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No Third-party Apps on iPhone Says Jobs
Posted by
CowboyNeal
on Fri Jan 12, 2007 02:12 AM
from the hack-something-else dept.
from the hack-something-else dept.
wyldeone writes "In an interview with the New York Times, Steve Jobs confirms reports that the recently-announced iPhone will not allow third party applications to be installed. According to Jobs, 'These are devices that need to work, and you can't do that if you load any software on them.' In a similar vein, Jobs said in a MSNBC article that, 'Cingular doesn't want to see their West Coast network go down because some application messed up.'"
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iPhone Not Running OS X 476 comments
rochlin writes "We know that Steve Jobs has said the iPhone won't accept third-party apps. The iPhone looks to be running on a Samsung provided ARM core processor. That means it's not running on an Intel (or PPC) core. That means it's not running OS X in any meaningful sense (Apple can brand toilet paper as running OS X if they like). Darwin, the BSD based operating system that underlies what Apple has previously been calling OS X, does not run on ARM processors. The Darwin / Apple Public Source licensing agreement says the source would have to be made available if it is modified and sold (paraphrased; read it yourself). A Cingular rep has said the iPhone version of the OS source will not be made available. It will be closed, like the iPod OS and not like Darwin. So if it ain't Darwin, it ain't OS X (in any meaningful way). An InfoWorld article on an FBR Research report breaks down iPhone component providers and lists Samsung as the chip maker for the main application / video cpu. So, that leaves the question... What OS is this phone really running? Not Linux or the source would need to be open."
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No Third-party Apps on iPhone Says Jobs
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Right... (Score:5, Insightful)
(http://www.accordion.org/ | Last Journal: Tuesday June 06 2006, @10:55PM)
Re:Right... (Score:5, Insightful)
(http://blog.jrock.us/ | Last Journal: Sunday October 10 2004, @04:11AM)
The iPod is pretty neat straight out of Apple, but the true possibilities of the device aren't really reached. Take a look at the Rockbox firmware for iPods -- it adds tons of features that Apple said were "technically impossible" or that "nobody wants". Right now I'm listening to a gapless FLAC album with a bit of crossfeed, and it's wonderful. Fuck you, Jobs. You don't know what I want. Stop telling me what to do!
With respect to phones, I think the iPhone is going to be a flop. When it's all said and done, it's a $3000 phone (can't get one without 2 years of Cingular's worthless service) that plays mp3s and has a calendar with pixmaps borrowed from OS X.
I'm holding out for Trolltech's Greenphone. It runs Linux, and the point is openness... you can recompile the kernel if you want! Paired with KDE 4, I think it's going to blow the iPhone out of the water... at least for people that want a useful, hackable mini-computer and not a $3000 status symbol.
Re:Right... (Score:5, Informative)
2007 looks like an interesting year for smartphones: the iPhone on the one hand, and OpenMoko and Greenphone for open Linux-based platforms on the other.
Re:Right... (Score:5, Interesting)
(http://www.nodomain.org/)
So expect an iPhone 2 in about 12 months time with these features if they want to launch in the Europe/Asia (which is a larger market than the US by a long way so they'd be stupid not to).
(The Apple TV is also aimed squarely at the US market also, given that itunes doesn't support video downloads in any other country (and 'a selection of pixar short films' does *not* count) - sensing a pattern here...)
Re:Right... (Score:4, Informative)
(http://www.nodomain.org/)
Re:Right... (Score:5, Insightful)
(http://www.splatterfish.com/)
I realize many here would happily take an ass-ugly black brick if it ran linux, had a full array of ports (USB and serial, oh yeah!). However, unless you've been asleep since the iPod rolled out, you may have noticed that people seem to really dig the simple interface and gorgeous industrial design. People don't want whizzy features. They want a phone that makes a good status symbol, and this will fit the bill nicely.
Re:Right... (Score:4, Interesting)
(Last Journal: Friday November 09, @04:36PM)
While EDGE is certified by the IMT-2000 initiative as "3G", it's seen as a transitional technology for 2G networks, networks that have EDGE are better than networks without them, but over-all, a 2G network enhanced with EDGE is still 2G. Or 2.5G if you want to get really into the marketing terms (2G with packet switching.)
