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Music Businesses Media Apple

iTunes Indie Meeting Notes 454

BWJones writes "The CD baby! site contains notes taken from the indie music meeting recently held at Apple. Interesting statistics revealed were that there are about 500k songs/week being downloaded from the iTunes Music store and that 45% of songs are being purchased as albums. Other interesting items of note are that Apple is treating everyone as equvalents in that all labels receive equal treatment with the same deal, the same agreements and you work with the same team of people. What's more is that Apple cuts a check EVERY MONTH which is huge for the smaller labels." Wired has another story about iTunes which notes that what Jobs taketh away, the community is bringing back.
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iTunes Indie Meeting Notes

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  • Details pulled (Score:1, Informative)

    by gerf ( 532474 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @02:24PM (#6133824) Journal
    The details were pulled from the first link, before there's even one post. ya'rg! Anyone happen to have visited before he pulled the info?
  • See Gnutella News (Score:5, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 06, 2003 @02:26PM (#6133840)
    Here [gnutellanews.com]
  • DONT BOTHER (Score:4, Informative)

    by jayteedee ( 211241 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @02:27PM (#6133846)
    All the details have been pulled and the following remark inserted:

    "And yes, sorry, there used to be more details here. I didn't realize yesterday's presentation was supposed to be confidential. When I found out, I pulled the details. Honest mistake."
  • Re:Details pulled (Score:4, Informative)

    by ablair ( 318858 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @02:29PM (#6133862)

    As always, good old MacSurfer [macsurfer.com] toi the rescue with a link to the Gnutella News story [gnutellanews.com].

    Lots of interesting details; it looks like Apple is being fair and genuinely trying to help out independent artists as much as possible.
  • by thefinite ( 563510 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @02:30PM (#6133874)
    One interesting note I remember from reading it: No independant artists. You have to come in through one of the independant labels. Apple pays the label. The label pays you.
  • by 1019 ( 262204 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @02:31PM (#6133879) Homepage
    I got an invitation to go to Apple's office for a presentation/meeting today (June 5, 2003) about how to get independent artists into the iTunes Music Store. There were about 150 people there, representatives from the best independent record labels and music services, in this invitation-only conference room. Steve Jobs came out and started a two and a half hour presentation/seminar/Q&A about iTunes and the benefits of independent labels making their music available there. I type fast and had my laptop, so I wrote down all the major points of their presentation as they went.

    NOTE: I've skipped the super-basic introduction to iTunes and what it does, because that can be found so many other places. This is the stuff that I felt was most important to musicians:
    The basics

    * The basics of iTunes Music Store are covered in many places, so if you haven't used iTunes Music store yet, read these links first:
    * Apple's iTunes Music Store website.
    * Great video showing the service.
    * NOTE: iTunes is not a website! It can only be accessed from the iTunes software run on Mac OS X (now) and Windows (by the end of the year.)
    * I highly suggest trying it for yourself. If you don't have a Mac, use a friend's. Enter your credit card info and actually buy a song. Tell it to store your info for future purchases. Buy a few more songs with the one-click system. I'm serious. You should try it yourself to really experience how amazingly cool it is.
    * They're using a DRM called Fairplay to make sure you can't put these songs on the internet and have them play on another player.

    Current Stats:

    * There are 6-7 million copies of iTunes in use.
    * 3.5 million songs sold so far. Selling about 500,000 songs a week now.
    * More than 75% of songs have sold at least once. There is a wide breadth in purchasing. This is not only fueled by hits.
    * 45% of all songs have been bought as an album. In other words: don't worry about the death of the album format. 45% of people prefer to buy as an album anyway, even though they always have the option to only buy per-song.
    * 90% of sales are 1-click downloads. (1-click is where customer has credit card stored on file, so that as soon as they click a song title, it starts downloading and their credit card is automatically charged.)
    * 10 previews (free 30 second listen) for every purchase. Meaning: 10 listens per buy.

    Price of music on iTunes

    * Songs must be 99 cents each.
    * Full albums are recommended to be $9.99 or lower.
    * Album price must be less than or equal to the sum of their tracks. So if you have a 5-song album, it can't be more than $4.95 to buy the full-length album.
    * Apple strongly recommends going even lower than $9.99. They'd like to see that price drop to make the full-album purchase even more desirable.
    * Only exception: if a song is over 7 minutes long, they won't offer it as a separate download. It will be available as part of the album only.
    * There is no cost to put your music on iTunes.
    * There will be no up-front advance from Apple.
    * Details on the wholesale price to the label will be mailed to us, later.

