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Apple Updates, Cripples iTunes 653

A user writes "Apple has issued an update to iTunes 4, iTunes 4.0.1. It can be downloaded via Software Update. The big change seems to be that iTunes will now only stream music to other Macs on the same subnet. This is presumably a response to people publishing public lists of shared iTunes playlists, though it does mean that anyone wanting to stream music from home to work or vice versa is SOL. Oh well." You can't share between 4.0 and 4.0.1 iTunes, so be careful in updating. AppleScript access to shared playlist tracks is fixed, though. Woop woop.
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Apple Updates, Cripples iTunes

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  • VPNs (Score:5, Interesting)

    by MBCook ( 132727 ) <foobarsoft@foobarsoft.com> on Tuesday May 27, 2003 @06:07PM (#6051925) Homepage
    I don't have access to a Mac (let alone two) but couldn't you use a VPN if you wanted to stream from home to work or vice versa? You know, tunnel the traffic so it looks like one local network even though it isn't?
  • Re:VPNs (Score:5, Interesting)

    by JoeBuck ( 7947 ) on Tuesday May 27, 2003 @06:08PM (#6051939) Homepage

    Certainly, or use SSH port forwarding.

  • Re:VPNs (Score:2, Interesting)

    by kwerle ( 39371 ) <kurt@CircleW.org> on Tuesday May 27, 2003 @06:12PM (#6051978) Homepage Journal
    Certainly, or use SSH port forwarding.

    Anyone tested to see if this works - especially the ssh tunneling?
  • Re:VPNs (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Bigbluejerk ( 535787 ) on Tuesday May 27, 2003 @06:13PM (#6051992)
    Couldn't Apple have just added encryption to iTunes streaming?
  • by SharpFang ( 651121 ) on Tuesday May 27, 2003 @06:15PM (#6052010) Homepage Journal
    ...to create a "hotfix" for that? I guess that's 5 mins work and a 3k binary to repair this, for a skilled person... Then just put the "hotfix" along with your music list...
  • by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 27, 2003 @06:22PM (#6052063)
    Or better yet ... buy an iPod!
  • Re:And so it begins (Score:5, Interesting)

    by gsfprez ( 27403 ) on Tuesday May 27, 2003 @06:23PM (#6052081)
    No, i'm complaining, and i'm sure others will as well.

    Apple is rapidly approaching a point that their only saving grace is that there is nary a hint that Apple is actively maintaining rights to my Mac to disable any software that may do this, if iTunes 4 won't - such as in XP, w2k, etc.

    If/when that happens, then yeah, i will remove X and install YDL on the whole damn hard drive.
  • by SweetAndSourJesus ( 555410 ) <.moc.oohay. .ta. .toboRehTdnAsuseJ.> on Tuesday May 27, 2003 @06:28PM (#6052131)
    Apple's Music Store allows you to authorize up to three Macs to play your purchased music. They could have allowed you to share music with any machine that has your key. This would satisfy the "want to listen to home music at work" request while still meeting their responsibility not to allow outright piracy.
  • Re:Here We Go Again (Score:3, Interesting)

    by mcc ( 14761 ) <amcclure@purdue.edu> on Tuesday May 27, 2003 @06:47PM (#6052293) Homepage
    this is not the crippling of iTunes

    I'm an iTunes user, and I say its music sharing is crippled. I don't care what apple's intentions are, if I can no longer use a tool for the purpose I keep it around for, then it's crippled, at least from a semantic standpoint.

    Apple worked very hard to get the RIAA to soften up as much as it has with DRM in the iTunes Music Store.

    "As much as it has"? Dude, the mp3-streaming thing was just about the only thing that separated Apple's DRM from the DRM schemes on previous pay-for-online-music services. There have been a number of limited-location install schemes where you could only listen to the mp3s on one platform in one music player that you could buy music through before, but iTunes was different because you could go somewhere else and still *listen* to the music, even if it wasn't local. Not anymore.

    If you don't like the terms, don't buy the music.

    OK.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 27, 2003 @06:49PM (#6052309)
    Because that's why companies pay for a high bandwidth net connection. So their employees can waste it all on streaming music from their home machine to their work machine.