The 3G version of GSM is called UMTS. HSDPA is an enhancement to two of UMTS's air interfaces (W-CDMA and TD-CDMA.) This offers better bandwidth and far lower latency than EDGE. Call quality, thanks to higher bit rates, is good too.
So... why wouldn't the iPhone sell in Europe? Because most GSM operators have UMTS networks as well as 2G GSM networks, and most people want a phone that isn't limited to 2G GSM. Tariffs encourage use of 3G services - as an example, the only unmetered mobile Internet access option in the UK is from T-Mobile, where the tariff requires use of T-Mobile's 3G network.
If you're selling a device one of whose primary advantages is Internet access, selling one that doesn't support UMTS in Europe is ridiculous.
Now, in the US, Cingular are trying to roll out a UMTS network but have been hampered by lack of spectrum. The only other major GSM network in the US is T-Mobile, and they've specifically waited for spectrum, planning to launch 3G in the next few months. That'll take time to deploy too. So releasing an EDGE phone is acceptable here, because a UMTS phone would be more expensive, would probably operate on the wrong frequencies initially, and offer few advantages given the lack of a viable network to use the UMTS side on.
That argument cannot be made for Europe, and it's going to bite Apple in the rear if they don't put UMTS in the European version.
Apple thinks it can make 10 million sales of this thing in a year. Unless they take the rest of the world seriously, recognizing that 3G is big outside of the US, that people outside the US are used to unlocked, carrier-neutral, phones, that the smartphone market is actually under active development outside of the "free cheap phone with two year contract" US market, they're going to have to make almost all those sales in the US. I don't think they can pull that off, especially given they've locked their fortunes to Cingular's.
Re:Nail on the Head. (Score:4, Informative)
The article below in case the link dies.
Japan far ahead of iPhone
Cellphones there used for everything from buying milk to booking a train
January 12, 2007
Bruce Wallace
SPECIAL TO THE STAR
TOKYO-Tomoaki Kurita presides over racks of cellphones lined up outside his shop on a busy sidewalk in Harajuku, Tokyo's catwalk of youth street culture where people attracted by the riot of phone options can stop to flip open and fondle the latest models of what the Japanese call a "keitai."
From behind his busy counter, Kurita giggles when asked about the excitement in the United States over the arrival of Apple's iPhone cellphone that also could be used to download music and surf the Internet.
"Sounds like business as usual," he says.
As stock markets swooned and techies buzzed over Apple Inc. CEO Steve Jobs' long-awaited entry into the cellphone market, Japanese consumers could be excused for wondering: Why the fuss?
Many Japanese had a hard time buying Jobs' hype about "reinventing" the phone. The revolution is well underway in Japan, where cellphones are used for everything from navigating your way home by GPS to buying movie tickets and updating your blog from wherever you are.
Oh yeah. Japanese cellphones also download music, surf the Net and make phone calls.
They've been a natural extension of daily life the past few years, spurred by the Japanese decision to be the first country to upgrade to third-generation cellphone networks, or 3G, which increased broadband capabilities and allowed for greater, faster transmission of voice and data. Apple's iPhone, by comparison, will operate on a 2G network.
It was 3G that sparked the boom in music downloads that makes it common for phones to be used as portable digital music players here.
And it is 3G that has led the Japanese into a world where they can watch live TV on their phones, use the phone as a charge card to ride trains or buy milk at the corner store or take a taxi, and conduct conference calls between as many as five people. Ticket Pia, Japan's major entertainment ticketing agency, has been selling email tickets to cellphones since 2003.
Most observers contend the U.S. has begun to close the gap on cellphone use in Japan, South Korea and Europe. Music downloads by cellphone are rising in the U.S. - and the long-term threat to iPod's lead in downloads was a major force behind Apple's entry into cellphones. Other functions are following.
"We plan to introduce one-way video conferencing in the U.S. this year," says Melissa Elkins of LG Electronics MobileCOMM, referring to a function that would allow one person to be visible to the other during a phone call. Two-way telephony has been available in South Korea for about 18 months, Elkins says.
But the biggest difference between the U.S. and countries like Japan is the culture the keitai has created. To wait for a light on a Tokyo street corner or ride a train these days is to see crowds of people with their heads down, thumbs pumping as they send photos, text message or play online games on their phone. Increasingly, they are reading books and manga comics on their phones, too.
