Pocket PCs Masquerade as iPods 334
agwadude writes "Wired News has a story about a British software firm called StarBrite that is selling a virtual iPod that runs on Microsoft's PocketPC operating system. It mimics the iPod interface exactly, including the unique scroll wheel. It's a mere $20 but this seems right considering it's only software, and it only supports MP3. MacDailyNews has a shorter story."
Missing something? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Missing something? (Score:5, Insightful)
I can play mp3's on my ipaq now, but it's a pain in the ass to switch the songs.
I do agree though, that the battery life, and capacity is the majority.
Re:Missing something? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Missing something? (Score:4, Informative)
Another major problem is that folks hear of `iPod' all the time, but nobody hears of iriver (or others). When I show some ipod lovers my iriver, they `wow' at how small and light it is (and the fact that my battery lasts for close to 30 or so hours on a single charge [single 2200 mAh AA]; or that I can play Ogg files
Basically I view iPods as really cool toys (like them italian sports cars), but if you want something more practical (fuel economy/street safe, etc.) then get something else.
Re:Missing something? (Score:5, Informative)
Anyway, I'm fairly certain Apple's relevant patents on the iPod are for the actual hardware design, and it'd be hard to sue for a software ripoff that doesn't even have all of the iPod's features (like non-MP3 sound file compatibility)
Well then it's an industrial design issue (Score:5, Informative)
I'm pretty sure you can sue for infringement on any of the claims in a patent. That said, the only thing Apple obviously mention as being patent-pending (that I can see) is their Auto-Sync [apple.com] technology.
In any case, the design would be covered by industrial design [wikipedia.org] law - it was on this basis that Apple successfully sued [apple.com] Emachines over their iMac lookalike PCs.
Re:More of a look and feel issue (Score:3, Informative)
One of the specifics that you don't remember (and I don't entirely remember either) is that Apple and MS had license agreements.
MS claimed the license agreement covered what they were doing. Apple disagreed.
MS won.
SteveM
Re:Industrial design is about the aesthetic (Score:4, Informative)
Wonder if he works in the Patent Office these days?
Re:Missing something? (Score:5, Funny)
I thought...what the hell is a Fendi???
Re:Missing something? (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Missing something? (Score:3, Funny)
Oh come on, any remotely attentive guy with a girlfriend* will know what a Fendi is!
* Note: Said guy must also have been tricked into watching Sex and the City on the odd occasion, and has also been dragged through rip-off markets in Ventimiglia on the border of France and Italy, and then dragged through more rip-off markets in Beijing, and paraded past the real-deals on Champs d'Elysee, in Canne, Nice, Antibes, Monaco, Hong Kong, Singapore, Luzerne, Madrid, Florence, etc.
This is so cool... (Score:5, Funny)
$250 PDA
$400 4gb Hitachi CF microdrive
$20 for this software
and the Apple lawsuit?
Priceless.
Re:This is so cool... (Score:2, Informative)
Re:This is so cool... (Score:2)
Re:This is so cool... (Score:5, Funny)
The touch-n-feel defendant you're thinking of is probably Michael Jackson - slightly different.
Re:Missing something? (Score:3, Funny)
It's the software + the hardware (Score:5, Insightful)
Lovely hardware working perfectly with lovely software is Apple's modus operandi - at a lovely price (for Apple).
Re:It's the software + the hardware (Score:5, Funny)
> any one of 10k songs really really quickly and easily, with one
> hand.
what are you listening to that you need one hand free?
Re:It's the software + the hardware (Score:5, Funny)
You insensitive clod! (Score:4, Funny)
Re:too true (Score:4, Insightful)
If it were over-priced someone would have come out with a copy that is the same storage/size/weight but cheaper. Can you point me to such a product?
Re:too true (Score:3, Informative)
Practically the same size (2-3mm thicker), exactly the same weight and capacity. about GBP40 cheaper than the 20GB iPod here in the UK and it comes with a built in FM radio and a great LCD remote.
