Steve Jobs Hates Buttons 713
ElvaWSJ writes "While many technology companies load their products up with buttons, Steve Jobs treats them as blemishes that add complexity and hinder their clean aesthetics.
The iPhone is Steve Jobs's attempt to crack a juicy new market for Apple Inc. But it's also part of a decades-long campaign by Mr. Jobs against a much broader target: buttons.
The new Apple cellphone famously does without the keypads that adorn its rivals. Instead, it offers a touch-sensing screen for making phone calls and tapping out emails. The resulting look is one of the sparest ever for Apple, a company known for minimalist gadgets. "
Obviously... (Score:5, Funny)
How is the buttonless iphone to use (Score:3, Interesting)
I've got a little T-Mobile Dash/ HTC Excalibur and i can actually type really quickly on its tiny keyboard. I find it hard to believe that without feedback it could be better.
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What would really help is if all of iPhone's apps used the widescreen keyboard when you turn the unit sideways. For now it only does this in Safari (and it has to be in landscape mode before you brin
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Seemed fast for me--here's why (Score:5, Interesting)
- No pressing required - Because I didn't need to press the buttons down--just touch them--it felt easier and faster to type. It's more of a smooth easy motion from button to button.
- Predictive targetting - In the middle of common words, I was able to trigger the correct next letter even if I didn't nail the button image exactly. I even experimented with it a bit, going successively faster and sloppier (aw yeah), and it was surprising how imprecise I could be and still get the word right or mostly right.
- Easy correction - With the touch screen and "magnifying glass" cursor control, it was easy to go back and correct mistakes after typing. So I found that it was best to just plow through typing the entire thing, and then go back and make corrections if needed.
It's definitely a different style. For me, typing on phones usually works best if I get it exactly right as I type. The iPhone is more like touch-typing on a regular keyboard--just blast through and correct after the fact if needed.
And like touch-typing, there is definitely a muscle-memory aspect to the iPhone. The keys don't have a feel to them, but they are always in the same place. I was faster after about 15 minutes because my fingers were "calibrated" to where the keys are. Those with good hand-eye coordination (gamers for instance) will have an easier time with this IMO.
Re:Seemed fast for me--here's why (Score:5, Informative)
Re:How is the buttonless iphone to use (Score:5, Informative)
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Generally speaking, guessing what you want is what software does.
Defaults, preferences, templates and even localized software exist so that the system and/or an application can make a 'best guess' as to what you want whenever you perform an action or sequence. Do you really think you 'open' a word processor, 'create' a new document or 'save' a file? Thes
Problem is.... (Score:5, Informative)
I design high end interfaces for home theaters (where the remote it's self costs around $2500.00US or more.) and the number one thing my customers like is not the fancy graphics, cool animations or nicely laid out controls on the touchscreen.. but the VOLUME CONTROL HARD BUTTONS built into the side edge. They like being able to without looking press volume up or down or mute instead of having to look at the screen and press a non tactile feedback graphical button.
Buttons have their use, you cant get rid of them.
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2500$ for a remote? (Score:3, Funny)
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Re:Problem is.... (Score:5, Insightful)
The TiVo remote control is just that. A device that remotely controls another device. You're paying attention to your TV. You shouldn't need to take your eyes off it to change the volume.
The iPhone isn't a remote control. It's the device you're using, so there's the presumption that you'll be looking at it with some sort of regularity while you use it.
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-Peter
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Buttons are intuitive.
No interface control is intuitive by itself.
The problem with buttons is that once you have more than a very low number of them, it becomes more and more difficult to find the right one, and the real estate wasted on the interface gets larger and larger.
I bet you that right now you have at least 10 keys on the keyboard in front of you that you press less than once a day on average. I know I do. Your phone probably has at least one button on it that you've not used at all for the past month, if not the past
Re:Problem is.... (Score:5, Funny)
The nipple. All other interfaces are learned.
You'd think so... (Score:5, Informative)
Pretty much every interface is a learned interface, but the simpler the interface, the easier it is to learn.
