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Run Mac OS X On Non-Apple Hardware, With a Dongle
Posted by
timothy
on Thu Sep 25, 2008 02:30 PM
from the not-actually-an-imperative-statement dept.
from the not-actually-an-imperative-statement dept.
An anonymous reader points out Gizmodo's review of a USB dongle, made by a company called Efix, which allows for an effort-free transformation of a non-Apple computer into one that runs Mac OS X. According to the reviewer, the transformation is perfect (aside from a few quirks he describes as "trivial"); the included screenshots sure make it seem that way, too. The dongle costs $155, and works only on a subset of PC hardware. Non-Apple machines running OS X will no doubt make Apple unhappy, though, so, the reviewer concludes, "it's understandable if you wanna approach this with caution."
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Submission: Turn your PC into a Mac with a dongle by Anonymous Coward
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I just ordered one!! (Score:5, Interesting)
They take Paypal and Credit Card and it was $169 + $10 shipping...
Interestingly, I noticed that their Website appears to be based in England? http://geotool.servehttp.com/?ip=209.25.134.78&host=www.efixusa.net [servehttp.com]
I wonder if Apple and its vast team of Lawyers are the reason for the offshore hosting and sales site? (I bet it will be shipped from overseas too...)
Hardware Compatibility List: http://www.efixusa.net/hardware_comp.php [efixusa.net]
NOTE: The EFiX-USA Ebay Store has no inventory at this time: http://stores.ebay.com/EFiX-USA [ebay.com]
Re:I just ordered one!! (Score:5, Insightful)
$155 makes the Apple Premium seem reasonable.
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Re:I just ordered one!! (Score:5, Insightful)
Especially when you factor in the cost of OS X. You're already up to $300, without a computer.
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Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:I just ordered one!! (Score:5, Informative)
you know, i never really understood people's prejudice against mac users until now. but, wow, you're a douche.
helping people set up their hackintoshes would be a great way to expose some PC users to the benefits or advantages of OS X. someone who doesn't want to take the plunge and invest in a $3000 machine could use this dongle to try out the OS before they commit to a full Apple setup.
assuming that any hackintosh users must be pirating OS X is a rather condescending attitude towards PC users, and particular PC users who are interested in OS X.
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Re:I just ordered one!! (Score:5, Informative)
someone who doesn't want to take the plunge and invest in a $3000 machine could use this dongle to try out the OS before they commit to a full Apple setup.
The price of the dongle plus the price of OSX is more than enough to buy a slightly used Mac Mini.
assuming that any hackintosh users must be pirating OS X is a rather condescending attitude towards PC users, and particular PC users who are interested in OS X.
Your right its wrong to assume. But he's right, most hackintoshes are built using pirated software. Deal with it.
helping people set up their hackintoshes would be a great way to expose some PC users to the benefits or advantages of OS X.
Presumably these PC users are already sold on trying OSX given they are working on a hackintosh. And again, if these PC users are willing to shell out a few hundred bucks on dongles and a copy of the OS to try it out, they can buy a slighly used mac mini, or an older ibook. Or shell out just a little bit more and get an new mini.
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Re:I just ordered one!! (Score:5, Insightful)
well, i can't say what most hackintosh users do, but from what i've read here it seems like there are definitely some people who don't pirate OS X for building their own hackintoshes.
i'd also note that it seems like the fact hackintosh users have to obtain a hacked OS X setup disc to have a decent chance of getting their hackintosh to work that promotes piracy in this case. if they could get help from more experienced OS X users on how to do it legally, then that might reduce piracy, wouldn't you say? and seeing as this dongle lets you use any old OS X disc, the original incentive of simply downloading a hacked disc image is no longer relevant.
regarding the hackintosh vs mac mini argument, i have to point out that a smaller price tag isn't the only issue. it does no good for the consumer to buy a cheap mini if he really needs a more powerful machine. so, yes, he could buy a cheap mac mini or get the dongle and OS, but with the dongle + OS he can use that on a system that actually fits his needs. then if he likes the OS, he could invest in a $3000 Apple workstation--or whatever model happens to be appropriate.
it's sorta like saying, "well you can can a BMW motorcycle for under $10k" when they might be looking for a sedan. some people don't have the need for a mini-type system, regardless of what OS it runs or manufacturer it's by.
