Stories are starting to pop up all over the web about the AppleTV, which evidently means that Apple has set loose the hounds of marketing and the units are (or will be tomorrow) available in Apple stores. Still no word on whether or not it plays DivX files. That will be the key to me purchasing one.
Apple already builds an Apple TV for standard def TV users - it's called the iPod video. Buy one - they're the same price as this rig, albeit with less storage at the same price point, but you get portability. -- The Apple TV - It's the true video iPod everyone tittered about all through 2005.
Instead of a cable or dock, it uses 802.11g/n.
Instead of headphones, you attach your TV/Home Theatre.
Apple limited the device to widescreen because they understand the market for the device a whole lot better than you do. People with big glass 4:3 TVs are getting rid of them. People who already have 16:9 or high-def sets will have the scratch to pop for one of these devices. They're the "wavefront" consumers who embraced the iPod first, and Apple hopes they'll embrace this iPod for the living room.
The question is. When will we get (non Disney) content?
I'd imagine MPAA member execs will be a little cautious about entering a partnership with Apple after seeing Jobs' enthusiasm about music DRM turn into an about-face when confronted with interoperability regulation in the EU,
This whole article is an embarrassment to SlashDot. The OP starts off by "wondering" if Apple TV will support DivX when the information on supported formats has been posted on the Apple TV web site for months.
Most of the responders seem to know nothing about the product. Asking embarrassingly stupid questions like "does it have a keyboard?", "When are they going to have non-Disney movies?" and telling us that you can only play DRM'ed video on it???
There is hardly a question posed here that would not be answered by a ten second trip to the Apple TV website and anyone following the product even the slightest bit would know the answer to them. Most of the "opinions" on the product here are ill-informed nonsense at best. On top of that, there is a lot of bitter, mean-spirited, childish banter that one would expect on kids sites like Digg or Gizmodo, not SlashDot. I am truly embarrassed to see this kind of junk here.
For those who want to know:
- doesn't support DivX
- a keyboard would make it a computer, not a set-top streamer
- non-Disney movies already available (have been for a while)
- *does* play non DRM'ed music and video (just like iPod)
I am not going to bother trying to refute every point made here or talk up the device, but for a cool techie site populated by intelligent IT people who are supposed to be in the know on stuff like this... this article and most of the related comments are a joke.
You can rip any DVDs you happen to own/rent to H.264. You can download pirated HD shows in H.264 (probably a lot more when this becomes more popular). And, probably not too long from now, you'll be able to buy HD shows and movies from the iTunes store.
Compare the cost of your cable bill + netflix account + tivo service to that of just buying episodes of the shows and movies you watch. Maybe it doesn't work out well for you, but there are some people who would do very well with something like this.
That's actually a pretty interesting point. I'll give it a try.
Netflix $15/Mo * 12 Mo = 180/Yr Cable $40/Mo * 12 = 480/Yr (I get some crazy package deal with cable and internet so I'm not sure if suddenly my internet bill will go up, worth considering.) No Tivo:( Total = 660/Year
Shows I watch regularly: Lost, Heroes, random junk
iTunes store: Lost = 34.99/Season Heroes = 42.99/Season Total = 78/Year Leaving me with $582 to buy my iTV and random junk...
The OP has an interesting point. On the other hand it'd make it mighty hard for me to watch sports, CNN and other live programming only found on cable.
I don't know how rip a dvd into h.264/quicktime container and retain 5.1 audio. I wont buy any of product like this now, but as soon as I can solve this audio problem I will.
If you transcode the audio to AAC, you can mux it with H.264 video into an MPEG-4/QuickTime container. If you do that, though, you won't be able to pass it through to your receiver over S/PDIF.
I only transcode audio for mono & stereo sources. For multichannel audio, I leave it in AC3 and mux it with H.264 video into a Matroska container.
Creating an.mp4 file with H.264 & AAC looks something like this:
Both assume that the input is NTSC video that can be inverse-telecined to produce film-rate progressive-scan video. ${1} is the source file, ${2} is the destination file (without extension), and ${3} is a "crop=w:h:x:y" parameter to get rid of any black bars around the video. On a Gentoo box, you'll want to emerge mplayer gpac mkvtoolnix to get the necessary software.
I think the reason why it doesn't support Divx is obvious. Apple wants to try and kill Divx as a de facto standard, if they possibly can. They would much rather have people using H.264 inside.mp4 container files, than Divx video inside.avi or.divx containers.
