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Apple Businesses

Why I Ain't Buying A Mac 201

Posted by CmdrTaco from the not-enough-superfluous-animation dept.
gphat writes "An article at Rush Magazine details why the author isn't buying a Mac. This is in response to Apple wanting our input last week."
This discussion has been archived. No new comments can be posted.

Why I Ain't Buying A Mac More

Why I Ain't Buying A Mac

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  • Apple's Market (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Jess ( 11386 ) <gehinjc @ a l u m .mit.edu> on Tuesday April 02, 2002 @12:23PM (#3270533)
    The problem is that this guy is not in Apple's market. Apple is not going after people who want to tinker around with hardware and buy componets that have 0.1% markup. They want to sell to computer *users* like schools, small businesses, and the typical home user (like your mother). With that said, I do have to agree with the price issue that he raised. In the end, most people will probably choose a lower price over a cooler computer (iMac, for example). Apple needs a value line that competes with the $800 PC's.
    • It's the original iMac (iMac Classic). It's priced to sell at $799.

      Big problem is that Apple doesn't push it, and it's targetted at the edu segment. I'm not even sure you can get it if you are not edu.

      If apple put some marketing into this line as well as the iMac line, then that would be great. It would make a well rounded computing lineup.

      IMO, I think apple is not doing this because of three things. 1., they are afraid that it would canabilize their iMac sales. The margin on the Classic can't be that much. 2. It would cost more in terms of having product in the channel and additional production costs. 3. It would add confusion on what you, the consumer, should buy.

      __nether
    • I like to tinker and I'm a Mac owner.

      The result is a dual 550mhz G4 Cube - really!

      Off topic but I'm pretty chuffed as we put it back together a few hours ago and it's still alive.
      It does have a (extra low noise) fan now but it's still almost silent.

      Hope it keeps going:)

    • Re:Apple's Market (Score:2, Informative)

      by PoiBoy ( 525770 )
      They already have something to compete with the $799 Gateways and Dells -- a $799 iMac. Although l337 g33ks may find it sluggish, for the average user it's a great deal. It does everything PC's do, and it's (flame suit on) easier for mom and dad to figure out how to use than a Windows box.
    • "In the end, most people will probably choose a lower price over a cooler computer" By that logic, everyone would drive Geo Metros. I think most comsumers just don't realizes that they have a choice.
      • I think most consumers just don't want to be bothered with something different. In fact, many are downright scared of not being part of the Windows herd.

        It means they actually have to think about their computing decision.

        I think the Apple Stores are going to help a lot here. Definitely the coolest place to buy a computer.

        D

  • So why is this "news"? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Lars T. ( 470328 ) <Lars,Traeger&googlemail,com> on Tuesday April 02, 2002 @12:25PM (#3270564) Journal
    There is absolutely nothing in that article that hasn't been said already. Even the G4 ATX style motherboard isn't a new idea - infact they are being sold (but can't run OS X).
  • 1) Because I can do everything on a PC that I could do on a MAC.
    2) Because I don't need flashy/trendy/cool cases to do my job.
    3) Because I don't want to pay for an OS when I can get one for free.
    4) Linus is much 'cooler' than Steve.
    5) I don't need to make Toy Story 3 on my computer, just recompile a kernel and play Civ3.
    6) I don't want that damn iMac making faces at me.
    • 1) Because I can do everything on a PC that I could do on a MAC.

      You can do everything in assembly language that you can do in your favorite high-level language, too.

      • If Macs were the equivalent of a high-level language, while PCs were the equivalent of assembly, why don't Macs have the equivalent market/mindshare that high-level languages enjoy over assembly? A better analogy might be that you can do everything with Cadillac that you can with a BMW. You can enjoy a nice, luxurious driving experience, while the BMW is basically just flashier and more expensive.
        • Good point, because Cadillacs suck just like PCs. They are ugly, loud, energy wasting and their fans think they offer the same "nice, luxurious driving experience" a BMW does.
        • I sat in a cadillac and a BMW at a recent car show, and the BMW just seemed better put together than a Cadillac. And the costs are about the same. There is no Cadillac below 30k
        • I wasn't equating Macs to high-level languages, although I can see how you might infer that. I was attempting to refute, with a little style, the idea that being able to do x is somehow an argument to do it that way. Apparently I didn't succeed :(

          You may not want to buy a Mac and your reasons may be valid, but the fact that you can do the same things with a PC that you can with a Mac is not a reason to buy one over the other, just as the fact that I can do anything with assembly that I can with *insert favorite language* is not a reason to migrate all your company's apps to assembly.

      • it's so funny that you mention this. My company sells a compiler for the playstation II vector unit. At present everyone who writes code for the ps2vu does so in asm. Can you imagine how stupid it seems trying to talk to people who say that they dont need a compiler cause they can do it in asm? What is most annoying is that some people in my company actually entertain the notion that they may have a point!

    • Re:Why *I* am not buying a Mac (Score:5, Interesting)

      by garren_bagley ( 413546 ) on Tuesday April 02, 2002 @12:38PM (#3270675)
      You cannot do everything on a PC that you can do on a Mac. I bought my first Mac a month ago for the quality of entry level video editing. Within one day I had burned a DVD of my most recent ski vacation with edits and a soundtrack. I tried this for a long time on my PC which was supposedly more powerful and was never satisfied with the results. At one point I upgraded my PC to Windows XP and found it was incompatible with my Microsoft Mouse!

      It is also not possible to do this on Linux, I tried that to. After finally getting firewire to work I found that there were too many incompatible file formats. Maybe you can get it to work but I'm tired of tinkering every night.

      My SGI Irix machine worked fine. HELL! it is just 1 180MHZ RK500 and still seems faster than my PC but I could only get a 4 gig hard drive.

      Everything else I've discovered that I love (iTunes, iPod, iPhoto) is just gravy.
      • Very surprising.
        What audio/video editing software did you use on the PC?
        • I started with IntroDV from Digital Origin and then purchased their upgrade. It worked OK on simple stuff but if I tried putting a soundtrack underneath a transition between clips it would not smoothly render on my 1GHz Compaq.

          I suspect that Imovie2 does better because it renders and saves a whole new clip in the background and Digital Origin tried to render the whole thing live as it was exporting. I thought about getting an ultra-SCSI drive but bought a Mac instead. Glad I did.
        • I own and still use PCs, however I call myself a Mac user. This is always the thing with a PC, "my PC could do that IF...". With Macs, typically you just try something and it works. Not to say the Mac is free of all silly problems, it definitely has some of its own. A greater percentage of my time in front of my Macs is spent accomplishing the tasks I set out to do, instead of dealing with silly Windows (and sometimes silly Linux) problems, for example, figuring out which video software works, let alone which one works best. I can't knock Linux for its stability though, 102 days uptime each for 3 systems before the power failed.