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Re:I just ordered one!! (Score:5, Insightful)
And again, if these PC users are willing to shell out a few hundred bucks on dongles and a copy of the OS to try it out, they can buy a slighly used mac mini, or an older ibook.
So instead of trying out the OS on hardware I already own, I can spend the money on extra hardware I don't want that will potentially require me to swap around cables and/or get a KVM. Top that off with the fact that you're saying they could instead get a used mac mini or ibook that potentially has hardware problems... gee, where do I sign up. The cheapest "official" refurbished mac from apple that a person could be reasonably assured of the hardware's condition is over $1000 [apple.com]
Hardware choice is a convenience. Convenience is a benefit people are often willing to pay for.
I've had the chance to use OSX at work. But if I hadn't had that opportunity and someone told me I could run it on my current hardware for $300 (including a copy of OSX), I can understand how that would appeal to people.
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Re:I just ordered one!! (Score:5, Informative)
Oh, and not one single hackintosh user that I have come across in #MacOSX has ever said they are using a boxed copy of the software, the same names always come up - Maxxus, JaS etc etc.
Actually that's the old method of doing it, individual releases hand made by various guys. The new technique uses boot-132 which allows you to install from an unmodified retail DVD. Basically you make a boot disc that includes any extra drivers or kernels you need for your setup, boot off of it, then swap the CD for the Leopard install DVD and run a normal setup. What people can do now is make boot CDs for OEM machines and you'd only download the ISO which only uses say 50MB or so, then theoretically you buy a legal copy at the store and use that. There's also generic boot CDs that include a ton of common drivers and hardware and will work for most people.
Just sayin... the copyright infringement aspect of using a hackintosh is now eliminated. As for EULA's, well that's another story.
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Re:I just ordered one!! (Score:5, Funny)
I see it as Win-Win.
Isn't it more of a Mac-Mac?
(I'm so sorry, but I couldn't resist.)
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Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
I'd try my hand at the math for comparable hardware again if I were you. =)
Re:I just ordered one!! (Score:5, Insightful)
Actually, Hackintoshes become most attractive when you start talking about NONcomparable hardware. There are some pretty down to Earth configurations that Apple just doesn't consider "cool enough" to make (cue in the Apple zealots who will proclaim that configuration styles used by 95% of PC users are "unnecessary niches").
I for example want a tower machine. I want something with a consumer-grade desktop CPU - dual or even single core, and just 1 of them - with no monitor strapped onto it, and with a case that has ample drive bays and expansion slots so that I can add storage space and add in a video card as needed.
In otherwords, I just want a plain-fscking computer. Not a tiny one. Not an all-in-one. Not a multi-thousand $$$$ workstation, and certainly not a laptop. Just a plain old tower. I'd even pay the famed "Apple tax" on the damned thing if it was made to buy. And don't give me the "there's no market for that" line - PC makers are selling the damned things like hotcakes.
So, given that Apple won't make what I want, I built a Hackintosh. Yes, I installed a hacked copy of OS X, so no dongle needed. I think my total investment in this machine is around $650 (and that includes a retail copy of OS X). For that I've got a dual-core 1.8Ghz processor, 2GB of RAM, 160GB of hard drive space, and a Geforce 8600GTS video card. And if I need a little more than what any particular component can provide, I'll just swap the part out because the system is upgradeable.
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Re:I just ordered one!! (Score:5, Insightful)
Yes, I've said this on a few forums - this is the fairly large 'niche' that Apple really do need to appeal to. People who want a reasonably spec'ed machine that has decent upgrade potential. The main reason cited by die-hard Mac zealots* is that it would compete with the Mac Pro, but I think if they only released models with dual-core CPUs and one or two free PCIe slots then the high-end graphics/video/audio professionals wouldn't be interested because the video and graphics people want quad- or 8-cores for rendering speed and the audio people want PCI slots for their Pro Tools cards and DSP.