It's my understanding though that at least in recent versions, Divx is essentially ISO-compliant MPEG-4 Part 2 ASP video, albeit in a nonstandard container. So it seems like it ought to be possible to 'recontainerize' a Divx.divx or.avi into an.mp4 file without decompressing and recompressing it, thus avoiding loss. I'm not aware of any software tools that do this, though, and I might be misunderstanding ways in which Divx diverges from the standards.
Although I would really like to see Apple and.mp4 win this one, I'm not sure that they're going to; the installed base of divx-playing equipment may just be too big, and they may be forced to release an update to add support for it later.
I find it odd that so many Slashdotters seem in love with.divx or Divx-containing.avis, which are just as much of a closed, single-vendor, proprietary format as MS Word's.doc is, and everyone loves to just shit all over that. The.mp4 container format is the video equivalent of ODF, and although I'm not going to buy one, I hope that the Apple TV is popular enough to get the script kiddies and release groups that push TV shows and movies out on bittorrent using it (because, lets face it, the main driver of Divx is "unauthorized" content, to put it politely).
mp4 [wikipedia.org] is not a proprietary Apple format, but an ISO standard that anyone can support. VLC Media player [videolan.org] supports it. Also, ffmpeg [mplayerhq.hu] has h264. When it comes to which has better hardware support, mp4 wins. When it comes to software support, mp4 wins. MPEG4 is an open standard. There are patents involved, but no royalties. Matroska was created to avoid patents, whereas mp4 has many patents in it. Matroska surely violates someones patents, but we just don't know whose yet. MPEG 4 has all the patent issues sorted out.
I actually just finished transcoding all of my video to mp4 as i prefer its subtitle support over the cheesy avi hacks. DivX was created during the non standard days of MPEG4, as the spec was not finalized. That spec is now finalised, and the standard codec is h264 in an mp4 container. These videos play in Windows, Linux or any other OS which has an h264 codec. They can be imported into iTunes as best as i know. My iTunes question of the day is actually which subtitle formats they use, as I don't know the answer to that.
Then you pull up a seat, put up your feet, and pick up the included Apple Remote to play your movie on TV. Give yourself a hand: You've just changed the way you watch digital media.
I'm a bit disappointed that it doesn't have some basic tivo functionality. You can't control a cable or satellite box, you can't tune in over-the-air broadcasts, analog or digital. All you can watch is iTunes content, most of which you have to *pay* for.
I would have snapped up an "HD iTivo" in a second but that's not what it is.
Then explain Windows Media Center. I'm able to not only record and pause live TV, I have a well designed guide for finding programs and setting them to record whenever that show comes on, all for free (well, the cost of the MCPC anyway). I can even use my XBOX 360 as a MCPC extender and keep my MCPC in anotehr room altogether.
Probably because Tivo has a patent on DVR technology. See Tivo v. Echostar.
Truely you jest.
Windows Media Center ReplayTV MythTV MediaPortal (open-source backport of XBMC with added TV functionality) DirectTV PVR (in house, current generation) MS TV (closed box PVR for cable in use by major cable companies) MS IPTV (NYR but shown at CES - closed box PVR for IPTV - xbox 360 and standalone) UltimateTV (defunct)
I'm sure the list goes on. They all support recording, trick play, guide etc. and none of them infringe on any patent Tivo has. I'm sure Tivo's got a patent on a lot of aspects of their implementation, but nothing so all-encompasing that it would prevent Apple from including this functionality.
The reality is that it is HARD to provide a global (or even across the US) solution for TV which includes guide listings for everywhere, works with cable, satellite, etc. and is as reliable as a cable box. Apple is not interested in this (yet at least) and this is never what AppleTV was purported to be. It's more like a media center extender, except that it doesn't require a media center PC, or a windows media connect device with a better UI and no windows requirement.
That's a gross simplification of course, and I know they've made choices around local caching and PC-independent operation that differ from MCX and WMC - and choices around PC/Mac interop that differ from Tivo and all the closed box PVRs.
