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Patents Apple

Move Over Apple - Samsung Files For a Patent On Page Turn 125

Posted by samzenpus
from the here-I-am-on-the-road-again-there-I-am-up-on-the-stage dept.
Nate the greatest writes "Remember last year when Apple received a patent on the faux page curl in iBooks? Lots of people laughed at the idea that Apple could patent the page turn, but not Samsung. The gadget maker has just filed for their own page turn patent. The paperwork explains in great detail what the page turn looks like, how the software would work, and what on screen gestures could be used to turn the page."
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Move Over Apple - Samsung Files For a Patent On Page Turn

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  • If I were (Score:5, Insightful)

    by ganjadude (952775) on Wednesday May 01, 2013 @08:13PM (#43605489) Homepage
    If I were getting beat up by a competitor for what I consider stupid patents I would start filing stupid patents to fight back as well.

    all this does is show once again that the patent system needs work.
  • Re:If I were (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday May 01, 2013 @08:57PM (#43605695)

    Samsung and apple in this case are to blame here. They are the ones who keep filling for horribly dumb lawsuits. So blame Samsung, blame apple, blame their attorneys if you want but don't blame a completely unbiased set of rules and regulations.

    It's a case of dumb and dumber really. In the end though, I'm not so worried about the one writing up this junk, I'm more worried about those approving it. Who's dumber really, the one who made the fail, or the one who fully endorses it?

  • Re:If I were (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Runaway1956 (1322357) on Wednesday May 01, 2013 @09:01PM (#43605725) Homepage Journal

    AC's response is kinda messed up.

    I don't entirely agree with you, but it has been pointed out that some "rights holders" have bought up patents as a defense against being sued by patent trolls. So yeah, it makes sense, in a way, to file for trivial patents as a defense against other trivial patents.

    It would be better though, if all the legitimate big players in the patent games would just declare a truce, get together, and lobby for patent reform - along with copyright reform.

    The system is most definitely broken. I don't think that Samsung is taking the "best" approach to fixing the real problem - not by a long shot.

    We need an analogy here, I think. A housing developer built on some low lying land, in a "classy" area of town. All the in-crowd bought his houses - that is, the "rights holders bought homes in the subdivision. The city's sewer system backs up onto these properties. Samsung's "fix" here, is to add three inches of topsoil to their own property to keep the sewerage from running onto their own property. Of course, that does nothing about the sewerage running in the streets, or on their neighbor's yards. The whole neighborhood still stinks to high heaven, and it's an unhealthy place to live.

    It's time for the subdivision to partner with government, and get the damned sewer system fixed, and get the crap out of everyone's neighborhoods!!

  • by walterbyrd (182728) on Wednesday May 01, 2013 @10:22PM (#43606039)

    > Samsung and apple in this case are to blame here.

    No, only Apple is to blame. If somebody punches you in the face, and you hit back, are you to blame?

    Samsung is only defending itself against a scummy patent bully.

  • Re:OBVIOUS! (Score:3, Insightful)

    by walterbyrd (182728) on Wednesday May 01, 2013 @10:24PM (#43606051)

    In all fairness, how can they deny Samsung a bullshit patent, when they have granted Apple so many bullshit patents?

  • by walterbyrd (182728) on Wednesday May 01, 2013 @10:26PM (#43606069)

    > Remember Apple started playing this game when someone sued THEM

    Difference is: Apple's patents are pure bullshit, and Apple only sues over their bullshit patents because Apple is scamming the system.

    Not *all* patent lawsuits are scams. Some patents are entirely legitimate. Apple is the master of junk patents, and scam lawsuits.

  • Re:If I were (Score:5, Insightful)

    by VortexCortex (1117377) <VortexCortexNO@S ... t-retrograde.com> on Thursday May 02, 2013 @02:37AM (#43607075) Homepage

    Everyone seems to love to jump on the "The patent system is at fault here its terrible, it lets this stuff happen" when in reality there is nothing wrong with the patent system at all.

