iPad Jailbroken 624
A day after the release of Apple's tablet computer, a hacker claims to have gained root access to the iPad. "A well-known hacker of the iPhone, who previously defeated Apple's restrictions on developers, has claimed in a video to have hacked the iPad. Just a day after release, the hacker, who goes by 'MuscleNerd' online, said that he has gained root access to the iPad..."
Only Apple (Score:5, Insightful)
If you'd get a normal tablet or computer, you wouldn't need to jailbreak it. Apple is moving us towards closed computer environments. If Microsoft did this everyone would be angry about it, but now that it's Apple its all fine and classy.
Re:Only Apple (Score:5, Insightful)
Try to get outside apps running on a kindle.
Re:Only Apple (Score:1, Insightful)
IIRC, tablets run more-or-less normal versions of Windows XP so the admin rights were built into the account to begin with! There was no need to get "root" because it was enabled by default.
Undoubtedly, there will be tons of apple haters in this discussion who are sick of hearing about ipad because it's not open, proprietary, etc. The community understands your arguments. Bashing apple while trying to compare them to microsoft just undermines your credibility and the valid point you are trying to make.
Re:Only Apple (Score:3, Insightful)
ok
http://www.griffin.net/2010/01/hacking-the-amazon-kindle-dx-part-2-qt-and-sudoku.html [griffin.net]
Re:Only Apple (Score:5, Insightful)
"If Microsoft did this everyone would be angry about it, but now that it's Apple its all fine and classy."
That just goes to show you that without some numbers to back it up life is so ambiguous. In MY impression there is a preponderance of Apple-hating commenters here on Slashdot. Presumable those same Apple haters are not also running Windows, which is just as closed as anything Apple puts out, but consistency of thougt--even among so-called geeks--is not a major human trait.
Still not worth purchasing (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Only Apple (Score:5, Insightful)
> If the iPad doesn't work for you - don't buy it.
And help other people understand why they should't buy one either. Oh, wait, that's what he's doing, and you want him to stop.
Re:Only Apple (Score:2, Insightful)
It's just as closed as Windows
Awesome! Where do I go to download the Windows 7 kernel source?
Honestly... (Score:2, Insightful)
People who buy this device are buying into the environment created for the device by Apple. As such, someone gaining root access to the device that Apple will analyze and patch, and you *still* won't be able to use the app store for... seems like a waste.
So, I ask again... why do we care?
Re:Doesn't surprise me. (Score:5, Insightful)
i would be even less surprised if some of the jailbreakers had insider information to help them unlock the apple devices. as well thought out as apple's info-release schedules are (sanctioned leaks on upcoming products?) it totally makes sense for them to have two versions of the ipad on the market:
1, typical user experience, customer buys it and it does what it says it will
2, enhanced user experience, customer buys it and hacks it to do something else
in either case, a customer buys it, and in the relatively small second subset, the group who would normally curse the company out and hold off from buying the device because it's 'crippled' actually gives apple money.
of course it was quickly broken, it's part of the dance.
Re:Only Apple (Score:5, Insightful)
Because the OS on the Zune is so free and easy to modify.
Apple has a closed environment on the iPad/iPhone/iPod line, the rest of the hardware contains an OS that is just as open (more so in some respects) than Windows. A software platform that it continues to develop and open up. You don't need to jailbreak an OS X box.
There is nothing to suggest Apple are moving "us" towards closed environments. If the iPad doesn't work for you - don't buy it.
Whaaaaaa? Are you in some strange bizzaro world where Apple isn't the embodiment of a closed system?
The rest of the hardware contains an OS that is just as open ? What the hell are you talking about? Tried to boot OSX on a whitebox yet? Apparently not or you'd see how ludicrous your statement is.
There's nothing to suggest that Apple is moving "us" (why is "us" in quotes?) towards a closed environment? You mean other than the fact that every product they have is locked down and closed off? You are deluded if you think Apple wouldn't love to lock OSX users into an App store - the only reason they haven't is because Windows would regain most of the customers lost to OSX if that happened. Apple is way too far behind in the OS arena to try to dictate terms to it's users, whereas they are/were far enough ahead with the iPod/iPhone to dictate whatever the hell they wanted. The whole iPod/iPhone environment is a perfect example of exactly what Apple would do if it had the power to do so - and it's also a perfect example of why Apple should never be given enough marketshare to accomplish anything like it.
Re:Only Apple (Score:2, Insightful)
I find it hilarious to see all the kindle owners ragging on the ipad for being overpriced and ...
Ah, but if you already own a Kindle (it came out before the iPad, donchaknow), it's much cheaper than buying an iPad.