It's not supposed to be a DVR or a Tivo. It's supposed to eliminate the need for them. I'm buying one to get rid of my cable bill. At $85/month (factor in digital cable, HD service, DVR box rental, DVR service, etc), my cable bill comes to $1020 on the year. Take out $300 for the AppleTV and $100 for an OTA HDTV antenna, and I've got $620 to spare on buying shows. I don't watch nearly enough shows for that, so the AppleTV pays for itself in the first year. Starting in year two, I have no hardware cost
I was set to buy one, but it is fro wode screen only. II can watch widescreen movies on my standard TV, why couldn't the include s-Video and two analog plugs for sound? or wuold ahve making 9" to a side just been too big?
Apple is known to not cling to old technology. They would rather ride/drive the HDTV wave than cling on to S-Video or composite past. See dropping the floppy on iMac, dropping ADB & SCSI in favor of USB and FireWire.
I have a feeling there will be more coming that takes advantage of the HDTV than exists in this 1.0 product.
by Anonymous Coward
on Wednesday March 21 2007, @06:58PM (#18436845)
My laptop is nearly as big as my tv and has a much nicer screen, and my DVD player handles.avis and jpgs pretty well, and will be good if I ever get a better TV. But lots of people have nice TVs and not so convienent computers, this will be good for them.
For thoseof us who use our computers near-constantly there doesn't seem to be a point of making it easier to go from computer to TV, I don't think this box is for us. Now, if iTunes gets more movies and/or better pricing on movies and TV shows, then that may help.
The XBOX 360 makes a great Apple TV replacement for people who use PCs intead of Macs. It costs a little more, but it will play DVDs and cool games in addition to streaming your music, photos, downloaded shows, and TV (including live TV). Works properly with HDTV and all the DRM crap as well for those with digital cable. And it even comes in white!
If you are trying to save cash, you can also use your classic XBOX or third-party dedicated device. We call them "Media Center Extenders" here at the 'Soft.
No, seriously, I can't wait 'til someone makes a Linux hack for it.
One feature they really ought to add, and it could be done all in software, would be the ability to stream video off network shares or NAS devices rather than relying solely on its internal HD.
Tivo records any program I want, even pay-per-view movies that are cheaper than iTunes movies. If I opt for premium channels I can record all the movies I want from HBO, Showtime, etc for a low monthly fee.
My DVD player allows me to play DVDs I rent from a local video store that rents DVDs cheaper than iTunes sells downloadable movies. All I have to do is wait for a DVD release, and I have half-off membership to rent the DVD for $1.25 instead of $2.50 for a new movie because I am a loyal customer and get the discount as a result.
I don't need to have an Internet connection to use the Tivo or DVD players. In the case of Tivo most of the programming is due to a low cost monthly fee, and I get the Tivo player/recorder for free if I sign up for a year contract.
I don't really use iTunes, so I wouldn't benefit from an AppleTV box. I think that iTunes is ruining the market and locking down what we can and cannot play on our own equipment. We no longer can buy a movie, and we no longer have control over how we can play it and on what device we can play it on. For example my Linux box and third party MP3 player cannot play iTunes files, nor can my Amiga box. Ironically that my G3 iMac runs Mac OS9, and does not have the latest iTunes software for it to use with the AppleTV had I bought one.
AppleTV is a nice idea, I suppose if one buys a lot of iTunes files. I except Microsoft to have a MSNTV in a year or two to compete with AppleTV. I'd suspect they use some sort of Windows CE type device at the $299 or $199 price range, or maybe offer a discount on an XBox 360 if the buying agrees to a one year contract with media subscriptions and get $200 in rebates from the XBox 386 sale.
The limitations of the AppleTV is that it cannot get my satellite programming, cannot play my DVDs (do they expect me to rip them into some format and violate that MPAA agreement?), cannot work with my Linux and Amiga boxes, and limits how many times I can play a file or how long I can play a file due to DRM that isn't present on my Tivo or DVD players.
My Tivo and DVD players allow me to play any media any time I want for as long as I want for how many times I want to play it. AppleTV does not, so I don't need AppleTV.
OK. It's not hard to find a widescreen TV these days but my 4:3 still works. It's still good enough. How hard would it have been to just fit the stupid menus in 4:3 format as an option? Apple may be human-focused but it certainly isn't customer-focused.
"Part of the secret of Apple TV is that, like most of Apple's products, it doesn't try to do everything and thus become a mess of complexity. It can't receive or record cable or satellite TV, so it isn't meant as a replacement for your cable or satellite box, or for a digital video recorder like a TiVo. It can't play DVDs, so it doesn't replace your DVD player. Its sole function is to bring to the TV digital content stored on your computer or drawn from the Internet."