          • "I can do everything on my PC that I can do on a Mac. Of course, there were some driver and integration issues, but what do you expect? Computers are like that. Also, the video software took a while to get used to, but all software is like that. What do you think, I'm some stupid grandmother who can't figure out a few problems? Deal with it. And I don't have a SuperDrive, but who wants that? And the video software couldn't do some things I wanted, but hey, software has limitations. Besides, I can do everything on a PC that I can do on a Mac. I don't need no fancy cases. Computers are tools; you're not supposed to enjoy using them. And it's cheaper, if you don't buy an external SuperDrive, but as I said, who wants that?"

            That's approximately what I hear most of the time.

            I've used PC's and own one. I've also used Amigas, Ataris, NeXT, DEC Vaxen, IBM SYSTEM/360, SGI, every imaginable UN*X, Alpha, DG Nova, Cyber 205, ETA-10, TRS-80, 68HC00 and 1802-based systems I built from chips, and other stuff I can't remember right now. Not to mention overclocking the direct video board on a Thinking Machines CM-2 with 65536 processors.

            I like the Mac. A G4 is my current development/word processing/video editing machine. I have no fear of hacking hardware, but when I feel like doing that, I whip out the breadboards and do it. The Mac gives me something that nothing except the Amiga gives me--an environment where issues were thought out, not always with perfect solutions, but always with a craftsmanship that is a cut above the rest. I spent most of my life and still spend it at work putting together large pieces of software. I like being able to whip out a tool with just a few lines of code in Cocoa; I like being able to have undo/redo from day 1; I like dealing with the products of designers, developers, and engineers who are not my intellectual inferiors, and I don't mind the fact that they make more money than the average code monkey, nor that this money comes out of my pocket. I like having a cooperative rather than an adversarial relationship with those who write the API's I use.

            Some people don't like that sort of thing. That's cool. But you can't compare apples with mock apple pie.

      • You cannot do everything on a PC that you can do on a Mac

        I disagree. I have burned several DVDs, both home movies and legal copies of movies. As for Win/Linux, I use both and have had success with both. Granted that I work in the entertainment industry and have access to drivers/support/help that most don't. I have a dual P3-ghz machine with a gig of RAM that I built myself. It has RH 7.2 and Win2k. I also have a kick ass video card and that probably helps. I guess what I mean to say is that a Mac is great for people who want a no brain solution to digvid, "Everything else I've discovered that I love (iTunes, iPod, iPhoto) is just gravy." Exactly.

        After finally getting firewire to work I found that there were too many incompatible file formats. Maybe you can get it to work but I'm tired of tinkering every night.

        I never had a problem, but maybe my firewire board is made differently. All I know is that I have no incentive to look at a Mac when I can do all I need with a PC. Not to mention that I can upgrade without breaking the bank.
        • Or, Another thing I couldn't do on my PC.

          (late one night) I'm trying to import some jpegs and it's not working. Hey, the extention is .jpg and maybe it is looking for .jpeg!! I have 300 files! How am I going to change that with a GUI?

          HMMM. I pull up Terminal. Perl is already there! I write a throw-away script to convert all the *.jpg files to *.jpeg. THAT'S EASY!

          I've never used OS 9 but I suspect I wouldn't like my Mac so much if it didn't have OS X
          • How am I going to change that with a GUI?

            Last I checked Perl is standard on most Linux distributions. Hey and Windows has this cool thing called "Command Prompt". I can even write a "script" called a batch file and it runs rename commands too! Yep, that's easy.
            • The program he wanted to import the files on probably wouldn't run under Linux.

              You could probably find a Windows version of it, but he would have to go to the trouble of using the Windows command line, which in my experience is miles away from the Linux or MacOS X.

              So on balance, this is a unique MacOS X advantage - a great crossover between Unix and the Mac.

              D
              • ...go to the trouble of using the Windows command line, which in my experience is miles away from the Linux or MacOS X.

                Won't argue with you there, but the point was that it was possible. I can do it in Windows/Linux on a PC and you can on a Mac. Personally, I can do things much faster with a CLI than a GUI. Convenience be damned, I prefer to be a granular as possible and therefore get exactly what I want.
                • You'd probably like MacOS X if you gave it a shot.

                  You can use a CLI when you feel like it, or a GUI when you feel like it - and both are world-class.

                  D
                  • You'd probably like MacOS X if you gave it a shot.

                    You can use a CLI when you feel like it, or a GUI when you feel like it - and both are world-class

                    I actually have access to a G4 at work and an iMac at a friends house. It's not that I have anything against Macs (my first computer was a Mac classic) it's just that I have no need to move to it. Hopefully in the future I will be able to devote some time to it and have a real base of understanding to compare it with other OSes.
            • Last I checked Perl is standard on most Linux distributions
              That's where I learned Perl.
      • You are the model Apple customer. You don't want to mess with the hardware as evidenced by your inability to get a M$ mouse to work with XP. With apple, you don't have to many chances to stray from their established hardware norm, so it almost always works. And that's fine. Focus on video editing the mac way. But, you should now... my firewire dvd ram/r works fine on my pc under win2k and winxp. And I'll bet my smp athlon 1800+ with 2 gigs of ddr ram and dual 100 gig WD drives on a pci ide raid card would more than hold it's own against any Mac out there. And to top it all off, I know I spent quite a bit less than Apple's comparable offering.
        • Nobody could get that Microsoft Mouse to work with XP. I pulled the SGI mouse off of my O2 and it worked fine until I bought another (Microsoft) Mouse. I didn't really mind this because I had wanted to buy and optical mouse anyway.

          BTW, I actually DO want to mess with the hardware. It is just that I want to make it do NEW stuff not work on making it do the stuff it was supposed to do when I bought it.
      • Interesting to see a fellow Irix + Mac user. MacOS X is a lot better in software availability terms, but the Irix interface is still the best Unix I know of. MacOS X looks better, but Irix has superior usability. And my Irix system has been super-stable - it's up for more than half a year now, which by an astonishing coincidence is the amount of time since my last hardware upgrade.

        Anyway, the solution to your problem is to hook up an external SCSI hard drive. Even though SGI wants god-awful amounts of money for a certified drive, you can choose any SCSI drive you want without any trouble and minmal expense.