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You can actually get a job as a certifie [iblce.org]
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As you are clearly speaking from zero experience, and just as clearly, have never breastfed anything, I'm going to treat your Wikipedia knowledge with the contempt it deserves, doubly so, because you didn't even bother t
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Even if you have the experience you claim, which I find highly unlikely, the only other possibility is that you're one of those La Leche style breastfeeding nazi's who refuse to accept that there could ever be a pr
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Re:Problem is.... (Score:5, Informative)
I just checked with my friend who has an iPhone, and it -does- have hard buttons for volume on the side. So as much as he hates them, he didn't go crazy.
Re:Problem is.... (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Problem is.... (Score:5, Funny)
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Well, maybe those old guys got it right the 1st time....Telecasters, LP's and tube amps...well, they just sound GOOD. Not many effects are needed if you get the basic tools right.
Besides....amps that glow are cool!!!
Re:Problem is.... (Score:5, Insightful)
Buttons that have one label are used in conjunction with different modes to change properties not reflected in the labeling of the button...Basically, you have to memorize the manual because the interface is the opposite of intuitive.
It's that way with nearly all consumer electronics. There will be ten buttons but there will be a need for 30 buttons, to follow that button-centric design philosophy, but you can't put 30 buttons on it so the 10 buttons have to have 30 buttons worth of functionality, which means some buttons toggle the functionality of other buttons.
So, in a nutshell, though I am not completely fond of Apple's obsession with minimalist controls, they do an infinitely better job on their crappiest product than any piece of home A/V equipment I've ever seen. One look at a universal remote will tell you that.
Re:Problem is.... (Score:4, Informative)
A $2500 remote, and you make do with +/- buttons to adjust the volume? Augh! +/- buttons are a miserable way to adjust such an analogue function. Adjustment is either too slow (going up/down 1 dB per keypress) or too fast (when you hold the button down and the acceleration function kicks in).
A linear slider or a rotary knob is much better: it allows both fine control, and huge, fast adjustments (without too much overshoot) when needed.
As far as I know, there are only two remotes that get this right: the Philips SRU 9600 [philips.com], and Quad once had a remote like this.
I'm using a Griffin Powermate [griffintechnology.com] to control the volume when watching TV on my computer. It's brilliant.
Re:Problem is.... (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Problem is button abuse, not buttons (Score:5, Insightful)
The problem with buttons is they take up space - physical space and cognitive space. Watch a 65 year old try and use a modern A/V system remote, and they're totally lost. It's like looking at the cockpit of a 707.
It's a problem, because while 90% of the people only use 10% of the features, you have to be able to access the other 90% of the features. How many times do you change the surround sound mode of your home stereo? I did it once per input, then never did it again. So why do those buttons still take up space on my remote?
The harmony remote is one attempt at reducing the complexity - you trade complexity up front (you need to program the remote with your devices) for simplicity later. The above mentioned 65 year old had no problem watching TV with the harmony remote - on a system an order of magnitude more complicated than his.
The higher-end models have almost no buttons; they have screens that overload. In fact, you really only need four or five for a TV remote: volume up, volume down, channel up, channel down, power, change input. Sure, the number keys are nice, but they aren't necessary.
However, a more sophisticated remote costs more money. Simplicity always costs more up front, but pays off every day because there's less aggravation. Buttons are cheap. Removing buttons is expensive.
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With out buttons you can have context sensitive control. On a soft screen there would be a huge MUTE button every time the unit is left idle. And a simple slide your finger down the control would reduce v
Re:Problem is.... (Score:5, Informative)
The iPhone, just like the Mac, has plenty of buttons.
There are just not many hardware buttons. Really. Bear with me...
Compare the number of buttons in MS-DOS (or other CLI) interfaces against those on the Mac. The "menus" of a CLI interfacer are like menus at Chinese restaurant. Except, of course, with a CLI you can't point and say "I want this."
