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Media (Apple) Businesses Media Apple Hardware

Getting Sony TRV-22 Cams Working w/ G5s? 106

Posted by Cliff from the solving-the-problems dept.
Phil wants to take a bite out of this issue: "I'm having a time trying to get my Sony handycam to work with my Mac G5. Sony provides software for all Windows environments, and a USB driver and 'shim' program for Mac OS, but not Mac OS X. The Mac documentation says to hook a camera into the Firewire port, no software needed. So is there a device that will allow me to go from USB to Firewire, or do I have to spend a lot of money on an OS 9 video capture program? I can't seem to find an answer anywhere I look, and was hoping Slashdot readers could help me out, because I know I'm not alone with this problem. Thanks."
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Getting Sony TRV-22 Cams Working w/ G5s? More

Getting Sony TRV-22 Cams Working w/ G5s?

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  • TRV-19 as well (Score:3, Interesting)

    by boredMDer ( 640516 ) <pmohr+slashdot@boredmder.com> on Sunday February 29, 2004 @05:25PM (#8424453)
    I just got an iBook G3 800 and have been trying to get my TRV-19 handycam working with it.

    It's basically not detected as all, short of an external USB audio device. Yes, USB Streaming is set up on the camera (works fine on my windows box).

    Any way to have this work under Panther? I only have the USB cable that came with it, and would prefer not to get the firewire cable.

    So, any one have a clue?

    • Yeah (Score:5, Informative)

      by 2nd Post! ( 213333 ) <gundbear.pacbell@net> on Sunday February 29, 2004 @06:09PM (#8424712) Homepage
      Get the FireWire cable.

      It's much cheaper than any other solution.

      iChat AV, iMovie, and Final Cut all work wonderfully when you have it hooked up via Firewire.

      Else none of those programs will work.

    • Re:TRV-19 as well (Score:5, Informative)

      by Andy_R ( 114137 ) on Sunday February 29, 2004 @06:15PM (#8424757) Homepage Journal
      Get the cable. Trying to shove video down a USB connector when you have firewire is ridiculous.

      The last 3 Macs I bought all came with the cable, check that you don't already have it and filed it away when you found it wasn't needed for anything when you set the mac up.

    • Re:TRV-19 as well (Score:5, Funny)

      by AKnightCowboy ( 608632 ) on Sunday February 29, 2004 @09:08PM (#8425606)
      Any way to have this work under Panther? I only have the USB cable that came with it, and would prefer not to get the firewire cable.

      Sadly this is one of the areas where Macs far fall behind PCs running Windows. Getting digital video editing going on a Mac is one of the hardest feats you'll ever encounter next to game playing. I'd sell the G5 and pick up a nice Alienware box if I were you. I would be willing to take the G5 off your hands since I'm such a sucker for hard luck cases... how about $1000 for the whole thing out the door and we'll call it even?

      • Ummm, I don't know what you're talking about. Video on a mac is quite possibly one of the easiest things you can do. Let me break it down for you:
        1. Turn camera on
        2. Connect camera to your computer using a firewire cable
        3. Open video software (iMovie or Final Cut Pro/Express) and use the capture command.

        Thats it, no software, no device drivers. I've done it many times using different software and cameras, and I've never had a problem. I've even used an analog capture box without any problems (except for th
      • Don't make fun of the poor sap. He's a moron...I mean uh...n00b. Yeah, that's it.
      • Uh, hello? Please don't make that sound like hard facts! Importing digital video to my Windows box was totally impossible. I'm so glad I tried demo versions of the video editing tools instead of buying one right away. I must have tried like six different programs, Premiere and such included. No luck.
        On my mac i started iMovie, plugged the camera in, and then everything *just worked*. That's one of the things that made me think of mac's as reliable and easy to use.
        Sure there has to be people who run into p
      • RTFP! Other folkks who read your post got confused.....they read the first line and went off into a Mac inspired rage....I read the whole thing and GOT THE SARCASM! Yeah I'd take it off his hands for 100 bucks too!
    • Most Macs (G4s did, I dunno about G5s) come bundled with a Firewire cable. Steal one from a friend, who most likely isn't using it, and plug it in. You'll get much higher quality than you would with USB anyway.