    Sales report to SoundScan

    * Apple is reporting all iTunes sales to SoundScan!
    * SoundScan measures per-song not per-album.
    * So if someone buys your whole album, each track on the album is reported as a song sale.
    * SoundScan requested to do it that way. It was their idea, not Apple's.

    About positioning and getting attention on iTunes

    * Apple has hired an editorial staff with backgrounds in music to decide what gets featured.
    * Editorial team makes decisions every day as to what goes where.
    * Big labels don't get preferential treatment.
    * "We pick music we like, and we think everyone else is going to like."
    * "We've had a lot of people offer money", but A
  • by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 06, 2003 @02:32PM (#6133882)
    Cd Baby reports on itunes meeting re: indy music.
    Posted by leflaw on June 6, 2003 at 7:44 AM EDT
    Apple iTunes + independent music

    I got an invitation to go to Apple's office for a presentation/meeting today (June 5, 2003) about how to get independent artists into the iTunes Music Store. There were about 150 people there, representatives from the best independent record labels and music services, in this invitation-only conference room. Steve Jobs came out and started a two and a half hour presentation/seminar/Q&A about iTunes and the benefits of independent labels making their music available there. I type fast and had my laptop, so I wrote down all the major points of their presentation as they went.

    NOTE: I've skipped the super-basic introduction to iTunes and what it does, because that can be found so many other places. This is the stuff that I felt was most important to musicians:
    The basics

    * The basics of iTunes Music Store are covered in many places, so if you haven't used iTunes Music store yet, read these links first:
    * Apple's iTunes Music Store website.
    * Great video showing the service.
    * NOTE: iTunes is not a website! It can only be accessed from the iTunes software run on Mac OS X (now) and Windows (by the end of the year.)
    * I highly suggest trying it for yourself. If you don't have a Mac, use a friend's. Enter your credit card info and actually buy a song. Tell it to store your info for future purchases. Buy a few more songs with the one-click system. I'm serious. You should try it yourself to really experience how amazingly cool it is.
    * They're using a DRM called Fairplay to make sure you can't put these songs on the internet and have them play on another player.

    Current Stats:

    * There are 6-7 million copies of iTunes in use.
    * 3.5 million songs sold so far. Selling about 500,000 songs a week now.
    * More than 75% of songs have sold at least once. There is a wide breadth in purchasing. This is not only fueled by hits.
    * 45% of all songs have been bought as an album. In other words: don't worry about the death of the album format. 45% of people prefer to buy as an album anyway, even though they always have the option to only buy per-song.
    * 90% of sales are 1-click downloads. (1-click is where customer has credit card stored on file, so that as soon as they click a song title, it starts downloading and their credit card is automatically charged.)
    * 10 previews (free 30 second listen) for every purchase. Meaning: 10 listens per buy.

    Price of music on iTunes

    * Songs must be 99 cents each.
    * Full albums are recommended to be $9.99 or lower.
    * Album price must be less than or equal to the sum of their tracks. So if you have a 5-song album, it can't be more than $4.95 to buy the full-length album.
    * Apple strongly recommends going even lower than $9.99. They'd like to see that price drop to make the full-album purchase even more desirable.
    * Only exception: if a song is over 7 minutes long, they won't offer it as a separate download. It will be available as part of the album only.
    * There is no cost to put your music on iTunes.
    * There will be no up-front advance from Apple.
    * Details on the wholesale price to the label will be mailed to us, later.

    Sales report to SoundScan

    * Apple is reporting all iTunes sales to SoundScan!
    * SoundScan measures per-song not per-album.
    * So if someone buys your whole album, each track on the album is reported as a song sale.
    * SoundScan requested to do it that way. It was their idea, not Apple's.

    About positioning and getting attention on iTunes

    * Apple has hired an editorial staff with backgrounds in music to decide what gets featured.
    * Editorial team makes decisions every day as to what goes where.
    * Big labels don't get preferential treatment.
    * "We pick music we like, and we think everyone else is going to like."
    * "We've had a lot of people offer money", but Apple refuses money, and has no plan to ev
  • by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 06, 2003 @02:34PM (#6133902)
    here are the deatils...