;) Not that related, but you CAN "root" a Kindle, and put Linux programs on it. That doesn't magically give it the power or display of the ipad, but hey, at least you'd have a physical keyboard, right?
Cost, battery life, *and* free wireless data. (I believe you'll find the iPad has a better browser, but hey.
Re:Only Apple (Score:5, Insightful)
It doesn't have to be open source for it to be friendly to the OSS community - the developments with Webkit and other projects that Apple has contributed to, as well as things it has created itself and released like libdispatch - are beneficial for everyone.
It doesn't have to be open source for it to be open - it's a posix compliant unix OS with a nice GUI on top (not just "unix like"), that can also support X (if you choose to install it) and numerous other OSS stuff. It's also based on a bit more than just "old BSD code" - it's not like they just nailed the lid shut and called it done - they continue to develop the code at the core (and push their changes back to the community).
It doesn't make sense *at all* for Apple to close up OS X into the same business model as the iPhone OS - they're just totally different markets. The iPhone OS market works because it provides a single, consistent store with a plethora of free or cheap apps (with the odd expensive one which tend not to be the norm). This is pretty much the polar opposite of the way they have positioned OS X, especially with regard to the open source *parts* of the OS that they continue to develop and push.
By your logic, since "it makes perfect sense", I assume that Microsoft is going to adopt the same model it uses for Xbox live and the Xbox 360 software for Windows. I mean, they're all about control right - it only makes sense!
Bad impression then (Score:2, Insightful)
"In MY impression there is a preponderance of Apple-hating commenters here on Slashdot."
I think you'll find that about 20% of posters hate Apple, 20% would defend Apple if they were killing babies, and the rest don't care. Since you're an unabashed fan of Apple, I think you've adopted a bunker-like mentality that makes you feel that unless you're very complimentary to Apple that you hate them and you need to speak up to defend the honor of poor beleaguered Apple.
This is why we care. (Score:1, Insightful)
Apple is good at marketing to the hipster market. Each hipster has a large supply of money they can spend, but didn't actually work for. It mainly comes from each hipster's parents and/or trust funds.
Now, Apple has gotten a lot of money from these hipsters in the past, and will likely get more in the future. This makes it look like their ideas are "good" to the executives at competing manufacturers, even when they're very fucked ideas (you know, like closed platforms).
After seeing Apple's success, HP, Dell, Google, Microsoft and others will try to emulate it by producing their own shitty tablets built upon closed platforms with shitty "app stores" and all of that crap. So now when you go to buy a computer, you'll get stuck dealing with all this nonsense.
You won't be able to buy an open tablet, all thanks to Apple and their success tricking their competitors into thinking that closed-platforms are the way to go.
Re:Only Apple (Score:3, Insightful)
You are putting words in his mouth. He did not even imply such an idea was his.
Looks Good for Porn (Score:5, Insightful)
It's probably good for browsing porn. I hate always having to boot a full OS for just to browse porn. It looks super portable too, so I'd be able to browse porn from just about anywhere. It has a fairly big screen, which would be good for browsing porn. And good battery life so I could browse porn for long periods of time. The touch screen is nice, so I'd be able to touch the porn I'm browsing. It has good Internets connections, so I'd be able to browse lots of porn fast. I don't think it's good for much else. I think I'm sold.
Re:Honestly... (Score:1, Insightful)
iPad is not a PC (Score:2, Insightful)
The Kindle is an e-book reader, not a tablet PC.
The iPad is an overgrown iPod Touch, not a tablet PC. For one thing, "PC" in Apple marketing language usually refers to Lenovo-compatible hardware running an operating system made by Microsoft.
Re:Only Apple (Score:3, Insightful)
SSD drives still aren't cheap. I recently bought an 128GB SSD drive for my laptop and it was $350. Sounds as if Apple is stressing the market right now by buying everything up for the iPad. I'd guess seeing lower prices and high capacities will depend on the SSD manufacturers being able to crank up to handle the demand. Everyone moaning and groaning about how horrible the iPad is should be thankful that it'll make SSD cheaper faster (after causing the prices to go up for a short while). There is no excuse for a mobile device having a platter based drive anymore.
Re:Only Apple (Score:4, Insightful)
There is nothing to suggest Apple are moving "us" towards closed environments.
Other than the fact that they deployed the iPhone OS on a device that could(should) have used a better, generically useful OS. Other than the fact that Jobs thinks this type of computer will be the future of computing? Other than the fact that with the iTunes store being the sole provider of software for the iPhone OS, Apple gets a slice of every pie? No, check that, they already got a slice with the OS being locked to special hardware; now they get a sliver of every other slice by becoming the sole software distributer. Where do you get MS Office for the iPad? iTunes. Where do you get Microsoft's free RDP client for iPad? Well, there's already a fully functional pay version from another third party, and Apple won't make money from a free App with better functionality. Denied; no reason given.