It plays OGGs and WMVs but not AAC (plus MP3s obviously).
KAPUTT (Score:4, Funny)
Very Awesome (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Very Awesome (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Very Awesome (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Very Awesome (Score:5, Insightful)
A better use for the money would be wifi (for bluetooth-like syncing, not for uploading songs), longer battery life, and more durable parts (it's durable now, but it couldn't hurt to stiffen up some parts).
Besides, if I want my iPod to look prettier, I'd want it in the design of the case, not on the screen.
Re:Very Awesome (Score:3, Funny)
That's what SHE said...
Re:Very Awesome (Score:5, Interesting)
Apple would be forced to prohibit it, of course. And we'd be forced (compelled, actually) to implement it.
maybe colour, maybe not (Score:3, Informative)
While I agree with you completely, I could easily see Apple using a kind of inexpensive in-between technology to introduce some colour to the display, if for purely aesthetic reasons (this is Apple we're talking about).
Some of the newer low-cost Nokias have pseudo-colour screens that look like the real deal, until you try to put some graphics on them and realize how chunky they come out. It's
software... (Score:5, Insightful)
Sign of things to come. (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Sign of things to come. (Score:5, Informative)
They make money on the hardware, not the music. Therefore the harm.
Re:Sign of things to come. (Score:2)
Re:Sign of things to come. (Score:2)
right now, the itunes music store is a loss leader (or nearly breaking even) to sell iPods and iPod mini's
Re:Sign of things to come. (Score:3, Informative)
I thought it was pretty common knowledge that Apple didn't make money on iTMS?
Also, this isn't even reverse engineering. It is a poorly mimicked interface, no actual reverse engineering of the iPod occured I'm sure.
Re:Sign of things to come. (Score:5, Informative)
- "So our philosophy is that traffic to the music store will lead to iPod sales and iPod sales will lead to the sale of Macs."
And the Seattle Times noted last October [nwsource.com]:And they already appear to be gone (Score:3, Funny)
You are right (Score:5, Informative)
Apple had their way [yahoo.com] with these guys and forced the renaming of the product (to pBop) and slight modifications to the interface.
Slashdot is behind the times. This story would have been meaningful a couple days ago.
Re:You are right (Score:3, Informative)
Re:And they already appear to be gone (Score:4, Informative)
Re:No, they're not gone. (Score:2)
And yeah, odds are good that the slashdot effect is what's causing it but maybe, just maybe a crack team of Apple lawyers got their first. They probably timed their strike to coincide with the appearance of this story just so they could hide their own attack in the giant dustcloud created by the slashdotting.
Difference (Score:5, Funny)
Well, there's where the iPod emulation starts to fall apart. It should be $60+ if they want to emulate more of the experience.
Re:Difference (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Difference (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Difference (Score:4, Insightful)
The irony of this comment is that the software is shown running on the iPaq, which has a permanently sealed battery that is, if anything, harder and more expensive to replace than the iPod's. So not only is the poster complaining about a battery problem that doesn't exist (the iPod's battery is fairly cheap to replace), the same "problem" exists in the PDA.
And yes, I own both an iPod and an iPaq. The iPod's battery is fine. The (much older) iPaq's battery is dead. You wouldn't believe how tricky it is to replace an iPaq's battery...
Re:Difference (Score:5, Funny)
Say hello to mr. C & D letter... (Score:4, Insightful)
Besides, the beauty of the interface is how it is designed for your hands, not your pointing device. How do you get feedback and all that on a touchscreen, be it with your fingers or worse, with a PDA-pencil...
Re:Say hello to mr. C & D letter... (Score:2)
Re:Say hello to mr. C & D letter... (Score:3, Informative)
Actually this is old news. They have already had talks with Apple and they have already changed a few things. You can read about it here [macworld.com]. Basically they changed the layout some and changed the name to pBop.