    I got an invitation to go to Apple's office for a presentation/meeting today (June 5, 2003) about how to get independent artists into the iTunes Music Store. There were about 150 people there, representatives from the best independent record labels and music services, in this invitation-only conference room. Steve Jobs came out and started a two and a half hour presentation/seminar/Q&A about iTunes and the benefits of independent labels making their music available there. I type fast and had my laptop, so I wrote down all the major points of their presentation as they went.

    NOTE: I've skipped the super-basic introduction to iTunes and what it does, because that can be found so many other places. This is the stuff that I felt was most important to musicians:
    The basics

    * The basics of iTunes Music Store are covered in many places, so if you haven't used iTunes Music store yet, read these links first:
    * Apple's iTunes Music Store website.
    * Great video showing the service.
    * NOTE: iTunes is not a website! It can only be accessed from the iTunes software run on Mac OS X (now) and Windows (by the end of the year.)
    * I highly suggest trying it for yourself. If you don't have a Mac, use a friend's. Enter your credit card info and actually buy a song. Tell it to store your info for future purchases. Buy a few more songs with the one-click system. I'm serious. You should try it yourself to really experience how amazingly cool it is.
    * They're using a DRM called Fairplay to make sure you can't put these songs on the internet and have them play on another player.

    Current Stats:

    * There are 6-7 million copies of iTunes in use.
    * 3.5 million songs sold so far. Selling about 500,000 songs a week now.
    * More than 75% of songs have sold at least once. There is a wide breadth in purchasing. This is not only fueled by hits.
    * 45% of all songs have been bought as an album. In other words: don't worry about the death of the album format. 45% of people prefer to buy as an album anyway, even though they always have the option to only buy per-song.
    * 90% of sales are 1-click downloads. (1-click is where customer has credit card stored on file, so that as soon as they click a song title, it starts downloading and their credit card is automatically charged.)
    * 10 previews (free 30 second listen) for every purchase. Meaning: 10 listens per buy.

    Price of music on iTunes

    * Songs must be 99 cents each.
    * Full albums are recommended to be $9.99 or lower.
    * Album price must be less than or equal to the sum of their tracks. So if you have a 5-song album, it can't be more than $4.95 to buy the full-length album.
    * Apple strongly recommends going even lower than $9.99. They'd like to see that price drop to make the full-album purchase even more desirable.
    * Only exception: if a song is over 7 minutes long, they won't offer it as a separate download. It will be available as part of the album only.
    * There is no cost to put your music on iTunes.
    * There will be no up-front advance from Apple.
    * Details on the wholesale price to the label will be mailed to us, later.

    Sales report to SoundScan

    * Apple is reporting all iTunes sales to SoundScan!
    * SoundScan measures per-song not per-album.
    * So if someone buys your whole album, each track on the album is reported as a song sale.
    * SoundScan requested to do it that way. It was their idea, not Apple's.

    About positioning and getting attention on iTunes

    * Apple has hired an editorial staff with backgrounds in music to decide what gets featured.
    * Editorial team makes decisions every day as to what goes where.
    * Big labels don't get preferential treatment.
    * "We pick music we like, and we think everyone else is going to like."
    * "We've had a lot of people offer money", but Apple refuses money, and has no plan to ever accept money for placement.
    * Even what looks like a banner ad at the top of the screen is put there by App
  • Details pulled but.. (Score:4, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 06, 2003 @02:39PM (#6133954)
    According to a post in the MacRumors [macrumors.com] forums from CDBaby the details were pulled and here's why:

    --------------
    It wasn't wrath or lawyers that asked me to pull it. It was a friend of mine that works there.

    I sincerely didn't know yesterday's presentation was supposed to be confidential. In fact I thought it was like an indie-music press conference.

    Nobody's mad, though. Honest mistake.

    Sorry guys!

    --
    Derek Sivers, CD Baby
    http://www.cdbaby.com

    --------------

    But.... here it is anyhow...

    I got an invitation to go to Apple's office for a presentation/meeting today (June 5, 2003) about how to get independent artists into the iTunes Music Store. There were about 150 people there, representatives from the best independent record labels and music services, in this invitation-only conference room. Steve Jobs came out and started a two and a half hour presentation/seminar/Q&A about iTunes and the benefits of independent labels making their music available there. I type fast and had my laptop, so I wrote down all the major points of their presentation as they went.