I've got a Mac Mini and bought it with the highest processor/HD/memory combination available at the time, and still needed to buy an external drive to have a decent amount of storage space. I can't justify a Mac Pro because I'm really only doing don't-quit-your-dayjob home studio stuff. What will happen is in 6-12 months' time I'll buy a first generation Mac Pro second hand when all the real pros are upgrading to 8-core monsters, so Apple will miss out on a sale. If they made a mini-tower I would buy it tomorrow.
*I'm a Mac fan but not a zealot. I think.
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Ah yes, the mythical Mac mini-tower (Score:5, Interesting)
The posters above a're absolutely correct, and it's a huge opportunity that Apple is missing. All they need is a cut-down Mac Pro, call it a Mac Pro Mini. One upgradeable CPU, one (not four) hard drive bays, one (not two) optical bays, two (not eight) RAM slots, one slot for a graphics card, maybe one other slot, and a nice set of ports. They can't sell that for $999 and make a profit? Or sell it for $699 and use it to storm the gates of corporate America while they are annoyed about Vista. I think hackers, switchers, and many businesses would be thrilled with a Mac like that.
I even have a way to make it sexy enough for Steve Jobs: Make it "green"! Put it in a recyclable aluminum case and commit to making motherboard upgrades available for (say) five years.
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Re:I just ordered one!! (Score:5, Informative)
Yeah, I totally agree with that. Apple just doesn't offer enough hardware options to make it attractive. I mean, comeon, either the mac Mini which sucks as soon as you are looking for something that you want expand. The MacPro? Sure, it is a great platform, but very expensive...
I built a hackintosh out of a quadcore Q6600, 4GB of Memory, two 500GB drives and a 512MB geforce card. My cost was less than a thousand dollars and it works great (plus a 30" monitor), even better than my Official Macbook Pro. Apple just does NOT provide that kind of configuration for that price. The equivalent config with a MacPro is $2850...
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Exactly. (Score:5, Funny)
That's why Dell went under years ago, before they'd ever even really gotten started.
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Re:I just ordered one!! (Score:5, Insightful)
Using prebuilt systems to compete with that segment is practically impossible because you have to charge for the labor the customer is willing to do themselves, so Apple isn't ever going to try.
If Apple sold the a bare "Apple blessed" desktop motherboard with a copy of OSX for $260 the enthusiast DIY crowd would be all over it like white on rice.
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Re:I just ordered one!! (Score:5, Informative)
Exploding capacitors
Quick straw poll for slashdotters:
How many years have you been using PC-based hardware and how many exploding capacitors have you encountered?
I'll start: ~20 years, 0 exploding caps.
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Re:I just ordered one!! (Score:5, Funny)
In ~25 years, one board with 6 caps that look like they were installed in reverse. It was an industrial motherboard. I plugged it in and they popped and shot flames a couple inches high before smoking out. Totally freaking awesome.
I've also seen the battery in an Amiga 3000 explode and spew acid all over. Lots of little acid-chewed holes in that motherboard.
And once I had the RAM in a Dell PE2650 actually melt. Burned itself black and started to drip. Again, totally freaking awesome.
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Re:I just ordered one!! (Score:4, Informative)
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Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
You're saying you can build a Mac compatible system from the list of components for less than $450 dollars?
gigabyte GA-EP35-DS3 for $132
1GB DDR2 for $25
Core 2 Duo E2160 1.8GHz $60
Case+PS $90
GeForce 7300 GS $70
SATA DVD+RW $40
Seagate SATA HDD $40
EFIX dongle $155
Total of $612
Not including shipping+handling+tax of course.
Re:I just ordered one!! (Score:5, Informative)
There is no Apple Premium. There is shortage in variety in Apple Hardware choices. Apples Cost just as much as near Identical System (You need to include all the specs including weight and dimensions). However most people don't need all those specs only a subset of them. Thus can get a system elsewhere for cheaper as they do not need to spend extra to get the 17" screen and a Fast CPU with a lot of RAM, because they don't care that it is 1" thick and doesn't need Firewire, Lighted keyboard... However if you compare a System that has the exact same specs as the Mac (or very close) you find the prices are about the same +/- $100.
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Re:I just ordered one!! (Score:4, Insightful)
There is no Apple Premium.
yes there is. you can do all sorts of comparions (when I've done them the Apple device, Mac or iPod, always comes out more expensive) but there is a different kind of proof -- theres been plenty of financial reports (including Apples own) stating that they have a significantly higher profit margin on their hardware than competitors. where do you think that is coming from?