        Easy to set up, too. I don't remember the details, but it went very smoothly for me.

        Hope that helps.

        D
      • What are the specs on your Mac? I am looking at Powerbook G4s to do DV and music (Logic, Reaktor, etc).

        Interested...
    • Mr.Intel wrote,

      1. Because I can do everything on a PC that I could do on a MAC.
      2. Because I don't need flashy/trendy/cool cases to do my job.
      3. Because I don't want to pay for an OS when I can get one for free.
      4. Linus is much 'cooler' than Steve.
      5. I don't need to make Toy Story 3 on my computer, just recompile a kernel and play Civ3.
      6. I don't want that damn iMac making faces at me.


      Damn, I wish I had your job! What kind of job title comes with those responsabilities (compiling a kernel and playing Civ3), anyhow?
    • I don't need to make Toy Story 3 on my computer, just recompile a kernel and play Civ3.

      So, right after saying you want a free OS and that Linux is coolor than Steve, you admit to running a Windows game.
    • 1) Because I can do everything on a PC that I could do on a MAC.
      3) Because I don't want to pay for an OS when I can get one for free.
      4) Linus is much 'cooler' than Steve.

      Wait a sec... you're claiming you can do everything a mac does on your PC and you're running linux? Don't get me wrong, I love linux and all, but it's not acclaimed for the highest quality software and ease of use as you get from a mac. (although it gets better daily)
    • 5) I don't need to make Toy Story 3 on my computer, just recompile a kernel and play Civ3

      That's what everybody seems to forget in all this: Most people don't do the stuff that a Mac is so great for. A lot of people do though, and those people are the core of Apple's market.

      What apple needs to do is encourage more people to do the things Macs are good for. They don't need to sell to the people who don't care about a G4's performance on photoshop, they need to see that more people need to use photoshop and have it be fast.

      No one has ever been impressed with how fast or reliably my G4 surfs the internet: you don't need a lot of speed or reliability to surf the internet. They are impressed when I create cool pictures, edit movies and animate 3D movies.

      OS X has already done everything Apple can do to impress the Linux and non-casual Windoze users. Someone who only plays games and programs is never going to need a Mac. Apple needs to encourage more people to be content producers, not cater to people who are not content producers.

      • Someone who only plays games and programs is never going to need a Mac. Apple needs to encourage more people to be content producers, not cater to people who are not content producers.

        Couldn't have said it better myself. I don't do enough serious digvid to need a Mac. If I did, I would get an Avid box anyway.
    • 1) Because I can do everything on a Mac that I could do on a PC.
      2) Because I don't need beige/boxy/boring cases to do my job.
      3) Because I want an OS that comes free with the computer, instead of one I can "get for free" by downloading a couple hundred MBytes on my PC that doesn't have an OS on it yet.
      4) Sir Clive is cooler than either.
      5) I don't need to recompile a kernel to play Civ3.
      6) I don't want that damn PC making noises at me.

  • Another idiot blowing his horn.... (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Auckerman ( 223266 ) on Tuesday April 02, 2002 @12:47PM (#3270741)
    His points:
    1. Macs are Expensive
    2. He buys components to "stay ahead of the curve"
    3. Mhz

    My points:
    Number 1 and number 3 are MULTUALLY EXCLUSIVE. Every 4 or so years (+/- 1) I buy a Mac. It usually takes that long for a new use of computers to come along that challenge previous processors. I bought a 6100/60 to do word processing, e-mail, and what is now basic web browsing. I bought an iMac for mp3, CDRW, digital imaging (with larger images than the 6100 liked). I will buy a G4 iMac in the next year or so for digital video. I average about $1200 for 4 years, which is about $300 a year, or $1/day. I spend more on coffee/lattes than I do on Macs. Now my PC (bought to play video games). Every 6 months or so I do a mobo and/or processor replacement so that I can buy any game in CompUSA/BestBuy, which is about $250 a year in UPGRADE costs. That doesn't even take into account graphic cards (1 new one a year), hard drives (when I run out of space or when the cost of a new one that is 3X as big is same as origional drive), replacement monitors (evey few years), etc. All in all, I spend a little more on my PC use than I do on my Macs.

    Number 3 is a bunch of shit. Think of it like this. When one purchases a computer, they (hopefully) buy it for a purpose. They have a need they are fulfilling. Lets use are car example. Lets say you could buy a sedan for $15000 or a normal run of the mill city car for $15000. Based on a simple look the sedan is a better deal. Now lets say that sedan had the drivers seat on the wrong side of the car AND every year you had to buy brand new tires to keep up with roads designed for sedans. Not only that the Sedan pollutes the fuck out of the enviroment, some times doesn't start for any appearant reason, and the radio keeps turning itself on to the easy listening station once you achieve highway speeds. Sedan isn't looking so good anymore, especially since the normal car is reliable, doesn't treat you as if you are the enemy.

    His points are stupid. There are reasons NOT to buy Macs, but these aren't among them. He's an average WinTroll trying to get web hits and it worked.

    • Re:Another idiot blowing his horn.... (Score:4, Interesting)

      by IpalindromeI ( 515070 ) on Tuesday April 02, 2002 @12:55PM (#3270807) Journal
      Number 3 is a bunch of shit. Think of it like this. When one purchases a computer, they (hopefully) buy it for a purpose. They have a need they are fulfilling.

      Unfortunately, this isn't really true, in general. Many people *don't* have a purpose in mind when they go out computer shopping. Last summer at work I was talking to this guy about computer upgrades and he was talking about his new computer. The 1Ghz's had just come out and he was getting one right away, upgrading from like a 700mhz I think. Then he talked about the kinds of things he did on his computer; the most CPU intensive task was playing a flight sim:P People just want the latest-and-greatest, they don't care that they're wasting their money getting features they don't need and won't use. Oh well, I guess it's what keeps the industry alive.
      • Quite often flight sims are _VERY_ cpu intensive, and a 300Mhz speed bump could have made quite a noticable difference.
      • That's so true. People get roped into demanding the biggest thing out there with no real need (think SUV's). Most average computer users (ie, prob no one who reads /.) would probably be just as happy with a two or three year old computer as they are with the latest and greatest. I still have an old p166 beating around that my girlfriend uses to check email, surf the web, a MS Word, and you know what, it does all of those things great. Can it do video or work on a 1gb Photoshop file, no, but it doesn't need to. That's why I bought a G4. That 4 year old p166 does all the stuff that it needs to do, and that's all the stuff that alot of people need a computer to do.
    • I think you're drawing the wrong conclusion from the fact that your Windows game machine requires more upgrades.