    Yes, that's sarcasm. Do your companies know that you are wasting their bandwidth and money on music streaming? That would not be tolerated here. It could lead to disciplinary action or even dismissal.
  • Re:fair use? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by diverman ( 55324 ) on Tuesday May 27, 2003 @06:49PM (#6052314)
    Great idea, unless the machine I use at work is my personal PowerBook trying to access my PowerMac at home. The point of putting the music on my PowerMac was that I wouldn't be taking up 1/3 of my PowerBook HDD space for music.

    And most of the music I have to share are MP3s from my own CDs. I actually don't have any pirated music in my collection (well, maybe 2-3 songs... but that's all). It has nothing to do with authorization, in my case, but rather sharing.

    I know that there are strong legal reasons, but the paranoia in me can't help wonder what this change will do to sales of the iPods. Could it possibly drive up sales as the only method to make your music portable? Hmmm...

    This change is truly disappointing to me.

    -Alex
  • by djupedal ( 584558 ) on Tuesday May 27, 2003 @06:58PM (#6052377)
    "Optimized for local MP3, OGG and WMA audio content, but also supports internet radio streams, other audio formats, and/or remote content by adding them manually."

    Did you go to the site and check it out [sourceforge.net]? Netjuke simply provides mtu's (or streams, in conjunction with ShoutCast, QTTS, etc.)....the 'play' ability depends on the player on the client side. It is a web based interface, and if your OS and client support a given format you're good to go. We already know how to convert AAC files...
  • Re:VPNs (Score:1, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 27, 2003 @07:05PM (#6052431)
    You're right in principal; there is a potential for trouble when you stack TCPs. However, that problem is just as relevant when tunneling a single port over ssh as it is when you vpn your whole connection. And, in practice, I haven't seen it be a problem. I use ppp over ssh regularly, and often have ssh sessions with tunneled ports going over the ppp connection (yes, thats right, four TCP layers when I tunnel my pop :)

    It seems like this would break down, but it usually doesn't. And when it does, restarting the outmost ssh (the one with the ppp going over it) is all it takes to get back online. If the ip's are the same, the inner ssh connections are usually persistant enough to stay alive.

    This post is going over an ssh -D socks proxy, which in turn is going over a ppp over ssh tunnel. So thats IP( TCP( SSH( PPP( IP( TCP( SSH( SOCKS( TCP( HTTP ))))))))) 9 layers of encapsulation where there would usually be IP( TCP( HTTP)) 2. And you know what? I've been wasting time on slashdot like this all morning, without trouble. And, thanks to ssh, nobody at work sees anything but port 22 traffic coming from my port on the switch!
  • Hmm (Score:2, Interesting)

    by General Sherman ( 614373 ) on Tuesday May 27, 2003 @09:10PM (#6053241) Journal
    I suspect that Apple did the AppleScript update first, and then under pressure from the recording companies that so graciously allowed the lame DRM that iTunes had, they stopped the WAN sharing. But honestly, how long could that last? At least they still let you do LAN sharing, which if you're at an office or something like that could be quite nice.

    Shared office music library. Push your copanies T3 line to the max.
  • Comment removed (Score:5, Interesting)

    by account_deleted ( 4530225 ) on Tuesday May 27, 2003 @09:45PM (#6053421)
    Comment removed based on user account deletion
  • It supports AAC (Score:3, Interesting)

    by phpsocialclub ( 575460 ) on Tuesday May 27, 2003 @09:49PM (#6053439) Homepage
    My roommate, Blake is the leader of the netjuke project. Although we both think AAC is crap, it is supported in Netjuke. If you player is enabled to play a file it will play. Netjuke can also effortless support huge collections, unlike itunes
  • by mikew03 ( 186778 ) on Tuesday May 27, 2003 @11:42PM (#6053969)
    Have you actually tried it and listened to the results? It actually works fairly well. If you have $10,000 speakers at home then what are you doing listening to any form of compressed music? But for most of us it sounds just fine.
  • well then (Score:0, Interesting)

    by SweetAndSourJesus ( 555410 ) <.moc.oohay. .ta. .toboRehTdnAsuseJ.> on Wednesday May 28, 2003 @02:00AM (#6054628)
    I guess your cunning retort defeats his entire argument. Thank you, oh wise one, for contributing so much to the discussion.
  • Re:VPNs (Score:3, Interesting)

    by pigeon ( 909 ) on Wednesday May 28, 2003 @03:06AM (#6054861) Homepage
    Or you could use Zina, which is like Andromeda, but free, where andromeda costs money... (although andromeda may be more mature). Isn't open source great?
  • by Peer ( 137534 ) on Wednesday May 28, 2003 @03:29AM (#6054945) Homepage
    Help. Help. I'm being oppressed.