But wait! There's more! A standard Microsoft alert dialog box -- Windows and Mac OS -- typically has a longwinded description of the problem and the same two buttons to respond with: No and Yes. I have an example right here from MS Word for Mac OS X:
The line "Continue with Save" in itself is rather vague; the user must plow through a lengthly bit of prose (for a GUI) to ascertain just what is going to happen. I'm convinced that Microsoft if using FUD to bully the user to always save their documents in Word format. Changing from any other format to Word format never generates a scary warning.
Contrast Microsoft buttons to Mac buttons using TextEdit. Changing an RTF document to text the dialog reads:
The differences are striking:
The meaning of Yes and No are only clear within context. In many, if not most, Microsoft applications, if you choose No, it may not stop, it may go on and do something different. I find most everybody tends to stop and read that lengthly prose to make sure what is going to happen if it's something they haven't done in a while; there's just too much information to gather in at a glance.
"Convert this document to plain text?" Ah, it's going to... well, the answer is in the question.
Buttons? It's not how many that's important, it's how soft and clear they are.
Re:Problem is.... (Score:4, Funny)
Sure, if they were my customers spending $2500 on a remote, I would value their opinions most highly.
Would you like an extra button on that button sir?
Blemishes (Score:5, Funny)
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Cant find MB2 and MB3 #$^%&* (Score:2)
Alternate Keypad (Score:5, Funny)
On an iPhone, you have to press an additional button that opens up an alternate keypad that will allow you to type numbers and punctuation. So typing something as simple as elipses (...) requires you to tap your finger 9 times. Enjoy your phone, losers! People like me who have shit to do will stick to a keyboard that doesn't have its lips wrapped firmly to the user-interface equivalent of a throbbing dong
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Establishmennt (Score:3)
Where has it been established that iPhone owners are more likely to be using other Apple products? I've seen plenty of posts from Apple OS X users stating they have no desire for an iPhone. Right now I would not hazard a guess as to what operating systems iPhone users generally have, except that it's most likley more windows users than mac just based on percentages and wide mainstream appeal of the device.
Maddox's Take on the iPhone and... BUTTONS (Score:4, Funny)
http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net/c.cgi?u=i
Fastest dupe ever (Score:5, Funny)
CmdrTaco managed to break the record of fastest dupe by duping first sentence in the same headline.
But Maddoz says... (Score:2, Redundant)
Read the part about buttons...actually just read the whole thing.
Juvenile Spam Garbage (Score:3, Interesting)
Is there some slashdot rule I am just finding out about how everyone here is twelve and likes to say "cock" a lot? Are we going to be assailed with right-wing propaganda and poo-poo jokes a la South Park on a da
fat fingers work with buttons (Score:2, Redundant)
Right click can be useful too. Maybe even center and scroll. Call me nutty, but form follows function.
Maddox agrees:
http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net/c.cgi?u=i
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That said, I loved the way everything except typing works on the iPhone. Everything is faster and easier than it is on my BlackBerry. Right up until the point where I want to use the keyboard.
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Buttons as Features (Score:5, Informative)
I see his point, but OTOH, there are times when buttons ARE preferable. I can text a message on my cellphone without looking at the phone because there is a tactile reference to where each key is located. This is quite handy (pun intended!) Try texting a message inconspicuously at your next boring meeting.
Re:Buttons as Features (Score:5, Funny)
So you're the guy who sent me the message "AKI( Ekdlu WO.T 67Grtgixool;"?
Of Course He Does (Score:5, Funny)
It's no coincidence that he always wears a mock turtleneck sweater with no buttons to kill him on the front and a pair of zippered jeans.
You think Ballmer's a nut, you should see Jobs talk to his employees: "For every button I find on this interface, I shall kill you
chicken or egg? (Score:5, Funny)
How do you turn off the monitor?
It's easy, you just use the touch screen button there.
Oh, then how do you turn it back on?