      1. The fact that you have a whole machine for gaming suggests that Mac isn't a viable gaming platform for you.

      2. Games require more upgrades than mp3s, CD-RW and digital imaging

      3. If Mac were a viable gaming platform for you, you'd be upgrading more. I don't know how Mac upgrade costs compare to PC upgrade costs, but you'd probably be spending more than your PC upgrade costs, and significantly less than you spend on Mac and PC combined.

  • Interesting user base (Score:2, Informative)

    by (trb001) ( 224998 )
    First, some background: I'm a Programmer/System Administrator with a heavy bias towards Open Source software.

    And this guy's article got posted on Slashdot? Wow, whoda thunk...

    Honestly, this guy isn't in the arena to buy a Mac. In the same sense, my roommate who is a graphics art/animation major in college is dying for a new iMac/Powerbook. Everyone in her classes seems to use them and love them. Myself, very similar to this guy (programmer/general computer geek), I would never even consider a Mac...more likely I would piece components together into one of the three have/fully built cases I have already sitting around my office.

    --trb
    • That's all very true, but something I think Apple needs to keep in mind is how many average users have a tech friend or family member to whom they defer all computer issues. Arts/animation people know they need a mac, but how many people is that really? Probably about just as many as the hardcore tech people like me or the guy who wrote this article. But hardcore tech people (I suspect) have more influence in their family and friends over computer purchasing decisions.

      And when I consider what computer to get for my family 100 miles away, there are two issues.

      1. Cost. 2. Reliability.

      Apple obviously isn't and probably shouldn't be interested in the first. So they really need to push the second. They need to convince me that I'm not going to hear grief about system instability, or about how all my family's friends can do X, but they can't because I forced Operating System Y down their throat.

      The last computer I bought for my family ran Windows 2000. Mac OS X was out, but 10.1 was not released, and I knew from running my iBook that all the kinks were not yet worked out. The next computer I buy (probably this september, as one of my siblings is going off to school) could very well be a mac, even though I'm a tech head like the guy who wrote this, depending on my faith in the likelihood of how often Mac OS X vs. Windows 2000 (no, i won't touch XP) will make my parents/siblings curse my name.

      If you want families like mine to run Apple, Mr. Jobs, you're going to have to go through us hardware nerds.

  • Executive Summary (Score:1, Redundant)

    by 4of12 ( 97621 )

    Loves

    • underlying UNIX of Mac OS X
    • fast G4 chip
    • snazzy physical design
    • good desktop interface with DVD players, access to Office, IE if needed.

    Hates:

    • expensive price.
    • that he can't trade in cheap mix 'n match components for an inexpensive upgrade path like PC commodity world.

    • More than a hate (Score:1, Troll)

      by fm6 ( 162816 )
      that he can't trade in cheap mix 'n match components for an inexpensive upgrade path like PC commodity world.
      This is more than the prejudice of a particular techie. This is a fundamental feature of modern computer economics. It means more competition between component makers, and thus lower prices. It means companies can give employees precisely the hardware they need to do their jobs. It means people can save money by upgrading instead of replacing. (In practice, people don't upgrade as often as they could, but it's still a big economic factor.)

      For a while there, it seemed like Apple was learning to cope with this kind of economics. They no longer have so many proprietary interfaces and components. (They even used to have proprietary disk drives!) But now they seem to be doing it all over again -- not with the basic technology, but a silly need to be Cool. So we get all kinds of physical gimmickry that raises the price of the product. Sometimes these actually add value, like the easy-to-setup iMac cases. But mostly they're just pandering to the Distintive Brand and Design cult. All the little things they could do to extend their market breadth (rack systems for example) they just refuse to get into because it doesn't fit their image. This is a formula for irrelevence.

    • Comment removed based on user account deletion

  • Some problems here... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by gfilion ( 80497 ) on Tuesday April 02, 2002 @01:01PM (#3270857) Homepage

    The author says PowerMac G4 933MHz with a 60Gb hard drive, 256Mb of RAM, and a Super Drive (that's DVD and CD-RW people!). This is going to run me $2,299.00. At Dell's website (Dude, yer getting' a Dell) I can get a 1.8GHz Dimension with an 80Gb drive for $1,497.00. That's $800 dollars less for the same functionality, more hard drive space, twice the clock speed (I won't get into CPU architecture), and your required contribution to the Microsoft Empire in the form of Windows XP and Microsoft Works.

    First, the superdrive is a DVD-R and CD-RW, it burns DVDs and CDs. The Dell doesn't have that, and guess what, it costs about 800$ to get one. The assembled-with-the-cheapest-possible-parts-PC doesn't have a warrantee, so it's not a fair comparaison.

    Also, his whole argument about weither more MHz is better is quite stange. At first he says that only Joe Sixpack thinks that, and people who know computer architecture relalise that the MHz are only a part of a computer speed. Two lines later, he says that the Mac is slower because it has a lower frequency.

    Let me tell you something, if you ever have two computers that have the same performances (time to do a task), always take the one with the lower frequency, you'll have a more stable system, it will produce less heat, etc.

    Overall, it was a pretty crappy article...
    GFK's

    • Re:Some problems here... (Score:5, Interesting)

      by coolgeek ( 140561 ) on Tuesday April 02, 2002 @02:06PM (#3271443) Homepage
      A comparably equipped Gateway, of course with a 2Ghz P4, is a mere $300 less than the G4/933. Both with large flat panel displays, of course. Being a guy who has purchased a whole glut of commodity hardware, and built my lab of 7 Pentiums $200 at a time, I have to say I was never able to appreciate the value of a Mac until I bought one and started using it as my "daily driver". For example, said G4/933 has 2MB L3 cache running at 1/2 clock speed. More than enough to keep your average loop-calls-several-nested-subroutines close at hand, and scads more than the what 0K (of L3-cache =) stock on a P4. The SuperDrive extracts CD audio at about 11-16x, ripping a whole CD in 2-4 minutes. Power management that really works. Or, on my TiBook, I actually get about 4-5 hours battery life when writing/testing code. Why? because Apple developed a power management chip that keeps all system clocks running, but idles the CPU down when the system encounters idle time, then bounces back to full speed in a few milliseconds. That kind of developement will never happen in a commodity PC market. And my VAIO never passed the 3.5 hour mark with TWO batteries.