Re:But Apple doesn't have a real legal leg to stan (Score:3, Funny)
All I have to say is that if the Soviet government had lasted long enough to use Window
Too many levels of indirection... (Score:5, Funny)
Apple's legal team already knows ... (Score:5, Informative)
it was so similar, in fact, that Apple asked them to make some changes, including the name.
Starbrite has "cooperated fully to address Apple's concerns" but, if you ask me, it is still pretty much a rip off of the iPod interface (GUI and physical). Isn't this kind of thing legally protectable?
Re:Apple's legal team already knows ... (Score:2, Interesting)
Both cases went on for years and were either settled out of court or just fizzled out IIRC.
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
I don't get it... (Score:2, Informative)
Do you have some information that Apple's legal team doesn't?
Re:Apple's legal team already knows ... (Score:3, Informative)
Old News (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Old News (Score:3, Funny)
several people suggested that it was legal because HP has licensed iPod development from Apple... because the pictures showed an iPaq running the software.
they claimed that this was HP's iPod.
ow. ow. ow.
ipod killer? hardly (Score:5, Insightful)
$20 for mp3 player software? why? just make an ipod skin for some free software.
What's the big deal? (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:What's the big deal? (Score:2, Informative)
Reminds me of a CmdrTaco saying... (Score:5, Funny)
Tad expensive? (Score:5, Interesting)
Do people really want to pay $20 purely to get a skin for their pocketPC, that has less functionality(only mp3's) than something they can download for free.
Re:Tad expensive? (Score:3, Interesting)
For some people, that's very true. Most portable audio player's interfaces have a lot of options on screen at the same time, and require a good deal of precise input. Most of the time, it's not hard to tap a 10 pixel area 3 mm accross with a stylus, but try hitting the same area with your thumb while running.
You can't do it. You hit the wrong thing. It sucks. In fact, I sold my PocketPC for precisely this reason (since all i used the PPC for was reading boo
working info (Score:2, Informative)
And the Google cache [66.102.11.104]
Another Example of Apple doing things right... (Score:5, Interesting)
I don't really like the fact that the software is a total rip-off of Apples UI design, and that it may (potentially?) reduce iPod sales (although probably to a minimal degree, if at all), but it does seem to very much re-inforce that consumers are generally extremely pleased with Apple's products, and the carefully thought out design that goes along with them.
Mikro$haft might get a Klew eventually, but probably not, and in the meantime, I'll rejoice in my Mac OS X bliss, and never look back. (Converted Mac user since July 2002)
Re:Another Example of Apple doing things right... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Another Example of Apple doing things right... (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Another Example of Apple doing things right... (Score:2)
Of course, there will always be those who will just use the warez copy - and never would (or could) spend the $$$ on the app, so no loss.
Apple has the advantage of hardware here - you can dupe the looks, but you can't dupe the whole package.
I'd guess that this will only increase sales o
pictures (Score:5, Informative)
Oh, brother... (Score:5, Funny)
*YAAAAAAWN*
Hold still little pig. I just have some lipstick I want to put on you...
Anonymous spokesperson? (Score:5, Funny)
Did Apple's Lawyers post this story? (Score:5, Funny)
Think Different.
PocketPC + Toshiba HD +$20 = iPod? (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:PocketPC + Toshiba HD +$20 = iPod? (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:PocketPC + Toshiba HD +$20 = iPod? (Score:2, Insightful)
iPod for PPC Overkill? (Score:4, Interesting)
I mean this to take nothing away from the exquisitely designed, iPod, but I no longer have the desite to possess a single specialized device for every eFunction in my life. Sure, I sacrifice some sizzle sans iPod, some corporate penis-size sans blackberry, and some cuteness sans the postage stamp-sized phone du jour, but I love just having it *ALL* on my Samsung.
Re:iPod for PPC Overkill? (Score:3, Funny)
You are an Emacs user, aren't you...