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Re:I just ordered one!! (Score:4, Interesting)
No Apple premium, you say? +/-$100 you say?
I was shopping for a laptop recently and decided that the MacBook Pro was the kind of laptop I was looking for, except it seemed a bit spendy. Next in line was the well-known ThinkPad which has a reputation for being rugged, well-built, and reliable, just like the MacBook Pro. So I compared the two online as closely as possible. I used the standard 15" MacBook as a reference and customized the ThinkPad accordingly because the reverse is much more difficult. Here's what I found.
Both Laptops have:
Screen physical dimension: 15"
CPU: Intel Core 2 Duo 2.5GHz
Memory: 2GB (2x 1G)
HDD: 250GB SATA, 5400rpm
Optical drive: 8x dual-layer recordable DVD
Wifi: 802.11n
Bluetooth: Yes
Ethernet: Gigabit
Battery life: About 5hrs
Macbook Pro
Graphics: NVIDIA GeForce 8600M GT with 256MB of GDDR3 SDRAM
Weight: 5.4 pounds
Thickness: 1"
Display: 1440 x 900 pixels
Keyboard illumination: backlight
Operating system: OS X
Pointing device: Multi-touch trackpad
Webcam: Yes
Video output: DVI
USB: 2 ports
Firewire: 1x 400 port, 1x 800 port
Expansion cards: 1x ExpressCard
Audio In: optical, line, microphone
Audio Out: optical, line, speakers
Card reader: No
Fingerprint reader: No
Price: $2499
ThinkPad T61
Graphics: NVIDIA Quadro NVS 140M (128MB)
Weight: 5.0 lbs
Thickness 1.2"
Display: 1680x1050
Keyboard illumination: Overhead LED
Operating system: Genuine Windows Vista Home Premium (default)
Pointing device: Trackpad and trackpoint with buttons for each
Webcam: No
Video output: VGA
USB: 3 Ports
Firewire: 1x 400 port
Expansion cards: 1x PC Card, 1x ExpressCard
Audio in: line, microphone
Audio out: headphones, speakers
Card reader: 4 in 1
Fingerprint Reader: Yes
Price: $1208
If you look just at computing power, the two are identical except that the MacBook Pro has a beefier graphics chipset. The rest of the advantages are mainly to do with better multimedia capabilities. (Except, curiously, screen resolution.) This could be worth more than double the cost of the ThinkPad if that's the kind of work you do. As a far more casual user and part-time hacker, I appreciated some of the more mundane enhancements that the ThinkPad offers at a much more attractive price: More ports, gizmos, and buttons.
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Re:I just ordered one!! (Score:4, Interesting)
the only use for the dongle is to commit copyright infringement, which is illegal
You mean license infringement.
I could buy a copy of Mac OS X now and use it as a doorstop without violating copyright (or its license for that matter).
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Fear the fruit! (Score:4, Interesting)
Mac vs. PC (Score:5, Funny)
Perhaps this will inspire a new "I'm a Mac, I'm a PC" commercial, with the PC donning a strap-on.
Or not.
Re:Mac vs. PC (Score:5, Funny)
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Intel Only (Score:4, Interesting)
Why is this needed? (Score:5, Insightful)
I was under the impression that you could already run OS X on a PC as long as the hardware was supported. What exactly does this thing do that you can't do already?
Re:Why is this needed? (Score:5, Informative)
You still need a custom hacked Kernel to do it, this removes that need. Even hackintosh's need a custom DVD, this will install with an off the shelf Leopard DVD.
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Re:Why is this needed? (Score:4, Interesting)
that's interesting, i've never used a USB dongle before, though i've come across certain video-editing programs that support special hardware dongles that are supposed to enable advanced features.
how exactly does a USB dongle work? is it just a software program that is executed from a USB key fob? certainly it can't be so simple as to just copying the data from the dongle and putting it onto another generic USB drive can it?
i would imagine that the USB dongle would have to have special hardware with the program saved on some kind of firmware. i'm not too familiar with the capabilities of the USB interface, so i don't know if that might be a vital part of how this dongle works. but if you can reverse engineer the dongle and boot up the image from any old USB key, then you could just as easily make bootable DVDs.