    NOTE: I've skipped the super-basic introduction to iTunes and what it does, because that can be found so many other places. This is the stuff that I felt was most important to musicians:
    The basics

    * The basics of iTunes Music Store are covered in many places, so if you haven't used iTunes Music store yet, read these links first:
    * Apple's iTunes Music Store website.
    * Great video showing the service.
    * NOTE: iTunes is not a website! It can only be accessed from the iTunes software run on Mac OS X (now) and Windows (by the end of the year.)
    * I highly suggest trying it for yourself. If you don't have a Mac, use a friend's. Enter your credit card info and actually buy a song. Tell it to store your info for future purchases. Buy a few more songs with the one-click system. I'm serious. You should try it yourself to really experience how amazingly cool it is.
    * They're using a DRM called Fairplay to make sure you can't put these songs on the internet and have them play on another player.

    Current Stats:

    * There are 6-7 million copies of iTunes in use.
    * 3.5 million songs sold so far. Selling about 500,000 songs a week now.
    * More than 75% of songs have sold at least once. There is a wide breadth in purchasing. This is not only fueled by hits.
    * 45% of all songs have been bought as an album. In other words: don't worry about the death of the album format. 45% of people prefer to buy as an album anyway, even though they always have the option to only buy per-song.
    * 90% of sales are 1-click downloads. (1-click is where customer has credit card stored on file, so that as soon as they click a song title, it starts downloading and their credit card is automatically charged.)
    * 10 previews (free 30 second listen) for every purchase. Meaning: 10 listens per buy.

    Price of music on iTunes

    * Songs must be 99 cents each.
    * Full albums are recommended to be $9.99 or lower.
    * Album price must be less than or equal to the sum of their tracks. So if you have a 5-song album, it can't be more than $4.95 to buy the full-length album.
    * Apple strongly recommends going even lower than $9.99. They'd like to see that price drop to make the full-album purchase even more desirable.
    * Only exception: if a song is over 7 minutes long, they won't offer it as a separate download. It will be available as part of the album only.
    * There is no cost to put your music on iTunes.
    * There will be no up-front advance from Apple.
    * Details on the wholesale price to the label will be mailed to us, later.

    Sales report to SoundScan

    * Apple is reporting all iTunes sales to SoundScan!
    * SoundScan measures per-song not per-album.
    * So if someone buys your whole album, each track on the album is reported as a song sale.
    * SoundScan requested to do it that way. It was their idea
  • by computerme ( 655703 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @02:40PM (#6133966)
    Found this on the macnn boards:

    Sorry - I took the details down from that page. It wasn't wrath or lawyers that asked me to pull it. It was a friend of mine that works there. I sincerely didn't know yesterday's presentation was supposed to be confidential. In fact I thought it was like an indie-music press conference. Nobody's mad, though. Honest mistake. Sorry guys!

    -- Derek Sivers, CD Baby http://www.cdbaby.com
  • Re:It's almost there (Score:2, Informative)

    by amichalo ( 132545 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @02:40PM (#6133967)
    RTFA

    Apple stated you MUST use a lable to sell music and it would not support people posting their own tracks on iTMS.

    Further, the FA says participation by a lable in the iTMS is invitation only.

    RTFA
  • by VValdo ( 10446 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @02:40PM (#6133973)
    The "What Jobs taketh away.." article refers to Andromeda [turnstyle.com], a $35 web-based file streaming program.

    There is a free GPL'd alternative, ZINA [pancake.org] (Zina Is Not Andromeda) as well as other solutions [sourceforge.net]. A search of freshmeat.net [freshmeat.net] for "jukebox" will reveal even more...

    W
  • Re:mac problem (Score:5, Informative)

    by Midnight Thunder ( 17205 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @02:44PM (#6133996) Homepage Journal
    Okay I take the bait:

    You are running an OS that was written 13 years before you bought your Mac and was updated with more and more features, meaning in many cases unoptimized bloat. I am guessing you are running MacOS 9, and this does not have many of the low-level features of a modern OS. The multi-tasking used by the OS is cooperative, so if one process hogs the CPU no other app gets a chance. Other things to take into account is that the OS has virtual memory (the OS doesn't differentiate between what is real and what isn't, when allocating memory) and not swap space, so this can also affect performance if you are trying to do a lot at once.

    Windows NT on the other hand had a lot of new code and was essentially a new OS and was written with many of the modern features you would expect from an OS. I am not so sure Windows 95/98 would be performing as well on this machine. One thing you don't say is how much memory you have on that PC, since memory make a LOT of differnce.

