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OS X Operating Systems Programming IT Technology

Third Parties Already Taking Advantage of Tiger 371

tezbobobo writes "Tiger been out hours and already the Apple download page has been updated to take advantage of the update's new features. These cover areas including Spotlight plugins, Dashboard plugins, and Automator plugins. These allow a range of actions from searching within omnigraph documents (spotlight), to resizing photoshop documents (automator), and (my fav) a dashboard wireless locator. The best bit -- a cursory glance indicates about half are freeware."
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Third Parties Already Taking Advantage of Tiger

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  • by Bender0x7D1 ( 536254 ) on Friday April 29, 2005 @01:41PM (#12385569)
    There's more focus on it in the Mac world because they don't suck, they work properly and don't come preloaded with spyware.
  • by jandrese ( 485 ) * <kensama@vt.edu> on Friday April 29, 2005 @01:41PM (#12385573) Homepage Journal
    Yeah, but this way it can be combined with non-Photoshop operations. You could build a script to generate an index and filesystem with an integrated browser to build customized demonstration CDs.
  • Prediction (Score:5, Insightful)

    by chia_monkey ( 593501 ) on Friday April 29, 2005 @01:42PM (#12385575) Journal
    In no time at all there are going to be a whole slew of Dashboard-centric sites, Automator-centric sites, Spotlight-centric sites, and so forth. Just like there are a myriad of PHP, Javascript, CSS, etc sties, we're going to see a bunch based solely on this new Mac OS.

    You gotta hand it to Apple. They create an entire industry around an iPod (don't you love how Belkin, once a patch cord company, makes loads of money off iPod accessories) and are now already sporting sites all over for an OS just recently (and in some places not even out yet) released.
  • Taking Advantage (Score:3, Insightful)

    by vertinox ( 846076 ) on Friday April 29, 2005 @01:48PM (#12385642)
    Did anyone else misread the headline and think: "Oh no! They are releasing spyware for OS X!"

    *Phew!*

    Still, I'm hope they made sure that Automator is secure with Mail.app unlike vbscript and Outlook Express originally was. I'd rather not have my email being Automated to send certain things to everyone on my address book.
  • SuperKaramba (Score:1, Insightful)

    by bosewicht ( 805330 ) on Friday April 29, 2005 @01:57PM (#12385728)
    Isn't dashboard just superkaramba?? thats what it looks like, y is everyone making suc ha big deal out of it? It has been running on Linux for sometime
  • Re:TigerDirect? (Score:1, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday April 29, 2005 @02:01PM (#12385765)
    "P.S.- Just ordered the Mini a few minutes ago."

    and that matters to anyone else exactly HOW?
  • by Dink Paisy ( 823325 ) on Friday April 29, 2005 @02:08PM (#12385839) Homepage
    Photoshop can be driven by Javascript, VBscript and Applescript. Those aren't limited to Photoshop. Although, now that I think about it, the premise of Automator seemed to be that you could easily create scripts. So it's probably just using the existing scripting capability of Photoshop, but exposing it to users in a simpler package.
  • Re:Which? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Tsiangkun ( 746511 ) on Friday April 29, 2005 @02:20PM (#12385962) Homepage
    You can tell by all the support being given to users of this particular Tiger that it's not tiger direct.
  • by 99BottlesOfBeerInMyF ( 813746 ) on Friday April 29, 2005 @02:26PM (#12386051)

    For Thunderbird messages to be indexed, searchable and retrievable, each message should be saved as an individual file.

    You might want to mention that Thunderbird's version of the mbox format does not do this, instead one file is created for each mailbox. Unless this changes, it will not be easy to implement Spotlight searching on individual mail messages in Thunderbird.

    This is actually a potentially large failing in Spotlight. Being able to find the right file is a wonderful thing, but for really big files it would be much better to find a location within that file.

  • by the_2nd_coming ( 444906 ) on Friday April 29, 2005 @02:31PM (#12386129) Homepage
    the fact that the widgets are 20 MBs in RAM for one. the JS system is slow, and the widgets are on the desktop all the time.