      And all that "fancy" design is more than just good looks. I can reach under the middle of my 17" Studio Display, and plug a USB device into one of the ports on the back, without moving anything, and without having too see ugly USB outlets all the time. There are many other subtle benefits resulting from Apple's design efforts. Suffice it to say, one cannot truly appreciate them until actually using them.

      • because Apple developed a power management chip that keeps all system clocks running, but idles the CPU down when the system encounters idle time, then bounces back to full speed in a few milliseconds. That kind of developement will never happen in a commodity PC market.

        That's strange...my 'commodity PC' seems to have that feature, and it appears to work fine in Linux (although it's not a laptop). Just because Bill Gates is too stupid to use it doesn't mean it's not there...

        and plug a USB device into one of the ports on the back, without moving anything, and without having too see ugly USB outlets all the time.

        Ummm...my USB ports are located in the back too, however if I had a lot of USB devices and was plugging them in all the time, I'd think having the ports in the front would be easier.

        There are many other subtle benefits resulting from Apple's design efforts. Suffice it to say, one cannot truly appreciate them until actually using them.

        I used to test network cards on Macs about 6 years ago...I always thought their hardware design was idiotic. None of them had any real power switches, so any serious flaw in the card would often require me to unplug the power cord because there was no real power switch. Also they wouldn't shut down properly sometimes--guess what? Had to pull the power cord. Yes, I know these are extreme cases--but isn't that what most planning is for? Also I hated the fact that even the floppy disks used an electronic eject system instead of a mechanical one--that meant you had to wait several seconds for the friggin disk to come out, and if you turned the power off and forgot to eject the disk, you'd have to turn the computer back on! I don't want to know what to do if the power goes out!

        Unfortunately, other hardware makers have gone in this direction (software controled power switch, and CDROM eject), but at least my computer still has a real power switch in the back in case anything gets flakey...however I must admit, I just got ACPI working in Linux--and it's a comforting thing to know I can press the software power button, and Linux will attempt to shut down properly. In the event my crappy ps/2 keyboard falls out of it's connector (why did they have to change from the standard 5-pin?), or my fb or whatever experiments screw up the screen/keyboard/etc and the only solution is to reboot without seeing anything on the screen or keys don't work...

    • Actually Dell does have a combo DVD+RW/CD-RW for $429. Of course adding it STILL throws this guys numbers off.

      The PowerMac also comes with a Nvidia GeForce4 MX while the stock Dell he is comparing it too has a GeForce2. I really don't know much about graphics cards so when I tried to recreate his comparison I upgraded them both to a GeForce4 Titanium which cut down the price difference some more. You also have to add the Dell movie studio package to get the FireWire ports that are standard on the Mac.

      The Mac also has Gigabit ethernet which isn't an option on the Dell. Not quite sure what the value of Apple's built in ethernet card is.

      The Dell has a "faster" (as in more Mhz) chip but the actual performance difference probably depends on what you are doing with it. From what I have seen it seems intel's clock speed advantage translates into a real performance advangtage but Altavec MORE than makes up for it when it can be used. So in general computing the Wintel machine wins; in mutlimedia stuff the Mac wins. In my own use mulitimedia tasks are the only processor intensive stuff I do. I will notice a perfomance advantage in FinalCut Pro but not in my wordprocessor.

      Comparing the bundled software is difficult because the bundles are so different. The Dell comes with more productivity stuff; the Mac with multimedia and of course the DevTools CD. Overall, I think the Mac software bundle probably has a pretty significant edge in both quantity and quality.

      Still trying to match up bullet points on spec sheets item for item, the Dell is still significantly cheaper.

      Of course industrial design, the relative quality of the components and engineering don't show up on a bare spec sheet nor does even more intangible elements like "ease of use" and the like. The consensus opinion seems to be that in quality of engineering and in the attention to "intagibles" the Mac again has a significant edge. Is it worth the price premium? I guess that is for consumers to decide.

  • Lame Price comparison (Score:4, Informative)

    by AaronBaker2000 ( 480581 ) on Tuesday April 02, 2002 @01:03PM (#3270866) Homepage
    In his example, the author explains that a Dell costs $800 less than a comparable G4 with a superdrive. However, Dell doesn't even offer a superdrive on any of their products. Where the hell does he find the basis for that comparison?!? There isn't a PC on the market that can compare with the G4's video production capabilities.

  • He just doesn't get it (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Dokushoka ( 570664 ) on Tuesday April 02, 2002 @01:09PM (#3270941) Homepage
    Macs are for people who want to do stuff with their computer, not do stuff to their computer.
  • I've been a computer user for... sheei** since I was old enough to know what one was. I started out on one of those old RadioShack Tandy TRaSh 80 Color III's those old keyboards you hook up to your TV and program in BASIC. Those were the days. Then I got a real computer. My Macintosh Performa 6400 200Mhz... wow that thing kicked ass back in the day. I did so much with that thing. I was certainly a Mac evangelist. Learned C and C++ on that, HTML, made my first few web sites on it with the help of Photoshop and BBEdit. Then I got another real computer. It is what has become my Athlon 1Ghz, 320Meg RAM, 40Gig HD, nVidia GeForce 2, etc. etc... which I've built myself the same way the author of this article pointed out, piece by piece. I started out with a grandaddy of an old giant noisy desktop mega ATX case and slowly replaced parts and case till the only thing left of that original beast is my Sound card and a couple sticks of RAM. My point I guess if I have one is that PC's rock. Macs rock. I agree that Macs are expensive but if you HAVE the cash and you DO want one, then do it up. Personally I can think of plenty of other stuff I'm gonna buy before I buy a new G4 :( but alas such is life.


    And btw, this guy's "fuzzy math" shines through, I like how he pointed out some specs and a price, then only one or two of the same specs and another lower price (I think he left out ram) then he hid behind absolutely no backup whatsoever, claiming to have some sort of "rocking" system for like a grand. I don't know about other folks but I have a rockin system and unfourtunately altogether it didn't just cost a grand. If I had every feature that the new G4's had then I'm sure I'd be coming close to about 2 grand, I think I probably am already. Price only matters to those who are greedy.


    another little point I didn't like was about this whole Mhz business - just isn't a good comparison factor between machines. There are so many other hardware factors that can influence overall performance. Even if you get your system specs completely tight, each uses such and such rpm hard drives made by the same company, exactly 256megs 168 pin DIMMS at 133, there are still plenty of other factors... os, the compiler the os was compiled on, the system the os was compiled on, the programs you're running, the compiler THEY we're compiled with, your bus speed, your chipset, your entire architechture, the size of your chip cache, how many chip specific features the compiler you're using takes advantage of, how many OS specific features your programs take advantage of... the list goes on. I think this guy mentioned that he's never seen a mac respond as quickly as he feels his PC does on a regular basis. Hmmm, sounds like as a PC fanatic this guy really uses macs a lot... riiiiiight. Wonder if he's actually used any of the programs compiled with support for the G4's new architechture. In short this guys reasons for what he says are IMHO stupid. Sorry for the long windedness, just wasting time. peace.

    one more quickie, apple should advertise more. apple has numerous commercials posted on their web site. why? I mean I get a kick out of em but no one else likely will unless they're already mac fans. I've seen a fairly recent new iMac commercial but that's it. Where are the logos at the sporting events, during survivor, all these giant shows? ok... over and out for real.