    There is no test for obviousness, despite it being a requirement that patents must not cover obvious innovations. The PTO grants a massive amount of patents that should be invalid, as proven time again in the courts. The cost to invalidate a patent is in the millions, but the cost to file and receive a patent is in the hundreds. They don't take responsibility and readily put forth the fact the standard for granting a patent is far below the stated requirements, so the courts are weary to just invalidate a patent -- believing that the patent office is actually doing it's job well, when in reality they'll let you patent essentially anything: If you want a weak patent that won't hold up in court, they're cool with that so long as you pay your fees, cross your t's, dot your i's, and replace all the terms such that the application won't generate any hits when searched in their patent database. First to File means that patent application secrecy is needless -- If you're filling a patent it should be public knowledge so we can protest anything that is obvious / file our prior art. Yes, it would take longer and be more expensive to grant patents, but just make those filing for the patents pay the bills; This would bring the cost of patents up closer to their actual cost -- No, instead it's basically a government subsidy for legal warheads.

    Furthermore: Patents are not required to spurn innovation. Demand for innovation exists regardless of patents, and will generate drive for innovation by basic market forces regardless of granting monopolies. Look at the Automotive and Fashion industries -- Neither of which have design patents or copyright, and yet design is their core sales point, and they are very innovative in design. Patents and Copyright merely enforce artificial scarcity, when the artists and researchers could just as easily make their money without patents: Simply withhold their labor unless agreement to be payed for it is ensured (like car mechanics and home builders do, it's a proven system). If there are those who would not invest without monopoly assurances afterwards then those who will invest in research regardless will out compete them -- As proven by stagnant companies doing poorly in the automotive and fashion design industries compared to those who innovate without promise of monopoly. Anyone who fears Trade Secrecy / Trade Unions locking up innovation has never met a reverse engineer from this century. We strip layers off of microchips to discover their wiring at the nano scale. We have spectrograms and readily derive the secret recipes for foodstuffs and medicines -- Hence the generics market existing. It's not economically feasible for secrets to exist in consumer products today, you can't hide the molecules and machine code from me (and yes, I do read and write fluently in machine code). [vortexcortex.com]

    We have NO EVIDENCE that the patent system is fulfilling its goals. We don't know if it's harmful or not, but there are indications that point to it being harmful (frivolous patent lawsuits and bogus patents), and there are at least two data points that indicate patents are not required at all. The real problem with the patent system is that we did not do a test to see if it was beneficial. Everyone just assumes it is without ANY evidence to support their claims. We need to do the experiment and abolish patents to see if they were harmful or helpful. We can re-institute the laws if we need to later. Continuing to operate the world's economy on assumptions of untested hypothesis is egregiously intellectually and economically negligent. That patents exist at all with no proof they're beneficial is the problem. That problem can not be fixed until we've abolished patents.

    If you assert that there are no problems with the patent system then I must point out: Ignorant people like you, who operate based merely on assumptions without any evidence to back their claims, are the problem.

  • Re:If I were (Score:4, Insightful)

    by VortexCortex (1117377) <VortexCortexNO@S ... t-retrograde.com> on Thursday May 02, 2013 @02:57AM (#43607121) Homepage

    Samsung and apple in this case are to blame here. They are the ones who keep filling for horribly dumb lawsuits. So blame Samsung, blame apple, blame their attorneys if you want but don't blame a completely unbiased set of rules and regulations.

    So if you want to blame something for a problem them blame those directly responsible for the problem instead of pointing your fingers at an invisible boogie man or some abstract idea.

    By your own logic Samsung and Apple can not be blamed. They are only "filling for horribly dumb lawsuits" because they are "a completely unbiased set of rules and regulations" -- They are artificial amoral corporate entities, and they must act the way they do because the rules say they must do so or be held accountable by their shareholders: Profit by any means is why they do this.

    So, why don't you heed your own advice and "blame those directly responsible for the problem instead of pointing your fingers at an invisible boogie man or some abstract idea" of corporate personhood?

    You're the kind of guy who cries "Cheater!" and blames the AI for following the rules of the game.

  • Re:OBVIOUS! (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02, 2013 @06:34AM (#43607793)

    I think he was referring to three examples of the same idea being discovered twice at around the same time in each case. E.g. Calculus (Newton and Leibniz), and the telephone (Bell and Swan) are classic examples. I don't know of anybody else working on relativity at the same time as Einstein, but considering the explosion in theoretical physics at the time (e.g. quantum mechanics) it is unlikely that relativity would have remained undiscovered for long.

    The point is an important one: great discoveries would happen anyway, we cannot assume that a patent system makes them more likely.

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