The keitai has become an extension of personality.
There is software to create a personalized home page on the cellphone. Young men and women customize their phones, hang posses of tiny dolls off them, cover them with stickers and paints.
"I like it because it's cute," says Mami Nawa, 23, as she shows off the dial pad she has painted in purple and pink to
Re:Right... (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Right... (Score:5, Informative)
(http://theravensnest.org/ | Last Journal: Sunday October 07, @07:05AM)
Re:Right... (Score:5, Interesting)
Well, I have a Trolltech Greenphone on my desk because we develop software for it. And while it is hackable, Linux based, and a nice geek gizmo, there is no way I'm going to use it as my primary mobile phone. Teeeeny stuff to hit with the stylus. Lots of buttons that you don't really know what they do. Difficult to enter text. (It's a development platform after all.)
Personally, I'm using the cheapest Motorola cellphone available (monochrome display, does nothing more than phone and SMS), and I'm holding out for the iPhone to hit Europe. Because I don't WANT to hack a device to use it as a phone/PIM, even if I COULD.
Re:Right... (Score:4, Insightful)
(Last Journal: Saturday January 31 2004, @05:25PM)
What might kill the phone is its price and lack of features. No GPS, no G3, poor battery life, and a camera with yesterday's specs; so much for being 5 years ahead, Steve. It looks cool, but I'm not paying around $500 for a pretty case and a slick user interface, when my current WM5 phone (with GPS) costs $150 on a cheap 2 year plan.
Re:Right... (Score:4, Insightful)
(Last Journal: Monday November 28 2005, @12:21PM)
And yet you still bought an iPod. I think that's the kind of "Fuck you" Jobs can live with.
Re:Right... (Score:5, Insightful)
So that's it? The iPhone saved space by not having a plastic keyboard? Please tell me after two days after the keynote that's not the only advantage it actually has.
Re:Right... (Score:5, Funny)
Well, because the iPhone will not be available for another 6 months I guess it really is 4 1/2 years ahead of anything out there.
Re:Right... (Score:5, Informative)
(http://www.hansprestige.com/ | Last Journal: Friday September 14, @04:25PM)
You see, real smartphones let you install whatever software you want onto your phone. Hell, even many (most?) non-smart phones can run Java apps. That's certainly the kind of functionality Cingular customers are used to.
What Apple's doing with the iPhone, OTOH, is what Verizon customers are used to: the carrier tells you what you can do with your phone. You buy it, but you don't really own it. They say it's about quality assurance, and to some degree it might even be, but what it's really about is making sure you pay for extra features, instead of downloading freeware or writing your own. They think that if you're getting extra value out of their service, you owe them for it. But even Verizon doesn't go that far with their smartphones!
There might be apps written by third parties on the iPhone, but who writes them is pretty much irrelevant, because you can't write or install them without going through Cingular and/or Apple. They'll charge for the SDK, for testing apps, and for making apps available to users, and those costs will be passed onto the end user in the form of (1) paying to download apps and (2) limited selection because amateurs can't afford to develop.
Re:Right... (Score:4, Informative)
Jobs is looking for the top buyers who will pay nearly anything for a phone that just plain works and has simple email/text messaging and maybe a web browser. In this market, the iPod is really just a bonus.
My only question is, is this a GSM phone that will let me change out the chip so I can use it around the world? Unfortunately, I don't think so. Anyway, my dad will surely buy it in the next year. He's slowly converting to the entire Apple line (First an ipod, then 2 imacs, now this).
Re:Right... (Score:5, Insightful)
Jobs is not an idiot, and it is just barely possible that Apple has done a little market research on this subject, so your statement is probably correct. This is not a phone for the average
If Apple follows the iPod legacy, they'll produce a device with stupidly high usability and a narrowly defined feature set that serves the objectively-identified desires of their target customers: wealthy, style-and-trend-conscious technophiles who don't actually know anything about technology. Pre-iPod, MP3 players were like those 19th century automobiles that you steered with a tiller rather than a steering wheel. The iPod didn't add any new functionality, but it made existing functionality vastly easier to use. If the iPhone does the same thing it'll be a major hit. Open or closed really doesn't matter, because that's not something that the target purchaser cares about.