    I think it is funny that the konfab guys think that confab widgets are easier to develop than HTML/CSS + scripting language of your choice which is found in Dashboard.
  • by Crash Culligan ( 227354 ) on Friday April 29, 2005 @02:57PM (#12386431) Journal
    One word of advice: If you ever have to ask a question that is critical about Apple on Slashdot, post as AC. Things that are considered normal, harmless questions or even humorous in other sections get trolled to death here. The "Cult of Mac", unfortunately, is not a joke.

    I could argue the "Cult of Mac" thing. The fact is, every group trolls here. Apple threads get Windows- and Linux-fanatics. BSD threads get "- is dying!" trolls like nobody's business. And SCO threads... well, in that case it's pretty much deserved. But nobody is spared. In a community this large, everybody hates something.

    It's just plain old garden-variety groupthink, where a lot of people receive a stimulus and respond similarly. It's not a cult, but it's just two or three steps removed.

    Now, as for the success of Apple on Slashdot... you need to go back a ways, but it wasn't always the way. Practically any thread mentioning Apple would attract its share of detractors, anonymous and virtiolic. Then something unforseen happened: Steve Jobs returned.

    Apple is doing a certain amount of hand-holding here and provides some documentation and a great programming enviroment -- it got even better with Tiger.

    I'm not really fan of Steve Jobs either, but I will admit that a (mostly) benevolent dictator is the best thing Apple could have gotten at the time. He challenged -- and changed -- computer culture, to the point that those silly looking triangular bubble-shaped iMacs that every "expert" at the time pooh-poohed still pop up in some clip-art collections.

    Over time, Apple apparently started doing some things right. Not everything, but enough to continue their survival. "Apple is dying!" went from troll's battle cry to last bastion of the hold-outs, and now where it's used, it's sarcastic. Even you admit in your post that they're doing some things correctly.

    In this case, the customizeability isn't quite programming, nor should it be. The fading of Hypercard from the public eye was enough warning that most people don't want to deal with programming. There's enough control under the hood on OS X that those people who want to can play with perl, python, ruby, c, c++, obj-c, java, emacs, vi, pico, php, etc. For the rest of them, there's this neat thing that does what they tell it -- programming in essence, but not in name. And that might make it easier for people to swallow.

  • by amichalo ( 132545 ) on Friday April 29, 2005 @03:09PM (#12386567)
    Remember Konfabulator? You know, the program that Dashboard totally ripped off and has destroyed the market for?

    True enough that Dashboard widgets take a page right out of Konfabulator's playbook and nothing but Job's RDF can distort that fact.

    Still, Deshboard is really just a next version of Sherlock, Apple's tool for searching the yellow pages, tracking packages, and looking up movie times, all rolled into a Konfabulator desktop model.

    Seems like the right thing for Apple to have done would be to buy Konfabulator out right.
  • Re:SuperKaramba (Score:2, Insightful)

    by the_2nd_coming ( 444906 ) on Friday April 29, 2005 @03:49PM (#12387015) Homepage
    your a retard who cannot read.. both konfab and apple agree that dashboard may LOOK like konfab, but fundamentally they are different technologies.
  • Perfect match... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Your Average Joe ( 303066 ) on Friday April 29, 2005 @03:53PM (#12387064)
    There are at least two markets that Apple matches 100%
    1) The clueless Windows user that call the tower the hard drive.
    2) UNIX geeks that are tired of messing with Linux

    Windows gamers do not match. Windows gamers match 100% using an XBox or PS2 for gaming. They would save a bundle in hardware upgrades as well...
  • The problem is that it was a crap implementation.

    You do realize that it spawned a whole new javascript runtime for each widget, correct?

    I just don't know how they could be expected to purchase a "widget" software vendor when the only thing worth buying was the community's goodwill; the architecture itself was crap.

    Not only that, but Apple has had legal tangles with Arlo Rose in the past (A straight rip of the Aqua interface for his Kaleidoscope product). Most intelligent companies generally do not hop into bed with legal opponents (counter-examples exist).