    No you're not (yet). But this simple move by Apple demonstrates that they can and will restrict rights to music you bought.
    There was no need to tunnel stuff, the need has been created by Apple to prevent piracy, but it also restricts fair use.

    There's no garantee that they're not gonna restrict your rights further. This just shows owning the music is better than any DRM solution. What if my Mac died and all I have left is linux-PC with 3000 songs I can't listen to anymore?

  • Re:VPNs (Score:2, Interesting)

    by Kynde ( 324134 ) <kynde@[ ].fi ['iki' in gap]> on Wednesday May 28, 2003 @03:52AM (#6055026)
    this problem is not unique to ssh. any tunneling protocol will suffer the same degradation. seems to me though it should be possible to change the ack timeout or increase the window size for the tunneled tcp connection to smooth out the bumps.

    I never said was unique to ssh, besides not any tunneling protocol will suffer the same degradation. Like I said, for example cipe
    is UDP based simple tunnel.

    Sadly in all implementation of TCP that I'm aware of there are no parameters. But when you think about it the whole TCP as-is, was never developed to be run on reliable medium and no simple parametrization will help there. When run on reliable transport the whole sendwindow and timer mechanisms should be altered.

    Point being, tcp is not meant for reliable transports and there are no simple tweaks for that either.
  • by Golias ( 176380 ) on Wednesday May 28, 2003 @04:01AM (#6055057)
    Look more closely. This is not a DRM means to "restrict rights to music you bought" from their store. This is a limitation of how you can use the iTunes app. You can't stream off the network with their application.

    You can still play your AAC files purchaced from the iTunes Music Store, even if you Mac "died" (as you put it). For that matter, you can archive all of those files as either AAC or AIFF files on any media you chose, including the HD of your Linux PC (which should be able to support AAC "any day now")

    You seem to have this crazy notion that AAC is another Windows Media Player file alternative, created solely to place ultra restrictions on files and force you to "rent" music rather than purchace it (as a new Microsoft music service is expected to do in a few months). Nothing could be further from the truth. AAC was invented at Dolby for the purpose of offering a better compression algorythm than MP3, and it succeeds briliantly. At a bit-rate of 128, it sounds as good or better than a 192 VBR MP3. Yes, it stores some information in the DRM layer... this is exactly why it will become the new standard. It permits fair use (archiving, copying to other sources, listening on other playback equipment, sharing it with close friends) without allowing you to freely rip off and distribute the files they sell you (and are trying to sell to others) to the entire world.

    Kindly offer one example of "fair use" which is prevented by the DRM restrictions Apple places on the files they sell you (and only the files they sell you). Here's a little help: "Fair Use," according to US copyright law, includes the right to make back-ups, to make copies to other media, to extract samples for educational use. Fare Use does not include the right to make copies available to other people, although the files sold by Apple actually allow that on a limited basis.

    Now, which Fair Use rights do you think we are being denied? We are all very anxious to hear this.

  • by Golias ( 176380 ) on Wednesday May 28, 2003 @04:32AM (#6055152)
    Frankly, I'm not too worried about it. I sneaker net all my crap to work via iPod anyway.

    If I had mod points to give, one would be yours, FRB.

    When I first heard about the iTunes streaming service, I immidiately began speculating about the many ways I would use it. The thought of accessing all of my music from all over my house and even at work, while keeping it all stored on HD that's shared out to everywhere else I go... it seemed like a new Golden Age was dawning.

