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Wozniak Praises 'Beautiful' Windows Phone 362 362

judgecorp writes "Apple co-founder Steve Wozniak has praised the user interface of Microsoft's Windows Phone, saying that aspects of its user interface are more 'beautiful' than comparable sides to the iPhone. The comments, in a New Domain, follow on from a comment by Forrester boss George Colony who blogged that Apple would decline in the post-Jobs era. Both pieces have kicked off the kind of online argument you would expect."
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Wozniak Praises 'Beautiful' Windows Phone

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  • Re:Windows Phone 7 (Score:4, Insightful)

    by RyuuzakiTetsuya (195424) <taiki.cox@net> on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @10:38AM (#39857061)

    I played with a Lumia 900. It's well thought out but execution is lacking. The thing wouldn't get on the in store AT&T wifi. So I go to toggle it off and see what LTE is all about and the soft toggle for wifi on/off gets stuck in the middle. Err. What? It's a UI element! Really?

    Windows phone 7 is full of interesting and good ideas with poor execution and little polish.

  • Re:Windows Phone 7 (Score:1, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @10:38AM (#39857065)

    Yeah, and they've been paying clueless morons to rave about their shit on the internet too. Combined with subpar features and absolutely no interest from the public market, WP7 will make a fucking killing in Slashdot comment threads but nowhere else!

  • Re:Windows Phone 7 (Score:5, Insightful)

    by cptdondo (59460) on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @10:39AM (#39857087) Journal

    OK, the hyper-coordination between articles praising the WinPhone and gushing first posts is getting annoying.... How about a 15 minute rule between article and first post? Or maybe restrict first post to accounts that have been around for more than 15 minutes?

  • Online argument? (Score:1, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @10:39AM (#39857089)

    "Both pieces have kicked off the kind of online argument you would expect"... I expect the kind that has all the /. trolls and shills locked in I-wish-it-was-mortal combat for the next, say 12 hours.

    Too bad they both suck, Maemo 4evah!!

    /me's work here is done...

  • And.....? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @10:43AM (#39857127)

    So what if Woz praised something a competitor produced? He's entitled to his own opinion, negative or positive, and it says nothing about the state of Apple. Is Apple going to decline without Jobs? Who know, but Woz having an opinion is hardly a sign one way or the other. The only thing it does is dispell any notion that he's an arrogant prat who couldn't possible even deign to glance at a competitor's product without vomiting.

    Maybe this sort of thing gets to me too much, but I'm really fed up of this "you must be 100% for whichever brand-tribe you join!" guff. If he liked bits of another product then so what, that's competition for you.

  • Re:Windows Phone 7 (Score:1, Insightful)

    by ThePub2000 (974698) on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @10:43AM (#39857129)
    I really like my WP7. It's simple and straight-to-the point in how it gets the job done. The MS Office integration between desktop 2010 and WP7 using live is excellent and I don't think it would be easy to live without now that it's something in my phone! My biggest complaint is that lack of "ease" of integration with Windows 7. The Zune software is really crappy. Additionally not being able to link with bluetooth is silly, really the phone should be able to do everything over BT but instead it's a pointless addition to any WP7 handset. Otherwise I have been really impressed by the WP7. I bought it not knowing what I'd get and have been more than pleasantly surprised.
  • by Chrisq (894406) on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @10:45AM (#39857163)
    Its not surprising that Wozniak stuck to tech rather than going into management. He gives his honest opinion, saying what he believes to be true. There is no place for this sort of thing in the boardroom.
  • Re:Windows Phone 7 (Score:4, Insightful)

    by ZeroSumHappiness (1710320) on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @10:47AM (#39857177)

    Or you should visit the Firehose more often.

  • Re:Windows Phone 7 (Score:2, Insightful)

    by ByOhTek (1181381) on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @10:50AM (#39857197) Journal

    I have a WP7 phone (HTC). I've never seen those issues. I'm guessing they are hardware/driver issues. I'm guessing the UI toggle is tied to the processing state of the action - it stalled in the middle, so it died.

