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Apple, the New Microsoft?
Posted by
Zonk
on Fri Feb 09, 2007 04:56 PM
from the rolling-stone-obviously-an-authority-on-this dept.
from the rolling-stone-obviously-an-authority-on-this dept.
VE3OGG writes "Apple, the ultimate source of cool. The marketers of slick. The next 'evil empire'? While it might sound goofy at first, Rolling Stone magazine is running an article that summarizes some very interesting points that detail how Apple could become the next technology bad guy. Among the reasons given: Apple's call to be rid of DRM (while continuing to use it in iTunes); Apple's perceived arrogance when they warned consumers not to upgrade to Vista, while not rushing to fix the problem themselves; and Apple's seemingly unstoppable market dominance in the form of the iPod. The iPhone featured heavily as well, a product that is months from release but steals the press from more competitive products. What do you think, could Apple eventually take the place of Microsoft?"
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Won't take the place of MS... but competition... (Score:5, Insightful)
-M
Re:Why DRM and Locks on Apple Stores are Dumb, Job (Score:5, Insightful)
Steve never says that we should do away with intellectual property; his essay boils down to saying DRM is counter-productive and doesn't actually do anything other than piss people off. You can buy unDRMed music if you want, but for online distribution, we're needlessly hindered, and he's right.
That a big leap to implying that he's a hypocrite because he won't give away the company.
Also, I rather think that whoever writes this sort of thing should use the products, or research the company at least a little. I've NEVER used a key to activate OS X, all the way back to 10.0. Don't criticize the company for things they already do right.
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At least it will look better (Score:5, Funny)
Duh (Score:5, Insightful)
If it weren't for Microsoft, Apple would be Microsoft.
Re:Duh (Score:5, Insightful)
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No, but not from lack of trying... (Score:5, Insightful)
Some examples off the top of my head - legal action against bloggers, iPhone trade mark, stock options, treatment of Woz.
If anything, they are able to get away with actions which would be considered unforgivable were they committed by Microsoft. The only reason they are not considered as evil is due to their size - except in the case of music downloads, they are not in a monopoly position.
Apple are a very big company (albeit smaller than Microsoft) and have been for many years. To pretend they are otherwise is naive to say the least.
Re:No, but not from lack of trying... (Score:5, Insightful)
I mean "iPhone trademark"? Huh? What have they done evil? I'm sure the courts can help decide that fairly. Apple has no particular advantage over Cisco in that. I'm sure they will pay Cisco whatever they deserve, probably a lot more than I'd think they deserve.
Stock options? Who exactly is harmed by that? The stockholders? I'm a stockholder, and sure am not complaining. It's a rule violation, sure, but how is that so evil?
Legal actions against bloggers....ok I'll grant you Apple can be a bit of a control freak. I happen to enjoy Apples big dramatic announcements, and not having them spoiled, so I can't blame them from trying to protect stuff like that. Other things...well, ok, they can be a bit heavy handed.
Treatment of Woz....Hmmm. He seemed to make out ok on the deal. That just seems a little bit of a personal thing on Steve Jobs part, not really Apple. Woz doesn't seem overly bitter. In any case, consumers aren't harmed by it.
Microsoft, meanwhile, well almost everything they have done to leverage their monopoly to prevent competition is in a whole different ballpark. It directly hurts consumers by preventing competitors from staying in business and making new stuff, and by raising prices. That's evil.
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The article is FUD ... (Score:5, Insightful)
Warning their customers that their software doesn't run on Vista is a nice thing to do for their customers. As we've seen in other stories, lots of other software won't run on Vista either. Heck, some of Micosoft's own software won't run on Vista from what I've heard.
And, from the last point in the summary, it is entirely possible that people like the iPod because it's a good product, and the iTunes software makes it easy to use. The iTunes music store is also nice, because it was quite literally, the first legal place to buy digital music. DRM or not.
It is possible that at some point in the future Apple could become a big evil company. But, none of the things to suggest that in the article summary are anything more than FUD and sensationalism.