    MacOS X is the Apple's new OS and has plenty of modern facilities, which should make it fly. The problem is the eye candy and all the other GUI stuff which adds an extra load to the CPU. The OS is improving and is getting faster. In theory if MacOS X had the same GUI as MacOS 9 (in other words one which requires less processing), I am sure that you find it running fast ion the 8600.
  • by UnknowingFool ( 672806 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @02:47PM (#6134027)
    The difference between check and cheque is the same between color and colour, humor and humour, authorize and authorise. The spelling is different especially on differnt sides of the Atlantic. If the person writing the article is American, it's not wrong.
  • Re:DRM (Score:2, Informative)

    by Frac ( 27516 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @02:50PM (#6134042)
    the logical way to handle it is to use the "Artist's Website" feature of the music store to provide a link to an external site from which DRM-free MP3s can be downloaded.

    Nope.

    Quoted from the original article:

    What you CAN'T do

    * You can not sell an album as album-only format without allowing the purchase of single-songs.
    * Can't search by record label, although you can see the record label on the album info page.
    * There will be no links from iTunes to your website, or to buy the physical CD.
    * Right now there are no sub-genres, only big genres. (rock/jazz/etc.)
  • by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 06, 2003 @02:54PM (#6134066)
    But with previewing before buying it won't be a new untested album.... that's part of the beauty of it
  • by Palshife ( 60519 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @02:57PM (#6134087) Homepage
    Apple never promised the feature that was taken out of iTunes 4.0. It was made clear in the license agreement as to what would be possible. The feature was an oversight, a bug, that was corrected in 4.1. Apple had to pull it because it wasn't supposed to be there in the first place.
  • by berniecase ( 20853 ) * on Friday June 06, 2003 @02:59PM (#6134103) Homepage Journal
    Well, let's see. I've bought close to 70 songs from the music store. I'm mostly buying stuff that I didn't have already. I've bought only one album, and single tracks apart from that.

    So, if Apple says there are 3 million OS X users (I don't have the exact number), let's take a conservative estimate of maybe 6 or 7 songs per user. That's 19.5 million songs. The iTunes music store was started on 28 April, and if 500,000 songs a day are sold (on average), then you end up with the numbers stated above. I don't think this is too hard to achieve.

    Of course, my math could be horribly horribly wrong. I'm sure someone will point that out :-)
  • Reasons for removal (Score:1, Informative)

    by rjaredp ( 679449 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @03:12PM (#6134189)
    I posted this as part of a thread but here it is again. This is post by Derek at the MacRumors forum: sorry - took the details down It wasn't wrath or lawyers that asked me to pull it. It was a friend of mine that works there. I sincerely didn't know yesterday's presentation was supposed to be confidential. In fact I thought it was like an indie-music press conference. Nobody's mad, though. Honest mistake. Sorry guys! -- Derek Sivers, CD Baby http://www.cdbaby.com
  • by Monkey-Man2000 ( 603495 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @03:15PM (#6134213)
    (Plus Steve Jobs reminded us they have $41 billion in the bank and are not in debt. They're not desparate for cash.)

    Is that right? I've never heard they had that much cash in the bank. Doesn't that mean they have about as much cash as Microsoft? That just doesn't sound right to me.
  • by jchapman16 ( 300859 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @03:21PM (#6134252) Homepage
    "Sign up for Earthlink" is one of the options in the internet setup along with "LAN", "Airport", and others. Earthlink isn't paying Apple for this; Apple actually invested in Earthlink several years ago. Personally, I think Apple wants to make sure there's at least one Mac-friendly independent ISP (not AOL or Microsoft).
  • by Rude Turnip ( 49495 ) <valuation.gmail@com> on Friday June 06, 2003 @03:22PM (#6134260)
    Form an S-corp. It's net income is your income...and you can deduct expenses obviously.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 06, 2003 @03:29PM (#6134319)
    Yes, that's true, but look at the reason behind it.

    When Apple originally thunk up the iMac, the idea was to create a computer that could be out of the box and on the internet in something like ten minutes. In those days, broadband was unheard of. So they had to have a worldwide ISP partner so customers who bought iMacs could be up and running quickly and easily.

    There were two choices. One: start their own ISP. (Bad idea. Been done. Failed.) Two: partner with a worldwide ISP. (Good idea.)

    So now, when you start your new Mac, you're given four choices. One: sign up for an Earthlink account. Two: plug in the information about an existing dial-up ISP account. Three: use Ethernet instead. Four: skip networking altogether.