All this for $299? You could theoretically buy an Xbox 360 for the same price and watch video stored on your computer downloaded from the internet or DVDs, or play games. For $399 (not Mossberg's "50% more"), you can watch video stored on your computer, play DVDs, play games, download games and demos, and download episodes of shows and movies as well as trailers, etc. You don't even need to have a controller plugged in. The remote will do just fine.
For $300, you could also buy an old Xbox, "convert" it to something similar, and still have money for a Tivo. And I'm sure there's dozens of other options (that I'm not aware of) that work just as well for less.
I'm not a fan of useless combination of features but AppleTV is far, far away from being a killer app, as are most set-top boxes.
Still no word on whether or not it plays DivX files. That will be the key to me purchasing one.
By opening a Divx file into a registered version of Quicktime you can save a reference file of the movie that is loadable into iTunes and Front Row. Works with Xvid as well. I haven't tested this on an AppleTV but since it's the conduit for iTunes into your TV, I don't see why it wouldn't work.
Tivo is not necessarily the right product to compare it against. I think comparison between AppleTV and XBox 360 based IP TV will be a better apples to apples comparison (Saw what I did there? Saw what I did there?)
IP based TV is one area where I don't see Apple making a dent on Microsoft's solution. There are many things going Microsoft's way here: (a) Microsoft's 10 million or so install-base (b) The fact that unlike most other Microsoft products, 360 has decent reputation and following in it's field (c) Xbox Live is also very much "alive" already (d) There will be a huge intersection of gamers and early adopters of IP based TV (e) Xbox 360 is already connected to your TV and your home-theatre
Is this the Xbox 360 that can not sync your computer music to its harddrive for whatever bizzare reason? To listen to music on my 360, I have to turn on my computer (Laptop) in my family room. The user interface stinks and it does not play any of my iTunes stuff. No thank you.
While I agree that the Apple TV is severely limited in functionality, your attack on the remote I think is misguided. Personally I've found the Apple remote to be one of the best things to happen to media viewing since TV remotes went wireless. Navigating through Front Row with the remote is elegant and simple and a far superior experience to using any traditional media remote. Everything can be achieved with far less buttons, in a much smaller and neater remote than any other TV/media device offers. It's m
As a Mac user, fully agreed. My question is though: Why haven't other manufacturers clued into Apple's techniques?
Case in point: AppleTV vs. D-link DSM-520. Which sounds sexier? Why do manufacturers keep insisting on using freaking SKUs for product names? It does not work! Especially when your brand name has no style cachet in existence!
Second: Apple spent a lot of time on that UI, and it's slick as hell and looks easy enough to use for a grandma. Why can't other DVR, set-top box, or any other electroni
The only thing that the Apple TV has that the D-link DSM-520 doesn't...
You're wrong about the UI being the most important, the most important thing it has that the DSM doesn't is an Intel CPU. The AppleTV will be become the modders box du jour for video because of this fact alone. This is the FIRST Intel based media PC that is both silent and affordable. I'm expecting mine friday and the first thing I'm doing is popping the case open, pulling the drive, and seeing what I can do with this thing.
... for half the cost you get a crazy additional amount of functionality.
Let's see. For "half the cost", I can buy a used device, take the time to modify it myself, and come up with a box that doesn't include a remote, support, or warranty; doesn't sync with or stream from iTunes; doesn't sync my photo library; doesn't have wireless; is about five hundred times larger; has 1/5th the capacity; and doesn't actually support playing back HD video [xboxmediacenter.com].
The thing will play specially encoded H.264 movies from iTunes with DRM bolted onto, end of story
Or, you know... not.
There's an "Export to [apple]tv..." option in the latest quicktime that produces unencumbered H.264 files. So DRM is not a requirement for it to play. The apple specs only declare a smallish subset of H.264 and MPEG4 files, but 720p H.264 isn't bad at all.
iPods, iTunes, and AppleTV all support MP3s. You could probably have made the exact same argument for that. I don't think them selling protected videos in their store would preclude them from supporting Divx. At the same time, I think the chances of it supporting Divx out of the box are slim as their computers don't even support it natively (needs a codec download).
Correction: Apple generally produces high-quality hardware six months after the product was launched. Until then, the early adopters are just one big beta team.