  • Should just work (Score:2, Interesting)

    by mmarlett ( 520340 )
    I don't know the specifics of your camera, but having used a dozen digital cameras and a number of digital camcorders, they all pretty much just work.

    Just plug the camera in (I'm assuming the firewire cable, but USB if that's what it has) and the appropriate program should launch. iMovie, I'm again assuming.

    My question is this: Did you try just plugging it in to see what happen, or were you looking for some complicated solution before you found a problem?

    • Re:Should just work (Score:5, Informative)

      by jo_ham ( 604554 ) <joham999 AT gmail DOT com> on Sunday February 29, 2004 @06:02PM (#8424653)
      There is no framework for video over USB in OS X as far as I know, unlike firewire.

      It's not as simple as hooking up a USB-based video camera and having it work straight away with OS X.
    • This isn't always true. I have a Samsung/Medion DV camera here, which is recognized in iMovie under OS 9 but not in OS X Jaguar. So to import my video I have to reboot my G4 MDD and then I have to reboot again to start working with it. Also not recognized in FCP.

  • Did you try (Score:3, Informative)

    by MoneyT ( 548795 ) on Sunday February 29, 2004 @05:33PM (#8424495) Journal
    Using image capture in your applications folder?

  • Image Capture (Score:4, Insightful)

    by HebrewToYou ( 644998 ) on Sunday February 29, 2004 @05:33PM (#8424500)
    Have you tried the Image Capture application yet?
    I do not, repeat *DO NOT*, own this camera.
    I do, however, know that when I want to extract video from a USB image device (such as my Canon PowerShot S30 [30 second .avi clips]) the OS X application of choice is Image Capture. It's fairly straightforward, so give it a try.
    On a side note, chances are that the OS 9 video capture Application would not work properly. As the Power Mac G5 can only run OS 9 as Classic [emulation] you're going to have a real hard time finding a compatible application.
    Finally, since hindsight is 20/20, you really ought to have purchased a FireWire DV camcorder. They behave much better on the Mac.

  • If the port on the camera... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by JeffTL ( 667728 ) on Sunday February 29, 2004 @05:36PM (#8424517)
    ...is FireWire, get a FireWire cable. If your camera is USB only, you got skinned; sorry.

  • Doesn't it come with a Firewire/i.Link port? (Score:5, Informative)

    by ryan_fung ( 610676 ) on Sunday February 29, 2004 @05:36PM (#8424519)
    Sony's spec. [sonystyle.com]

    From the page:
    Features:
    i.LINK(R)* DV Interface (IEEE 1394)

  • Firewire for DV / USB for still Images (Score:5, Informative)

    by madcoder47 ( 541409 ) <development.madcoder@net> on Sunday February 29, 2004 @05:38PM (#8424528) Homepage Journal
    The USB port on sony Video Cameras is for transferring still images off the compactflash card, while the firewire port is used for transferring DV (Digital Video) content. If your mac does not have a firewire port, i highly doubt it would be running OS X. Get a 6-to-4 pin firewire cable to hook the camera up and try iMovie.

    • Re:Firewire for DV / USB for still Images (Score:5, Informative)

      by jaysones ( 138378 ) on Sunday February 29, 2004 @05:58PM (#8424631)
      Furthermore, iMovie's documentation [apple.com] says:

      "Many DV cameras include both a USB and FireWire (also known as iLink or IEEE 1394) connection. The USB connection on DV cameras is usually designed for downloading still images and not video. Use the FireWire connection when working with iMovie. If your camera does not have a FireWire port, it will not work with iMovie. "

      • Also, iMovie's docs are also incorrect here too. Some dvCams also use the USB (2.0) as a video capture too. This would require a driver and I doubt you'd ever be able to use iMovie.