    And you can't blame the phone OS if the store can't make their WiFi and phones work together. I've used my phone on my WiFi at work and the Sprint store, and had no issues whatsoever.

    WP7 has it's flaws, particularly with the 3rd party dev API, but the issues you mentioned seem more likely to be AT&T or the hardware manufacturer.

  • no surprise (Score:5, Insightful)

    by smash (1351) on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @10:52AM (#39857229) Homepage Journal

    Wozniak is a nerd's nerd. He isn't the general public, and what woz thinks is awesome is not likely to be what Joe average wants to use. That is not meant to be an insult by the way, the man is a genius. But he's a technical genius and not a genius with regards to what people want (that was Jobs).

    I'd say that getting a glowing review by wozniak is just as likely to be the kiss of death as it is to be the harbinger of iphone doom...

  • Since 1984... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by sycodon (149926) on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @10:53AM (#39857247)

    George Colony who blogged that Apple would decline in the post-Jobs era.

    Since day one of the Macintosh, or you might say day one of the IBM PC, people have been predicting the demise of Apple. With every new model and every new OS, legions of entrenched industry analysts stood up and said with certainty..."whoa, this may be the end of Apple".

    I guess if they just keep saying that, one day it will be true and they can pat themselves on the back for being so prescient.

  • Re:And.....? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by squiggleslash (241428) on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @11:00AM (#39857345) Homepage Journal

    Well, I'm curious to know Woz's opinion on things. Woz may be associated with Apple, but he's a smart geek who's been in computing since the beginning, and he's not a fanboi of any particular technology despite his Apple connections.

    Would you have written something similar, or considered it non-newsworthy, if the subject was Dave Haynie, Richard Stallman, Chuck Peddle, or James Gosling?

  • Re:Windows Phone 7 (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @11:02AM (#39857375)

    Well, to be more fair, he almost certainly has a shitload more posts than that going back for quite a bit longer, just spread between a few dozen accounts.

  • by Lucas123 (935744) on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @11:02AM (#39857381) Homepage
    He's not an Apple fanboy. He just likes good technology regardless of who makes it.

    --
    The mill's closed. There's no more work. We're destitute. I've got no option but to sell you all for scientific experiments.
  • Re:Windows Phone 7 (Score:5, Insightful)

    by CowTipperGore (1081903) on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @11:03AM (#39857389)

    TechCar is the latest iteration of a large group of astroturfing accounts. There's a bunch of high UID accounts with similar style names (two random words smashed together) that shill pro-Microsoft and anti-Google positions. Unsurprisingly, he was born yesterday to post in Bonch's story claiming Google management knew about the wifi harvesting. He shows up to defend a well-established anti-Google (and pro-Apple) shill and has since posted a series of anti-Linux, anti-Google, and pro-Microsoft comments.

    Assuming he follows the same pattern as the rest, mods will catch on in a week or two and his karma will plummet. The account will get put to sleep and a new one will be created.

  • Re:Since 1984... (Score:4, Insightful)

    by tgd (2822) on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @11:04AM (#39857391)

    George Colony who blogged that Apple would decline in the post-Jobs era.

    Since day one of the Macintosh, or you might say day one of the IBM PC, people have been predicting the demise of Apple. With every new model and every new OS, legions of entrenched industry analysts stood up and said with certainty..."whoa, this may be the end of Apple".

    I guess if they just keep saying that, one day it will be true and they can pat themselves on the back for being so prescient.

    Well, to be fair, the first post-Jobs era at Apple did almost sink the company. Microsoft, ironically enough, is a big part of the reason Apple made it out of the mid 90's in business. And if you talk to their shareholders now, most of them will tell you that, while the post-Jobs era now has been good from a stock value and revenue standpoint, its been pretty damn concerning from a mid-term to long-term innovation and investment standpoint. Look at the pace of "real" innovation that was happening at Apple for the ten years before Jobs' departure, and look at the pace now. That should have people worried. "Innovation" now is "hype up the technology developed by a company we're suing (Samsung's high-resolution panel)" and "we're in 150 markets". Software innovation is dried up -- they're rolling out largely features that came from Android and WP7, implemented in the jailbroken community, and absorbed much later by Apple.