Cheers
Amusing Premise, Moronic Reasons (Score:5, Insightful)
Lets look at these one at a time:
Apple's call to be rid of DRM (while continuing to use it in iTunes);
Apple is selling music players and needs a way to get music to users easily so they will buy said music players. The providers of said music are a cartel convicted of abuse multiple times. The cartel required DRM and Apple pushed back on how restrictive it is and prices. Does anyone think it would be better if Apple refused to do business with them and let Microsoft dominate the DRM market? Apple needed to be there to stop MS from using the incompatibility of DRM'd songs against their OS offering. There is nothing hypocritical about saying it would be better for everyone (except the RIAA) if DRM was no more, either voluntarily or by law. Does anyone complain that OpenOffice reads and writes .doc files, all while they talk about how bad it is people are locked in that format?
Apple's perceived arrogance when they warned consumers not to upgrade to Vista, while not rushing to fix the problem themselves;
Perceived arrogance? Some people think Apple was arrogant when they apologized for their software not working and recommended people hold off upgrades? Can you tell me the name of a software vendor that isn't cautioning customers to wait until things stabilize, because I'll happily stop doing business with the irresponsible twits.
They have about 70% which is the minimum share where some governments start investigating possible antitrust issues due to dominance. Compare this to MS's 90% and multiple convictions for abuse. Some of Apple's actions are antitrust abuse if they have enough market share, but all in markets where MS already is abusing their monopoly and the governments have declined to stop them. Two wrongs don't make a right, but two monopolies battling one another is a lot better than one screwing consumers as hard as possible.
The iPhone featured heavily as well, aproduct[sic] that is months from release but steals the press from more competitive products.
Ummm... umm... what? Apple released pictures and discussed a cool upcoming new device and people paid attention and this is somehow indicative of Apple becoming an evil empire? I like it when companies come out with cool toys. I hate it when they come out with crap that no one likes but everyone has to use anyway.
Could Apple suddenly gain a dominant position in the market and then abuse that position? Well, it is vaguely possible, but the items listed are no reason to think it might be likely. If they do that, and we all suffer as a result I'll complain my head off, but one nice thing Apple has done to date is avoided any lock-in that keeps me from migrating all my hardware and files to another platform like Linux. Until they do that, I'm not about to lose any sleep over the danger of Apple, when the danger of MS has never been stopped and shows no signs of slowing.
What is Charles Coxe smoking? (Score:5, Insightful)
Talk about spin:
Forgetting that Steve Jobs explained the decision to announce now rather than later. His explanation was that Apple was about to file applications with the FCC. Jobs wanted to quell any rumors and address everything up front once Apple did that.
I guess this is compared to Cairo and Longhorn where some features promised have not been released in Vista even though they were promised 10 years ago. These announcements by MS had the effect of stifling adoption of other OS like OS/2, NextOS, etc. Maybe Apple will do the same thing, but I would wait til summer before I would accuse Apple of MS tricks.
Did he happen to read the rest of the article where Jobs explains that Apple has to include DRM or the content providers would not license the content to Apple. Also Apple is not alone in this situation. Sony, MS, Best Buy, hmmm. It seems that most online music distributors use DRM.
I don't know where this information comes from, but Apple's statement [apple.com] is thus:
Considering that some MS applications don't work with Vista, most companies are waiting until SP1 to install Vista, and other third party vendors like McAfee, Intuit, etc, are also having issues with Vista, I don't see how Apple's stance is unique.
tell me about it (Score:5, Funny)
No kidding. While it may have wireless, it has less space than a Nomad. Lame.
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Re:Who is the ultimate source? (Score:5, Insightful)
Miles Davis?
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Re:Its possible (Score:5, Insightful)
What was the last boxed retail Microsoft software you bought? For me I think it was MS-DOS 6.22. Everything since has come pre-installed on a new computer when I purchased it. It's not so much that I chose to buy it, as I didn't choose not to buy it.
Not a bad distribution channel to have, if you can get it.
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Re:No, because... (Score:5, Insightful)
Sony, like Microsoft, acts in such a way that it's tough to believe they even like their customers. They are quick to adopt restrictions, slow to correct their mistakes, and want to be in all markets, even when it puts the company at odds with itself.
Apple, on the other hand, is very careful not to enter new markets unless it feels it genuinely has something to contribute. More importantly, they dislike restrictions, as evidenced by their reasonable DRM in iTunes and lack of CD key for OS X. They assume that their customers are good, honest people. Sony and Microsoft like to assume that their customers are criminals.