        In the case of the poster....why don't you use the iLink port? Gte a 4 pin to 6 pin cable and your set. My JVC works perfectly with my 12 inch Powerbook.

  • Firewire cams not USB (Score:1, Insightful)

    by Visigothe ( 3176 )
    It comes down to the mac expecting a Firewire DV cam, not a USB cam.

    Not to bash Sony, but it figures they would create a DV cam [is it real DV, or some DV-like protocol... check] that *wasn't* firewire/IEEE 1394, despite the fact that they are a member of the 1394 consortium. Does any Mac user remember the Sony Spressa [a painfully bad USB CD-R drive]?

    Sony has a habit of tweaking things so they make things as painful as possible for users. For example, their iLink is 4 pin 1394, rather than the *far* mor

    • Re:Firewire cams not USB (Score:5, Informative)

      by MBCook ( 132727 ) <foobarsoft@foobarsoft.com> on Sunday February 29, 2004 @08:20PM (#8425363) Homepage
      The camera IS firewire. It has USB to download still images and little video clips taken onto the memory card while in camera mode (like most digital cameras do). To get digital video you use FireWire. My mom has a Sony cam that works this way and it works just fine.

      As for the 4-pin FireWire port, it saves a hell of alot of space. My mom's little digital video camera is TINY, and there would be no place to put the 6 pin port without making the camera physically bigger. I don't see anything wrong with that.

      Now the 4 pin port on my Dell laptop, THAT I hate. Why not make it 6 so it's powered? So I don't have to have power for HDs I plug into it, etc? WHY MAKE ME BUY OBSUCRE CABLES FOR WHAT SHOULD BE THE STANDARD 6 PIN PORT??? Dumb Dell. My laptop has MORE than enough room to put a BUNCH of 6 pin ports around the laptop, but they just put a tiny little 4 pin one on.

      Back on topic, I don't know what's going on but there seems to be alot of Sony bashing in this thread from people who haven't look at things. There IS A FIREWIRE PORT ON THE CAMERA, I think the guy is just using it wrong. Sony is a good company, why don't you trust that they knew what they were doing and put firewire on it?

      • Presumably, your laptop's power supply is the issue. While putting 2 extra pins on the socket might be simple, adding the necessary strength to the power supply and cooling system to power whatever device(s) anyone might ever choose to plug in isn't going to be simple at all.
      • Even worse are Sony's two FireWire sins:

        1. Put an unpowered 6-pin port on desktops.

        2. Put a 4-pin port on laptops, then put a proprietary 'power out' connector right next to it! (So they can have a custom made cable that carries both FireWire and power, instead of just using standard 6-pin FireWire to do it, which would take up the exact same amount of space.)
    • "Does any Mac user remember the Sony Spressa [a painfully bad USB CD-R drive]?"

      I made the mistake of buying that P.O.S.

      I wasn't a Mac user back then, but had a Dell Inspiron notebook as my primary PC for school. I bought the drive thinking it would solve my limited-space problem.

      That was the worst $200 I spent in my life. I had SO many under-runs, it wasn't even funny (well about 50%).

      USB 2.0 is better than the old standard, but still not as great as FireWire. I love my powerbook, and my external Fir

  • Use the FireWire port (Score:5, Informative)

    by rmlane ( 589573 ) on Sunday February 29, 2004 @06:02PM (#8424652)
    The DCR-22 has both a FireWire and a USB port.
    Use the Firewire port, and it will just work.

    Features The full range of input and output connections are included, being one of only two in the range to do so. FireWire, MiniUSB and single-jack AV connectors are provided, along with LANC, S-Video in/out, headphone and external microphone sockets, which are situated at the front of the body.

