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Microsoft To Release 'iPod Killer' at Christmas?
Posted by
Zonk
on Thu Jul 06, 2006 03:31 PM
from the happy-holidays dept.
from the happy-holidays dept.
ShellFish writes "According to a report from Engadget, Microsoft is poised to finally take on the Apple iPod this holiday season. Tired of uninspiring offerings from its hardware partners, Microsoft is getting into the ring itself. The new media player from Microsoft will feature a bigger screen than the iPod Video, have built-in WiFi for downloading music without a PC, and Microsoft will work with music and TV content providers to build an iTunes Music Store competitor. In what may be the crucial competitive stroke, Microsoft will also allow you to download from its store any song that you've purchased from Apple, unlocking users from iPod's vendor lock-in."
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Microsoft Developing iPod, iTMS Competitor 304 comments
Software writes "Reuters reports that Microsoft is developing an iPod and iTunes Music Store competitor. Few details are available, but it's known that Robbie Bach (the man behind the Xbox) is heading up the project." From the article: "Most iTunes rivals charge monthly fees to access a catalog of entertainment, but some allow consumers to buy individual songs for about $1 each. Microsoft's service will emphasize the pay-per-download, or a la carte, model, the sources said. A subscription component will also be offered, according to early accounts of the planned service. One source, who has seen a demonstration of the service, said it was an improvement over iTunes."
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Not only that... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Not only that... (Score:4, Funny)
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Re:Not only that... (Score:5, Funny)
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Re:OK, kudos to that (Score:5, Informative)
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Re:Not only that... (Score:4, Insightful)
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Re:Not only that... (Score:5, Insightful)
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Re:Not only that... (Score:5, Informative)
Proud owner of iPod Nano. But when it's time for replacement, I'll give this product a look-see.
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Re:Not only that... (Score:4, Informative)
And Apple learned from its mistakes, now you can use USB 2.0 or FireWire.
Not anymore, you can't. iPod videos ship with a USB(2.0) cable only and are unsynchable through firewire, even with the proper cabling. I believe the Nanos are the same way, but am fuzzy on the details. And lemme tell ya, coming from a guy with four Macs, being forced to sync with the only one with USB2.0 on it (which ain't where my music lives) is supremely fucking annoying.
Triv
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Re:Not only that... (Score:5, Insightful)
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Re:Not only that... (Score:5, Insightful)
Which will increase the size.
AAC isn't a proprietary vendor lock-in format, it's the successor to MP3, as in MP4. It's amazing how many people think AAC is an Apple thing. They've obviously never even looked into the format. AAC is the standard audio format for next-gen movies (HD-DVD and Blu-Ray).
Right, people have found no uses for the port at the bottom of the iPod.
This is another money-sinking venture into locking you into WMA and getting you reliant on Windows tech. The device will be bulky (bigger screen? What, you think Apple won't be introducing new iPods this Christmas either? Probably those huge widescreen touchscreen iPods we've been hearing about for a year) and will only work with Windows and Window Media Player. Yuck.
As for free downloads of iTunes purchases, does Microsoft think people use iPods because of the iTunes Music Store?
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Survey of High Schoolers: iPod not built to last (Score:5, Informative)
If you want something that's built to last, get an iPod.
Business Students at a local university surveyed a bunch of local high schools. They found that Apple scored low on reliability. Apple also scored low on features, the kids really thought the lack of AM/FM was a negative(*). However, iPod was the most common player. Apple did win on ease of use. Many iPod owners admitted they traded functionality/reliability for "status symbol"/fashion. The kids were fairly well informed since there was a lot of comparing and contrasting of the various players they had.
(*) I expect Apple has similar research of their own and it probably inspired the Radio Remote. I'd wager future models will have it built in.
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Radio? (Score:4, Insightful)
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Re:Survey of High Schoolers: iPod not built to las (Score:5, Interesting)
These were part-tme MBA students (ie worknig professionals by day) who had taken statistics and maketing and were working under the supervision of a professor who has been hired by large corporation to do just such studies. Now this was a class project, not a corporate sponsord project, so it was small scale and regional (southern California) compared to an Apple sponsored study but it included interviews, questionaires, and focus groups. The results are not so easily dismissed. The sample size was significant, distributions, p-values, and other sanity checks on the data were good.