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Re:chicken or egg? (Score:5, Funny)
buttons arent bad. (Score:2, Insightful)
Granted, i dislike the typical A-B button and other shortcuts electronics manufacturers go through, but buttons can be done right. Its a shame no one is really trying. Softkeys can be a lot worse than buttons. Buttons should
Such a good idea, Apple already did it. (Score:3, Interesting)
Apple agrees with you. This is why they included two very real volume control switches on the side of the iPhone (small enough so they are not easy to accidentally change). And also why the headphones include a small clicker device that you can use to pause, play, or skip tracks.
Aesthetics arent everything. For instance, i much
Tactile Feedback (Score:5, Interesting)
In the EU there is already legislation to make software, websites and devices accessible. The buttonless iPhone must score pretty low on the accessibility scale.
Re:Tactile Feedback (Score:5, Interesting)
Why should the other 99% of the population abstain from it?
I'm all for developing devices that make life easier for disabled people.
I'm very strongly against making life more difficult or limited for the rest of us in order to cater to them.
Harrison Bergeron (Score:3, Funny)
Seems like making carriers offer a phone actually targeted to the visually-impaired (maybe with text-to-speech webbrowsing and braille input) would be preferable to trying to force vendors of phones with explicitly visually-oriented features to move to accommodate a user base that would be poorly served by its useful feature/price ratio.
It should be the carriers and not every single kind of phone that should supp
Pushing conventions has its rewards (Score:3, Insightful)
iMac -- made the "minimalist" move of omitting the floppy. I remember thinking at the time back in the late 90's this would create a data island, and being quite uncomfortable with the decision -- today, most would feel this was a smart move, and the ubiquitous USB drive has replaced the clunky floppy. Overall, a success.
Mouse -- keeps on pushing the minimalist single button. I detest this, and know many people (linux, mac, and pc users) that feel the same. Another button simply adds to the functionality -- I right click several hundred times per day, and don't want combo presses or holding down to approximate this. Overall, I view this as a bad move.
iPhone -- we'll see the verdict regarding this. I, for one, would appreciate a "hang up" button as I tend to push this a million times when I want to hang up... it is nice to have a solid feeling as you wait for the UI to respond. With a softkey, did you really hit it? Did the UI register it? You don't know without watching the screen. I view this as a bit extreme, but we will see if people complain. Buttons have their place when well-implemented.
Can you imagine getting on a "soft-key" elevator? I think it would be cool at first, then really annoying.
I'm happy that Apple pushes technology like this, but only in ways that force adoption of a better technology.
Ah well, we can all "vote with our wallet..."
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The new apple mighty mouse (which comes with macs) does in fact come with two buttons, and the right one can be enabled my going into the system preferences and tellin
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I'm not normally one to kvetch if some device isn't perfectly tailored to the disabled - and the iPhone is a perfect example. No, a blind person can't effectively use it, but that same blind person can acquire another device that mimics the essential functionality.
With an elevator, though, if you get rid of braille and tactile buttons, you've essentially prevented a blind person from reaching the upper floors of the building. There isn't a feasible alternative to the elevator to g
Jobs is an Switchofascist (Score:2, Funny)
His unbridled hatred of buttons goes back to his childhood experience with a vending machine which consistently failed to deliver Andy Capp's Hot Fries, instead dropping the unwanted carrot sticks.
That's right! (Score:2)
Steve Jobs goes too far (Score:2)
I used to share Mr. Jobs' disdain for buttons. Then I went out and bought an iPod Nano. I found that the touch-wheel on the Nano was unbearably sensitive, given my somewhat larger than average thumbs. There's no real way to tune the sensitivity of the touch-wheel, either, like you can with
Does he hate blind people too? (Score:2, Interesting)
Great idea for products that already exist (Score:2, Interesting)
Cell phones have been around a long time. People
Doesn't hate buttons. Hates Genericy (Score:5, Interesting)
The iPhone does in fact have five physical buttons - a sleep/wake button, a home button, a volume up/down button, and a silencer (OK, technically that's a switch).