    But then, for the sake of my CD-less car stereo and listening to music while jogging, I bought an iPod. Once I had the iPod, all these thoughts of streaming completely vanished. I've got my entire record collection in my hip pocket at all times now, and I can listen to it on any music device that I can extend a stereo mini-jack from (which, thanks to RCA-to-mini cables, FM transmitters, and those tape adapter thingies, means damned near everything that has speakers.) Screw streaming from a server... I would need another computer running iTunes to do that. The iPod is the music library now. Every time I get another album (or cave into the desire to download a song off iTMS,) I just rip to my main computer, and sync the iPod to it in a matter of seconds next time I plug in the Firewire cable (which won't be long, since that's how I recharge the iPod 90% of the time).

    I had friends parrot the "iPod will change the way you listen to music," hype to me over the past year or so... and now that I have an iPod, I see the light. You can call us all "pod people" if you like, (or "iPod people"... hmm, "iPeople?") but this tiny little gadget actually was a bigger revolution than I really expected it to be before buying it. Those of you who haven't acquired an iPod yet probably think I'm crazy, but iTunes for Windows comes out at the end of this year and the rest of the world will catch up. I'll see you when you get here. I now value my cheap little iPod more than my car or my TV. The hype was not a lie.

    Fuck streaming.

  • by goldcd ( 587052 ) * on Wednesday May 28, 2003 @05:37AM (#6055312) Homepage
    There's that from the obvious Apple fan-boy (or girl) who will defend Apple to the death - the type who still contends that their $2500 PowerBook is faster than their neighbours £1250 Dell.
    The other is from the DRM hater who believes all music should be free and was gunning for Apple from the moment they announced they'd be charging for music and you wouldn't automatically get mailed CD copies to hand out to strangers in the street.
    I'd like to position myself between these two camps. I'm not a great lover of Macs, but I do have a sneaking admiration for Apple. Apple are the first company that has actually managed to bring the record labels together and produce a service that actually does work. You can search for a tune you want, click and it's in your ears on your Ipod on your way to work the next morning - all legitimately, artists having been paid etc etc.
    The problem as a few people have touched upon is that this update could be the tip of the iceberg - they've changed the way my software operates at the behest of some evil RIAA request, does this mean they'll cave into every whim of them in furutre?
    So far Apple have closed an undocumented 'feature' of their previous offering. They never said you'd be able to do it, so you can't sue them now they've closed it. If you don't like it, don't upgrade, stop using ITunes, put a masonary spike through your ipod and post it back to Steve - otherwise quit whinging.
  • by jtrascap ( 526135 ) <bitbucket.mediaplaza@nl> on Wednesday May 28, 2003 @05:58AM (#6055371)
    It's not SHARING if it's being downloaded.
    Let's look at it this way. What do you define as sharing?

    1) You've got your window open, blaring your radio the 5-person crowd on the street. THIS is iTunes sharing...

    2) You've got your stereo on and are copying your music collection to cd, then placing them on the window sill for anyone to take. Or worse, people are reaching in, up to 5 at a time, and taking those cds without asking you. THIS is what Apple stopped.

    I can't see why this is hard to understand - in the second scenario, you're either distributing or being stolen from, and that's all that's changed.

    You can still tunnel to the Mac if you want, and you can still set up web sharing to give out your music if you want. But *you* have to do it - Apple won't do it for you!

    And can you blame them? (Obviously, some can...maybe we need to start teaching civics and ethics again).
  • by alchemist68 ( 550641 ) on Wednesday May 28, 2003 @08:05AM (#6055673)
    Apple tries to make it convenient for us to have our music where and when we want it. For the few who have abused that privaledge, some freedom is taken away. When are people going to learn NOT to abuse the nice things in life? Apple has resisted the scum and villany at the RIAA, innovated better software than the Borg, and generally has a pretty happy and loyal customer base. Please, idiots, pirates, and unix heads, don't ruin anymore of this great program Apple has GIVEN us. If you keep finding ways to circumvent Apple's safeguards to protect the artists and music industry as well as give is userbase FREEDOM to with their music as they please, there won't be an Apple Music Store for long.

    Stop messing around with iTunes, port numbers, SSH, etc...
  • by rockhome ( 97505 ) on Wednesday May 28, 2003 @08:17AM (#6055705) Journal
    I thought the reason I bought my iPod was so that I could
    carry my tunes with anywhere I went, work, train,
    plane, beach, rental car, bicycle, Segway, 4-wheeler,
    Ski-Do, hang glider, etc.