    Read this for a much more cogent elucidation: http://daringfireball.net/2004/06/dashboard_vs_kon fabulator [daringfireball.net]
  • by Anonymous Coward on Friday April 29, 2005 @05:07PM (#12387817)
    Well, I can see why "please spend a bunch of time to rewrite your storage format so it works better with our OS feature" isn't particularly high on the list for the Entourage folks. They store a lot of data in there- custom flags, custom searches, cross-references with other files, their new project management stuff for Office 2004, and so on. They already HAVE the "Gee Whizzy" things like smart folders that Spotlight has. Basically, what's being asked here is "spend time re-implementing what you already have so it's more compatible with the OS...meanwhile, we'll add features to OUR competitive clients (Mail and iCal) while you're off spending engineering man-hours doing that".

    Yeah, Spotlight is cool. But developers are also smart enough to remember that Apple has played Lucy with the football to developers' Charlie Brown. Quickdraw GX, anyone? Publish and Subscribe? OpenDoc? Or better yet, AIAT/V-Twin/SearchKit- which was Apple's pride and joy of searching and the Next! Cool! Thing! for search a couple of years ago? What if MS had spent time on that and now was being told, "oooh, sorry, not the cool thing any more"?

    The simple fact is that developers are wise to not just drink the goddamn Koolaid the OS manufacturer hands out at developer conferences(whether it's MS or Apple), but to consider what the right thing is for themselves and their customers. Sometimes, that means saying "no", or pushing back- if MS, Adobe and others hadn't pushed back in 1998, there'd be no Carbon, and likely Office, Photoshop and other core productivity apps would be Windows-only by now, because rewriting them in Cocoa or sticking them in Classic/Blue Box was a non-starter.
  • by nullreference ( 700997 ) on Friday April 29, 2005 @05:34PM (#12388055)
    Good question.

    It's a self-reinforcing phenomenon. An existing strong community advocates for your products, and as long as you don't disappoint, it reinforces your product and community. Apple has such a strong and tight-knit community base, information and news tend to circulate quickly and thing get amplified. For instance, I've heard more about the Tiger release from Apple users than from Apple itself...

    It's questionable whether pure number or dollar-wise there are more Apple add-ons than say PCs. I would say not. For example I bet for every single 3rd party add-on (software or hardware-wise) for Macs there are probably two, three or more similar ones for PCs. It's just the one for the Mac gets quick circulation within the Apple community whereas the ones for the PC either compete against each other or are somewhat diluted in the multitude of options. I remember when I used my Macintosh heavily, it seemed like there was one and only one good app for every purpose. For windows there are dozens and sometimes they're all mediocre.

    As for cell phones, at least in this part of the US there are tons of add-ons -- face plates, blinking what-nots, games, etc -- although the market for those tend to be middle/high-school crowd. Again because of the shear number of cell phone models the community gets diluted. (I guess diluted community is an oxymoron).

  • by Anonymous Coward on Friday April 29, 2005 @05:45PM (#12388155)
    Well, to be fair, it's fairly reasonable of them not to want to split up their database into squillions of tiny flat files, isn't it?

    You know, it's really not. Here's why, in several interrelated but overlapping points.

    1. HFS is optimized for small files. It has to be; an average installation of Mac OS X has over a quarter of a million of them, most just a few hundred bytes long.

    2. A big file is a single point of failure. If you're not using self-validating format (like an XML-based format), you're kind of up a creek if that file should happen to get damaged. Do you want to tell your users that they just lost five years worth of e-mail because one byte got screwed up?

    3. Entourage has a long-standing and well-known limitation related to its database anyway. When the database hits two gigabytes, Entourage craps out. (That limit was raised to 4 GB in a relatively recent patch. I don't know about you, but I'm sitting on five gigabytes of mail here.)

    4. If you think about it for a second, you can see that it's basically impractical -- so impractical as to border on impossible -- for Spotlight to work any other way than the way it does right now.

    So bottom line, Microsoft has to re-implement their backing store anyway. Why not do it in a way that's more reliable and more compatible while they're at it?
  • by Maserati ( 8679 ) on Friday April 29, 2005 @08:42PM (#12389432) Homepage Journal
    I support products from both Apple and Microsoft:

    How about "please spend a bunch of time to rewrite your storage format so it doesn't completely implode if a single byte gets written incorrectly?" Or how about "please spend a bunch of time to rewrite your storage format so it doesn't crap out when it hits two gigabytes?"