  • Make sure DV out is set... (Score:5, Informative)

    by sessha ( 656763 ) on Sunday February 29, 2004 @06:44PM (#8424892)
    I have a DCR-TRV17 and it works just fine with Final Cut Pro and iMovie for video transfer. As someone mentioned, you need a 4 pin - 6 pin firewire cable, which you should definitely buy online as best buy, etc. usually gets about $40 for the cable. Just make sure in the settings when you go to capture that you set the DV stream Out -> On (something similar to that) and then your iMovie or FCP or whatever will detect the DV stream. If you want to transfer the images, you can use either an external usb memory stick reader or a 4-6 pin USB cable and image capture or iPhoto will do the trick. Of course, still images are pretty lousy on DV cameras - not useful for much. You would be better off getting a cheap digital camera just for photos.

  • I had the same problem a while back w/ an older Sony handycam and a blue and white G3 mac. The solution turned out to be a "Media Converter" breakout box that turned the signal into a DV signal that the mac could import.

    The one we used was a Sony model, but there are others listed on apple's Made For Mac site, including one by Canopus (search for Media Converter)

    Here's a link to the one we used:
    http://dv411.com/sondvmcda2dv.htm

    There must be cheaper ones on the market by now, as this was at least 4 years

  • Look at the front of the camera (Score:4, Informative)

    by kalidasa ( 577403 ) * on Sunday February 29, 2004 @07:26PM (#8425095) Journal
    Notice that the specifications [consumerdvreviews.com] list an IEEE1394 interface? And looking at the front of the camera in this pic, I think I see an iLink logo (a fat lowercase i). iLink is Sony's brand name for 4-pin firewire. If you look under the flap with the i logo, you should see a little port about a third the length and 3/4 to half the width of a USB port. That's the iLink port. As I said above, a 4-pin to 6-pin Firewire cable from Apple should do the trick. iMovie and Final Cut will both recognize the camera. If the computer doesn't have firewire (just possible, I suppose; I got my first mac when OS X came out), then you're using the wrong tool for the job anyway.
  • Firwire is needed for video streaming. Get a cable, plug it in, enjoy!

  • G5 (Score:2, Informative)

    by Papa Romeo ( 664245 )
    Since the poster is using a G5, he can use the FireWire port in front of the computer to hook up a 6pin-to-4pin cable. The iLink port was described above. If you are using iMovie all you need to do is turn on your camera and launch the program and you'll have control of the camera from your computer. If you are using Final Cut (Pro or Express) it's a little more complicated to set up but the manuals are pretty clear. No extra software or adapter needed.

  • Give it up (Score:4, Interesting)

    by djupedal ( 584558 ) on Sunday February 29, 2004 @08:35PM (#8425467)
    is there a device that will allow me to go from USB to Firewire - Sure, it's called a TRV-30 :)

    Firewire is key... If you buy a DV cam with only USB, better hope you've kept the receipt.

    USB is good for moving images off the Memory Stick, if you could make it work (you can't), but I wouldn't want video across that channel...way too poor quality if any at all.

  • So Much Mis-Info! (Score:5, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 29, 2004 @09:24PM (#8425670)
    OK, the Sony DCR TRV-22 IS in fact a FireWire Mini DV camera. Go check out your local Apple Store, they have one there that is hooked up, using iMovie. The thing is, though, none of the Sony camcorders ship with a FireWire cable. You'll need either a 6-4 pin FireWire or a 9-4 pin FW cable ('cause the G5 has the fancy new FireWire 800 on the back). Buy the 6-4 because it's cheaper! Next, just plug the TRV-22 in, turn it to playback mode and launch iMovie. if you need help, check the Apple Knowledge Base [apple.com] and more specifically this article on how to hook up a Mini DV cam. [apple.com] Oh, yeah, the USB cable that ships with the camcorder is only for photos, not video.....hope that helps!!

    ~panthman~

  • Use Firewire and save yourself the hassle!! (Score:3, Insightful)

    by kiwioddBall ( 646813 ) on Sunday February 29, 2004 @09:30PM (#8425694)
    Yes, I've just been there myself on a PC rather than an Apple, with a Sony DV camcorder.