Re:Right... (Score:5, Insightful)
(http://www.hansprestige.com/ | Last Journal: Friday September 14, @04:25PM)
Perhaps you don't realize it, but you can go out today and buy a cellular device from any US carrier that does run third-party apps, without having to get them signed or tested by the carrier or manufacturer. The world hasn't ended, the networks haven't been crashed by rogue apps, and customer service desks aren't overwhelmed with calls from idiots who broke their own phones by installing something.
Re:Right... (Score:5, Insightful)
I mean, FFS. This is Slashdot, and you're glad that the most revolutionary electronic device in years is moronically shackled, and you get modded up? What is this, is your brain terminally fried by the reality distortion field?
Do you by any chance also believe Vista's DRM stack is good for everyone because it allows us to watch movies in an orderly manner?
Re:Right... (Score:5, Insightful)
(http://clintonhawk.net/)
As you say though, closing off those choices turns it yet another expensive phone, albeit w/ a slick UI. Frankly, I want a tiny useable computer which doubles as a phone -- not a phone which mimics some aspects of a computer. I wish Apple understood that.
As the first post said, Apple shot themselves in the face with that limitation. No way in hell I'd pay $600 for a device crippled to prevent 3d party apps. Note, I write this with the recognition that I'm also pretty much an apple fanboy (I have 4 apple laptops of various makes and models, plus two pre-g3 machines that still work -- though their only use is for show-n-tell time when company come over).
Re:Right... (Score:5, Funny)
That must be one crazy party.
Re:Right... (Score:4, Insightful)
(http://kestas.kuliukas.com/)
Just because he won't officially allow it doesn't mean it won't be done, it just means it won't be commercial (No iJamster).
Re:Right... (Score:5, Insightful)
So I'd attribute this more to carrier paranoia than to Jobs' control issues.
In any case, for me this is a deal-breaker. I was in love with this device yesterday. With no third party apps, I'm entirely uninterested until somebody hacks it.
Correction (Score:5, Interesting)
(http://etoy.com/)
The US- wireless carriers are all scared shitless of a device like this.
Sorry, you just don't have this kind of shit dictated by European phone networks. Phones sold here (with and without plans) have no such restrictions.
They also don't have any restrictions in uploading your sounds, images, movies or (in case of smartphones) applications.
They also don't come with criplled Bluetooth stacks or some of the other stunts of which US carriers seem so fond of pulling off.
Re:Correction (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Correction (Score:5, Insightful)
The carriers that you're thinking of that restrict all that stuff are Verizon and Sprint (at least the Sprint phone I had), but the GSM providers here like T-Mobile and Cingular seem to be much more open about what you can do with your phones, which is why this iPhone restriction is so strikingly odd IMHO. It just seems natural that you could use third party apps on your horribly expensive iPhone, but they've really reduced the reasons I'd even be interested in it because I saw no instant messaging application for instance.
What if I want to use Jabber to my private Jabber server? What if I want to view and edit Microsoft Office documents? I saw no way to even view Word docs or Excel spreadsheets on this unlike the Blackberry. This is an overpriced toy, nothing more. Paris Hilton will have one and so will the other materialistic bubbleheads, but until it supports third party apps it couldn't lick a Blackberry or Treo's taint, much less be years ahead of it in functionality.
Re:Right... (Score:5, Informative)
Nope, this is about Jobs' control issues.
Re:Right... (Score:5, Insightful)
I'd say it has more to do with the trademark suit. Apple can't claim their two devices don't converge if people are able to use the Apple iPhone to do VoIP, which is the only function the Cisco product can do. Right now the iPhone has a laundry list of features and abilities, but VoIP calling is not one of them. So, technically, the Apple iPhone and the Cisco iPhone are not in the same markets.
If development of the iPhone was opened up, I'd wager the very first third party app would be Skype. With a device that connects to WiFi networks so easily and VoIP, who needs a big bucket of Cingular minutes?
We still have six months before the device ships, the policy could change depending on how things go in the trademark dispute and the wireless carrier world as well. T-Mobile starts building their 3G network this year, and that will have an impact.