You object to students being the segment studied? Have you seen Apple's commercials? This is Apple's target market.
You fail to mention the players the iPod was compared to.
The survey covered needs, wants, perceptions, and customer satisfaction for whatever portable digital player were used. It was not an iPod study per se, iPod was just the most common player.
You say lack of AM/FM is seen as a negative. But is it a missing feature that would influence a significant amount of people's buying decisions?
It was a recurring missing "want". As stated in the original posts, the respondents said that they traded this want for the "status symbol" nature of the iPod.
"(*) I expect Apple has similar research of their own and it probably inspired the Radio Remote. I'd wager future models will have it built in." I'll take that bet. I don't think those things are flying off the shelves. Seems more like a specialty add-on for the small minority who want it to me.
The fact that Apple introduced such a product undermines your argument. If Apple's research showed it to be such a niche product they would have left it to third parties.
You fail to mention the iTunes factor. It's not all about the hardware. How did that figure into this survey?
They did not like being unable to transfer the files, a general DRM problem. MP3s were the preferred format.
[sidebar] iTune isn't really much of a factor anyways. I believe Jobs once stated that the average customer spent US$70. Not much of a lock-in, but that's a different thread (literally). [/sidebar]
I can't stress enough that I do not own an iPod, or care to.
I own one, 2nd generation, the first that were available for PCs. I happy with it.
I just hate to see know-it-alls throw around pointless and and arbitrary surveys like this as data we should all respect.
Really, from reading your post it seemed that you disliked the results and made many erroneous assumptions to rationalize why you should reject the data. As I pointed out it seems consistent with Apple's behavior with respect to radio. It's small scale and regional, but it was done by knowledgeable people under the supervision of experts.
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Re:Not only that... (Score:4, Funny)
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Re:Not only that... (Score:5, Insightful)
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Re:Not only that... (Score:4, Interesting)
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re: exactly! (Score:4, Insightful)
I use mine pretty much every day, since it's normally attached to a Pioneer adapter on my car stereo.
I'm not denying *some* people have had problems with theirs, of course. But my experience is, this is a device that feels quite "solid" compared to most of the competitors. (The buttons feel like they could fall out of some of the other models I've used!) Sure - they're easy to scratch up, but that's just a cosmetic issue. In some respects, I actually like the way they show poor/rough handling like they do. It gives second-hand purchasers immediate knowledge of whether the previous owner was the type to take care of his/her electronics, or just throw them about.
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Re:Not only that... (Score:4, Funny)
Umm, just what part of the Internet do you think you're in? You seem a little lost.
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Closed codec's and DRM I'm sure (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Closed codec's and DRM I'm sure (Score:5, Insightful)
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Re:Closed codec's and DRM I'm sure (Score:5, Insightful)
Microsoft's DRM is not more lenient. It is much more strict than Fair Play. I predict you will not love it.
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Re:Closed codec's and DRM I'm sure (Score:4, Insightful)
Not true and a common misconception. Microsoft's DRM can be as flexible and as inflexible as the provider of the music service would like. It is perfectly possible to set the restrictions to be better than those of fairplay, but it is also perfectly possible to do the opposite.
Microsoft does not define how these are set - it is down to the music service and the agreements they have with labels.
Given previous experience, you're probably right on that one.
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Woah (Score:5, Interesting)
I'll assume the summary leaves out the crucial word "free" in there. If so, that's pretty damn clever. I just wonder how/if MS will get the music cartels to agree to it, other than wholescale bombing of their headquarters' into submission by the Windows Air Force.
Re:Woah (Score:5, Insightful)
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Re:Woah (Score:5, Informative)
"...But it gets better. To attract current iPod users Microsoft is going to let you download for free any songs you've already bought from the iTunes Music Store. They'll actually scan iTunes for purchased tracks and then automatically add those to your account....[MS has to pay rights-holders...they'll lose money to win converts] "
From: http://www.engadget.com/2006/07/06/microsoft-plann ing-wifi-enabled-portable-media-player-working-o/ [engadget.com]
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Re:Woah (Score:4, Insightful)
Forget that, how will they enforce it?
Violate the DMCA and try decrypting the songs?