===--===
I believe a slashdot troll would say (Score:2)
OK... What's the Problem? (Score:2)
Almost right (Score:5, Funny)
from the i-smell-a-lawsuit dept.
Shouldn't that be the iSmell-a-lawsuit dept.?
attn all you IANALs: remember apple v windows 1.0? (Score:3, Informative)
Hundreds of doomsayers predicting the demise of this, and not one mention (modded up at least) of Windows ripping off the Mac interface...and Apple LOSING the subsequent lawsuit.
According to one legal analysis [duke.edu], Microsoft's legal strategy was that of "breaking Apple's nebulous 'gestalt' and 'look-and-feel' theory into specific identifiable elements and then knocking each one down like uncopyrightable bowling pins...demonstrating nearly two dozen windowing systems...that used elements Apple claimed to own.
Doesn't sound much different here, I doubt they'd waste their time on it.
Re:attn all you IANALs: remember apple v windows 1 (Score:3, Informative)
**Sniff** **Sniff-Sniff** (Score:3, Funny)
I can almost - *sniff* - yes, like rancid meat and sugar.
Good Lord! Apple released the lawyers! Everybody, run for your lives!
$20 Cool -- No; $5 Cool -- Maybe (Score:4, Informative)
So what? (Score:3, Informative)
Increasing or decreasing sales? (Score:3, Insightful)
Or, they go look for a CF hard drive for more space, learn about the iPod mini being much cheaper than the drives by themselve, and wind up buying a mini instead.
However, I don't see many people using this *as* an iPod... it's just not cost-effective. I bet some people who only need a few songs will use it, but more than likely those people would not be in the market for a real iPod no matter what.
I think pPod will actually increase iPod sales.
So the PocketPCs (Score:3, Interesting)
Slashdotted! (Score:3, Funny)
HP Logo??!?? (Score:3, Interesting)
Everyone sees to be missing the point (Score:3, Insightful)
Of course, they're probably gonna get nailed for it, but hey, it was fun while it lasted.
I have played with this some (Score:3, Informative)
I don't see it in my programs folder but it's in the start menu. without a physical groove, it's almost impossible to use your finger to "scroll" songs but it's not too bad with the stylus. no exit, either, just choose 'hide' from the main menu. not sure if that means it's still running and taking cpu cycles/battery life. plays music just fine, but took a million years to move 27 mb worth of music to it over USB.
summary: kinda cute, kinda neat, I don't plan to use it so I don't care about the outcome of the lawsuit.
No problem (Score:3, Insightful)
Apple will have no problems with that. They may have to change a few details, but as long as this is
1) only software, that;
2) doesn't totally emulate iPod's own (proprietary) software;
3) doesn't insult Apple's product...
there's no legal problem at all.
The only - philosophical - gripe might be they try to run with someone else's good idea, but then again, most everybody does. That doesn't stop people from buying Windows - or rival products that emulate Windows - or downloading Linux, or buying Apple mp3 players, or
You might have an issue with me naming linux, Apple, Windows,
Copying in it self isn't good, copying good ideas is only sensible. In the end, let lawyers and marketing sweat the details, and let us not waste time with these superficial issues.
Re:fr1st p0st (Score:2)
Re:fr1st p0st (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Paging Apple Legal... (Score:2, Interesting)
There wasnt a lot of fuss about it here, since software patents are only bad when folks other than the almighty Apple take them out.
Re:Paging Apple Legal... (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:"only supports MP3" (Score:4, Funny)
You just keep on buying your $19 CDs for one song and don't mind what the rest of us are doing. But I'm sure you are just stealing hte music and you expect everyone to give you everything for free. Move out of your mom's basement and join the real world.
Re:"only supports MP3" (Score:3, Insightful)
It *is* a bad thing that the software doesn't support AAC or Windows Media, both of which are more suited to portable devices than MP3 on account of their superior audio quality per kbps of compressed audio.