    The guts is, if you are serious about taking digital video from the camera, you must use a firewire cable. Don't believe what you read about USB2.0 being equivalent to Firewire speedwise so they must be the same - it isn't true. USB2.0 is functionally very different.

    Most video capture programs won't even recognize the USB2 connection - even on the PC (I suspect this is the problem you are having - The Sony USB connection is only good for taking stills from the memory stick really). However, plug in a firewire cable and you are sweet - all programs recognise it and it is a pure lossless transfer from the camera to the computer - PC or Mac. Apple have probably done you a tremendous favour by not recognising the USB connection.
    • In this case I would agree. There's simply no way to get a USB only cam recognize in iMovie. On the other hand, I use a USB 2.0 External HD to capture video to on my powerbook and it worked like a charm! I even used DVDBackup and copied a DVD directly to the drive and pay it from there as well. USB 2.0 CAN be used for video, but noone does because they already have adapted FireWire. Soon FireWire 800 will eclipse FireWire.

  • As other posters have mentioned, OS X has the software to do video capture from firewire devices. iMovie and the other commercial packages offer a neat set of options. For something in-between, you can check out BTV [bensoftware.com]. I've used it on OS 8.6, 9 and 10.2.x with an ixMicro TV capture card, an iRez PCMCIA capture card, the Dazzle DV Bridge, an XLR8 Interview capture device, and most recently with a Canopus ADVC-100. Once the system has the drivers, BTV can capture from it.

    For USB capture hardware drivers, t

  • I have the TRV22 (Score:2, Informative)

    by burgburgburg ( 574866 )
    Get the Firewire cable. It's worth it. Leave the USB for the still picture captures.

    I got a six foot 4 pin to 6 pin Firewire cable from B&H Photo for $20. Works great.

    • Re:I have the TRV22 (Score:2, Informative)

      by graphxjoe ( 757773 )
      I have the TRV-22 and use it all the time on a G5 dual 2ghz. Just plug in the firewire cable (mine came with my camera) into the firewire port on the front of your G5, turn the camera on to VCR and capture away in iMovie or Final Cut. No problems for me other than an occasional timecode break. USB is for accessing still shots from the memory stick.
      • Just a quick tip, at the risk of being OT.

        You can avoid timecode break problems by pre-blacking your tape. You can do this a variety of ways. The easiest (to explain) is just record a tape with the lens cap on.

        I buy tape in bulk, so when I get a fresh batch, I take a few days to black them. Sounds like a pain, but it's really much less of a pain than dealing with TC breaks.
        • My camera also has a blank sensing detector. I just rewind it til I see video, hit the button and it places the head within the end of your video right before the blankspot. Works like a charm, but you may want to check it in play for a second to make sure your not recording over something or just record a bit past the "MAGIC" moment and you'll be fine.

  • Heh heh. Cliff got burned... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:55AM (#8426887)
    "The Mad Jester" (at yahoo.com, now _that's_ a serious email!!) trolled Cliffy with a non-question and Cliff took the bait.

    Anyone who shelled out the shekels for a Sony DV camera knows that it comes with Firewire (or iLink, or IEEE-xxxx).

    So my guess is that the entire article was an elaborate ruse.

    I'm pretty sure Pudge wouldn't have fallen for it, but it looks like Pudge has Sunday off.

  • gah (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward
    i dont know why this is even a discussion. i have used a TRV-11 extensively with a mac, and i know they work fine. GET A FIREWIRE CABLE. dear lord. video over usb = not good idea!!!

    and this doesnt help make mac users look any more intelligent either...