Interestingly, where other companies try to give their customers what they ask for, Apple instead tries to give them what they really want. Some people hate this, but it's working very well for Apple.
Also, Apple has already made their huge, almost company-ending mistakes. They've bounced back better than anyone could have thought. I'd say they've earned the success and attention they're getting.
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Re:No, because... (Score:5, Insightful)
Part of the reason for the last "negative" is the internet. They missed the early wave and if not for their "no honor, controlling the OS doesn't give us a competitive advantage" competitive advantage, IE could be a minor to non-existent player right now.
Apple, on the other hand, is very careful not to enter new markets unless it feels it genuinely has something to contribute.
Bull, unless by "contribute" you mean they have enough business sense not to get into a market that they can't A) make high margins from and B) do A by leveraging very good design ethic and brand recognition. Don't confuse market savvy with altruism.
More importantly, they dislike restrictions, as evidenced by their reasonable DRM in iTunes and lack of CD key for OS X. They assume that their customers are good, honest people. Sony and Microsoft like to assume that their customers are criminals.
Again, a load of hooey. Apple understands the significant importance of market share. They never had it with the Mac, so they HAVE to differentiate themselves there. If they were more heavy handed with how they treated their customers, then they would cease to exist (well the Mac as a platform anyway). Again, don't confuse understanding your market with superiour morals.
Interestingly, where other companies try to give their customers what they ask for, Apple instead tries to give them what they really want.
No, Jobs and Apple are good at understanding function, not necessarily "what customers want" or "really want". From the articles I've read on Jobs and Ivey on how they design, they focus on what a product should do, not what their interpretation of what customers want products to do. Huge distinction, and what truly makes Apple/Jobs special, they understand how things should function.
Now don't get me wrong, I'm a big a Jobs fanboy as you're likely to run across. I own more Mac's than entire third world nations. But I'm not blind to the kind of company Apple is (and they are just that, a company, whose primary focus it is to make money). They just happen to take a tact that benefits many/most consumers.
Parent
Re:No, because... (Score:5, Interesting)
IBM makes the chips that powers all of these new consoles and is still a big name in computing.
Nintendo has created a frenzy around another handheld machine and the Wii, which is killing Sony thus far, and has really revolutionized the way people play video games.
"...largely irrelevant"? Not a chance.
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Rolling Stone is an IT news source now? (Score:5, Funny)
Actually, scratch that last one -- there isn't enough drugs or catnip in the world to come to a conclusion like that...
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Re:Rolling Stone is an IT news source now? (Score:5, Interesting)
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Re:No, because... (Score:5, Insightful)
You must be using the Strawman OS. Windows is the only OS that comes close to telling the user what they need to do "Your desktop is cluttered...plug your device in to a faster USB port...turn on a firewall")
The Mac gets out of your way. It doesn't pop up balloons every time a peripheral is connected, like it's shocked that it worked. It's also not a cut rate UNIX with a GUI mimicking a cut rate Windows...spend some money and get a mature OS.
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Re:Sure, why not? (Score:5, Interesting)
AT&T (The Bells): Phone/Telecom monopoly. Is there a phone/telecom monopoly today? No.
IBM: Hardware monopoly. Is there a hardware monopoly today? No.
Microsoft: Software monopoly. Is there a software monopoly today? Yes. Is it shrinking? Yes.
There is always that guy who jumps in and grabs the whole market when it's brand new. The thing is, it never lasts, and then the market gets filled up with a lot of small savvy competitors, and fragments. This happens over and over throughout history. Microsoft seems eternal to us, but they're still pretty new, I mean, they're younger than I am. In forty years, they'll be completely different, and will not have the same level of dominance.
Apple may become an evil empire, if they work out a way to do real digital convergence so well that all other attempts fall hilariously flat. But the iPod is not an empire in itself...It's just a nice product.
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Re:Sure, why not? (Score:5, Informative)
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Re:Come on people, this is a COMPANY.. (Score:5, Insightful)
Secondly, I think its clear that Steve Jobs is fundamentally different than Bill Gates, and really is driven by a desire to change the world for the better. Yes he is a shrewd businessman as well, but I think he thinks that if they create great products and make people happy, the money will follow. Bill Gates and Microsoft seem to have the opposite priorities...make money, and create a great product only if you have to to acheive the former goal. If you can do it other ways (such as leveraging the monopoly, etc), just as good.