    Apple and MS have swapped roles now -- Apple is coasting on customer hype and its near monopoly, and Microsoft is the nimble innovator. And as someone who has a lot of stock in both, I have this lingering sense of dread that both companies are going to somehow screw this up.

  • Re:Windows Phone 7 (Score:1, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @11:06AM (#39857423)

    How about growing up, and just ignoring things that bother you on the internet?

    It's not like the 50th, 100th, 200th post is insightful. This is slashdot.

    They now have a BI section. They think that has to do with nerds and technology.

    It is the worst of "IT World", and the worst of fark. The trolls are the only thing I find enjoyable about the site anymore.

  • Re:Windows Phone 7 (Score:5, Insightful)

    by h4rr4r (612664) on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @11:08AM (#39857445)

    HTTP is not a replacement for every other protocol. I am sick of the brain dead thinking it is. We have other protocols for a reason.

    As a simple example, http sure is not enough for an ftp client, ssh client, etc, etc, etc. 7.5 of course will let you do all these things.

  • Re:And.....? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @11:17AM (#39857543)

    he's not a fanboi of any particular technology despite his Apple connections.

    Which I think is something which appearss to be missing in large chunks of the general population these days (at least, the population who actually care about technology). If you take a glance down the comments sections of many sites it's a perpetual argument-to-the-death for their own personal preference. I even know people who are like that in person when it comes to tech, but why? Why are people so obsessed with insisting that what they have is the absolute best ever and don't you dare disagree with me? At which point did people stop being consumers and start being believers?

    Would you have written something similar, or considered it non-newsworthy, if the subject was Dave Haynie, Richard Stallman, Chuck Peddle, or James Gosling?

    That depends on the context. Stallman has heavily criticised Apple for their ethics, which is something I'd be interested in hearing about. Would I think it's shocking and newsworthy if Stallman picked up an iPhone and said "You know, I really like the aluminium body they give these things"? No.

    If Wozniak thinks the Microsoft phone is beautiful then fine. If someone wants to report "comments from a guy who knows about these things on #upcomingtech" then fine. But trying to tie that in to an article about someone claiming that Apple is in decline as if the two are somehow linked and therefore Steve must be about to jump ship? Come on.

  • Re:And.....? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by JustSomeProgrammer (1881750) on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @11:23AM (#39857629)
    I honestly can't imagine Richard Stallman saying anything positive about anything Microsoft produces due to him never giving it a shot because of his personal beliefs of how software should be.

    I wonder what kind of phone he actually uses...
  • Re:Windows Phone 7 (Score:4, Insightful)

    by PoliTech (998983) on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @11:24AM (#39857637) Homepage Journal
    Did you actually mean to say that you think Steve Wozniak is a paid Microsoft Shill? (Not to mention a clueless moron?) Or did you just fail to proofread your trolling?
  • Re:Windows Phone 7 (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Dishevel (1105119) on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @11:31AM (#39857733)

    And you can't blame the phone OS if the store can't make their WiFi and phones work together

    Umm.
    Yes. You can. In almost all cases. If the store Wifi is working and everyone else can get on and that phone can not, What exactly is to blame?

  • Re:Windows Phone 7 (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Mister Whirly (964219) on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @11:32AM (#39857749) Homepage

    There's a reason, Woz has been an engineer and not a designer at Apple.

    Yeah - he actually invented things instead of putting pretty packages and a neat UI on existing things and marketing the hell out of them. He had the audacity to put function over form.

  • by crazyjj (2598719) * on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @11:38AM (#39857815)

    It's sad that Wozniak was always hindered by his inability to be a bullshit artist. It's just not in his nature to kiss ass or blow smoke. You ask his opinion and he gives it, without any regard as to whether or not it's what you want to hear.