Comment by Xeno 03/31/10 @ http://gizmodo.com/5506776/what-tech-nerds-think-about-the-ipad [gizmodo.com]
I really hope that this is not the future of computing. It's kinda like how most of our economy went away from inventing and producing to consuming. The iPad takes away the making and doing from computers and makes consuming the whole point. I'm not saying that consuming is bad just that I hope it's doesn't become the whole picture.
Re:Only Apple (Score:2, Insightful)
A Windowx installation is useless out of the box, yes, but you can install all those applications you said it lacks. On the iP* you can install what Apple lets you install.
Re:Only Apple (Score:2, Insightful)
I have OS X running on a whitebox - next question. Just because they officially discourage it, doesn't mean it is not possible. They don;t even make it difficult. The install DVD is not encrypted, has no serial numbers, does not phone home, does not need online activation. While it technically infringes the licence to do so, it is not hard to do.
"Every product locked down" - this is just nonsense. While OS X itself features closed source components, just because this is the case doesn't mean it cannot be open. Open and open source are not the same thing. OS X features a multitude of open protocols, codecs, standards and features that are designed to make it play well with other operating systems, as well as a continued commitment to open source projects that it includes and bases large parts of its systems on - CUPS, Webkit, libdispatch, OpenGL, OpenAL, GCC etc etc, just to name a couple. The reason OS X is good to use is that it combines open standards with with a business model that works well, and thus allows them to continue to exist as a large business.
If Apple wanted to lock people into an App Store for OS X they would have done so already - they will do what works for them in a business sense, nothing more, nothing less. They're not some evil emperor sitting on a throne trying to decide how best to screw over people - they are a company who exists to make money. For the iPhone, the model they have chosen happens to work for them, and is very profitable.
For OS X and the Mac, the model they have chosen is somewhat different and is very profitable for them also. They may not have the marketshare of windows, but they really don't need it. It works for them, and has seen their profits continue to look healthy year on year.
The "us" is in quotes because he is claiming to speak for everyone, which he clearly does not.
It is a fallacy to suggest that because the iPhone business model was successful for Apple that they would try and shoehorn that onto the Mac business model. You might as well say that now that Xbox live and the 360 are so well entrenched that MS will be moving that business model onto Windows.
Is it such a stretch to imagine that a company can have multiple different business models for the different products that it sells without resorting to end of the world scenarios?
Re:Only Apple (Score:5, Insightful)
Where can I get a normal tablet computer for the price of an ipad?
Well, I have no idea. You can get them cheaper though. [amazon.com]
Re:Only Apple (Score:1, Insightful)
Displays will make your eyes hurt
Except right now, of course, while you're sitting around reading Slashdot and other sites on an LCD. Reading on an LCD feels OK at the moment, for some reason. Right?
Or are you taking one for the team, suffering indescribable eye agony for as long as it takes to bring us the good news about e-ink and the Kindle?
You e-ink boosters remind me of the Chewlies Gum salesman in Clerks.
speedbump (Score:3, Insightful)
Running software not designed for it is not the real issue here. The issue is what is a stake and how appropriate the lockdown is.
apple tends to argue for "speed bump" DRM. basically make something difficult enough or a sufficient game of cat and mouse on the one hand (the speed bump) and and offer an express lane you can pay for. So for example, itunes. you can break the audio files if you want to. they impose some speed bumps to make it not worth your effort. then they offer enhanced value for staying in the itunes eco-system: the seemless updates to the ipod, cover art access, organization of the meta data, safe store, etc... All things you could do on your own but would most people would prefer it to happen magically rather farting around with bit torrent or sending your credit card to some russian mafia website.
Now for somethings like the iphone they have taken a much more agressive lockdown. I rationalize that by thinking about what they are protecting. You don't want crazy shit happening on a cell phone. so you make it hard to install anything not vetted by the mothership. Even the android market has this vetting. It's not that you can't do it. they just make it even harder. people will get much more enraged if their cell phones crash or the cell network itself starts malfunctioning.
SO that makes sense.
the Ipad is sort of in the middle regime so it's going to be more of a test of how apple wants to go. it's really more of a general purpose computer. some units don't have cell phones in them, and even those are not there primarily for voice but for data.
so you could see them going either way on this one. My suspiscion is they will try to maintain the lockdown. that's what they did with the ipod touch (which is not a cell phone).