With an Apple product, "no word" definitely means it doesn't play them.
Well, but there's not "no word". There's specific word that it doesn't play them direct from Apple itself. It syncs with iTunes; that's what it does. It supports h.264 and QuickTime, which is what iTunes supports. That's what it plays.
Maybe eventually somebody will figure out how to hack it to play divx, but out of the box, it definitely doesn't. A simple look at the AppleTV product page would tell you that. The submitter apparently doesn't know how to read.
FYI, I have not yet used the AppleTV. On an OS X machine, running 10.4.9, with front row, there is a method to play many movie files that are not purchased from the iTunes store.
For example, let's say you have digital video of your legal content, ie. kids hockey game, or a school play etc. and your Codec of choice is somewhere in the XVID or DIVX family. If you have the proper plug-ins for Quicktime/iTunes, they will play. It can get expensive in storage space if the content you are storing is in 22, 42 or 120 minute chunks, and doubly so if you have configured iTunes to copy all of your material into it's own DB.
You can drag those video files directly into iTunes and edit their tags to sort them appropriately.
Alas, I am not the source of this info, just one who has been able to make it work. The real trial and error - sorting out the bugs folks are here:
http://www.macosxhints.com/article.php?story=20051 013124423475 [macosxhints.com]
Again, I have not tried this on the AppleTV, nor have I tried it on XP or Vista - just a macbook pro.
How the hell did this get moderated "insightful" instead of "funny"? No, really. That's bad even for the kind of moderation you tend to get around here.
Pixels? Kids these days! In my day, we had lines. Lots of them. And every one of them were horizontal. We had to line them up on our tubes (yeah, tubes!) to make pictures out of them. By hand. We had these dials see, with strange labels like V-Hold and Horiz.
CmdrTaco's review (Score:3, Funny)
Re:CmdrTaco's review (Score:5, Insightful)
--
The Apple TV - It's the true video iPod everyone tittered about all through 2005.
Instead of a cable or dock, it uses 802.11g/n.
Instead of headphones, you attach your TV/Home Theatre.
Apple limited the device to widescreen because they understand the market for the device a whole lot better than you do. People with big glass 4:3 TVs are getting rid of them. People who already have 16:9 or high-def sets will have the scratch to pop for one of these devices. They're the "wavefront" consumers who embraced the iPod first, and Apple hopes they'll embrace this iPod for the living room.
Parent
Caution from Hollywood? (Score:3, Interesting)
I'd imagine MPAA member execs will be a little cautious about entering a partnership with Apple after seeing Jobs' enthusiasm about music DRM turn into an about-face when confronted with interoperability regulation in the EU,
This whole article is an embarrassment to SlashDot (Score:5, Insightful)
Most of the responders seem to know nothing about the product. Asking embarrassingly stupid questions like "does it have a keyboard?", "When are they going to have non-Disney movies?" and telling us that you can only play DRM'ed video on it???
There is hardly a question posed here that would not be answered by a ten second trip to the Apple TV website and anyone following the product even the slightest bit would know the answer to them. Most of the "opinions" on the product here are ill-informed nonsense at best. On top of that, there is a lot of bitter, mean-spirited, childish banter that one would expect on kids sites like Digg or Gizmodo, not SlashDot. I am truly embarrassed to see this kind of junk here.
For those who want to know:
- doesn't support DivX
- a keyboard would make it a computer, not a set-top streamer
- non-Disney movies already available (have been for a while)
- *does* play non DRM'ed music and video (just like iPod)
I am not going to bother trying to refute every point made here or talk up the device, but for a cool techie site populated by intelligent IT people who are supposed to be in the know on stuff like this... this article and most of the related comments are a joke.
Parent
Re:This whole article is an embarrassment to Slash (Score:5, Funny)
Parent
Re:This whole article is an embarrassment to Slash (Score:4, Insightful)
Compare the cost of your cable bill + netflix account + tivo service to that of just buying episodes of the shows and movies you watch. Maybe it doesn't work out well for you, but there are some people who would do very well with something like this.
Parent
Re:This whole article is an embarrassment to Slash (Score:5, Interesting)
Netflix $15/Mo * 12 Mo = 180/Yr
Cable $40/Mo * 12 = 480/Yr (I get some crazy package deal with cable and internet so I'm not sure if suddenly my internet bill will go up, worth considering.)