    That's the last time you get asked about Earthlink.

    Compare this to Windows, where every new computer comes with half a dozen third-party icons right on the desktop.

    The point is valid.
  • by tbone1 ( 309237 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @03:30PM (#6134335) Homepage
    That's a typo. It's probably $4.1 billion, and Apple is always said to have "about $4 billion in cash reserves".

  • by ablair ( 318858 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @03:33PM (#6134386)

    "Check" (the noun) in this instance is an incorrect spelling of the word that has become so ubiquitous it is now considered an alternate spelling. For Americans, it is becoming the only recognized correct spelling.

    "Seems to suggest that "check" is the correct modern spelling and that people writing "cheque" are just weird, or "chiefly British"

    Case in point (your link to Merriam-Webster is an American dictionary). Along with the weird "cheifly British" folk you can also include Canadians, Australians, New Zealanders, Indians, South Africans, etc... almost the entire English-speaking world outside the US.
  • by SoLoatWork ( 187259 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @03:35PM (#6134406)

    The iTunes Music Store requires: * A Macintosh computer (iBook, PowerBook, iMac, eMac or Power Mac) * Mac OS X 10.1.5 or later. (version 10.2.5 or later recommended) * iTunes 4 must be installed * Internet connection (DSL, Cable or LAN connection recommended) * Apple ID or .Mac account. If you donâ(TM)t have one, itâ(TM)s easy to sign-up. * The iTunes Music Store is only available in the U.S.

  • Re:Apple Policy (Score:3, Informative)

    by Have Blue ( 616 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @03:42PM (#6134478) Homepage
    Apple did not prevent LAN streaming. They prevented *Internet* streaming. You can still stream to the same subnet.
  • by dbrutus ( 71639 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @03:49PM (#6134575) Homepage
    You can get the most recent cash number here [yahoo.com]. As of the most recent quarter it's 4.53, slowly creeping up from 4 over the last few quarters.
  • by ablair ( 318858 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @03:51PM (#6134597)

    From the notes:

    "Rights are a 3 year term. For iTunes only, of course. This is totally non-exclusive."

    Apple apparently asks that you license them to sell your song for 3 year stints, but non-exclusivity means you can also sell your music wherever and however else you want.
  • by dbrutus ( 71639 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @03:58PM (#6134667) Homepage
    Actually, Apple agreed never to get into the music business and paid to retain the name of Apple. When they started putting in alert sounds, Apple lawyers cautioned that Apple Records could sue over it so they called the first sound released sosumi ( pronounced so sue me). They have always had a weak position with regards to the name Apple and it's always been weakest w/regards to the use of it in the music business.

    The Beatles will look at it and might or might not sue but I'm sure that there is a very carefully crafted legal strategy ready in case they do.
  • by VValdo ( 10446 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @04:06PM (#6134777)
    Uh. What? Why are you posting about Windows programs here on a Mac thread?

    Umm. What makes you think that Andromeda and the other streaming applications have anything to do with Windows? They all run w/ Apache (cross-platform, including OS X), PHP (cross-platform, including OS X), and stream to any mp3 player (including iTunes)

    The "what Jobs taketh away" crack is nothing more or less than Michael being his normal idiot self. It doesn't actually refer to anything, much less some piece of shit Windows hack that looks so absurd up next to DAAP and Rendezvous that you should be ashamed for even thinking of it.

    Again... I was referring to the Wired article [wired.com] that Michael was linking to, and not anything that is a "Windows hack".

    Sigh.

    W

  • by stripes ( 3681 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @04:13PM (#6134848) Homepage Journal
    What "hidden features" are there in TiVo?

    There is a 30 second comercial skip. If you do some more serious work (30 second skip is "press the right 3 magic buttons...possiabbly after searching for a show with the right magic name") you can get to the login shell on the TiVo & do all manner of stuff...including putting your own web or e-mail interface on the "record stuff" feature, or extracting video, or inserting it. It is a whole lot more work to do that though, way way more on anything other then the old series 1 stand alone models.

  • by butane_bob2003 ( 632007 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @04:13PM (#6134853) Homepage
    The artist is almost never payed directly, unless the label screwed up the contracts royally. Very simply put, the label owns the rights to the mechanical reproduction, any one who licenses it (Apple) pays the label a rate to do so. The artist is payed based on the percentage of the rate they are entitled to as specified in their co-publishing agreement under 'royalties'.
    I hope this is informative!
  • Re:Ho hum (Score:4, Informative)

    by BlaisePascal ( 50039 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @04:30PM (#6135015)
    Actually, a quote earlier indicated that Apple didn't want to deal with 200 lawyers. That, as much as anything, explains why they are channeling things through labels and partners.