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28 days later... (Score:4, Insightful)
Tell me that won't happen.
Stubborn (Score:3, Interesting)
If Apple pushed their OS more, they could start to worry Microsoft more, just as Linux already worries Microsoft (that's not a troll statement). Apple could also do that other thing that companies usually do to exist - make more money.
Re:Stubborn (Score:4, Interesting)
Apple doesn't want their OS to run on generic hardware because then they can't make it nearly as stable as it is on Mac hardware. That Mac OS has fewer hardware compatibility issues is kind of a no-brainer that way. Windows, being made to work with 3rd-party drivers on generic hardware, really does not have that advantage.
If I were Apple I'd probably choose inaction for a while. It wouldn't do to encourage this sort of thing because I could dilute the perceived user experience of owning a mac if it became less stable on generic hardware (which it almost certainly would). It also wouldn't do to discourage it right off the bat because this does have the potential to convert over some windows users if they can safely try it out.
The bottom line, though, is that these users didn't pay Apple for the hardware, so Apple will barely make any money off this.
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Awesome (Score:3, Insightful)
Why bother? (Score:4, Insightful)
Not quite a USB dongle (Score:5, Informative)
Uhhh.. You can already do this without the dongle (Score:5, Insightful)
Umm.. you can already run OSX on PC hardware *without* no stinkin' dongle!
Well, that is, if you don't mind pirating software. There are several hacked copies of the OSX Tiger and Leopard install DVDs floating about that allow you to install OSX on any reasonably modern PC. Google around for 'leo4all' or 'ideneb'. YMMV.
Also: http://www.osx86project.org/ [osx86project.org] has tons of resources on how to run a 'hackintosh'.
There are also some VMWare 'appliances' -- that is -- virtual machines with OSX already pre-installed on the vmdk files. You just dl them and use vmplayer or vmware workstation and you got yourself OSX inside a VM.
People have been runing OSX on PC hardware for a while now. So, given that -- how is this exciting at all? It isn't even any more legal than just dling pirated/hacked OSX install DVDs. The way I see it -- there is no advantage to paying $150 to break the law with a stinkin' dongle, when you can download a 4GB DVD torrent and get OSX for free. Both are equally illegal and violate Apple's EULA or whatever.
So how is this new/newsworthy/even mildly exciting?
Re:Uhhh.. You can already do this without the dong (Score:5, Informative)
People have been runing OSX on PC hardware for a while now. So, given that -- how is this exciting at all?
Because, with other methods, you need hacks, and updates require more hacks. The idea here is that you can use a virgin install of OS X and it Just Works.
It isn't even any more legal than just dling pirated/hacked OSX install DVDs. The way I see it -- there is no advantage to paying $150 to break the law with a stinkin' dongle, when you can download a 4GB DVD torrent and get OSX for free. Both are equally illegal and violate Apple's EULA or whatever.
They are not "equally illegal". In your case, you are downloading copies of software (copyright infringement), and also the software has been reverse engineered and hacked (which might violate something). Then, in both cases, you violate the EULA with the installation (which isn't illegal). So, actually, buying the "stinkin' dongle" doesn't break the law, though violating the EULA will allow Apple to sue, provided the EULA is legal and enforceable.
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Re:Uhhh.. You can already do this without the dong (Score:4, Informative)
Who says you cant just go out and buy a copy of OSX and modify and run it via hackintosh? All that is needed to get around the install is to emulate the EFI on boot and there's a program out now that does that thanks to some reverse engineering by someone in the hackintosh community. With that you can even run the Apple update. This also works on AMD CPUs as well. Might have some problems running things that use PCI slots, but certain soundcards do have drivers out there. Honestly, I don't give a rat's butt what Mr. Jobs thinks (and his "oh no, you have to buy my overpriced [now pc hardware other than the EFI mobos Intel makes for them] hardware to run my OS). I should be able to do with the software once I purchase it at full price, so long as I am not distributing my copy to everyone else.
For more information, check out this site [insanelymac.com]. Their faq will tell you the basics and they also have a list of hardware people have sucessfully installed OSX with here [insanelymac.com] as well as a list of sound card drivers for pci if you do a search.