    Unfortunately this quality, which should be considered a virtue, is usually considered a handicap in the corporate world.

  • by DrXym (126579) on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @11:39AM (#39857839)
    "Apollo" or Windows Phone 8, Microsoft's next version supposedly allows for native code support if the rumours are to be believed. But that doesn't help developers out there right now. Porting C written to OpenGL ES to C# XNA more or less qualifies as writing from scratch. Perhaps the big boys have the resources to put people to work on a port but I doubt many do.

    With just a little bit of glue and abstraction over input devices a game could probably share 90% of the code between iOS, Android and even the Blackberry Tablet OS / Blackberry 10. If you utilised some 3rd party gaming API it's probably even more again. Microsoft really need that native support and preferably OpenGL ES, even if its through gritted teeth.

  • Re:Windows Phone 7 (Score:5, Insightful)

    by ByOhTek (1181381) on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @11:44AM (#39857917) Journal

    You are assuming it is working with all of the others.

    Also, you are assuming the issue isn't with the driver or hardware (which would be the manufacturer of the phone, and not the OS).

  • by squiggleslash (241428) on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @12:05PM (#39858209) Homepage Journal

    No. I meant C++. iOS and Android requires a bit of Objective-C and Java respectively, but you can write all your heavy lifting code in C++. For instance, you can write a whole C++ library and reference it in your Objective-C code, through Objective-C++.

    You can, but you don't. The point here is not that there's some hypothetical apps out there that might be easier to port if there was a C++ compiler for WP7, it's that there are, in practice, very, very, very few, because C++ is not the recommended language of development for either iOS or Android.

    You might find a small subset of games easier to port, but there really aren't many of them.

    So in practice it wouldn't help Microsoft or WP7 in any realistic way to do this. Developers wouldn't fell "Yay! C++! I can port my apps!" because... their apps aren't in C++.

    Only Phone Manufacturers are allowed to write unmanaged code for WP7 so that excludes native c++.

    Well that sucks. Still, if Microsoft really does want a ton of quick and dirty ports from an established platform, perhaps encouraging Android devs to use J# for the porting, supplying an API for the purpose, is the way to go?

    I suspect they'd get more ports than they'd ever hope to achieve by supporting C++, despite it not helping with iOS ports. The sum total of Java apps for Android strikes me as several times higher than the sum total of C++ apps for iOS and Android combined.

  • Re:Windows Phone 7 (Score:3, Insightful)

    by istartedi (132515) on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @12:24PM (#39858405) Journal

    HTTP is not a replacement for every other protocol. I am sick of the brain dead thinking it is. We have other protocols for a reason

    This didn't happen because people are idiots. Admins censored the other ports, and people routed around it. Of course there are network tools that can tell if you are trying to piggyback something else through port 80, so you might as well finagle your exchanges into legitimate HTTP traffic.

  • Re:Windows Phone 7 (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Gr8Apes (679165) on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @12:58PM (#39858785)
    It's still a "windows" phone, advertised as such, so any failings in operation that appear to be software related will justly be seen as an MS failing.
  • Re:Windows Phone 7 (Score:5, Insightful)

    by gstoddart (321705) on Tuesday May 01, 2012 @01:31PM (#39859231) Homepage

    I have a WP7 phone (HTC). I've never seen those issues. I'm guessing they are hardware/driver issues.

    If users are going to have to fight with drivers on their Windows phones, then Microsoft has already lost the race. Nobody wants to muck with drivers on their friggin' phone. What the hell does that even mean? It's not like someone swapped out the network adapter or anything -- so if they wifi doesn't work out of the box, the entire phone is suspect and isn't ready for consumers.

    And you can't blame the phone OS if the store can't make their WiFi and phones work together.

    Well, then maybe the OS+phone combo, but people kind of expect wi-fi to be a well solved problem. Find the network, enter the password, and go. It's not like it's new or anything.

    If I was testing out a phone, and I couldn't get it to use the wifi in the store, I'd simply move onto the next phone. That's some serious warning signals the phone is going to be problematic.

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