    It also mean fewer checks that need to be cut every month, fewer reports to be generated, etc.

    Obviously, if they wanted to deal with CD Baby (who does all the essential services of a label, but will work for anyone for $35 plus $4/album), they aren't trying to shut people out.
  • Re:Album sales (Score:2, Informative)

    by milkman_matt ( 593465 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @04:37PM (#6135095)
    -- but the CD's so scratched I can't get a good rip of it).

    Slightly O/T, but, Informative too I hope :) I've got that problem too, half the CDs I own won't hardly play they're so scratched, (and I took good care of them too, 100cd caselogic book. I think the book scratched them up a good deal) Anyhow, I tried out that electric 'disc dr.' thing and it cleans up CDs -really- nicely. Anyhow, you could always burn yourself a new copy once you download it, but it's always nice to not waste a CD when you can salvage it y'know?

    -matt

  • by dadragon ( 177695 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @04:39PM (#6135120) Homepage
    Spelling check "cheque" is different from what the average person expects. It is, therefore, wrong.

    Simple rule: "Check" is a verb. "Cheque" is a noun referring to a bank note used for transferring currenecy to another person or corporation.

    It's correct in every English speaking country outside the USA, and is therefore correct. Check is wrong here.

  • Re:Album sales (Score:4, Informative)

    by stripes ( 3681 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @04:39PM (#6135122) Homepage Journal
    Your thought was right, you get billed for all the purchases made in a day. I've not yet bought tunes on consecutive days to know if they'd lump two days together or not.

    They tend to bundle charges made in 48 hour periods together [rentzsch.com].

  • by Theaetetus ( 590071 ) <theaetetus,slashdot&gmail,com> on Friday June 06, 2003 @04:41PM (#6135142) Homepage Journal
    Apple doesn't want songs over 7-minutes sold as songs-only due to bandwidth costs ($.99 for a 3-minute song or $.99 for a 15-minute song... not quite fair, is it?)

    As for the paradox, the quote from the article says that you can't insist that your album be sold album-only. However, I assume that in the case of an album with over-7-minute songs only, it would be sold as album-only.

    This is a good thing, though, when you think about it... We're all pissed at the big labels for their game of one or two singles and tons of filler and then insisting we buy the whole album. Steve stepped up and said no, you can not make an album to be sold album-only (although, you could simply make all the songs really long... but the labels aren't going to do that - they still want radio airplay, which means shorter songs). The no-album-only sales simply prevents 'filler' albums.

    -T

  • Re:mac problem (Score:5, Informative)

    by AKAImBatman ( 238306 ) <akaimbatman@gmaYEATSil.com minus poet> on Friday June 06, 2003 @04:47PM (#6135212) Homepage Journal
    This is insightful?! Ok, so he was right up to the "too expensive part". But those of you who think that Apple's are too expensive, should go check out the price of iBooks [apple.com]. Starting at $999 for a loaded packge including DVD/CD Burner combo, firewire, a *really* nice keyboard, OSX, a high powered 3D card, and of course iTunes itself.
  • by JJahn ( 657100 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @04:55PM (#6135279)
    You're right, as long as there is only one stockholder of the corporation. Otherwise it gets a bit trickier. However, you do have to fill out an IRS form to become an S corp., and then fill out a different one every year stating the earnings. So it is more work.
  • by gwernol ( 167574 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @04:58PM (#6135310)
    While the CD Baby page has not been taken down, its been neutered - all relevant info has been removed and I think its obvious why.

    Apple only gets about 6-12 months to have their innovations be innovations before someone else copies them.. putting out the info now, instead of in the 90ish days when the details will all be public, only gives MS and Real a head-start on their idea copying.


    Although that may be part of it, I doubt that's why Apple had them take down the information. I think its because the report contained detailed information about the business model behind iTMS and the relationships between Apple and the music labels. This would be considered sensitive commercial information by Apple and the labels as its wide-spread dissemination could hurt future negotiations for any of the parties involved.

    The technical and product innovations are less problematic because they are essentially public anyway - anyone can get an iTMS account and try out the product features for themselves. The business agreements behind the scenes are not public and are usually closely guarded secrets.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 06, 2003 @05:17PM (#6135477)
    Sorry - I took the details down from that page.