The new rationale will be that this is an appliance not something you are supposed to mess with. protection for content owners will be seen as paramount over make-like access to the internals. Byt treating it as a appliance that protects content owners they will be able to more freely provide content without onerous access modalities. This will keep the device behaving more like an appliance than a computer.
COntrary to cory doctrow I see this as good. why? well it's not an either or situation, it's an all of the above. If I want true access to my computer then I should buy a computer that allows this. it's called a laptop. I can put linux on it. it's mine to mod. But I should expect that I'll also run into access restrictions from content owners. I might find that less user freindly. On the other hand if I want easy access then there's this appliance I can use for that. I can't modify it. that's the trade, but it's a trade that gives me a value I want.
you could wish for both in one device and if this were easy to provide then someone will do it.
but because both devices, laptop and appliance exist, I have not lost anything.
Re:Only Apple (Score:1, Insightful)
"Windows, which is just as closed as anything Apple puts out"
No it isn't. I run Debian, not Windows or anything Apple, but I do know that while Microsoft Windows is non-free software and has onerous licensing terms the end user is permitted to install anything they like on Microsoft server, desktop and mobile operating systems. The same is not true of the iPad or the iPhone. This is a very big difference, and to pretend it doesn't exist or doesn't matter is foolish.
Re:Only Apple (Score:5, Insightful)
I have to strongly disagree here. You cannot compare a DRM restricted hardware platform like the iPhone and iPad (and PS3, XBOX, PSP, etc.) and an OPERATING SYSTEM.
Microsoft may not be open source, or play well with standards, but you are still running an operating system (licensed right?) on hardware that you get to actually own. Of course you don't own the operating system. If you want a more open operating system choose Linux instead. Open source with hardware you really own feels really quite nice.
If I purchased an iPhone or an iPad I would feel justifiably pissed off that I don't have complete root access from second one. Preventing me from doing that is completely retarded, unethical, and downright shitty. I can feel the arguments starting, so I will just say this: If you don't want me to have root access on the hardware... then RENT THE BASTARD TO ME. Don't SELL it.
The same goes with any other piece of electronics. I feel perfectly justified and ethically correct to run custom firmware on the PSP, mod my XBOX whatever, and ultimately enjoy a completely 'cracked' and 'hacked' PS3.
Which is, btw, why you can't ever hack a piece of hardware to run a different operating sytem that you own. You own it. You did not do anything but enjoy your PROPERTY.
So consistency of thought? I think most of /. is remarkably consistent in this regard. 1) DRM sucks and is Defective by Design, and 2) You should be able to do anything you want with your property.
This issue is pervasive in our culture right now. The powers that be are fighting as hard as they can to prevent our effective ownership of anything. They don't want us to resell our books, our music, our movies, our games. They don't want us to do what WE want with our hardware, but what THEY want with *their* hardware. They want laws to punish us severely when get around the draconian restrictions they put into place on us.
Their ideal world is one in which we own nothing, lease everything, and pay by the minute to do so. That dog won't hunt will it? Yet they continue to try to make it happen. So let's not distract from the real argument here..... the fact the iPad which you purchased is not wholly owned by you when the expectations are that you really do.
Re:Only Apple (Score:3, Insightful)
Sigh...not this shit again (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Only Apple (Score:5, Insightful)
Extreme example shows the logical flaw: You buy a gun. You simply cannot do anything you like with it.
Okay, so now we're into the world of laws and rights, aka the real world.
You're talking about computers? Well, I can easily build a page turner for a shop-bought scanner, and set up a book scanning service. From there I can use OCR and finally distribute the resulting text files around the world.
Do you believe your rights extend that far?
You never had the freedom to do anything you liked with anything you owned. Ever. When you start to impinge upon the rights of others, your freedom ends.
Focus on the reality, not this hand-waving "I should be able to do anything!" crap. You never could, and never will.
Re:Only Apple (Score:4, Insightful)
For 99% of people the universe of what apple lets you install is easily enough. With the added benefit of every app having been screened for malware.
It's easy to find an app that does what you want, in one place, relatively cheaply, and relatively well on the iPhone platform (I'm extending that to the iPad.. I don't own one of those yet). On the Windows platform you have to fish around for a whole bunch of apps just to get to the pre-installed functionality. And that is a bit of a slog, the road paved with malware and complete crap you have to search through from a multitude of different sources. Much of which is old versions that don't work on whatever version you happen to have.
On the Apple platform, if you really want to hack, they always make it relatively easy to jailbreak. I doubt this is an accident.
Re:Only Apple (Score:1, Insightful)
No he's not. He's trying to spin some FUD that this product somehow will affect his (and our) freedom in computer choices, which it will clearly not. In fact, it offers more choice and will hopefully spur competition in an otherwise quiet niche.