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Their website is STILL not using SSL (Score:5, Informative)
They want me to put credit card information into a standard HTTP page? I'm absolutely SURE I trust them not to do something stupid like store that information unencrypted in a database.
FAIL.
It sounds cool (Score:5, Informative)
but that iDeneb project [ihackintosh.net] is way cheaper as it does not require a dongle.
Others have found a way to hack their BIOS to use the Apple OEM ID and do their own EFI to run Mac OSX to fool OSX to think it is running on a real Apple Macintosh. The nice thing about EEPROMS is that you can flash update them easily, and anyone who knows machine language can hack their own BIOS file into one that can easily pass for an Apple Macintosh BIOS.
As for people like me, we don't even need a dongle to make our Intel PC turn into an Amiga [sourceforge.net] that is even cooler than an Apple Macintosh running OSX, and has a much lower memory footprint so it runs faster than OSX, and has an interface and look and feel like OSX or Vista, but is 100% free, 100% open source, and 100% legal.
For those who want to pirate OSX, get real, get AROS instead and support AROS developers to develop more AROS drivers and software. Why settle for a monopoly from Microsoft or Apple, when you can be free and use a non-monopoly OS that will run on almost any PC, Mac, Amiga, MIPS, PowerPC, etc system on the market?
You want an alternative to Windows? Wait until ReactOS [reactos.org] is done. It will run Windows applications. If you want an alternative to Windows that does not run Windows programs get HaikuOS [haiku-os.org] when it is ready as it is a free and open source BeOS operating system. Once OSFree is finished [osfree.org] it will be a free OS/2 open source OS, but I heard they will make it run under Linux to run OS/2 applications. Support your favorite free open source operating system instead of pirating OSX. Who cares enough about bloatware to pirate OSX or Vista, they are both bloated and buggy! If you want a free OS, get a free open source OS as I listed above when they are finished and out of beta testing. If you can't wait join in their beta program and give them feedback on how to fix it, or join the developers to help them get done faster.
Boycott Vista and OSX, and get Linux instead and install a Macintosh skin [interfacelift.com] on Linux instead of pirating OSX.
Re:It sounds cool (Score:4, Interesting)
"Boycott Vista and OSX, and get Linux instead and install a Macintosh skin [interfacelift.com] on Linux instead of pirating OSX."
OK so I do that. Now how do I run Aperture, Photoshop and Final Cut Pro on my Linux system? Yes those pprograms are the reason I have a Mac.
The reason one buys an OS is so they can run software. If the OS can't run the software you need it's usless.
That said. I'm typing this on a Linux system. I write software for Linux/Solaris but all of the creative digital content type stuff is done on mac OS X.
I've been a UNIX fan and user both at work and at home from long ago, i had UNIX before there was a thing called "Microsoft Windows". But I feel right at home on Mac OS X. It's the best desktop UNIX system out there. Solaris is the best server OS out there.
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Re:Weird turnabout (Score:5, Insightful)
News flash.. multiple people have multiple opinions on various topics!
In other words, it's not generally the same individuals making both of those claims.
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Re:Weird turnabout (Score:5, Funny)
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Re:Weird turnabout (Score:4, Funny)
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Re:Weird turnabout (Score:5, Funny)
And that, children, is where the Iceweasel [geticeweasel.org] came from.
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Re:Weird turnabout (Score:5, Insightful)
Because for all their high-and-mighty pontificating about "freedom" and "rights" and "DRM" and whatever, most people just like to get stuff for free/cheap.
Would Apple or the RIAA or Sony or whoever all of a sudden one day say "It's illegal to copy and share our stuff, but we promise never to come after you," you can bet your ass that the threads ranting about "my rights!" would dry up lickety-split. Because for the overwhelming majority of folks, it's not about the principle of the thing -- it's about you getting in the way of me getting stuff for free.
Sad, but true for all except a limited number of genuinely-involved purists.
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Re:Just need a test system (Score:4, Informative)
OSX is unsupported on VMware and it runs really really slowly. I'm not sure if this has been improved but the one time I tried it was just too slow to be usable even for testing.
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