    It wasn't wrath or lawyers that asked me to pull it. It was a friend of mine that works there.

    I sincerely didn't know yesterday's presentation was supposed to be confidential. In fact I thought it was like an indie-music press conference.

    Nobody's mad, though. Honest mistake.

    Sorry guys!

    --
    Derek Sivers, CD Baby
    http://www.cdbaby.com
  • Re:It's almost there (Score:3, Informative)

    by BlaisePascal ( 50039 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @05:21PM (#6135516)
    The article was written by a guy at CD Baby. CD Baby's pitch is that they are a online music store will sell anyones album and even issue the artist a UPC for their album if they want one, all for a reasonably low setup fee and per-copy fee.

    He was invited to this invitation-only meeting, where Apple was pitching their indie-contract to indie lables. Obviously, Apple thinks that CD Baby would qualify as a "label" or a "partner", and act as a gateway for Apple.

    If that's the case, then anybody who submits their album to CD Baby could potentially ask for it to be sent on to iTunes. Anybody. Of course, there may be a higher setup fee for that, as its more work for CD Baby.

    He didn't see a contract, so it's unclear how much money the "labels" are getting per song or album sold. CD Baby's current model is the artist sets the album retail price, and CD Baby takes a fixed cut per copy sold for their share of the retail price. I imagine in this case, of the $0.99/song, Apple will take a cut, and then CD Baby will take a cut, but who can tell how big those cuts will be?
  • by Rude Turnip ( 49495 ) <valuation.gmail@com> on Friday June 06, 2003 @06:11PM (#6135826)
    You have to fill out a tax return every year if you're an individual, too. It's slightly more work to be a corp, but it's worth it for two reasons:

    1. It's a business and so the expenses are deductible. 2. Limited liability.

    If there is more than one shareholder, you divy up the income by percentage. I have tons of small-business type clients that are S-corps and LLCs. Their financial statements and tax returns
    are really easy to read, moreso than personal returns.
  • Re:mac problem (Score:3, Informative)

    by Phroggy ( 441 ) * <slashdot3@ p h roggy.com> on Friday June 06, 2003 @07:35PM (#6136256) Homepage
    Unfortunately, as much as I wish it were otherwise, a lot of the people saying "Macs are more expensive" are actually right. Yes, Apple's laptops are price-competetive, but their desktops really aren't, especially when you're looking at speed.

    Case in point: it sure would be nice if I could play Unreal Tournament 2003. My 700MHz eMac will sort of attempt to run it, but at the lowest settings it's too slow to be playable. I'm told this is largely due to the video card (32MB GeForce2 MX) rather than the processor, although I don't really know.

    A 1GHz eMac with a 32MB Radeon 7500 is $999.
    A 1GHz iMac with a 32MB GeForce4 MX is $1799.
    A 1GHz PowerMac with 64MB GeForce4 MX is $1499 (plus monitor).
    A dual 1.25GHz PowerMac with a 64MB Radeon 9000 Pro is $1999 (plus monitor).

    Would the $1499 PowerMac be fast enough to make me happy playing that game? Maybe, I'm not sure. I bet the $999 eMac wouldn't be. I can build a 2.4GHz Athlon system with a nice video card for a hell of a lot less than that, even if you add the cost of Windows.

    Of course this has nothing to do with iTunes, which works beautifully.
  • by amichalo ( 132545 ) on Friday June 06, 2003 @10:51PM (#6136943)
    I know this is way off topic but for $799 plus tax and S&H Apple selling overstock/returned/refurbished iBooks (G3/CD/20GB/700MHz/128k) for $799. I just ordered one for my grand parents.

    There are other models too - with combo drive and faster processors. Take a look at The Apple Store [slashdot.org] and click the link on the lower left bottom of the page to "Special Deals: great prices on limited offers".

    It's a good way to get a Mac without blowing a lot of money and if you like it, eBay the one you bought and your Wintel/Linux box and get a more expensive new Mac.
  • Re:CD Baby (Score:2, Informative)

    by gmhowell ( 26755 ) <gmhowell@gmail.com> on Friday June 06, 2003 @11:46PM (#6137134) Homepage Journal
    Read this [slashdot.org], which claims to be the entire original text. The author (who runs CD Baby) says he will do this.

Today is a good day for information-gathering. Read someone else's mail file.

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