No Tivo
Total = 660/Year
Shows I watch regularly: Lost, Heroes, random junk
iTunes store: Lost = 34.99/Season
Heroes = 42.99/Season
Total = 78/Year
Leaving me with $582 to buy my iTV and random junk...
The OP has an interesting point. On the other hand it'd make it mighty hard for me to watch sports, CNN and other live programming only found on cable.
Parent
Re:This whole article is an embarrassment to Slash (Score:4, Insightful)
If you transcode the audio to AAC, you can mux it with H.264 video into an MPEG-4/QuickTime container. If you do that, though, you won't be able to pass it through to your receiver over S/PDIF.
I only transcode audio for mono & stereo sources. For multichannel audio, I leave it in AC3 and mux it with H.264 video into a Matroska container.
Creating an .mp4 file with H.264 & AAC looks something like this:
#!/bin/shd irect_pred=auto -oac copy -o /dev/null "${1}" && \d irect_pred=auto -oac copy -of rawvideo -o "${2}.264" "${1}" && \
nice -n 18 mencoder -vf harddup -ovc copy -oac faac -faacopts br=128:mpeg=4 -of rawaudio -o "${2}.aac" "${1}" && \
nice -n 18 mencoder -vf pullup,softskip,${3},harddup -ofps 24000/1001 -ovc x264 -x264encopts bitrate=1400:pass=1:turbo=2:keyint=240:bframes=3:
nice -n 18 mencoder -vf pullup,softskip,${3},harddup -ofps 24000/1001 -ovc x264 -x264encopts bitrate=1400:pass=2:turbo=2:keyint=240:bframes=3:
nice -n 18 MP4Box "${2}.mp4" -fps 23.976 -add "${2}.264" -add "${2}.aac" && \
rm "${2}.264" "${2}.aac"
Creating an .mkv file with H.264 & AC3 looks something like this:
#!/bin/shd irect_pred=auto -oac copy -o /dev/null "${1}" && \d irect_pred=auto -oac copy -of rawvideo -o "${2}.264" "${1}" && \
nice -n 18 mencoder -vf harddup -ovc copy -oac copy -of rawaudio -o "${2}.ac3" "${1}" && \
nice -n 18 mencoder -vf pullup,softskip,${3},harddup -ofps 24000/1001 -ovc x264 -x264encopts bitrate=1400:pass=1:turbo=2:keyint=240:bframes=3:
nice -n 18 mencoder -vf pullup,softskip,${3},harddup -ofps 24000/1001 -ovc x264 -x264encopts bitrate=1400:pass=2:turbo=2:keyint=240:bframes=3:
nice -n 18 MP4Box "${2}.mp4" -fps 23.976 -add "${2}.264" && \
nice -n 18 mkvmerge -o "${2}.mkv" "${2}.mp4" "${2}.ac3" && \
rm "${2}.264" "${2}.ac3" "${2}.mp4"
Both assume that the input is NTSC video that can be inverse-telecined to produce film-rate progressive-scan video. ${1} is the source file, ${2} is the destination file (without extension), and ${3} is a "crop=w:h:x:y" parameter to get rid of any black bars around the video. On a Gentoo box, you'll want to emerge mplayer gpac mkvtoolnix to get the necessary software.
Parent
Apple TV and Divx (Score:5, Insightful)
It's my understanding though that at least in recent versions, Divx is essentially ISO-compliant MPEG-4 Part 2 ASP video, albeit in a nonstandard container. So it seems like it ought to be possible to 'recontainerize' a Divx
Although I would really like to see Apple and
I find it odd that so many Slashdotters seem in love with
Parent
Re:Apple TV and Divx (Score:5, Informative)
I actually just finished transcoding all of my video to mp4 as i prefer its subtitle support over the cheesy avi hacks. DivX was created during the non standard days of MPEG4, as the spec was not finalized. That spec is now finalised, and the standard codec is h264 in an mp4 container. These videos play in Windows, Linux or any other OS which has an h264 codec. They can be imported into iTunes as best as i know. My iTunes question of the day is actually which subtitle formats they use, as I don't know the answer to that.
Parent
Re:Caution from Hollywood? (Score:5, Informative)
Disney own Miramax, Pixar, Touchstone, ABC, ESPN, Buena Vista, ABC and more. There's a little more to Disney then 40s Mickey Mouse clips.