    • In regards to the quickie at the end, I recently saw an apple TiBook ad in the movie Showtime. It was a definite planned placement, and was quite noticiable if you were looking for that sort of thing. The ads are out there, right in front of us.

    • Apple gets their advertising in the form of product placement. Mimi's iMac on the Drew Carry show, nearly all of the good guys in 24 using Macs, the ginormous impossible to miss Cinema display in Holden's studio in Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back. Apple gets their stuff seen in the media in terms of a culture reference, if you think of Mimi's desk you think of a Grape iMac with Trolls on it. Not that everyone thinks of Mimi's desk but it is definitely a noticable prop. In ID4 Jeff Goldblum's character has a Powerbook which was part of a product placement plan because there was a deal on their website saying a Powerbook saved the world.
  • that he found it necessary to share with us? it's like he has some kind of inner turmoil and is trying to persuade us in order to persuade himself.

    ah, premonition coming on: dude, you're getting a mac.

  • Apple needs depth in their product line (Score:4, Insightful)

    by elliotj ( 519297 ) <slashdot&elliotjohnson,com> on Tuesday April 02, 2002 @02:29PM (#3271642) Homepage
    I'm saving up to buy a Mac at the moment. If I was buying a PC I would have done so already, but the Mac I'd be happy with is more expensive than the PC I'd be happy with.

    This is an interesting distinction, and ultimately the source of my current predicament. My problem has long been that Apple's product line is too shallow and not diverse enough.

    The iMac is fine, but I suspect I will want to upgrade my video card at least once over the life of my machine. Why? Because I like games. The Mac itself will last for several years but I know with the pace of game development that I'll want a new video card before the system really needs any other upgrade.

    That puts me in the Powermac range, which is very pricey. I really don't want to pay for all the other bells and whistles that come with the Powermacs, like Gigabit Ethernet and a Superdrive, but I don't have a lot of choice once I get into that category. I won't even get into the financial problem of wanting a Apple display.

    I just wish Apple would sell a mid range tower. That's all. But I don't presume to know the economics of their market better than they do, so there must be a reason why. Perhaps they like forcing me for save up.
    • Honestly buddy, if you want to play games, get a PC or better still a PS2. I am a hardcore Mac user, the last thing I'll ever do I toss down money for a PC (luckily the college my Mom works for loves to throw out PCs all the time), but I would never suggest that someone gets a Mac for gaming purposes. It will only aggravate you with it's year old, shoddy ports and non-existent library.

      I really encourage you to save up and get a Mac (you won't regret it), but make sure you have something else to play games on.

  • From an Ex-PCer (Score:4, Insightful)

    by jellomizer ( 103300 ) on Tuesday April 02, 2002 @02:47PM (#3271770)
    I use to be a Big PC guy who loved getting new hardware and upgrading my PC every couple months to keep it up to date. But after a while I just got really expensive, Even with using Linux as your only OS. So I started to let my computer fall behind the times for a while and save up my money and I got myself a Sun Ultra 10. And I felt that is was a much easier to work with the Sun then with a Linux box. Although installing some programes were a bit more difficult (Had to do the make stuff). But I never had issues with the harware no unexpected crashes from hardware, it just worked after over a year it still works perfectly. And the only thing that I really should upgrade on it is the Ram. But that is only for a speed increase not because apps require more. I can probably get at least 3 more years out of the Sun Systems sience Solaris is pritty good on working on older hardware, I can get a long life out of all the equiptment More then a PC. So now I needed a laptop so after looking around I found the PowerBook G4 to be the best bang for the buck. 1 Gig of Ram 40, Gig HD, GigaBit Eathernet, Wireless Eathernet, Larger Crisp screen. USB, Firewire. It had all the stuff I needed and I check for Dell and I couldnt build a Laptop to come have the same specs and still it became more expensive. And adding external components to it is a lot less of a hassle. And the OS works a lot more closely to the hardware then a PC ever did. The Apple saves me money because it saves me time. Doing it yourself is nice but that is if your time isn't worth to much money. For me I have to much to do and PC debuging takes way to much of my time. Why spend an Hour Debuging if you dont have to. Sun Workstation and Apple Computers have a higher operation time and a Lower TOC then PCs do. Even with a Free OS.

  • From a non-gaming Mac user... (Score:4, Interesting)

    by singularity ( 2031 ) <nowalmartNO@SPAMgmail.com> on Tuesday April 02, 2002 @03:21PM (#3272011) Homepage Journal
    This past weekend I bought my fourth Macintosh computer. For details, you can check my journal.

    Disclaimer: I do not play games on my computer. The only thing I load up is MAME about once every month or so just as a stress-releiver.

    That said: I have found Macintosh computers to be very low-cost in terms of life-time expenses. Yes, up-front costs are lower for PCs, but having used PCs (my job requires PC use, and I have done tech support on them before), they are far less hassle and expense to keep running well.

    In addition, Macs tend to have a longer life than a comperable PC. I admit that you can throw Linux onto an older 486 or original Pentium, but most users will not do that. Most Mac users will hold onto their Macs for several years, even in its original configuration.

    So comparing up-front costs does not give you the entire story.

    Also remember that you cannot put a price tag on ease of use and ability to get things done.
    • As an experiment and as a follow-up to my post, I went to Dell's education store and tried to configure a Dell desktop as close to my new comptuer as possible.

      Dell: Dimension 8200, 1.8 GHz 256/80/DVD-RW CD-RW with a Dell 17" LCD: $2541.
      Apple: PowerMac G4/933 256/80/DVD-RW CD-RW with an Apple 17" LCD: $2791

      Dell does not seem to offer a SCSI card as an option, so I would add about $50 to that price tag (or subtract that from the Apple price). There were a few other configurations that went on both that I am not goign to go into detail here, but I set them up about as closely as possible.