But then you are discounting the noise less real, even if lacking physical feedback, buttons that appear on the screen in each application, tailored to each task. If these are not real buttons, than neither are membrane style buttons as on the Timex-Sinclair ZX-81 of old.
That tailoring is what Apple really likes, being able to arrange input aspects just so for each task. Perhaps the best example of this is the keyboard for the web browser on the iPhone; why have a space bar when entering URL's? This is replaced by "/" and ".com" keys which makes a tremendous amount of sense.
Apple loves task focused UI, and a mostly virtual button approach allows them to get closer to that than would be otherwise possible on a smaller consumer device built to perform a number of very different tasks.
I'm just waiting. . . (Score:3, Interesting)
Yes, yes, I am all for personal responsibility, but I am also for sound design in products. Asthetics should take a back seat to functionality when it comes to appliances and gadgets. If he thinks buttons cannot be made attractive, may I point Jobs at practically every new(ish) phone on the market, particularly the Motorola Razr and the Samsung Sync.
Fewer presses (Score:3, Interesting)
Shortage of buttons makes iPod difficult to use (Score:3, Insightful)
A perfect example is cited in the article: an elevator that has no buttons and stops on every floor. It's far less fucntional than an elevator with buttons. I don't like waiting unnecessarily. And if I were going from the top floor to the bottom floor, with no one else on the elevator, I would be fuming by the time I arrived.
Another example is the iPod itself. The lack of an explicit power button, also mentioned in the article, isn't a big deal. But having no separate volume control really harms the usability of the device. While I'm listening to music, I don't want to have to look at the screen. But because volume and seeking within the track are loaded up on the same physical control, I have to watch the screen as I toggle between the two functions. It feels like a huge step back from my Rio Karma, where I could easily adjust the volume with a pair of buttons and use the thumb wheel to seek in the track. If I'm reading, walking, or watching the scenery while listening to music, it's a big inconvenience to have to move my eyes to the screen.
The amount of time you spend navigating those menus is just sick. Want to enable shuffle? Navigate up to the root, down to options, back up to the root, and back down to your songs.
Want to select a song and start playing it in a fresh on-the-go playlist and, while it's playing, add more songs to the queue? Navigate down to select the song, up to the root, down to play from the playlist, back up to the root, back down to select your next song. Fantastic!
Now, of course, they could have made a more usable interface even with limited number of "buttons" they have. But it's easy to see that a couple more buttons would have helped immensely.
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And you don't. The default function of the click wheel is to change the volume. No looking necessary. Also, the click wheel offers much better control over the volume setting than +/- buttons would. With the click wheel, I can pretty much instantly set the correct volume for a song, unlike +/- buttons (see my other post [slashdot.org] in this discussion)
Want to select a s
When did Jobs morph into Steve Martin? (Score:4, Funny)
touch screens...complex buttons (Score:3, Insightful)
a touch screen is just a very complex button
so jobs is doing away wiht buttons by making them more complex?
Less is more, form follows function (Score:3, Insightful)
With the iPhone, he's forcing developers to think of new ways to use a tactile screen. He's sprinkled the creative field with some suggestions. Touch to click, drag to scroll, flick to page. I'm sure there will be others. One poster wanted to know how you could turn volume up or down without a knob. Why not just draw a clockwise or counter-clockwise circle on the screen? Software can determine that motion from key presses. It's innovation waiting to happen.
This sort of innovation through change and design is a good thing. It doesn't always work, but when it does, it's spectacular. Jobs is great because he keeps hitting this ball despite his failures. In time, we'll regard the iPhone as a success or failure, as a Mac or a Lisa, as an iPod or a Newton. But until then, try to remember that Jobs brings both to the table with regularity.
It's not a quirk (Score:3, Insightful)
Where do you put the friggin' keys? Lot easier to put them on the touch screen when you need them. It solves all the problems, as long as the typing goes well. My friends tell me they can type about 15 words a minute, after using it for a couple of weeks. Good enough?