Parent
From the apple website (Score:5, Funny)
Re:From the apple website (Score:4, Insightful)
You've just changed the way you watch digital media.
Yeah, I can no longer watch it, because most of it is encoded with xvid, divx and vcd.
Parent
not for me i guess (Score:5, Insightful)
I would have snapped up an "HD iTivo" in a second but that's not what it is.
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:not for me i guess (Score:4, Informative)
Truely you jest.
Windows Media Center
ReplayTV
MythTV
MediaPortal (open-source backport of XBMC with added TV functionality)
DirectTV PVR (in house, current generation)
MS TV (closed box PVR for cable in use by major cable companies)
MS IPTV (NYR but shown at CES - closed box PVR for IPTV - xbox 360 and standalone)
UltimateTV (defunct)
I'm sure the list goes on. They all support recording, trick play, guide etc. and none of them infringe on any patent Tivo has. I'm sure Tivo's got a patent on a lot of aspects of their implementation, but nothing so all-encompasing that it would prevent Apple from including this functionality.
The reality is that it is HARD to provide a global (or even across the US) solution for TV which includes guide listings for everywhere, works with cable, satellite, etc. and is as reliable as a cable box. Apple is not interested in this (yet at least) and this is never what AppleTV was purported to be. It's more like a media center extender, except that it doesn't require a media center PC, or a windows media connect device with a better UI and no windows requirement.
That's a gross simplification of course, and I know they've made choices around local caching and PC-independent operation that differ from MCX and WMC - and choices around PC/Mac interop that differ from Tivo and all the closed box PVRs.
Parent
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
OK (Score:4, Funny)
Too bad (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Too bad (Score:5, Interesting)
See dropping the floppy on iMac, dropping ADB & SCSI in favor of USB and FireWire.
I have a feeling there will be more coming that takes advantage of the HDTV than exists in this 1.0 product.
Parent
Obligitary question (Score:5, Funny)
GoogleTV (Score:5, Funny)
Obviously with Google's advanced technology in search and category, these videos will be sorted into different categories, genre, rating etc.
This is so not for the /. crowd (Score:4, Interesting)
For thoseof us who use our computers near-constantly there doesn't seem to be a point of making it easier to go from computer to TV, I don't think this box is for us. Now, if iTunes gets more movies and/or better pricing on movies and TV shows, then that may help.
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Geeky question (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Geeky question (Score:4, Informative)
Why is parent flamebait?
Parent
Just use your 360 (Score:4, Informative)
If you are trying to save cash, you can also use your classic XBOX or third-party dedicated device. We call them "Media Center Extenders" here at the 'Soft.
Re:Just use your 360 (Score:4, Funny)
Inquiring minds want to know!
Parent
Linux available on it in 3... 2... 1... (Score:3, Interesting)
One feature they really ought to add, and it could be done all in software, would be the ability to stream video off network shares or NAS devices rather than relying solely on its internal HD.
My Tivo and DVD Players are still better values (Score:3, Insightful)
My DVD player allows me to play DVDs I rent from a local video store that rents DVDs cheaper than iTunes sells downloadable movies. All I have to do is wait for a DVD release, and I have half-off membership to rent the DVD for $1.25 instead of $2.50 for a new movie because I am a loyal customer and get the discount as a result.
I don't need to have an Internet connection to use the Tivo or DVD players. In the case of Tivo most of the programming is due to a low cost monthly fee, and I get the Tivo player/recorder for free if I sign up for a year contract.
I don't really use iTunes, so I wouldn't benefit from an AppleTV box. I think that iTunes is ruining the market and locking down what we can and cannot play on our own equipment. We no longer can buy a movie, and we no longer have control over how we can play it and on what device we can play it on. For example my Linux box and third party MP3 player cannot play iTunes files, nor can my Amiga box. Ironically that my G3 iMac runs Mac OS9, and does not have the latest iTunes software for it to use with the AppleTV had I bought one.
AppleTV is a nice idea, I suppose if one buys a lot of iTunes files. I except Microsoft to have a MSNTV in a year or two to compete with AppleTV. I'd suspect they use some sort of Windows CE type device at the $299 or $199 price range, or maybe offer a discount on an XBox 360 if the buying agrees to a one year contract with media subscriptions and get $200 in rebates from the XBox 386 sale.