      In the end, it is pretty close. I, for one, would pay the extra $200 or so for the quality of the Mac.

  • Comparing apples to apples (Score:5, Informative)

    by TwitchCHNO ( 469542 ) on Tuesday April 02, 2002 @03:32PM (#3272079) Homepage
    Dell Precision Mobile Workstation M40

    512MB, SDRAM Memory (2DIMMS),
    48GB IDE Hard Drive,
    3.5 inch 1.44MB Floppy Drive,
    Internal Mini-PCI NIC/Modem,
    Internal 8-8-8-24X SWDVD/CDRW Combo Drive,
    Integrated IEEE 1394 "Firewire" port.
    nVidia, Quadro 2 Go, 32MB, VGA
    Mobile Pentium®III Processor,1.20GHz-M with 15.0in UXGA Display

    $3,968.00

    http://configure.us.dell.com/dellstore/config.as p? customer_id=555&order_code=WS-M40&cfgpg=1

    Apple G4 PowerBook

    667MHz PowerPC G4 @ 133MHz
    256K L2 cache @ 667MHz
    1GB SDRAM memory
    48GB Ultra ATA drive
    Combo Drive (DVD-ROM/CD-RW)
    ATI Mobility Radeon w/
    16MB DDR video memory
    Gigabit Ethernet
    56K internal modem
    1 FireWire & 2 USB Ports
    Airport Card Included

    $3,699.00

    http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPLE/WebObjects /A ppleStore.woa/53/wo/jQIy01qrrnBvvsUvNu/0.3.0.3.30. 27.0.1.3.1.3.1.1.0?123,54

    Dell Pros:
    nVidia, Quadro 2 Go, 32MB, VGA
    3.5 inch 1.44MB Floppy Drive,

    Dell Cons:
    No option to upgrade memory
    Price

    Mac Pros:
    Gigabit Ethernet
    1GB SDRAM memory
    Airport Card Included
    PRICE

    Mac Cons:
    ATI Mobility Radeon w/
    16MB DDR video memory
    No 3.5 inch 1.44MB Floppy Drive

    Wait - Macs are too expensive? Did I miss something? A price difference of $300 dollars & gigabit ethernet & wireless ethernet & 512MB more RAM. Mac are more expensive?
  • I think the feedback is pretty fair considering he's a PC user. I don't think Apple should reconsider making all of their components available "off the shelf" but I still think they're pretty damn good machines that can easily be configured to boot into MacOS 9, X and any PPC distro of Linux (and many a Windows OS if Virtual PC is installed- but that doesn't compare to actual hardware)- and in more cases than with the PC world... all of your components will most likely just work... and pretty flawlessly at that.
  • For many of my friends, (20-30+), one of the real reason is the games. Although we do real work on our pcs (I write programs on my Linux boxes and some of my friends design websites on their windows boxes), the real reason for many of us is that we want our machine to be GAME-COMPATIBLE. Sure there are games for Macs but they are much less (just checkout a local Fry's Electronics or Bestbuy), more expensive, and generally comes out much later or not at all. For my younger cousin and his friends, they are their family computer whiz, and their buying decision is whether they can run the latest games.
    For my gf, her primary use other than school work is to surf the web and chat with friends. Although she is an architecture (mostly uses Autocad on pcs) student in an art school (they use all Macs), she is so used to IE with the 5 button Microsoft mouse that she totally dislikes the 1 button mouse, the sluggishness and the interface of the Macs (from her words) in her school.

  • counterpoint (Score:3, Informative)

    by cbowland ( 205263 ) on Tuesday April 02, 2002 @04:01PM (#3272289)
    James Gosling (of sun and java fame) recently said he was switching to macs. To quote from the article, "And from a personal point of view, I personally actually read the [Windows] XP license and decided I couldn't sign it. So I've been shifting over to Mac. "


    Mac vs Win XP [computerworld.com]


    I understand that his reasons to switch involve licensing rather than hardward/cost/available software/etc, but I imagine that JG could pretty much run whatever he wanted without too much difficulty.


    Yes, Virginia, I just bought a mac. It is fabulous (my other frequently used machines include a win 98 box, solaris 8 on both sparc and intel, and RedHat 7.2) and as advertised, it is unix with a gui that does not suck and hardware/software integration that just bloody works!


    I was configuring a new sunblade the other day and the question arose, which was best KDE or Gnome? My vote -- AQUA ;-} (Actually, I choose to install both but run KDE.)

  • Apple == Volkswagon (Score:5, Insightful)

    by leifw ( 98495 ) on Tuesday April 02, 2002 @04:06PM (#3272321)
    The best analogy I've seen for Apple's place in the computer industry is to that of Volkswagon's in the auto industry, especially VW's marketing of the new Bug. Volkwagon makes a cool looking product and then sell it with all services paid; your oil changes and other routine maintenance plus any unscheduled maintenance in the warranty period are part of the cost of the car. Of course this means the vehicle costs more, but plenty of people see it as worth while. This really appeals to people who just want a cool no-hastle vehicle.

    Apple sells their products similarly; the various Macs since the iMac have been cool looking, easy to use, no hastle computers. Part of buying a Mac is the cool iTunes, iMovie, iPhoto, ietc. software that automagically does everything you bought your new PC for, including uploading your stuff to your mac.com website.

    It's all about increasing coolness and decreasing hastle for both VW and Apple.

  • Now that Macs are Unix machines I have this gut feeling that Windows is now the only bizarro operating system remaining in popular use. Mark my words: It won't be long before reporters start referring to Microsoft as "the beleaguered niche OS licensor."

  • Next please (Score:4, Insightful)

    by sg3000 ( 87992 ) <<sg_public> <at> <mac.com>> on Tuesday April 02, 2002 @09:16PM (#3274169)
    > I don't buy computers anymore; I buy components.
    Congratulations, pal, you're not in any of Apple's target market segments. Don't let the doorknob hit you on the way out.

    > I don't think Steve Jobs is concerned with Apple
    > making money -- excuse me, 'increasing
    > shareholder value'.

    I hate to say this, but this guy is a moron. Just because they're not interested in catering to the shade-tree PC builder doesn't mean they don't want to make money. In fact, Jobs clearly is interested in making Apple a profitable business. Along with Dell, Apple's one of two PC companies actually doing well during this recession. So claiming otherwise is just silly.

