like claiming that your Ford Focus is way better than a Ferrari because you got 4 wheels and an engine for so much less money.

  • by Onan ( 25162 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @03:15PM (#27054797)

    Uh, what vintage of imac was that? If you mean the crt or lamp-style ones, that's fair.

    But the past-several-years square imacs are incredibly simple to open. Three screws, and the whole back lifts off, exposing every component in the machine.

  • by anagama ( 611277 ) <> on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @03:31PM (#27055017) Homepage

    You are wrong, from the page you quote, for all models of the imac: "Support for external display in video mirroring mode"

    No -- you are wrong. Lift your eyes up a bullet point, and you will see "Support for external display in extended desktop mode". In other words, the iMac supports spanning AND mirroring.

  • by paulcone ( 1388145 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @04:03PM (#27055479)
    It does have that port -- it's called FireWire. I have two drives strung off mine -- one 500 GB and one 1TB.
  • by Joe The Dragon ( 967727 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @04:40PM (#27056041)

    You can get a DELL Studio XPS 435 about $1000 less with x2 ram then the mac pro.

    With the same cpu power.

    750GB 7200 RPM SATA Hard Drive vs 640GB

    a 640gb is $50 less on the dell

    Dell 24 inch S2409W Widescreen Flat Panel vs none

    ATI Radeon HD 4670 512MB vs # NVIDIA GeForce GT 120 512MB

    can add ATI Radeon HD 4850 512MB for $100 or ATI Radeon HD 4870 GDDR5 1024MB for $200 vs ATI Radeon HD 4870 512MB for $200 more

    can also get a Studio XPS 435 with No Monitor for $1,299

    with x2 the ram or - $150 for the same ram

    ATI Radeon HD 3650 256MB
    ATI Radeon HD 4670 512MB [add $50]
    ATI Radeon HD 4850 512MB [add $150]
    ATI Radeon HD 4870 GDDR5 1024MB [add $250]

    you can also find other dell core i7 deals as well.

  • by 99BottlesOfBeerInMyF ( 813746 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @04:42PM (#27056079)

    That's funny because I had the exact opposite experience with a dell laptop and a macbook air. The Air wouldn't detect the majority of displays plugged into it so you have to force it to use multiple monitors

    I've used laptops from Dell, IBM, and Apple and so far only the Apple one has smoothly worked for me. Generally I use the laptop when I'm out and about, plug into a monitor at the office and plug into a different monitor when working from home. With Mac laptops I can close the lid and take it to the coffee shop and open it and it works. I can close the lid unplug my work monitor, take it home and plug in my home monitor open the lid and it works. With all the others I had to unplug the monitor before suspending then un-suspend, then plug in a new monitor, and even then I often had to mess with the preferences.

    It's one of the reasons I haven't bought a Lenovo laptop for a long time.

  • by ogdenk ( 712300 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @06:34PM (#27057515)

    I call. My new Macbook White 2009, $999

    -2Ghz Core 2 Duo "Penryn"
    -1066MHz front-side bus
    -2GB DDR2 RAM
    -120GB SATA HDD
    -256MB (Shared) GeForce 9400M
    -SPDIF Audio In/Out
    -13.3" 1280x800 LCD
    -802.11a/b/g/draft-n wireless, bluetooth 2.1
    -8x DVD+-RW
    -4.5hr battery
    -5.0 lbs

    A real computer geek also knows that USBserial adapters are dirt cheap and work with just about any remotely modern operating system including OSX and even support funky baud rates or port settings.

    A PC-card slot would be nice but I can live without it. I wouldn't mind being able to put my old PCMCIA SCSI card to use and use CF->PCMCIA adapters instead of a USB card reader.

    The shared-memory video isn't really an issue as the 9400M is actually quite capable and has 16 real stream processors. CoD4 runs well and Quake 4 runs REALLY well. It'll be supported by OpenCL in Snow Leopard as well.

  • by CompMD ( 522020 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @06:45PM (#27057637)

    Nice! That's a good deal you got there.

    USB/serial adapters have *terrible* reliability when it comes to the actual serial data implementation. There are myriad problems that can result when trying to talk to devices such as embedded computers, GPS units, or data acquisition systems. This is even true with the manufacturer's Windows drivers running on Windows. They don't always work how you might expect.

  • by lmnfrs ( 829146 ) <lmnfrs&gmail,com> on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @06:52PM (#27057717) Journal

    Yep, that's a vital point because Nehalem Xeons currently are not available anywhere else, and the Nehalem Core i7 is not comparable. They are newer than the Xeon platform that is available and support 3 channel memory. That sounds nice, but the _older_ Xeon platform supported 4 channel memory with RAID and sparing (just like hard drives) and ECC to mention only a couple things. Desktop and Workstation/Server hardware are not in the same world.

  • by evilbessie ( 873633 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @07:21PM (#27058003)
    You forget in Europe we include the sales tax (VAT) in the headline price, in the states they don't do that. I think (but have no accurate figures so am probably wrong, but by less than 5% either way I'd venture) that sales taxes in the states are about 10%, so you are looking at 660 - 750, which is still more but then you expect that from apple, at lest we do in the uk...
  • Re:Eh (Score:3, Informative)

    by AtariKee ( 455870 ) on Tuesday March 03, 2009 @07:46PM (#27058281)

    Let's not forget that due to those high margins, they have almost 30 billion bucks in the bank with NO debt.

    Apple just does NOT care about market share. They make money with what they do. Why should they change for a few thousand hobbyists?

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