No FUD, this is about locked-down hardware AND software. Closed computing.
If closed computing isn't the direction you'd like computing to go in general, then convicing others not to buy from Apple because of this, and their other flaws, is logical.
Re:Only Apple (Score:5, Insightful)
"And if I should leave my Windows machine on the bus or drop it off of a pier, I can go back and get all those same programs."
Um, with the iPad, you just buy a new iPad, plug it in and sync. You get all the apps that you had in your lost iPad, along with the data for all the apps, so everything is configured the same as well.
For me, the main difference is that the UI on the iPhone/iPad has been designed from the ground up for Touch. Apple didn't start with a menu bar and all the regular widgets, then modify them so you could use them via touch, like WinCE and Windows Tablet. I still can't believe the Windows Office team crapped on the Windows Tablet team just because they could [ie, by screwing text input for example].
As a computer geek, you may find how the iPad works objectionable, but for the 99 other people around you on the street, they would much rather have the iPad, if you put both the iPad and a Windows Tablet machine down next to each other and let them try each out [IMHO, of course].
Re:Only Apple (Score:3, Insightful)
So you're saying all that matters is the kernel, and not the userspace?
Re:Only Apple (Score:5, Insightful)
you are absolutely wrong and are trying to pull a fast one. Murdering someone is illegal whether you are using a gun or a stone or a knife or a computer.
On the other hand you can take your gun and use it to open food cans and that is an example of use that the gun was not intended for. You can smelt the gun and make a knife out of it. You can make it into a flute. You can make it into a paperweight. You can take it apart and use parts to put together some other machine. There is no legal argument against you using your hardware, except in ways that are criminal. Of-course, again, US is crazy - thus DMCA happened there.
You're talking about computers? Well, I can easily build a page turner for a shop-bought scanner, and set up a book scanning service. From there I can use OCR and finally distribute the resulting text files around the world.
- in your world you believe this is illegal or wrong, most people in the world do not care about what you think, they are doing what you are describing every single day, have you ever visited the real world?
Do you believe your rights extend that far?
- I don't believe in imaginary property that much, I don't particularly care if someone's copyrights are violated, that's an artificial construct and also it does not kill anyone, no moral problems at all.
Focus on the reality, not this hand-waving "I should be able to do anything!" crap. You never could, and never will.
- you certainly can do anything, you are brainwashed not to understand this. You can even kill people, just make sure that other people, who don't like you doing it don't catch you. However I don't consider this to be polite behavior.
On the other hand there is no argument that can be made against you using your computer for purposes that do not cross legal boundaries. Buying thing and then doing whatever you wish with them, that's your right to give up.
Re:Only Apple (Score:4, Insightful)
Ah, the legal obligation part - that old chestnut. How can you say that Webkit is "one of the uninteresting parts" when it is emerging as a very powerful contender as a rendering engine that is going far beyond where KHTML would have been without it - both camps benefit, even if Apple is "legally obliged" - they chose KHTML rather than rolling their own. They could have gone a different route, with a more liberal (for them) licence, but they did not.
They have also released a lot of their code to the community, and continue to support and encourage OSS development - even stuff they are not "legally obliged" to support.
The burn support thing is to ensure compatibility. Ones that come up with "supported: Apple Shipping" are assured to work since they have been tested, but this doesn't mean that other third party drives *don't* work - have you actually tried it? I tend not to use Disk Utility to burn CDs though, I usually use the open source "Burn.app" which works with anything you chuck at it, and offers more options.
The Airport interface is there to support the Airport cards - if you have a third party one, of course you need a driver and config utility. I'm amazed I can't configure my ATI graphics card with Nvidia's tools - oh the humanity! The beauty of the system preferences window is that you can easily make a pane for your app/device/thingy, since it is designed to be easy to develop for, with open documentation, and human-readable preference files (which you can muck about with at the command line level if you prefer). If you put in a Broadcom card though, which the Airport cards are based on, the Airport interface config works, since the cards are essentially the same. They didn't need to add any code or drivers to support third party cards because they don't ship any - they only ship Airport cards, for every model they make. If you want a third party wireless card, you can use the third party driver that comes with it.
They are "open" in a very meaningful way. Their continued support for open standards, protocols and codecs is very important in the industry as a whole - GCC, OpenGL, OpenAL, NFS, CUPS, AAC, H.264, Webkit, CSS, HTML, HTML5 to name just a few.
Wrong (Score:2, Insightful)
Its just your prejudiced. Its NOT fine when Apple does it - and those who us with just a bit of IQ would NEVER buy an Apple product!