    Why do I need to stream my music to work? Think about it,
    all the other defenses of Apple make sense, and
    assuming you are all satisfy these criteria :

    1. You can listen to music at work.
    2. You have a persistent connection at home.
    3. Your connection allows you to run incoming services.
    4. You own a Mac.

    I think you can afford an iPod to carry your bleeding tunes
    to work. Honestly, If you can figure out how to update your
    DHCP and run things on high ports so your ISP can't filter,
    I think you ought to be able to get your self an iPod, or some kind of
    portable storage to bring along to work. Why make it hard?

  • Re:simple solution (Score:3, Interesting)

    by pclminion ( 145572 ) on Wednesday May 28, 2003 @09:04AM (#6055984)
    Otherwise, your box just sends out an arp request for every IP you try to connect to, gets nothing back and gives up.

    And about how fast do you think someone will whip up a software ARP proxy? I'm guessing oh... 12 hours?

  • Re:And so it begins (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Lodragandraoidh ( 639696 ) on Wednesday May 28, 2003 @09:47AM (#6056304) Journal
    I think the real issue is that the internet provides the opportunity for a real barter economy - I share something with you; you recipricate.

    The amount of sharing going on on the net does not equal the drop off in record sales. The simple fact of the matter is that what is being produced today is not wanted (dare I say it sucks?), as much as they would like to shove it down our throats. Just because a record is released doesn't mean it should automatically make money (particularly if it sucks).

    I urge anyone reading this to boycott the major record labels, and conversely start donating small amounts to independent OPEN SOURCE record labels - LIKE THIS ONE [opsound.org]

    If you are involved in music just to make money, then you are in it for the wrong reasons. Do us all a favor, and become a used car salesman...
  • Re:simple solution (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Sabalon ( 1684 ) on Wednesday May 28, 2003 @12:24PM (#6058026)
    Yeah...that is way wrong moderated - I was going for funny.

    But based on your description of what would happen, it sounds like I just created a new peer-to-peer network instead :)
  • by mrthoughtful ( 466814 ) on Thursday May 29, 2003 @07:45AM (#6066343) Journal
    In the 'good old days' of 1997, Apple authored a list of "ten commandments" as a part of it's compatibility tech note [apple.com]. It is the seventh commandment which is particularly interesting: "VII. Thou shalt think twice about code designed strictly as copy protection." Note, that these are the the commandments that are "determined from extensive testing of our diverse software base."

    Of course as soon as you choose to make allies in the music industry, you are going to have to negotiate, but one of the primary issues (mentioned so many times on slashdot that there is no point in providing links) is the question of whether we should have our liberty constrained in order to prevent us from breaking the law.

    We would love to say 'No!', but then watch how many of us flaunt copyright law as a standard practice.

    But also Apple was right - copyright protection is an unending waste of human resource, computer resource, comms resource, and slashdot posts!

    Again and again we find that the music/video/text/etc. copyright and patent laws are incompatible with the Internet as a technology, and the Internet is not going to go away. Sorry, lawmakers, but one day soon you will have to wake up to the revolution that came from a direction you didn't expect, and then we will stop having to put kludges on top of kludges to deal with the cultural soup that we are in.

    Creative minds will find a way of being able to provide a direct passage to it's audience. The huge publishing corporates are hanging onto a dying game. Monolithic software corporations are being replaced by interoperability standards.

    Apple, Listen! Remember! Think different!
  • by POds ( 241854 ) on Thursday May 29, 2003 @10:10AM (#6067215) Homepage Journal
    AustralianIT also covers this with their own article [news.com.au]. In this, it states that 3 Million songs have beeen paid for and downloaded so far. This is absolutly amazing. Apples market share is nothing compared to Windows. Imagine if it was even close to have a market share like windows, or imagine if instead each other market share was switched for a moment. Im guess there'd be a hell of a lot of Mp3s being sold. This could eventualy make up a very large part of Apples future. Well, they've said they've been wanting to go into this area for quite a while now, i never really though they'd pull it off though. Looks like they've jumped their first hurdle! :}

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