You also seem to be ignoring the fact that companies can decide that doing good things (or being perceived as doing so) is their preferred route to making money. Google, whether or not you agree with their definition of "evil", presumably thinks that it is a good business strategy to try to maintain an image of being a good guy. They think it is a good long term strategy.
Microsoft hasn't really worried too much about that, while other companies have. Now that the internet is what it is, it becomes a much more important priority, as a bad reputation hurts a lot more these days.
Parent
Re:Come on people, this is a COMPANY.. (Score:5, Insightful)
A person's sole purpose, if you boiled everything down, is to reproduce. So I take it you support rape? What about prostitution? Hell, why are you even on Slashdot? Go breed!
The fact that a form of natural selection means we're left with the companies best able to make money does NOT mean that is or should be every company's sole purpose in life. It is NOT a justification for Apple behaving the way it does, or for M$ behaving the way it does.
Whether or not Google lives up to it, stating "Don't be evil" as a company motto is a good idea.
And ultimately, I'd hope that evil companies lose in the long run anyway. Don't you? Don't you hope that a combination of regulation, customer dissatisfaction, employee moral crisis, and honest competition will one day unseat the Microsofts and Sonys of the world?
And regulation removes power.
For that matter, I don't know about Apple, but I really see no way that Canonical could become corrupt. If they did, we'd fork and move on. Or take IBM -- yes, I can buy an IBM server to put Linux on. And if IBM becomes corrupt, I'll buy Dell servers, or build my own.
It is possible to be a profit-driven company and not seek or maintain absolute power.
Oh, and by the way, are you religious? Are you aware that this statement applies to God? Just thought I'd mention that. If you believe in a God with any shred of compassion, then you must reject the "absolute power" statement.
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Re:Apple can't be (Score:5, Insightful)
As long as they follow their business model they've always had - tying software to hardware - they'll never achieve enough market penetration to be Microsoft.
Actually, in our current non-free market, that is the only way they can have significant growth.
For consumer level stuff, if iTunes becomes too cumbersome, people will move on. It's yet to face any serious competition, when it does, it won't seem like such an unstoppable force.
iTunes is a music jukebox application with about 1/10 the penetration of MS's Windows Media Player. Your comments don't make a lot of sense in that light.
They could have very microsoft-ish market share if they'd sell OS/X for commodity hardware.
They could go out of business if they'd sell OS X for commodity software. They already tried that once when they were ahead in the OS wars, and almost died. Several companies brought superior OS's to the market, but dies because of MS's monopoly power. Having a better OS is not enough to win in a monopolized market. It isn't even enough to survive unless you have a complete, separate chain of supply the monopoly cannot undermine.
I'd install it tomorrow if I could
Great. With you and all the other people that can afford to pay for a copy and who know how to install an OS, or even what an OS is, and who aren't locked into Windows for some applications or purposes that should boost Apple's market share about 3%, while completely killing the 50% of their revenue they get from hardware sales.
People don't install OS's. If Apple can't reach the pre-install market with OS X they are missing the largest chunk. If they are missing that chunk and are missing the business market who is still locked in with ActiveX, .doc, VB, exchange, etc then they are missing all but a tiny portion of the legal market, a good chunk of which Apple already has.
I'm sure some businesses love Macs and are all Apple this and Apple that, but that's the exception that proves the rule.
Apple does not target business for a number of pretty good reasons I'm not going into right now. Apple can slowly grow market share (as they have been) so long as they maintain their hardware/software chain. The minute they break that, MS can kill them.
You're right that the only way Apple will gain a large share of the market is by unbundling the two, but what you're failing to realize is that action is only possible if MS's monopoly is already broken or severely weakened. If Linux takes the business market, for example, then Apple could unbundle these two items. Or, if the government actually prosecuted MS effectively and broke them up into companies that were in competition with one another, then Apple would be forced to unbundle their products to survive as all the value of bundling would be gone, while the market would be highly competitive. Both are very unlikely in the near future.
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Re:Penultimate, eh? (Score:5, Funny)
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