Yes, Jobs is a design freak. But he doesn't make monstrosities like the old Citroen 2CV -- cool but weird design -- but in Apple devices, form follows function. Don't know, for myself, if it works, except I was typing better than on my stupid Moto RAZR in five minutes in the Apple Store. For that little adaptation, you get movies, full-screen web, etc., and no keyboard that takes up valuable handheld real estate. Good enough for me. How many sentences do you write on a phone? Aren't mobile message something like. "Got yr message. Go ahead. Meet U at 4:00." It would be rotten trying to write a screenplay on, but uh--
Now look at all the smartphones with keys. Type an e-mail, the keys are handy. (Though they don't go to horizontal when you turn a Blackberry, do they?) Surf the web, watch a movie, they shrink the available screen. Fold them up inside the phone and you've got thickness and heat problems. Go ahead, call him weird and a cultist. I think hating buttons is a good move.
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Not to say I don't like My Nokia E62 - it's great to be able to ssh myself out of a problem - and I am even considering a E61i when my phone operator is ready to give me one for free.
While very interesting, I will wait for an Apple-supported iPhone development toolchain before seriously consid
Re:Buttons!? (Score:4, Funny)
Ummm... that last point. Is there a phone... ah, never mind.
Re:Buttons!? (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Buttons!? (Score:5, Funny)
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You're in luck. There's a sleep/wake button, a home button, volume up/down buttons, and (in the headset) an answer/hangup switch.
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Re:Buttons!? (Score:5, Funny)
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Re:Buttons!? (Score:5, Informative)
As for your texting with the phone in your pocket.....I'm not one to question the habits of others but that is a new one on me.
Re:Buttons!? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Buttons!? (Score:5, Insightful)
Yes.
Most people can drive safely under normal conditions on the phone. Most people can drive safely under normal conditions with a BAC up to 0.15 or even 0.20. Most people can drive safely at 20-30mph over the posted speed limit.
Driving laws exist for the "not most" situations, however. Some people can't safely drive a monotonously straight road on a clear day while sober and well-slept. Roads occasionally get icy (in the North). Kids (or deer) sometimes jump out in front of your car with no warning (hey, I'd call that "Evolution", but the pesky legal system tends to call it "involuntary manslaughter"). People age and their eyes and reflexes get worse.
Put bluntly, we cripple the majority rather than take away the licenses of the 10% or so who should never get behind the wheel in the first place.
Re:Buttons!? (Score:5, Informative)
scientific studies have proven that talking on a phone while driving is dangerous even when completely hands free. even more so than a real life conversation because the lower quality signal requires more concentration to process.
these are scientifically proven facts. I notice that you, on the other hand, only seem to offer the fact that you haven't killed anyone yet as evidence of your super-human brain functions.
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Re:Buttons!? --handsfree cell phone use (Score:3, Interesting)
So while it is obvious that having a handsfree device is better than occupying your hand with the cellphone (don't get me started about people who smoke while driving), unless you completly separate the driver from the passengers you
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Yea, We Need More Thinking Like This... (Score:3, Funny)
I always also drive with the radio off because I find that distracting. I think others should also be compelled by law to drive without music.
And kids.
Re:Yea, We Need More Thinking Like This... (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Yea, We Need More Thinking Like This... (Score:4, Interesting)
Back when I was a teen, you HAD to learn to drive with a multitude of distractions. We used to joke that the driving test for gals would be driving while putting the makeup on...but, for guys, you had to pass the driving test consisting of driving down the street with a beer can in your lap, a cigarette in one hand while you shifted gears and fiddled with the stereo with the other one.
It got even more complex if your girlfriend was in the front seat with ya...as that you were also trying to keep an hand on her too...
Bah...if you learned to drive like the old days....adding a cellphone to the mix is nothing!!
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That, or ban GPS, music, and passengers.
It's unreasonable to single out cell phones - they're no more distracting than those other things.
Of course, I also question the funding on that study - it wasn't obviously documented in your link.
Re:Buttons!? (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Mrs. Jobs is a lucky woman (Score:4, Funny)
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