  • One Problem with this Article (Score:4, Insightful)

    by piecewise ( 169377 ) on Wednesday April 03, 2002 @12:51AM (#3275118) Journal
    Fortunately, I don't really care why someone else doesn't want to buy a Mac, and I don't care if they waste their time publishing an article about it.

    I care that I use one every day and I love it, and I wouldn't trade it in even for the newest, maxed out Dell.

    It's amazing how a company can have 90% customer loyalty -- but receive such awful press. Obviously PC users are missing something here. Brand loyalty and outstanding products aren't suppose to equal poor press and biased reporting. But hey, like I said, as a Mac owner I have the privelage of not needing to worry about it.

  • Not a target Apple customer (Score:3, Informative)

    by pvera ( 250260 ) <pedro.vera@gmail.com> on Wednesday April 03, 2002 @10:36AM (#3276602) Homepage Journal
    Apple does not have the same goals as Dell or Compaq. For Apple to capture even .5% of the total PC market in the states is a huge jump, while Dell or Compaq would have to grab an extra 10% before even feeling it.

    I had the same mentality as this guy, but a few things made me change, and I am in the process of saving my hard earned cash so I can afford to buy a titanium powerbook.

    I am a card-carrying Microsoft-dor-whore. It is not rewarding spiritually like open source is, but it pays the bills and the projects are always a challenge. Because of the need to do things that only run on Windows I never thought about macs. Then I realized that over the last 2 years I have done 99% of my coding on a text editor (editplus, which really rocks, wwww.editplus.com) and the other 1% was done thru a terminal services client.

    That meant I could use any kind of computer that could let me ftp a text file into my windows servers. Then I found out that there is a windows terminal services client written in Java that I can have for less than $50. On top of that I found out about Virtual PC. With Virtual PC I can have 3 or more computers in my back pack: A Mac, a Unix System and one or more Windows machines.

    Now, I know the hardware is expensive, but he did not cover all the angles. There is no Windows laptop that can match the iBook's weight and feature set for the price. A 256MB, 600 MHZ iBook with the combo drive is 4.9 pounds and around $1500 if you add airport card.

    Then, to be honest, there is no need to have my home computers running windows, even if I telecommute. I can do all my work with a Mac as long as I have the text editor and the terminal services client (I would not even need Virtual PC). And my wife could care less, she does not even use the second button in her mouse, and she was really thrilled when I took her to the Apple Store to see the new iMac.

    As for components, I am sick and goddamn tired of how the homebuilt never measures up to your retal boxes. Of the 3 computers in my house the worst one is the dual processor machine I built for less than $1000. The retail Dell and the IBM Thinkpad run great.

  • Troll (Score:2, Insightful)

    by dasspunk ( 173846 )
    More Apple FUD from the king of trolls...
  • Let me save you from reading the article. His whole arguement is cost. Yes, we know they're more expensive. Next...
  • I can't.

    in the end, owning a powerful mac, running OS X, in fact, OS X alone, will allow me to be 100 times more productive at work, and have 100 times more fun on the computer.

    it's a fact. i have extensively used both wintel and macs. i had moved away from macos for a while due to macos being a fairly poor development/programming platform. at least i could run cygwin under windoz, while still doing all of the usual desktop/office/end-user fun shit. But OS X changed all that.

    In the end, m$ poor implementation of OS-level security, expensive software, privacy invasion will cost me more in time, pain and headaches dealing with clumsy service packs and patches, expensive upgrades, hard drive reformats upon stupid vb worm infection.

    a note about apple hardware vs pc:

    back in '96, i had bought one of apple's first "PCI mac's" a powerpc 7500 with an upgradable 100MHz processor chip. Ever since i've bought it, this puppy has been ON *every single day*, and still is at the time of this writing.

    While in college i used it intensively for video capture, web sites authoring, graphics and more. I was even using it as my TV: i had plugged my VCR's video output to my mac's video capture input. Used my VCR's cable tuner to watch basketball games during which i'd perform freeze frames of cool replays from macos.

    when i left college, i cut a deal with some guy who needed a reliable webserver to run basic websites on, at an co-located server farm in bervely hills (anet.net). it was a webserver for over 3 years. On, every single day. always reliable. it was running MacOS 7.6, starnine webstar, blueworld lasso plugin, and a filemakerpro database for db-driven sites.

    today it's back at my home. it's now running linuxppc 2000 Q4. it's behind my earthlink residential dsl connection. i have a few domains CNAME'd to my dyndns.org alias, and host some personal sites for fun off of it.

    Let's see ... i bought it back in january 96, we're now in april 2002 ... so that's like ... oh ... a little over 6 years, up and running every day, not a single hardware failure, survived power failures, power surcharges, not a single hard drive-partition corruption (not even on that extra 10gig ibm drive i bought 3 years ago).

    i have had my hands on many pc's during that time as well. both at work and at home. running successive flavors of windoz. DELL laptops. desktops. fucking piece of shits. low-level hard drive corruptions. processor freezes. overheating. plus lame operating system failures. name an uncurable headache on your pc, i've had it.

    i still see 8 year-old mac laptops around. in fact my ex gf still uses one. the battery can't hold a charge anymore, but while plugged to the sector, the fuckin' thing runs.

    that dell laptop my work had given me lasted me a year and half with constant growing pains and weird processor-level chokes. i know other people who are experiencing similar issues with theirs.

    suprising?

    no.

    The point i'm trying to make is that my good old 7500 mac which i have been able to upgrade *A LOT* with different CPU chips (250mhz was my last one), up to ~300MB of RAM, 1MB motherboard level 3 cache (to supplement the 512k on the processor chip), has allowed me to do *A WHOLE MOTHERFUCKING LOT* of shit, in the 6 years i've owned it, without ever *having* to buy a new system. my original investment was still worth a lot to me 6 years later. i have learned, made money off of it. it has always been there, incredibly reliable, a faithful companion on my road to expanding my computing horizons. I still have a couple free PCI expansion slots i could most likely use to make it compatible with the latest peripheral standards like USB, 1GB ethernet and all that good stuff.

    i'm thinking total cost of ownership.

    now. 800 bucks. 1000 bucks more than a pc. you bet your fucking ass i'll happily spend it on a high-end mac. 'cuz in the end, i know the fucker's guna last me *a while*. and with OS X, computing is just guna more and more fun. reliable. powerful. oh yeah. did i mention more secure? just in case. let's stress that again. MORE SECURE.

    man i love OS X. this thing fuckin' rules.

    Also when making a buying decision, keep in mind that apple throws-in all kinds of really KICKASS software FOR FREE for OS X. FREE.

    shieeeet man.

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