The limitations of the AppleTV is that it cannot get my satellite programming, cannot play my DVDs (do they expect me to rip them into some format and violate that MPAA agreement?), cannot work with my Linux and Amiga boxes, and limits how many times I can play a file or how long I can play a file due to DRM that isn't present on my Tivo or DVD players.
My Tivo and DVD players allow me to play any media any time I want for as long as I want for how many times I want to play it. AppleTV does not, so I don't need AppleTV.
Widescreen Only? (Score:5, Interesting)
Ahem... (Score:4, Interesting)
All this for $299? You could theoretically buy an Xbox 360 for the same price and watch video stored on your computer downloaded from the internet or DVDs, or play games. For $399 (not Mossberg's "50% more"), you can watch video stored on your computer, play DVDs, play games, download games and demos, and download episodes of shows and movies as well as trailers, etc. You don't even need to have a controller plugged in. The remote will do just fine.
For $300, you could also buy an old Xbox, "convert" it to something similar, and still have money for a Tivo. And I'm sure there's dozens of other options (that I'm not aware of) that work just as well for less.
I'm not a fan of useless combination of features but AppleTV is far, far away from being a killer app, as are most set-top boxes.
Watching Divx with iTunes trick (Score:5, Interesting)
By opening a Divx file into a registered version of Quicktime you can save a reference file of the movie that is loadable into iTunes and Front Row. Works with Xvid as well. I haven't tested this on an AppleTV but since it's the conduit for iTunes into your TV, I don't see why it wouldn't work.
Re:Better than TiVo? (Score:4, Interesting)
IP based TV is one area where I don't see Apple making a dent on Microsoft's solution. There are many things going Microsoft's way here:
(a) Microsoft's 10 million or so install-base
(b) The fact that unlike most other Microsoft products, 360 has decent reputation and following in it's field
(c) Xbox Live is also very much "alive" already
(d) There will be a huge intersection of gamers and early adopters of IP based TV
(e) Xbox 360 is already connected to your TV and your home-theatre
Parent
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
As a Mac user, fully agreed. My question is though: Why haven't other manufacturers clued into Apple's techniques?
Case in point: AppleTV vs. D-link DSM-520. Which sounds sexier? Why do manufacturers keep insisting on using freaking SKUs for product names? It does not work! Especially when your brand name has no style cachet in existence!
Second: Apple spent a lot of time on that UI, and it's slick as hell and looks easy enough to use for a grandma. Why can't other DVR, set-top box, or any other electroni
Re:Better than TiVo? (Score:5, Interesting)
You're wrong about the UI being the most important, the most important thing it has that the DSM doesn't is an Intel CPU. The AppleTV will be become the modders box du jour for video because of this fact alone. This is the FIRST Intel based media PC that is both silent and affordable. I'm expecting mine friday and the first thing I'm doing is popping the case open, pulling the drive, and seeing what I can do with this thing.
Parent
You omit important details. (Score:4, Insightful)
Let's see. For "half the cost", I can buy a used device, take the time to modify it myself, and come up with a box that doesn't include a remote, support, or warranty; doesn't sync with or stream from iTunes; doesn't sync my photo library; doesn't have wireless; is about five hundred times larger; has 1/5th the capacity; and doesn't actually support playing back HD video [xboxmediacenter.com].
Awesome.
Parent
Re:No chance! (Score:5, Informative)
Or, you know... not.
There's an "Export to [apple]tv..." option in the latest quicktime that produces unencumbered H.264 files. So DRM is not a requirement for it to play. The apple specs only declare a smallish subset of H.264 and MPEG4 files, but 720p H.264 isn't bad at all.
Parent
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
Re:About Time (Score:4, Funny)
Parent
Re:About Time (Score:5, Funny)
Parent
Re:About Time (Score:5, Insightful)
With an Apple product, "no word" definitely means it doesn't play them.
Parent
Re:About Time (Score:5, Insightful)
Well, but there's not "no word". There's specific word that it doesn't play them direct from Apple itself. It syncs with iTunes; that's what it does. It supports h.264 and QuickTime, which is what iTunes supports. That's what it plays.
Maybe eventually somebody will figure out how to hack it to play divx, but out of the box, it definitely doesn't. A simple look at the AppleTV product page would tell you that. The submitter apparently doesn't know how to read.
Parent
Re:you can kind of (Score:4, Interesting)
Parent
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:and screw color (Score:4, Funny)
Pixels! We would have died to have pixels.
Parent