    They actually DID the second one. Of course, a 2GB to 4GB improvement means somebody had been using a signed INT to index the database... I'll never understand why Microsoft is so fond of monolithic binary data stores (Registry, Entourage db etc.), the goddamn things break and can't really be fixed. Entourage 2004 does fuck up a LOT less than X did, but 2-4GB of binary data that could (should) be represented as text on disk (thank the person who advocated .mbox stores in Mail.app 1.0 for me) represents a lot of valuable data at risk because of a terrible design decision.It'd make a little more sense if Entourage used the same monolithic format Outlook or OE use, but they invented a new kind.

    I swear there's a corporate directive to go with monolithic stores wherever possible (for very large values of possible).

    No point, just a bad day at the office because Entourage and GroupWise don't get along.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 30, 2005 @12:28AM (#12390454)
    I love it how people are sooo quick to say that Windows gamers should just use a console system for all their gaming needs. Plus, there are Windows gamers like me that already have several current console systems and do play console games.

    I could go on about why you are wrong, but since you love making generalizations and assumptions, and this has been discussed on games.slashdot and countless websites/forums/usenet groups/etc, I won't even bother.

    Since this "PC gaming is dying, a console is all you should need" is just as old as the "BSD is dying" trolls, and it has been proclaimed to be dead for years, lets just say you are still wrong and end it at that.
  • by 99BottlesOfBeerInMyF ( 813746 ) on Saturday April 30, 2005 @11:31AM (#12392240)

    To be honest, that was my first reaction, too. However: The little plugin thingies are going to be one of the first places where lots of people cut their teeth on programming.

    The original summary mentioned sites providing three types of third-party software to take advantage of tiger. Both automator scripts and dashboard widgets are great for quick and fast small tasks that can be easily distributed and used. They are great for really really quick or small operations and will be great for adding customized functionality for many people.

    That said, I don't think either is very important compared to the third item, spotlight plug-ins. This is new and real filesystem level functionality being extended by third parties. If this happened in Windows, Linux, Solaris, or NachOS it would be on the front page of Slashdot, and rightly so. A single day after the OS was released, thanks to dozens software developers, a user of tiger can instantaneously search their entire system based upon the contents of all sorts of file types. Apple allowing this for fifty or so very common data types is great, but the fact that people have already provided plug-ins to let my searches extend to OpenOffice files, Omnigraffle diagrams, Realbasic projects, Corel Painter Files, VOIP logs, and many more proprietary file types really makes me think that this technology will be used and extended to the point that it will really, really change the way I use my computer on a fundamental level. This is, as far as I know, the first time this sort of thing was possible on any system although I have no doubt that it will be embraced by every consumer OS within a few years time.

    This is definitely "News for Nerds."

  • Search Kit 2? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by guet ( 525509 ) on Monday May 02, 2005 @06:19AM (#12405450)
    Search Kit can index multiple things within a single file.

    Can Spotlight?

    If not, why not?

    Frankly I think your hostility to the Mac BU (and by extension anyone who questions this 'feature') is misplaced. Why should every mail application (or other application) have to change their storage format to a single file per object?

    If this is the case, this is a gap in the Spotlight API, and a step backwards from Search Kit - it would not be backwards compatible. If it is backwards compatible you can indeed index several things in one file (I know because I'm doing it presently with search kit).

    You can add arbitrary URLS (ie an url scheme of your devising) with :

    SKDocumentCreateWithURL

    Then add text to be indexed with :

    SKIndexAddDocumentWithText

    I haven't looked at the Spotlight API so I couldn't tell you if this is the case with Spotlight, but everyone seems to be saying that you need to feed it a file URL for each object searched. Perhaps because of the tie in with the operating system to see when files have changed.

    BTW, your posts are very interesting, and I'm glad you post here, but you do sometimes give the impression of talking as 'the voice of Apple' on all subjects. Is this intentional? You can't possibly know about everything Apple does.

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