Re:Only Apple (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Only Apple (Score:3, Insightful)
Yes he IS.
FUD is Fear, Uncertainty, and Doubt.
1) The fear is justified. This a move towards a more closed environment in which you freedom is in fact limited. You seem to want to argue that, but if I don't have root access by default, I am NOT FREE.
2) Uncertainty. I do feel uncertain right now. I honestly wonder how much longer in my lifetime I will get to enjoy hardware that I own, operating systems that I can modify, and computing sessions that are unmonitored by government agencies.
3) Doubt. I do doubt Apple's intentions here. I have always, always, always, doubted Sony's intentions starting from their infamous Root CD's in which no executives went to Federal Pound Me In The Ass Prison's.
This is 100% crystal clear a move towards 'closed' hardware that prevents you from full ownership. The iPhone was no different, The XBOX was no different, the PS1, PS2, and PS3 are no different. Basically anything with DRM in it was no different either.
Whereas before most of the devices that were limited in these ways were being marketed to children and as entertainment devices, this is more sinister. I don't need a PS3 to survive and can do so quite nicely without it. I already do.
However, I require a computing device to function. It is my trade, it is my livelihood, and most of my hobbies and passions revolve around it. I don't want to live in a world that is illegal for me to own my hardware and do with it what I wish. I am reminded of the Carterphone decision in a way, because AT&T at the time fought very hard to control your telephone even though you purchased it. Courts called it 'silly' and 'ridiculous' and slapped AT&T and the FCC very hard for trying to do so.
The iPad is not a choice. It is a limitation in pretty packaging designed to entice users into purchasing and using it, all the while, distracting them from the horrible truth. They paid for something they don't own.
This issue is not FUD, it is not Apple bashing (Sony is equally vile, if not more so, in this regard), and it does affect our freedoms. Perhaps imperceptibly so at first, but it is affecting our freedoms nonetheless.
What the original poster was saying, which needs to be said, MUST be said, and said as often as possible, is that we should all choose to send a message to these companies that we will not settle for anything less than total ownership when they are selling us a device. Any attempts to control our usage of that device should be fought, and fought as hard as any war we have fought for freedom, because, ultimately that is what it is really about.
You may not see this yet, but our world is rapidly changing to incorporate another dimension. It is real, and actions that occur in it have immediate and serious effects on the world around us now. Who will control it, our access to it, and what privacy we have in it is a very very very serious matter.
That is not Tin Foil Hattery I speak of, but practical truth. So you can say, "Well you have a choice to not by it and you don't need to bash Apple and make wild claims". Well that poster and I can also speak out about WHY you should not buy it, and not be accused of spreading FUD.
Re:Only Apple (Score:1, Insightful)
The Kindle has E-ink which is going to make for a better reading experience.
What makes you think that? There is nothing inherent in the photons reflected by e-ink that make then better on the eyes than those emitted by an LCD.
In fact, the e-ink display, like those on the Kindle are hard on the eyes due to low contrast and poor low-light visibility, while with a high-quality LED-backlit IPS display like the iPad has is superior to that of the Kindle's in every way *except* battery life, and given the iPad's 10-hour plus battery life with the screen on, that's really not much of an issue.
Re:Only Apple (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Only Apple (Score:2, Insightful)
They don;t sell OS X for whiteboxes because that's not their business model. They make their money from selling the hardware. This doesn't mean they can't keep the OS itself open (in the sense of operability).
What parts of OSS have they "taken and closed off"? I'm sure there's probably some BSD code floating about somewhere that has ended up with changes that were not released, but who knows. Their stance on OSS has been positive from OS X onwards - and yes, they have been successful in using OSS to make a profit, but they also give an awful lot back - a lot more than is merely required legally. They are well aware that a combination of open source, closed source and open standards work very well for them, and just so happens to help OSS as a whole.
They clearly don't go to a lot of trouble to prevent whitebox installs though, even after the switch to Intel. They take the same attitude to the one that came with the original iTMS - yes, there's DRM, but we strongly encourage you to burn your purchases to Audio CD every time you downloaded. Someone else posted before in another thread that it was "speedbump DRM" - minimal, minorly intrusive but trivial to remove (and it;s not even DRM on the install DVD).
Moving to unrestricted AAC for the iTMS as soon as it could and being one of the driving forces for H.264 over WMV as the future standard of web video (for the forseeable future) are all beneficial. We can save the patent-encumbered argument for another time, the battle for media on the web is first against WMV and Flash, and then we can look at other formats. It's clearly not ideal for the OSS community, but it is better than a closed format like WMV from becoming the standard. Little steps, towards the light, just like iTMS originally - DRM, now no DRM. Get the web and OSes in general using open standards first, then start refining it.