  • Get the cable! (Score:2, Funny)

    by ch3 ( 701440 )
    Gee, all this fuss for a stupid cable...
    Now that's end user support at its best. Couldn't you just walk to your local apple store/eletronic store/whatever photograph store and ask how to plug your DV cam on your G5? Any vendor with an IQ slightly above a donkey would have told you to get a 20$ firewire cable.
  • Firewire camcorders are plug and play on Macs, in all sorts of applications from iMovie to iChat AV, and many many freeware applications like EyeToy. Of course, this information isn't the least bit helpful to someone with a USB camcorder, but to anyone who is looking at purchasing a camcorder, get one with Firewire!
  • There is no standard specification for transmitting the 25Mbps DV stream across USB... PC or Mac, it doesn't matter. DV NTSC deck control, audio and video channels are transmitted via Firewire, period. There are very few applications that have issues with the TRV22 (I have a DCR-TRV18... even older), except perhaps Adobe Premiere, which is rather peculiar. All MiniDV cameras use the same DV stream, audio stream, and DV timecode stream parameters... so why Premiere only supports select DV cameras is entir

  • TRV-22 and macs in an institutional setting (Score:3, Informative)

    by gobbo ( 567674 ) on Monday March 01, 2004 @04:24PM (#8433100) Journal
    Hi. I'm right now spec'ing out a handful of TRV-22's for teaching entry level video editing. They're a good price point and fairly good quality, with some reliability.

    And, they're EASY. Easy, easy, easy. Video tech here is Mac-based. Here's how it works:

    1. shoot video
    2. boot computer
    3. turn on camera (make sure it's set to video not stills), set to Play or VTR, plug iLink port on camera to firewire 400 port on computer using a 4-6 pin $12 cable
    4. boot up iMovie/FCP/whatever
    5. capture your footage

    Really, that's all. Oh, well, for stills it's a bit different:

    1. shoot photos
    2. boot computer
    3. turn on camera, set to stills (or card) playback
    4. plug USB cable into camera and keyboard
    5. sit back and wait for iPhoto, then import

    As always, RTFM! In this case that's about 20 minutes investment. Once you've done that, you can worry about gotchas, like having to eject a USB connection, or whether to leave your camera plugged in by firewire between any reboots (don't - but you're using OS X, why reboot?).
  • I don't want to sound like a Mac elitist, and I know this is OT and probably redundant by now.... But, fricking blame Sony for NOT including a FireWire cable with a fricking DV cam. Yeah, you should know DV does not work over USB, but Sony confuses the issue for DV noobs by giving them a fricking USB cable in the box (who actually uses the sub-par still capability anyway?).

    Long story short, buy the FireWire cable Sony should have given you in the first place.
    • I have looked at several miniDV cams and NONE had the cable. My JVC didn't and your right....include the frappin 8 dollar cable! In fact, have one 4 to 4 and a 4 to 6. That should about cover 90 percent of the situations and incurs a minimal cost to SONY/JVC/Whoever.

  • Use FireWire when available...always. USB 2.0 (Hi-Speed) has a looooong way to go before the various bridge hardware is mature enough to compete with FireWire. Even then I don't think USB 2.0 is up to the task.

    As for Sony DV camcorders...USB is primarily for transferring still images from Memory Sticks or webcam functionality.

    If you own a Mac, you're basically hung out to dry on USB support. You probably don't want it anyway. Just get a MemoryStick reader and be done with it. Never EVER buy a camcord
  • ...on OS X. I have a Samsung SCD-60 (about 3 years old) that is literally Plug 'n' Play with Winblows. In fact this is really the only reason I even have Windows on my home PC anymore. I have never been able to get it to work in OS X, not Jaguar, and not Panther. And if you look at Apple's list of supported camcorder on their website, you'll notice that they only support about 4 manufacturer's models. This is ridiculous. Since DV over IEEE-1394 is an industry standard, you should theoretically be able
  • You're not really clear on what you want to do but anyway, if you are trying to webcam...streaming video, etc., try bensoftware's BTV (BTV Carbon Pro) and if you are having a USB driver issue try i/oExpert's driver. You can get more info on VersionTracker. If you're going DV w/ Firewire and having problems you best just check the cable. There should be no problem capturing video via Firewire into iMovie. Keep in mind inherent cable length restrictions for FW.

    You might also want to try Quicktime Broadcaster

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