Hack Apple's servers for information?
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Re:Woah (Score:4, Informative)
Albeit ostensibly benevolent, keep in mind Microsoft has a habit of trying to dump loads of money to gain initial market share. It'll be interesting to see how it turns out.
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Re:Woah (Score:5, Informative)
Personally I don't see how this will work. I can't imagine Apple being too keen on it.
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Re:Woah (Score:5, Interesting)
Personally, I'm going to be encouraging everyone I know to sign up for the service and download the Microsoft versions of their iTunes libraries - and then cancel their subscription.
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Re:Woah (Score:5, Funny)
"Why those are some real nice computers you got there at the RIAA, running some fancy Windows OS too. Sure would be a shame if WGA suddenly listed them all as pirated...."
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Ipod killer? Not unless... (Score:5, Funny)
How about Zen Vision killer? (Score:4, Insightful)
Apple will do fine. They have dominated the mp3 business far in excess of anyone's expectations, and for far longer. Even if they fall back to a 40% market share; that will still be a large and successful business.
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Does it literally kill ipods? (Score:5, Funny)
also.. (Score:5, Funny)
One jailer for another (Score:5, Insightful)
Next, I hope they'll let me "upgrade" all my paperbacks to MSReader encrypted format too!
If I had a dollar for every "iPod killer"... (Score:5, Insightful)
Apple and RIAA are laughing softly (Score:5, Insightful)
Apple is laughing because Microsoft seems to have no profit foothold anywhere in the business plan. As new entrants their players will most likely have to compete on price, reducing the profit margin there. And by re-paying labels for music already purchases, they are in essence subsidizing their customers' libraries--a huge expense. Compare to Apple who commands a healthy profit on the players AND a small profit on every song sold. The only thing better than beating a competitor is making them lose a lot money and STILL get beaten.
Do I need to input password... (Score:5, Funny)
What their iPod killer will be... (Score:5, Funny)
You know how you can order an iPod from Apple with a custom etching on the back?
Microsoft just placed an order for a few thousand blue iPods with "Microsoft" etched on the back. Internal reports suggest they won't even bother opening up the boxes as they come in the mail, instead just redirect them to their "customers".
fools (Score:5, Insightful)
The iPod is a) simple, b) reliable, c) user-friendly, d) cool, e) well designed and f) ties in well with iTunes. That's what sells it, not bigger screens or WiFi. Nobody who owns an iPod wants to fiddle around for 5 minutes to get the WiFi to work.
Music Store Lock-in Exaggerated (Score:4, Insightful)
The iTunes Music Store (iTMS) lock-in is exaggerated. I think Jobs mentioned that the average iTMS customer purchased US$70 worth of music. That's not much of a lock-in, especially given that we're talking about folks with the resources to buy an iPod - a digital player at the expensive end of the spectrum.
Now if only Microsoft would expand the policy to include music I purchased on LPs, 8 tracks, and casettes.
Already Exists? (Score:4, Informative)
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsmobile/media/giga
OGG? (Score:5, Interesting)
Yes, that's all very well, but will it play my OGG files?
STOP! (Score:5, Insightful)
Msft is not considered hip enough to sell iPods (Score:4, Insightful)
Consider the age group that is the target market. High school, and college students just don't consider msft cool anymore (did they ever?).
Re:Oragami (Score:5, Funny)
It was folded.
Parent
Re:Not going to buy it (Score:4, Interesting)
A wide library was extremely important to me. I like being able to go weeks without hearing a song again, and none of the other players I saw even came close in capacity. They need more jiggawatts.
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Re:Not going to buy it (Score:5, Funny)
If by 'hacking', you mean: insert a memory card with a movie on it and click 'play', then by all means, hack away mr. hacker!
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Re:Stop saying iPod Killer! (Score:5, Funny)
Oh, yeah?
http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/product.do?pid=009
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Re:In other news... (Score:4, Informative)
"The problem is, the PC model doesn't work in the consumer electronics industry, where you've got all these companies and some does one thing and another does another thing. It just doesn't work. What's going to happen is that Microsoft is going to have to get into the hardware business of making MP3 players. This year. X-player, or whatever."
The link is here: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10853916/site/newswee
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