Apple will do what is in its best interests to make money, and closing off OS X is clearly not the way to do that. If it turns out that they would make more if the iPhone/iPad was open then they will do that too, but I doubt it very much at the moment.
And as far as Games For Windows, sure, it's an example of trying to bring a console model to Windows, but Windows itself it untouched. I can't see them moving to a single store model for general apps, just like I can't see it happening on OS X.
Re:Only Apple (Score:4, Insightful)
So, my question: will this stop projects like Android?
Will this kill Linux?
Will this stop open source?
Of course not - you will always have choice, and there will always be other options. All this can do is a) make money for Apple (or not) and b) encourage competition.
The rise of the iPhone spurred the rise of numerous open competitors and everyone is better off.
You can avoid Apple (and the PSX, and the Xbox 360 etc) all you want, and stick to open alternatives. The market can only get stronger with the addition of competition. That was my point here, that this is just another entry into the arena, not the death of everything else and every other business model.
Re:Only Apple (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Only Apple (Score:5, Insightful)
I don't claim to be or strive to be like "the 99 other people" around me on the street.
I'm OK with that.
I also do not want to rely upon a single source for all of the computer applications I use. Too often, I find that some little-known open source free app is exactly the tool I need to get the job done, and sometimes the only tool that will get the job done. I'm not going to take the chance on being reliant on Apple to make available everything I need to do my work.
I like more open systems, and don't mind the little bit of fiddling that is required to make it work. Like my bike, and my musical instruments, and my 1963 Norton Commando, sometimes there is meaning in the little fiddling that I have to do.
I don't need, nor do I want, every single thing to "just work". That's just the kind of hairpin I am.
But don't hate on me just because I'm not planning to fly the same shiny tech flag as you and your 98 friends "on the street".
DRM (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Only Apple (Score:2, Insightful)
There are plenty of legitimate gripes one can make about Apple (I've got my own list as an exclusively Mac person at home), and we all know the relevant ones for MS. Claiming that Apple is less open than MS is just plain stupid, and will be so until MS starts open sourcing large portions of its key OS technology (user space or kernel).
Re:Only Apple (Score:3, Insightful)
Plus the matching size Kindle DX costs $489. Not exactly much cheaper than the base iPad.
Re:Only Apple (Score:3, Insightful)
Good luck, however, reading your Kindle in the dark.
I know, right? How worthless this book reader is, not even emulating the backlighting features of paper.
(PS: Backlit screen in a dark room equals eye strain, particularly a small screen at a close distance for a significant length of time.)
Re:Exactly unlike (Score:3, Insightful)
Actually, a linux kernel has been booted on the iPhone before, I imagine it still would, the only reason you can't run rockbox is nobody's taken the time to port it, considering you need to write drivers for the screen, audio chipset, touchscreen, etc. and that would take time that people figure is better spent elsewhere. Part of jailbreaking requires running a new unsigned kernel (it has to be patched to disable signature checks on executables among other things) so you could just as easily boot /any/ kernel, not just a modified version of the darwin kernel it comes with.
Re:Only Apple (Score:3, Insightful)
It's just a super sized iPhone for a hamfisted idiot (there's a lot of them out there)
It's Easter. Let's not be sacrilegious and disparage ham here, at least for today.
Re:Sigh...not this shit again (Score:3, Insightful)
But you are wrong, when other people buy it I most certainly lose. In our society buying something is analogous to voting for it. The more people that vote for it the more pervasive it'll become in our society. If not enough people vote for it then it may make the manufacturer bring it back to the drawing board and wonder why.
Re:Only Apple (Score:4, Insightful)
I think the backlight is the problem. That's why LCDs are hard on the eyes. You're essentially staring into a lamp and if you turn down the brightness you have to strain to read.
e-ink, otoh, is great. I borrowed a kindle to read a book a coworker was pushing on me and it was awesome. Significantly better than my computer monitor, N800, or Palm Pilots I've used in the past. If the e-ink was harder on my eyes do to low contrast, I'm really curious what metric you used for that. Reading on LCD screens makes my eyes sore and I need to look away at regular intervals, close my eyes for a bit, etc. I didn't experience this with the kindle.
Re:Wrong (Score:1, Insightful)
Its just your prejudiced. Its NOT fine when Apple does it - and those who us with just a bit of IQ would NEVER buy an Apple product!
First off, starting a comment with "Wrong" makes you sound like a total asshole.
Secondly, those of us a bit of IQ know that it is spelled "you're" as in... "you are", so I guess you aren't in our club anymore.... Boo hoo
wrong (Score:4, Insightful)
Uh-huh. Try reading a book on the iPad -- at the beach.
Don't get me wrong, I think the iPad will be great. But it's not an e-reader. The problem with e-ink is that it's not a mature technology. Apple is playing it smart here - stay out of the e-ink business until you can have color, or at least monochrome at a speed that is acceptable, and without that annoying "screen flash" as pixels rearrange when you turn pages. Once you can do that I think Apple will jump in and we'll see iPads with eink options (or perhaps some other kind of e-ink display appliance, maybe even a usable web browser). Why should Apple release an e-ink device that is just as annoyingly slow as all the others out there, when they can wait until all the tech is in place and jump in at the last minute with a device that gets it right, and then take credit for having practically invented the e-reader, the way they did with the mp3 player and the smartphone?
Re:Only Apple (Score:3, Insightful)
Taiwan.
Now how do I install applications from a third party web site on an Ipad.
How can I get OS X to run on my AMD 64 processor.
Re:Only Apple (Score:1, Insightful)
Re:Only Apple (Score:3, Insightful)
Your argument is flawed
- wrong. My argument is not about rented hardware, it is about bought hardware, get your facts straight.
If I buy a piece of hardware I must be able to do with it anything I want. Someone took it to mean that if I own a gun then by my logic I can kill without repercussions, which is of-course not doing whatever I want just with hardware but also with someone's life, so they are trying to be cute for the sake of an argument.
If I buy a TV tuner / cable receiver, it's mine. I should be able to do with it anything I want. Of-course they do not see it that way and will try to stop me from doing it, but in this case they are in the wrong, not me.
Re:You can read non DRM books on the ipad (Score:3, Insightful)
Hello? Earth to AC: The 3G version of the iPad IS NOT OUT YET. Therefore he is using "free" Wifi.
Re:Only Apple (Score:3, Insightful)
"Paying" 30% for the services the App Store provides is cheap compared to running your own store. You see, getting 70% of sales in the thousands is better than getting 100% of no sales at all. Heck it beats the margin of practically any traditional sales channel for software.
Also, if it is bad, why are Microsoft carbon-copying the idea for their Windows Mobile 7?
Anyway, all the points you raise are well known and developers STILL prefer the platform and App Store over the platforms with more freedoms, and they do exist (apparently). However, it seems there is an unhealthy amount of jealousy in the camps associated with said platforms since they seem more busy trying to make Apple change their policies than to, you know, actually promote the competing platforms.
Re:Only Apple (Score:3, Insightful)
Who needs Farmville when you have We Rule? :)
Zynga can choose to make a FarmVille client for the iPad like they made a version of Mafia Wars for the iPhone.
Re:Only Apple (Score:3, Insightful)
N.B. The iPad is fully legible in full sunlight.
Good luck, however, reading your Kindle in the dark.
Is the screen is better than a normal LCD? Otherwise, I suspect that your interpretation of "fully legible" differs somewhat from mine...
Re:iPad is not a PC (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Have you used a PC tablet? They suck! (Score:3, Insightful)
Or did you want one where you could upload any unlicensed copy you found on some "abandonware" site out there instead of the licensed games?
I want one where I can use C64 freeware or even self-developed C64 apps. I want one that doesn't freeze on purpose when it hits BASIC's REPL.
Re:Sigh...not this shit again (Score:2, Insightful)
You do not lose anything if someone else buys it.
Yes I do. When too much people buys a lot of crippled devices, the offer of non-crippled ones go down, and it may happen that I could not have the choice of buying a device that respect me. Anyway, showing people what the device really is, is not a bad thing. Education FTW.
Re:Sigh...not this shit again (Score:3, Insightful)
You do not lose anything if someone else buys it.
If this were true, we would have nothing to worry about, but in our so-called free market, the consumers vote with their dollar. Everyone who buys the iPad votes for locked down hardware, drm, and furthermore state that it's ok to sell a product with such rediculous restrictions that if we install OUR software on OUR hardware, the warentee is void. We will end up with no alternatives to this if everyone else but you and I says, "Yes! This is ok! I'll take 3."
Then we'll be fucked.
Re:Only Apple (Score:1, Insightful)
You never could, and never will.
We can, and you can't stop us. Fuck you.
Re:Only Apple (Score:1, Insightful)
N.B. The iPad is fully legible in full sunlight
Umm, no it is not. The iPad is 100% useless in sunlight. The screen looks completely black and you can not see a single thing. I have tried using my iPad in the sunlight. It does not even come close to working.
Re:Have you used a PC tablet? They suck! (Score:3, Insightful)